The Environmental Movement Is The Color Of Money

[Flanders]

The one thing that defines Americans more than any other in the Nevada conflict is what, or who, the individual American will fight for. The “what” is easy. Most Americans will fight for individual liberties and their country, while a substantial number of Americans will unwittingly fight for a government that betrays the country at every turn. The “who” is more complicated.

How many Americans will fight for the people named in an article by James Simpson:

Harry Reid, Rory Reid, Neil Kornze, Jonathan Magaziner, Ira Magaziner, William J. Clinton, Barack Obama, Paul Tudor Jones, Al Gore, Ted Turner, Michael Ahearn.

Make no mistake about it. If it ever comes to an armed conflict those who side with the government will be fighting for those characters named above in addition to fighting for the unnamed sharpshooters who manage to fly below the radar. No matter the issue they do what they do to get their hands on tax dollars. The trick for them is in convincing their rank & file supporters that it is about the rule of law, the Constitution, the common good, compassion, the economy, and every combination of the five.

Let’s examine their successes:

1. One look at how the government administers the law is enough to tell us that the rule of law has become a joke.

I’m not nearly as optimistic as is Judge Napolitano in the final seconds of this video:

Megyn Kelly | The Kelly File | Fox News

2. The Constitution is nothing more than an obstacle to the “men” John Adams feared:

A government of laws, and not of men. John Adams

“Men” are taking away our free “Negative Liberties” and replacing them with tax dollar “Positive Liberties”:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkpdNtTgQNM]2001 Obama WBEZ Interview Redistribution Wealth Warren Court - YouTube[/ame]​

3. Moral justification for enriching the wealthiest environmental parasites is the latest example of how the common good works:

If Democrat-linked entrepreneurs plan to turn the West into a massive arena for green projects, the implications are disturbing. The projects will eventually go as all others have gone before: failing as the unsustainable costs, maintenance problems and unseen environmental catastrophes they create become intolerable. The true goal of “green” energy, say cynics, is to make these people wealthier, not to save the environment.

Taqiyya the Liar slipped up and told the truth. Wealthy tax dollar parasites did not get rich on their own:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKjPI6no5ng&feature=player_embedded]Obama: If You've Got A Business, You Didn't Build That - YouTube[/ame]​

Question: When is the Left’s next class warfare demonstration scheduled against the tax dollar wealthy?

4. Parasite compassion is seen in the brutal slaughter of infants.

5. In addition to the welfare state, the “men and women” who controlled America’s economy for decades gave the country an economy built around strengthening the Rights of absentee owners; a permanent unemployment rate of at least 10 percent; a reduced standard of living for working Americans; the dollar’s shrinking buying power, and the necessity for economic open-borders. Therein lies the con job. Most Americans look at the economy without realizing that it is manipulated by the people who control it for their own benefit. So long as Americans think they are benefitting to some extent they tend to go along.

The people who manipulated the economy for the sole purpose of implementing the welfare state harmed more Americans than they benefitted. Those people manipulating today’s economy in order to fund environmental scams like the one in Nevada benefit nobody except themselves.

Here’s the link to the article I hope everyone reads before deciding the right and wrong of Cliven Bundy’s civil disobedience:

Clinton/Obama cronies behind Bundy showdown
High-level Democrats positioned to profit from 'green' projects
Published: 14 hours ago
by James Simpson

Clinton/Obama cronies behind Bundy showdown

 

[Old Rocks]

Oh, where is my little tin hat, little tin hat, little tin hat.................................

 

[Old Rocks]

Bundy is a criminal who has not paid his grazing fees in 20 years. The government should seize all that he owns until said fees are paid.

 

[Flanders]

Bundy is a criminal who has not paid his grazing fees in 20 years.

To Old Rocks: I know that you’re dumber than a rock, but do try to understand the issue before you comment. Listen closely to what Mrs. Bundy has to say in the first video:

On the Record with Greta Van Susteren | Fox News

The government should seize all that he owns until said fees are paid.

To Old Rocks: I suspect that you are a creature of the parasite class who sees civil disobedience as a personal attack:

On the Record with Greta Van Susteren | Fox News

 

[mamooth]

Hey Flanders, did you study under the Unibomber? Just curious as to how you learned to construct these manifestos.

 

[DriftingSand]

Bundy is a criminal who has not paid his grazing fees in 20 years. The government should seize all that he owns until said fees are paid.

If that was truly an issue they would have done something about it 19-and-a-half years ago.

 

[elektra]

The environmental movement is the color of Marxism.

Force the ranchers off the land, force them into the city.

The pretense is to save the Desert Tortoise in Nevada, yet Democrat Senator Harry Reid showed no concern while he lobbied, ruled, and regulated the building of the largest Solar Plant in the World, Ivanpah.

17 square miles of complete destruction of Desert Tortoise habitat destroyed, the solution is now to make new habitat by taking the land away from the people.

Where I live thousands of acres are bought through government rules and regulations and made permanently off limits to humans unless you have a bachelor degree by the government authorizing you to be a biologist.

Further the rules and regulations will not allow the telephone company to upgrade their equipment to give us DSL high speed internet.

How is this all connected.

While, there are rumblings this is the Marxist Revolution that they seek, force people off rural property and into cities where they can be controlled.

More and more land owned by the Government gives them much more power over our lives.

Bankrupt the country so they can declare Capitalism a failure and begin anew.

Take the guns, can't do that, well, so they shut down lead manufacturing.

All in the name of the Environment.

You think these people just do not get it when they are repeatedly caught in lies. They are strict activists who simply believe in Marxism.

Those who trade google searched graphs and "studies", in a debate, in a thread, they are simply caught up in the gave, distracted, from what is really going on.

 

[Flanders]

The environmental movement is the color of Marxism.

To elektra: Exactly why all the good little Communists flocked to the environmental movement after the Soviet Union imploded.

Force the ranchers off the land, force them into the city.

While, there are rumblings this is the Marxist Revolution that they seek, force people off rural property and into cities where they can be controlled.

More and more land owned by the Government gives them much more power over our lives.

To elektra: In short:

The theory of the Communists may be summed up in the single sentence: Abolition of private property. Karl Marx (1818 – 1883) and Friedrich Engels (1820 – 1895)

The pretense is to save the Desert Tortoise in Nevada, yet Democrat Senator Harry Reid showed no concern while he lobbied, ruled, and regulated the building of the largest Solar Plant in the World, Ivanpah.

To elektra: The entire political system was made infinitely more corrupt by the EPA. Environmental scams like Ivanpah came later.

Harry Reid is a piece of garbage, yet Nevada voters elect him, and his fellow Democrats made him majority leader. A lot of people in the government must agree with the things he does.

 

[Abraham3]

Bundy is a criminal who has not paid his grazing fees in 20 years. The government should seize all that he owns until said fees are paid.

If that was truly an issue they would have done something about it 19-and-a-half years ago.

They did. They've had him in court for over 20 years and have won numerous cases against him. He has ignored them. Do you all believe he has the right to do so? From CNN:

In removing Bundy's livestock from public lands, the park service and land bureau are carrying out two U.S. District Court orders from two different judges. "Cattle have been grazing in trespass on public lands in Southern Nevada for more than two decades," the National Park Service said. "The BLM and NPS have made repeated attempts to resolve this matter administratively and judicially. Impoundment of cattle illegally grazing on public lands is an option of last resort."

Added the BLM: "Mr. Bundy has also failed to comply with multiple court orders to remove his cattle from the federal lands and to end the illegal trespass."

The bureau does allow grazing on federal lands -- it administers 18,000 grazing permits and leases on 157 million acres across the country, the agency said.

Bundy's dispute with the government began about 1993 when the bureau changed grazing rules for the 600,000-acre Gold Butte area to protect an endangered desert tortoise, KLAS reported.

Bundy refused to abide by the changes and stopped paying his grazing fees to the federal bureau, which he contends is infringing on state rights. His family has been ranching since the 1800s, before the U.S. Department of Interior was created and endangered species became a federal issue, he said in an interview with KLAS.

"My forefathers have been up and down the Virgin Valley ever since 1877. All these rights I claim have been created through pre-emptive rights and beneficial use of the forage and the water. I have been here longer. My rights are before the BLM even existed," Bundy told the station.
*******************************************************************

The state has the right to change the law. Citizens are obligated to obey they law in its present state. Bundy's claim to have a right to graze his cattle on that land because his family has been doing so for over a century is specious. If that land had been bought by an individual, would you support his right to continue grazing his cattle there?

Bundy's cattle should be seized. If that isn't enough to settle his debt to the US taxpayers, enough of his property to settle the debt should be seized as well. If it's possible to leave him a roof over his head, that would be nice, but I wouldn't guarantee it. This is his fault. He made his bed, he gets to lie in it.

 

[elektra]

Yes, seize, seize, seize.

No private ownership of land.

All hail the mighty Marxist revolution silently winning across America

 

[Abraham3]

The only one battling the concept of land ownership is Mr Bundy who seems to believe that the government doesn't actually have the right to own any. No one has attempted to deny that Bundy owns land. He just doesn't own the land on which he's been grazing his cattle while refusing to pay the fees. And in order to pay the debt he has accumulated, two different judges have said the state has the right to seize his property: the illegally grazing cattle.

Why don't you try discussing the facts of this case rather than throwing out inappropriate and inapplicable sound bites?

 

[Flanders]

The only one battling the concept of land ownership is Mr Bundy who seems to believe that the government doesn't actually have the right to own any. No one has attempted to deny that Bundy owns land. He just doesn't own the land on which he's been grazing his cattle while refusing to pay the fees. And in order to pay the debt he has accumulated, two different judges have said the state has the right to seize his property: the illegally grazing cattle.

Why don't you try discussing the facts of this case rather than throwing out inappropriate and inapplicable sound bites?

To Abraham3: You’re a stupid man. Government land is called public lands for a reason. The government does not own land in the same sense that private citizens own land although the BLM, the EPA, and other bureaucracies act as though they own the land and the water —— public and private. Even federal buildings stand on public lands.

Note: Public airwaves are the same as public lands. The public actually owns them. The government is supposed to manage them for the public good. The problem is that the government abuses both public airwaves and public lands for the benefit of wealthy parasites.

Aside from the facts stated in this thread read this thread for more.

Senate Democrats Are Responsible For Harry Reid - US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

 

[elektra]

All hail the dictates of the Environmental Marxist movement.

All property and control of land must be ceded to the all powerful dictates of Environmentalism

 

[westwall]

Oh, where is my little tin hat, little tin hat, little tin hat.................................

\





Refute what he says or piss off.

 

[flacaltenn]

All I need to know about the ARROGANCE of these absentee landlords who own 80% of Nevada is that ranchers like Bundy drove cattle on that land while the "GENIUSES" in charge of land management set off 1000 NUCLEAR BOMBS within spitting distance of their homes. Desert tortoises live 100 years. Go ask the ones with the burn marks and the one eye missing from the blasts..

These are same IMMORAL bastards that are EUTHANIZING desert tortoises because they got tired of running a piddly refuge for them and allowed 1000s more to moved to build MASSIVE solar projects already. They are CRAPPY managers of the land -- and those rabble standing up to them are aware of EVERY ONE of their piss poor decisions.. Here's another one they attempt to pin on the ranchers..

Virgin River | webdev.msi.ucsb.edu
Beetles were moved by managers to St. George in 2006, then dispersed down the Virgin River where in 2010 they defoliated plants through the Virgin Valley and in subsequent years continued moving to the Mormon Mesa area in 2011 and in 2012 to Lake Mead, including the inflow from the mainstem Colorado River. Beetles scrape the foliage, causing it to dry out, but it takes several years to kill the weed. Instead, they will gradually decline leaving native plants to recover and re-colonize the riverbanks.

Biocontrol is not without risk; while Diorhabda poses no threat to other plants, wildlife managers worry that defoliation may threaten the willow flycatcher, an endangered bird that nests in tamarisk at some Virgin River sites, and defoliation during breeding can expose nests to the elements. Recovery of willows and other native trees will provide better future habitat, but wildlife agencies must consider even short-term risk of harm. Thus, monitoring is needed to assess positive and negative responses, and to identify where actions such as restoration should be focused to minimize risks.

So they smoke Desert Tortoises with Nuclear weapons, Make the rest of them target practice for bombing ranges, and than have the audacity to blame the ranchers for a flycatcher that THEY HAVE pushed to territorial extinction by releasing BUSH - EATING BEETLES..

Rabble? Militia? Insurrection? Not at all.. These folk understand the land and the awful track record of the absentee landlords.. Wouldn't be surprised if evicting ALL ACTIVITY from the area was part of a major political payback or giveaway...

 

[tinydancer]

Bundy is a criminal who has not paid his grazing fees in 20 years. The government should seize all that he owns until said fees are paid.

It's not about his debt. BLM has picked the Gold Butte area for their multi million dollar mitigation project.

Part of the pay to play to pollute scheme the feds have on the go with the solar power plants.

Power plant pays $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to trash out the desert and BLM gets to play Mother Nature in another part of the desert to make it perfect for the threatened tortoise.

It's all on record. I would have thought at least some of the people on the board who pretend to be enviros would at least have shown a smidge of a concern about this pay to play bullshit.

Basically the feds are selling out the desert for green energy. And none of the enviros seem to give a shit.

 

[Flanders]

All hail the dictates of the Environmental Marxist movement.

All property and control of land must be ceded to the all powerful dictates of Environmentalism

To elektra: Exactly so. Public lands are no longer owned by the government (the American people). EPA bureaucrats own the land in the same way the owners of a private corporation own land. The EPA interferes in how private property is used, while nobody, not even Congress, can interfere in the things the EPA does. Heaven forbid that Congress upset the United Nations in any way.

The workforce (the American people) have no say in anything the EPA does. The EPA uses its “ownership” to promote a political agenda most Americans reject.

Incidentally, Harry Reid is the kind of politician who encourages and empowers federal bureaucrats. Calling Americans terrorists laid the groundwork for slaughtering everyone engaging in civil disobedience. Watch this 12:04 video to hear just how far Reid and his kind will go.

Megyn Kelly | The Kelly File | Fox News

Oh, where is my little tin hat, little tin hat, little tin hat.................................

Refute what he says or piss off.

To westwall: You’re asking for the impossible dream, but thanks just the same.

 

[Abraham3]

All I need to know about the ARROGANCE of these absentee landlords who own 80% of Nevada is that ranchers like Bundy drove cattle on that land while the "GENIUSES" in charge of land management set off 1000 NUCLEAR BOMBS within spitting distance of their homes. Desert tortoises live 100 years. Go ask the ones with the burn marks and the one eye missing from the blasts..

These are same IMMORAL bastards that are EUTHANIZING desert tortoises because they got tired of running a piddly refuge for them and allowed 1000s more to moved to build MASSIVE solar projects already. They are CRAPPY managers of the land -- and those rabble standing up to them are aware of EVERY ONE of their piss poor decisions.. Here's another one they attempt to pin on the ranchers..

Virgin River | webdev.msi.ucsb.edu
Beetles were moved by managers to St. George in 2006, then dispersed down the Virgin River where in 2010 they defoliated plants through the Virgin Valley and in subsequent years continued moving to the Mormon Mesa area in 2011 and in 2012 to Lake Mead, including the inflow from the mainstem Colorado River. Beetles scrape the foliage, causing it to dry out, but it takes several years to kill the weed. Instead, they will gradually decline leaving native plants to recover and re-colonize the riverbanks.

Biocontrol is not without risk; while Diorhabda poses no threat to other plants, wildlife managers worry that defoliation may threaten the willow flycatcher, an endangered bird that nests in tamarisk at some Virgin River sites, and defoliation during breeding can expose nests to the elements. Recovery of willows and other native trees will provide better future habitat, but wildlife agencies must consider even short-term risk of harm. Thus, monitoring is needed to assess positive and negative responses, and to identify where actions such as restoration should be focused to minimize risks.

So they smoke Desert Tortoises with Nuclear weapons, Make the rest of them target practice for bombing ranges, and than have the audacity to blame the ranchers for a flycatcher that THEY HAVE pushed to territorial extinction by releasing BUSH - EATING BEETLES..

Rabble? Militia? Insurrection? Not at all.. These folk understand the land and the awful track record of the absentee landlords.. Wouldn't be surprised if evicting ALL ACTIVITY from the area was part of a major political payback or giveaway...

Was that ACTUALLY supposed to have anything to do with the Bundy case? Are you suggesting that any of that excuses Bundy from obeying the law and paying his bills? For fuck's sake, next time you want to try to change the subject or throw out a red herring or two, do a little more thinking before you post.

 

[flacaltenn]

All I need to know about the ARROGANCE of these absentee landlords who own 80% of Nevada is that ranchers like Bundy drove cattle on that land while the "GENIUSES" in charge of land management set off 1000 NUCLEAR BOMBS within spitting distance of their homes. Desert tortoises live 100 years. Go ask the ones with the burn marks and the one eye missing from the blasts..

These are same IMMORAL bastards that are EUTHANIZING desert tortoises because they got tired of running a piddly refuge for them and allowed 1000s more to moved to build MASSIVE solar projects already. They are CRAPPY managers of the land -- and those rabble standing up to them are aware of EVERY ONE of their piss poor decisions.. Here's another one they attempt to pin on the ranchers..

Virgin River | webdev.msi.ucsb.edu
Beetles were moved by managers to St. George in 2006, then dispersed down the Virgin River where in 2010 they defoliated plants through the Virgin Valley and in subsequent years continued moving to the Mormon Mesa area in 2011 and in 2012 to Lake Mead, including the inflow from the mainstem Colorado River. Beetles scrape the foliage, causing it to dry out, but it takes several years to kill the weed. Instead, they will gradually decline leaving native plants to recover and re-colonize the riverbanks.

Biocontrol is not without risk; while Diorhabda poses no threat to other plants, wildlife managers worry that defoliation may threaten the willow flycatcher, an endangered bird that nests in tamarisk at some Virgin River sites, and defoliation during breeding can expose nests to the elements. Recovery of willows and other native trees will provide better future habitat, but wildlife agencies must consider even short-term risk of harm. Thus, monitoring is needed to assess positive and negative responses, and to identify where actions such as restoration should be focused to minimize risks.

So they smoke Desert Tortoises with Nuclear weapons, Make the rest of them target practice for bombing ranges, and than have the audacity to blame the ranchers for a flycatcher that THEY HAVE pushed to territorial extinction by releasing BUSH - EATING BEETLES..

Rabble? Militia? Insurrection? Not at all.. These folk understand the land and the awful track record of the absentee landlords.. Wouldn't be surprised if evicting ALL ACTIVITY from the area was part of a major political payback or giveaway...

Was that ACTUALLY supposed to have anything to do with the Bundy case? Are you suggesting that any of that excuses Bundy from obeying the law and paying his bills? For fuck's sake, next time you want to try to change the subject or throw out a red herring or two, do a little more thinking before you post.

I really thought your reading comprehension would be sufficient. Guess I over-estimated. Bundy ranch is not about Grazing permits or fees because TODAY -- there ARE NO MORE grazing permits in that area.. EVERY activity is now illegal.. Bundy just happens to be the last of 16 hold-outs. And those folks PROTESTING the closure are FULLY aware of the hypocrisy and the arrogance and the mismanagement record that I presented above. Total ClusterFuck of confused land use policies and PERHAPS crooked motivations.. Which is what the OP is really about..

You'll never get the irony of what you're missing --- as usual...

 

[Abraham3]

Bundy's cattle should be seized to pay his bills. If that's not enough, the rest of his property should be forfeit. If you'd prefer a nation that doesn't operate under the rule of law, there are a number of alternate locations you could try. Bundy as well.