The Derek Chauvin Trial Thread

[ThisIsMe]

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

The part that will be the most damning, is the reaction of the on-lookers.

They were all screaming, begging them to let up on him, clearly saw the man dying.

How can civilians understand what was happening more than trained professionals?!?? This is inexcusable....aka willful.

Not to mention, their fellow police, who saw it necessary to report their actions to their superiors.

It was wrong.

And Chauvin will pay for it.

Again, I'm not going to say willful, in that they intended to kill him, because I don't think I believe that that was their intended goal.

Maybe I'm thinking of it differently, but, willful would imply an intent to kill. I think they were just not paying attention and observing Floyd's situation, and they failed to react properly, and perhaps if they were actually trained to remain on someone's neck for a certain period of time, that training is....faulty, and needs to be revised.

I do agree, it looks bad that the onlookers were making the suggestions that the police should have been thinking of. Heck, even if the police weren't thinking that, the onlookers telling them should have been a reminder to do what they were suggesting.

 

[2aguy]

faulty training

The hold he used was taught to him in his training.

I don't know about what police training involves so I can't comment on the actual hold that Chauvin was doing. The faulty training was the overall situation. I'm sure those officers have to take classes on how to deal with different situations, and I believe they even have to take some psychology classes as well. They need to be able to read the situation, and respond appropriately.

Floyd said many times that he had anxiety and claustrophobia, and the lady at the start of the video told one of the officers that floyd "had something going on up there". Sure, thats a bit vague, but, again, it all has to be considered.

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

The best coverage of the trial is here...

Chauvin Trial Day 1 Wrap-Up: Opening Arguments & Three State Witnesses

State Witnesses: 911 dispatcher, grocery worker witness, martial arts witness

legalinsurrection.com

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

Also.....he wasn't being still he was resisting.......and it isn't the cops job to take the suspects words as honest when they are trying to arrest them....

There job was to put him in the squad car........he resisted that....that's on him...

I disagree. An officers job is to serve and protect, and that even means the people in your custody.

No, the officers are not bound to take the person words as honest, but they are duty bound to listen and make the best judgment based on what they see and hear. As an officer, you have to be keenly aware of what is going on. You can't just arrest someone and treat them any way you want. You have to be careful and make sure your detainee is not in harms way.

Again, if you read what I wrote, and watched the video, you'd see that Floyd was not resisting, he was panicking. He was fearful of being restrained and then put into the car. He was in fight or flight mode, and that is a reaction to his fear. The officers should have seen that, from the very beginning, Floyd was distraught, even crying. Floyd was worried, and he repeatedly made his concerns known



I think the officers should have been able to see that and react differently.

Panicking is resisting.......he refused to stay in the car and they restrained him....according to MPD training.

Just what do you think the cops do if you "panic" once you realize that you are actually going to be arrested and you start to resist?

Do you understand anything about police work?

Again, I disagree, panicking is not resisting. Its fight or flight. Its a reaction to fear. Had they not been trying to force him into the car, he probably wouldn't have struggled. Yeah, he was terrified, so he didn't want to get into the car. Considering all the conditions he mentioned, and his behavior through the whole ordeal,.I understand, and the officers should have as well.

I agree, if you are about to arrest someone and they start acting panicked, yeah, one might think they are faking, but floyd.was showing signs of being distraught from the beginning.

Also, even if someone did start showing signs of panic just before they are being arrested, the officers still have to consider that, because that person may genuinely may experience anxiety and panic. Again, as an officer, you should be able to observe what is going on, if something isn't working, then you try something else. If Floyd was showing signs of panic from being forced into the car, then maybe don't put him in the car. Maybe say "ok, we will let you stay out here, in cuffs, as long as you don't try to fight, but if you do, we will put you in the car". Did they try that? Doesn't look like it. I don't think they necessarily HAD to put him in the car, especially with his obvious signs of anxiety.

I guess I don't understand the need to try to force him into the car, since really they were just there to investigate an alleged fake $20 bill.

From my take, had they not tried to force him into the car, he wouldn't have panicked, and he wouldn't have struggled.

It wasn't just a fake bill........he had a long criminal history, that they were likely aware of......a violent criminal history, and they were still overly polite to him as they initially tried to put him in the car...

 

[beautress]

Yep....I won't be on 2X the lethal dose of fentanyl and all the other drugs that killed floyd.

Here's the symptoms of fentanyl overdose..

Symptoms Associated with a Fentanyl Overdose - Treatment Options

How do you know if someone is in distress from a potential overdose on the opioid fentanyl? Here are things to look for and steps to take if you think someone might be overdosing.

americanaddictioncenters.org

The only symptoms he had were those that overlap w/being asphyxiated to death.

My money is on that's how all 12 jurors will see it.

Actually, at least 3 symptoms on your list are only determined post morten, and not prior to one's end. Which, since 2 of the 3 weren't known prior to Mr. Floyd's demise. On that account, Chauvin is guilty only of attempting to control an out-of-control angry man caught committing an egregious crime that goes with counterfeiting money one did not earn and that ruins good businesses that feed a lot of mouths. He committed a very bad crime that is also a federal offense.

 

[ThisIsMe]

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

The part that will be the most damning, is the reaction of the on-lookers.

They were all screaming, begging them to let up on him, clearly saw the man dying.

How can civilians understand what was happening more than trained professionals. This is inexcusable....aka willful.

Not to mention, their fellow police, who saw it necessary to report their actions to their superiors.

It was wrong.

And Chauvin will pay for it.

Moron, they didn't understand what was happening.....the ambulance was on the way......and because of the crowd, the ambulance crew refused to try to treat floyd at the scene and drove several blocks away to try to help him...because of the crowd, you doofus.

Why was the ambulance called?

 

[2aguy]

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

The part that will be the most damning, is the reaction of the on-lookers.

They were all screaming, begging them to let up on him, clearly saw the man dying.

How can civilians understand what was happening more than trained professionals?!?? This is inexcusable....aka willful.

Not to mention, their fellow police, who saw it necessary to report their actions to their superiors.

It was wrong.

And Chauvin will pay for it.

Again, I'm not going to say willful, in that they intended to kill him, because I don't think I believe that that was their intended goal.

Maybe I'm thinking of it differently, but, willful would imply an intent to kill. I think they were just not paying attention and observing Floyd's situation, and they failed to react properly, and perhaps if they were actually trained to remain on someone's neck for a certain period of time, that training is....faulty, and needs to be revised.

I do agree, it looks bad that the onlookers were making the suggestions that the police should have been thinking of. Heck, even if the police weren't thinking that, the onlookers telling them should have been a reminder to do what they were suggesting.

How many violent arrests did the onlookers participate in? How many criminals who first seem cooperative explode into violence?

You really don't understand what the police do....do you?

 

[2aguy]

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

The part that will be the most damning, is the reaction of the on-lookers.

They were all screaming, begging them to let up on him, clearly saw the man dying.

How can civilians understand what was happening more than trained professionals. This is inexcusable....aka willful.

Not to mention, their fellow police, who saw it necessary to report their actions to their superiors.

It was wrong.

And Chauvin will pay for it.

Moron, they didn't understand what was happening.....the ambulance was on the way......and because of the crowd, the ambulance crew refused to try to treat floyd at the scene and drove several blocks away to try to help him...because of the crowd, you doofus.

Why was the ambulance called?

He said he couldn't breathe....but as cops will point out, a lot of criminals say that, and other things to try to get out of being arrested...

 

[MarcATL]

Actually, at least 3 symptoms on your list are only determined post morten, and not prior to one's end. Which, since 2 of the 3 weren't known Pryor to Mr. Floyd's demise. On that account, Chauvin is guilty only of attempting to control an out-of-control angry man caught committing an egregious crime that goes with counterfeiting money one did not earn and that ruins good businesses that feed a lot of mouths. He committed a very bad crime that is also a federal offense.

Not just a crime, but "a very bad crime" huh?

#LOLGOP #TooFunny #CLASSIC

 

[2aguy]

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

The part that will be the most damning, is the reaction of the on-lookers.

They were all screaming, begging them to let up on him, clearly saw the man dying.

How can civilians understand what was happening more than trained professionals. This is inexcusable....aka willful.

Not to mention, their fellow police, who saw it necessary to report their actions to their superiors.

It was wrong.

And Chauvin will pay for it.

Moron, they didn't understand what was happening.....the ambulance was on the way......and because of the crowd, the ambulance crew refused to try to treat floyd at the scene and drove several blocks away to try to help him...because of the crowd, you doofus.

Why was the ambulance called?

Also, when they arrived they were told by the friends in the car he wouldn't wake up....and he was exhibiting signs of drug use......if you watch the trial coverage, the Defense attorney went through the call transcript.....the ambulance was dispatched but wasn't told to hurry at first, then they called the dispatcher again and told the ambulance to come immediately, lights and sirens.....

 

[ThisIsMe]

faulty training

The hold he used was taught to him in his training.

I don't know about what police training involves so I can't comment on the actual hold that Chauvin was doing. The faulty training was the overall situation. I'm sure those officers have to take classes on how to deal with different situations, and I believe they even have to take some psychology classes as well. They need to be able to read the situation, and respond appropriately.

Floyd said many times that he had anxiety and claustrophobia, and the lady at the start of the video told one of the officers that floyd "had something going on up there". Sure, thats a bit vague, but, again, it all has to be considered.

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

The best coverage of the trial is here...

Chauvin Trial Day 1 Wrap-Up: Opening Arguments & Three State Witnesses

State Witnesses: 911 dispatcher, grocery worker witness, martial arts witness

legalinsurrection.com

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

Also.....he wasn't being still he was resisting.......and it isn't the cops job to take the suspects words as honest when they are trying to arrest them....

There job was to put him in the squad car........he resisted that....that's on him...

I disagree. An officers job is to serve and protect, and that even means the people in your custody.

No, the officers are not bound to take the person words as honest, but they are duty bound to listen and make the best judgment based on what they see and hear. As an officer, you have to be keenly aware of what is going on. You can't just arrest someone and treat them any way you want. You have to be careful and make sure your detainee is not in harms way.

Again, if you read what I wrote, and watched the video, you'd see that Floyd was not resisting, he was panicking. He was fearful of being restrained and then put into the car. He was in fight or flight mode, and that is a reaction to his fear. The officers should have seen that, from the very beginning, Floyd was distraught, even crying. Floyd was worried, and he repeatedly made his concerns known



I think the officers should have been able to see that and react differently.

You haven't had enough of spewing stupid in this thread yet? Thank God you are nobody.

I'm sorry you can't see what I saw. If you read any of my threads on this site, you'd know I agree mostly with the right, but on this, I have to diverge. This isn't about right or left, its about right and wrong, and I feel Chauvin was wrong, along with those other officers who watched what was going on, and didn't stand up for what is right.

Please, stop looking at this through the lense of conservatism, and trying to stick it to lefty, and see what was happening here. The man was begging and pleading, for most of the video, and for 4 minutes while he was being held down. As an officer, you MUST be more aware of what is going on, ESPECIALLY after Eric garner.



This Steven crowder video shows the whole 20 minute video, apparently from the body cam. I don't know why you can't see what I see, but I see an officer who did not have the safety of his detainee in mind.

Did you watch the Crowder video? You really should......cause he disagrees with you...

No, I haven't watched all 3 hours of it. I just started the video, however, I wouldn't say that crowder completely disagrees. I think him and gerald A, and Dave landau all said that what chauvin did was wrong.

Now, again, I've not watched the whole video, but, I just don't see how you could take what he showed at the beginning and analyze it in a way to be anything other than flat out negligence. If he did, id have to say that crowder is wrong on this.

 

[2aguy]

faulty training

The hold he used was taught to him in his training.

I don't know about what police training involves so I can't comment on the actual hold that Chauvin was doing. The faulty training was the overall situation. I'm sure those officers have to take classes on how to deal with different situations, and I believe they even have to take some psychology classes as well. They need to be able to read the situation, and respond appropriately.

Floyd said many times that he had anxiety and claustrophobia, and the lady at the start of the video told one of the officers that floyd "had something going on up there". Sure, thats a bit vague, but, again, it all has to be considered.

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

The best coverage of the trial is here...

Chauvin Trial Day 1 Wrap-Up: Opening Arguments & Three State Witnesses

State Witnesses: 911 dispatcher, grocery worker witness, martial arts witness

legalinsurrection.com

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

Also.....he wasn't being still he was resisting.......and it isn't the cops job to take the suspects words as honest when they are trying to arrest them....

There job was to put him in the squad car........he resisted that....that's on him...

I disagree. An officers job is to serve and protect, and that even means the people in your custody.

No, the officers are not bound to take the person words as honest, but they are duty bound to listen and make the best judgment based on what they see and hear. As an officer, you have to be keenly aware of what is going on. You can't just arrest someone and treat them any way you want. You have to be careful and make sure your detainee is not in harms way.

Again, if you read what I wrote, and watched the video, you'd see that Floyd was not resisting, he was panicking. He was fearful of being restrained and then put into the car. He was in fight or flight mode, and that is a reaction to his fear. The officers should have seen that, from the very beginning, Floyd was distraught, even crying. Floyd was worried, and he repeatedly made his concerns known



I think the officers should have been able to see that and react differently.

You haven't had enough of spewing stupid in this thread yet? Thank God you are nobody.

I'm sorry you can't see what I saw. If you read any of my threads on this site, you'd know I agree mostly with the right, but on this, I have to diverge. This isn't about right or left, its about right and wrong, and I feel Chauvin was wrong, along with those other officers who watched what was going on, and didn't stand up for what is right.

Please, stop looking at this through the lense of conservatism, and trying to stick it to lefty, and see what was happening here. The man was begging and pleading, for most of the video, and for 4 minutes while he was being held down. As an officer, you MUST be more aware of what is going on, ESPECIALLY after Eric garner.



This Steven crowder video shows the whole 20 minute video, apparently from the body cam. I don't know why you can't see what I see, but I see an officer who did not have the safety of his detainee in mind.

Did you watch the Crowder video? You really should......cause he disagrees with you...

No, I haven't watched all 3 hours of it. I just started the video, however, I wouldn't say that crowder completely disagrees. I think him and gerald A, and Dave landau all said that what chauvin did was wrong.

Now, again, I've not watched the whole video, but, I just don't see how you could take what he showed at the beginning and analyze it in a way to be anything other than flat out negligence. If he did, id have to say that crowder is wrong on this.

Negligence? It was how they were trained........and as to laying the guy on the side? They don't say if the manual gives the conditions for putting the criminal on his side.......how long after he stops resisting, so, these cops were trained in the techniques they used....they were polite and courteous to the criminal up to the point he started resisting ..........the guy died because of the drugs in his system, not because of the cops.

 

[MarcATL]

Again, I'm not going to say willful, in that they intended to kill him, because I don't think I believe that that was their intended goal.

Maybe I'm thinking of it differently, but, willful would imply an intent to kill. I think they were just not paying attention and observing Floyd's situation, and they failed to react properly, and perhaps if they were actually trained to remain on someone's neck for a certain period of time, that training is....faulty, and needs to be revised.

I do agree, it looks bad that the onlookers were making the suggestions that the police should have been thinking of. Heck, even if the police weren't thinking that, the onlookers telling them should have been a reminder to do what they were suggesting.

Here's the simplistic breakdown of the degrees of murder...

• 1st Degree: I decide to kill you before hand and go about doing it (woman hiring a hitman for hubby, or me walking up to you and just stabbing you to death seemingly out of the blue but I disliked you for a long time)
• 2nd Degree: You and I get into an argument, that leads to a physical altercation and during the impromptu altercation I decide that I have to kill you (or did something that's very likely that will result in your dead)
• 3rd Degree: I was doing something and ignorantly kill you. (like reckless driving, or losing control of my vehicle innocently or we were arguing, you got in my face, I shove you back to get you out of my face, but you stumble back and hit your head on the table and die on the spot)

That's the simplest description that I believe explains it nicely.

 

[GMCGeneral]

What makes you think this is such a "Big Trial"? The Fake Impeachment trials of twice exonerated Donald J Trump were bigger news.

The trials of the Baltimore PD officers were pretty big too.

America is on trial...................again.

Shut up, Limey

 

[XponentialChaos]

"Blood" Choke? Do you even know what that is? And as the Andrew Branca pointed out, you have to cut off blood flow to both carotid arteries, not just one, you dumb ass.......

Ok. What do you think the final ruling will be?

 

[beautress]

The trial has not ended to the best of my knowledge.

True.

Actually, at least 3 symptoms on your list are only determined post morten, and not prior to one's end. Which, since 2 of the 3 weren't known Pryor to Mr. Floyd's demise. On that account, Chauvin is guilty only of attempting to control an out-of-control angry man caught committing an egregious crime that goes with counterfeiting money one did not earn and that ruins good businesses that feed a lot of mouths. He committed a very bad crime that is also a federal offense.

Not just a crime, but "a very bad crime" huh?

#LOLGOP #TooFunny #CLASSIC

The decisions Mr. Floyd made to play Pharma Roulette and to disregard his arrest with egregious acts were equal to passing a counterfeit bill. The moral of this story is to avoid perpetrating bad money for goods.

Those you defending the deceased man's crimes have no idea of the many who have been cheated out of life, a living and liberty on account of counterfeiters' cheating that goes on and on till caught.

 

[ThisIsMe]

First you say:

his actions showed a gross and severe lack of judgment and faulty training

Then you say:

I don't know about what police training involves so I can't comment on the actual hold that Chauvin was doing

Please, just stop.

I don't have to know the specifics of police maneuvers and policy to know that what I saw on video, if he was following his training, is faulty training.

I know those officers have to take classes on more than just how to use a gun and how to take down someone. Officers generally have to take classes periodically throughout their career and I believe some of them are psychology classes.

I don't disagree that Chauvin was taught the knee on the neck maneuver in training, but when they failed to consider his pleading, his repeated claims, and for 5 minutes they knelt on his limp body, either they ignored their training, or the training was faulty to not teach them to be more aware of the situation.

I didn't see one, so forgive me if there's already one, two or three in existence.

If not, let this be the official thread to discuss the biggest trial of the century.

No bruising, no reticial hemorrhaging....no suffocation by the police officer. His air supply was not cut off....

2X the lethal dose of fentanyl....
[/QUOTE
PETECHIAL !! Can I kneel on your neck for about 10 minutes while you're handcuffed.... Please!!!!

Sure.........go ahead........I won't die because I didn't take a chemical cocktail, then down pills on top of that to hide them from police.

I was being a little facetious. Mr FLoyd was quite capable of speaking if he said he couldn't breathe. And I'm reasonably sure a veteran Minneapolis Police officer has heard violent dangerous drug abusers being taken into custody say they can't breathe. Maybe letting him regain his ability to resist was not a risk the officers were willing to take. They had contact with him before in the past as I understand

Well, being able to speak doesn't necessarily mean one has ample ability to breathe. Not being able to breathe doesn't mean he couldn't draw any breath at all, it could mean that he could not inhale enough air to fill his lungs to a capacity to maintain normal function, yet still have enough air to gasp out pleas for relief.

At one point in the video, you can tell Floyd was becoming exasperated, because his words became guttural. His phrase "i can't breathe" started to become "i can't BLEATHE". Replacing the 'R' with an 'L' in the word breathe, which would indicate that he was starting to become weak, and he was forming whatever words were easier to speak.

Sure, you can say I don't know what I'm talking about (I'm sure you will), but those are my observations from what I saw on the video.

 

[ThisIsMe]

The pathologists who analyzed Mr. Floyd found fentanyl mixed with other mind-altering substances produced a most convincing likelihood that Mr. Floyd, sadly, was already dying when apprehended by police, and his uncooperative with police led them to thinking he intended to kill someone, including themselves, and the steps they took coincided with saving lives the perpetrator was aiming to take, in accordance with their training. Cops are required to stop threats to other human beings' lives. The rules apply equally to everyone, including the prodigy of slaves who were set free from their oppression 160 years ago. Mr. Floyd broke all the rules that day including a suicidal amount of highly dangerous drug cocktails. The foot on the throat possibly postponed death by fifteen minutes if it slowed the flow of toxins in his bloodstream to the brain. It is truly sad that Mr. Floyd guaranteed his death by the mixed up drugs he used his final day on this earth.

Why isn't the defense arguing that Chauvin followed his training?

Do you understand anything about actual Trials? The prosecution starts first, they bring out their witnesses, then rest their case...then the Defense brings out their witnesses...that is when the actual manual and trainers will come out and state Chauvin followed his training...

So when the defense presents that this type of restraint procedure was part of his training, the People who approved and sanctioned the training the Chief and City Administrators should also be tried for Murder. Anyone who knew this procedure could result in death should be held responsible right. If they knew the risks and did nothing to end the policy then it becomes depraved indifference to human life and they should all be held responsible. Just want to spread the love. City scapegoating this Officer? It must have been a training and supervisory issue or they wouldn't have given up $27 million so easily. Someone Did a Complete CYA.

Well, no. See here again, this is about being able to recognize the situation. The knee on the neck may be a legitimate maneuver, and may be effective, but the officer applying it has to know what he is doing, and when enough is enough.

So, I wouldnt hold everyone accountable for what may be a legit tactic, but Chauvin should definitely have known to let up, especially when Floyd stopped responding.

 

[ThisIsMe]

faulty training

The hold he used was taught to him in his training.

I don't know about what police training involves so I can't comment on the actual hold that Chauvin was doing. The faulty training was the overall situation. I'm sure those officers have to take classes on how to deal with different situations, and I believe they even have to take some psychology classes as well. They need to be able to read the situation, and respond appropriately.

Floyd said many times that he had anxiety and claustrophobia, and the lady at the start of the video told one of the officers that floyd "had something going on up there". Sure, thats a bit vague, but, again, it all has to be considered.

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

The best coverage of the trial is here...

Chauvin Trial Day 1 Wrap-Up: Opening Arguments & Three State Witnesses

State Witnesses: 911 dispatcher, grocery worker witness, martial arts witness

legalinsurrection.com

Now, I know its going to be hard to keep everything straight, especially when so much is going on, and all happening so fast, but, when they heard "clausterphobia", "anxiety", and "i can't breathe", that should have sparked something in someone that "hey, maybe we should just let this guy stand up, as long as he's still"

Also.....he wasn't being still he was resisting.......and it isn't the cops job to take the suspects words as honest when they are trying to arrest them....

There job was to put him in the squad car........he resisted that....that's on him...

I disagree. An officers job is to serve and protect, and that even means the people in your custody.

No, the officers are not bound to take the person words as honest, but they are duty bound to listen and make the best judgment based on what they see and hear. As an officer, you have to be keenly aware of what is going on. You can't just arrest someone and treat them any way you want. You have to be careful and make sure your detainee is not in harms way.

Again, if you read what I wrote, and watched the video, you'd see that Floyd was not resisting, he was panicking. He was fearful of being restrained and then put into the car. He was in fight or flight mode, and that is a reaction to his fear. The officers should have seen that, from the very beginning, Floyd was distraught, even crying. Floyd was worried, and he repeatedly made his concerns known



I think the officers should have been able to see that and react differently.

Panicking is resisting.......he refused to stay in the car and they restrained him....according to MPD training.

Just what do you think the cops do if you "panic" once you realize that you are actually going to be arrested and you start to resist?

Do you understand anything about police work?

Again, I disagree, panicking is not resisting. Its fight or flight. Its a reaction to fear. Had they not been trying to force him into the car, he probably wouldn't have struggled. Yeah, he was terrified, so he didn't want to get into the car. Considering all the conditions he mentioned, and his behavior through the whole ordeal,.I understand, and the officers should have as well.

I agree, if you are about to arrest someone and they start acting panicked, yeah, one might think they are faking, but floyd.was showing signs of being distraught from the beginning.

Also, even if someone did start showing signs of panic just before they are being arrested, the officers still have to consider that, because that person may genuinely may experience anxiety and panic. Again, as an officer, you should be able to observe what is going on, if something isn't working, then you try something else. If Floyd was showing signs of panic from being forced into the car, then maybe don't put him in the car. Maybe say "ok, we will let you stay out here, in cuffs, as long as you don't try to fight, but if you do, we will put you in the car". Did they try that? Doesn't look like it. I don't think they necessarily HAD to put him in the car, especially with his obvious signs of anxiety.

I guess I don't understand the need to try to force him into the car, since really they were just there to investigate an alleged fake $20 bill.

From my take, had they not tried to force him into the car, he wouldn't have panicked, and he wouldn't have struggled.

Are you serious?

Had they not been trying to force him into the car, he probably wouldn't have struggled.

You do understand that he was being arrested....right? That when you are arrested, they are going to put you in the car....right?

Did you see the parts where Chauvin was consoling this guy? Telling him that when Floyd asked the officer to stay with him, Chauvin said they would stay with him, that they rolled down the window for him, and would turn on the air conditioning for him...did you see that?

They did everything they could to calm the criminal down, and then he resisted being in the car........

You do understand that he was being arrested....right? That when you are arrested, they are going to put you in the car....right?

Not necessarily. I don't believe there is a requirement to put them in the car, as long as they are subdued and restrained. A lot of times people are handcuffed and then told to sit on the ground, or the curb. Given the obvious anxiety and stress that Floyd was going through, this could have bee one of those times they opted to take that route. Again, with the warning that if he fought them any more, they would put him in the car.

They never gave him that option.

They did everything they could to calm the criminal down, and then he resisted being in the car....

Yeah, I saw them.say they would stay with them, that was nice. That still doesn't change the fact that Floyd was obviously panicking and in fear,.in fact, the fact that Floyd was asking them to stay with him should have been just another indicator of how afraid he was.

 

[ThisIsMe]

The trial has not ended to the best of my knowledge.

True.

Actually, at least 3 symptoms on your list are only determined post morten, and not prior to one's end. Which, since 2 of the 3 weren't known Pryor to Mr. Floyd's demise. On that account, Chauvin is guilty only of attempting to control an out-of-control angry man caught committing an egregious crime that goes with counterfeiting money one did not earn and that ruins good businesses that feed a lot of mouths. He committed a very bad crime that is also a federal offense.

Not just a crime, but "a very bad crime" huh?

#LOLGOP #TooFunny #CLASSIC

The decisions Mr. Floyd made to play Pharma Roulette and to disregard his arrest with egregious acts were equal to passing a counterfeit bill. The moral of this story is to avoid perpetrating bad money for goods.

Those you defending the deceased man's crimes have no idea of the many who have been cheated out of life, a living and liberty on account of counterfeiters' cheating that goes on and on till caught.

I'm not discounting whatever crimes he may have committed, but there is a justice system for that, a justice system that gives every person their day in court.

Floyd's crimes are not at the heart of this, Chauvins actions are.

 

[WelfareQueen]

I am not aware of Joe Biden lynching anyone, but the Dim Party invented lynching and the Klan. . Maybe your team can get this cop lynched.

You are not aware of many things my very slow, and dimwitted fellow-poster, no surprise there.

Mark you and I used to have some serious conversations back in the day, So I will give you my honest opinion on this matter. I worked emergency services for years. I worked directly with cops for almost 30 years. The cop in the Floyd case acted inappropriately. He did not follow police procedure. He is guilty of negligent homicide imho.

However, Floyd acted like a jackass and was a jackass. He has as much responsibility as the cop. He broke the Law and he was under arrest, Shut the fuck up, get in the squad car....your ass is going to jail. But no...Floyd was a dumb ass and acted like a dumb ass. It was a perfect storm of stupid because the cop was just as much of a dumb ass as Floyd.

Had Floyd gotten in the squad car, shut his mouth, and rightly gone to jail it is the end of the story. But again, he didn't. He was a moron and his fatal mistake was to run into a cop that was just as stupid and had just as poor a judgment as he did. Is the cop a racist? None of us know. However, if he is Floyd teed it up for him.

Bottom Line. Negligent homicide. Both the cop and Floyd acted like idiots. Their shared stupidity created the problem.

 

[MarcATL]

Mark you and I used to have some serious conversations back in the day, So I will give you my honest opinion on this matter. I worked emergency services for years. I worked directly with cops for almost 30 years. The cop in the Floyd case acted inappropriately. He did not follow police procedure. He is guilty of negligent homicide imho.

However, Floyd acted like a jackass and was a jackass. He has as much responsibility as the cop. He broke the Law and he was under arrest, Shut the fuck up, get in the squad car....your ass is going to jail. But no...Floyd was a dumb ass and acted like a dumb ass. It was a perfect storm of stupid because the cop was just as much of a dumb ass as Floyd.

Had Floyd gotten in the squad car, shut his mouth, and rightly gone to jail it is the end of the story. But again, he didn't. He was a moron and his fatal mistake was to run into a cop that was just as stupid and had just as poor a judgment as he did. Is the cop a racist? None of us know. However, if he is Floyd teed it up for him.

Bottom Line. Negligent homicide. Both the cop and Floyd acted like idiots. Their shared stupidity created the problem.

I think Floyd was genuinely panicked.

Do you not agree?

Or are you going to go w/the rightwing talking point about him dying from fatal overdose of some drugs?