The Official Zimmerman Trial Verdict Thread

[Luissa]

And if I had killed someone, I would expect anything they said about me and would probably deserve it... Since the death would have been caused by my actions.

You'd "deserve" to be lied about? Really? You'd deserve to have your reputation besmirched while the reputation of the person you killed was protected? God, but you're a saint!!!

If I caused their death why would it matter what their reputation is?

 

[Oldstyle]

Of course you want to believe a man who lied about his finances along with having a history of violence.

And what exactly IS his "history of violence", Luissa? Shoving away the arm of someone? Is that the best you've got? Because compared to George Zimmerman most people I know have a LOT more violent episodes in their "history's". I played hockey and got in dozens of fights. I took martial arts and competed in dozens of tournaments where I kicked and punched scores of people! I've tossed so many people out of the night clubs I've managed over the years I've lost count. Trust me when I tell you that most of those involved more than just brushing someone's arm away. I shudder to think what the liberal press would do with my reputation if they needed to tear me down.

Why did his girlfriend file a restraining order? Yes he counter filed afterwards, but I am guessing that would be they had a violent relationship.
And where did you hear he only shoved his arm away? I have never read that. Have you seen the police report?

She filed a restraining order and he counter filed...both were granted. So out of THAT you're assuming that they had a violent relationship? Gee, knowing how ugly it can get when LOTS of people break up I'm not going to leap to that conclusion. It could simply be they simply loathed each other and made the separation legal.

As for the police report? Didn't you chastise others for not reading the string? Oops...guess who obviously DIDN'T!

 

[Oldstyle]

What I got out of this case so far is A) Zimmerman is an asshole who should have listened to dispatch when they said to not follow Martin, and wanted to play "bad-ass-I-have-a-gun" along with the self righteous opinion of "I-am-a-part-of-neighborhood-watch-therefore-I-am-a-double-bad-ass" as entitlement to do what he did. Did he plan on the final results? I don't think so. Is he responsible? Yes.
B) Martin, in my opinion, was an asshole for not running to his home, not calling the cops, and going back to where Zimmerman "lost him" and confronting Zimmerman thinking he would be "a bad-ass-look-at-me", not knowing Zimmerman was armed. Did HE plan on the final results of his actions? Probably not. Is he responsible for his actions that night? Yes.

In short..both were idiots.

I believe the initial police report. It said Zimmerman was justified in everything he did and told the truth that was backed up by forensics evidence on the scene.

The initial police report wanted to arrest Zimmerman on a manslaughter charge because the lead detective didn't believe Zimmerman.

The forensic evidence wasn't available until weeks later.

Even the physical evidence was not consistent with Zimmerman's story.


>>>>

Actually that was the story that was floated by the main stream media when they bought into the whole "racist police force" theory for why Zimmerman wasn't charged. It was later refuted. Zimmerman's story has always remained consistent despite being questioned on it REPEATEDLY. It's why I believe him.

 

[Luissa]

And what exactly IS his "history of violence", Luissa? Shoving away the arm of someone? Is that the best you've got? Because compared to George Zimmerman most people I know have a LOT more violent episodes in their "history's". I played hockey and got in dozens of fights. I took martial arts and competed in dozens of tournaments where I kicked and punched scores of people! I've tossed so many people out of the night clubs I've managed over the years I've lost count. Trust me when I tell you that most of those involved more than just brushing someone's arm away. I shudder to think what the liberal press would do with my reputation if they needed to tear me down.

Why did his girlfriend file a restraining order? Yes he counter filed afterwards, but I am guessing that would be they had a violent relationship.
And where did you hear he only shoved his arm away? I have never read that. Have you seen the police report?

She filed a restraining order and he counter filed...both were granted. So out of THAT you're assuming that they had a violent relationship? Gee, knowing how ugly it can get when LOTS of people break up I'm not going to leap to that conclusion. It could simply be they simply loathed each other and made the separation legal.

As for the police report? Didn't you chastise others for not reading the string? Oops...guess who obviously DIDN'T!

I have broken up with many boyfriends I have never had to get a restraining order. If they are married most legal separations do not need restraining orders. You are dead set on Zimmerman being a saint aren't you?
And I read what you posted and others, I didn't see anything about him just pushing his arm out of the way. Care to show me?

 

[Luissa]

I believe the initial police report. It said Zimmerman was justified in everything he did and told the truth that was backed up by forensics evidence on the scene.

The initial police report wanted to arrest Zimmerman on a manslaughter charge because the lead detective didn't believe Zimmerman.

The forensic evidence wasn't available until weeks later.

Even the physical evidence was not consistent with Zimmerman's story.


>>>>

Actually that was the story that was floated by the main stream media when they bought into the whole "racist police force" theory for why Zimmerman wasn't charged. It was later refuted. Zimmerman's story has always remained consistent despite being questioned on it REPEATEDLY. It's why I believe him.

Really, it has? I don't think you have looked into it much then. I think you want to believe him because he is a fellow gun owner. See how that works?

 

[Luissa]

Everything I have read said he shoved the officer not shoved his arm out of the way. Please show me where it says that.

 

[Oldstyle]

Zimmerman's assaulting the police office was not dismissed because Zimmerman didn't know the officer in the process of making arrests wasn't a police officer. The charges were eventually dropped because, up to that point Zimmerman had no arrest record for violence so he was routed into a Pre-Trial Diversion Program for first offenders requiring completion of anger management counseling. The statement by the police officer clearly showed that he'd identified himself and shown Zimmerman his badge, so ya Zimmerman did know that the person was law enforcement.


>>>>

It was an undercover agent with the State ATF and Zimmerman didn't know he was law enforcement until after the confrontation began. THAT is why the charges were dropped from assaulting an officer to "resisting officer without violence". Zimmerman was trying to get into the Sheriff's Department at the time. You really think that he would have assaulted someone he KNEW was law enforcement? THAT is the story that was put out about him but as usual the news media got it wrong in their zeal to make him out to be the "dangerous racist".

It was an undercover agent with a State agency responsible for business and alcohol enforcement (I don't remember if it was called "ATF").

Zimmerman was arrested for assault AFTER the officer who was in the process of making another arrest identified himself as an officer and showed Zimmerman his badge. The charges were reduced because of acceptance into a pre-trial diversion program instead of processing him for a felony conviction. The charges were reduced and finally dismissed after mandatory counseling.

​

That July, Zimmerman was charged with resisting arrest, violence, and battery of an officer after shoving an undercover alcohol-control agent who was arresting an under-age friend of Zimmerman's at a bar. He avoided conviction by agreeing to participate in a pre-trial diversion program that included anger-management classes.

Zimmerman accused of domestic violence, fighting with a police officer - U.S. News
George Zimmerman: Prelude to a shooting | Reuters

Fuck You.

Zimmerman's response to the police officer after he identified himself.

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/exhibit_list_redacted.pdf



>>>>

It's in that last http, Luissa...anything else I can do to help get you up to speed on this?

 

[Oldstyle]

Everything I have read said he shoved the officer not shoved his arm out of the way. Please show me where it says that.

Which goes to show that the sources that you've been getting your information from are the very ones that I stated had a narrative about Zimmerman that was based more on what they WANTED him to be...than what he actually was.

 

[Oldstyle]

You know...those same sources that insisted on running a picture of Trayvon Martin from years earlier that made him look like skinny apple cheeked cherub instead of some of the more recent ones that made him look like a thug?

 

[Luissa]

It was an undercover agent with the State ATF and Zimmerman didn't know he was law enforcement until after the confrontation began. THAT is why the charges were dropped from assaulting an officer to "resisting officer without violence". Zimmerman was trying to get into the Sheriff's Department at the time. You really think that he would have assaulted someone he KNEW was law enforcement? THAT is the story that was put out about him but as usual the news media got it wrong in their zeal to make him out to be the "dangerous racist".

It was an undercover agent with a State agency responsible for business and alcohol enforcement (I don't remember if it was called "ATF").

Zimmerman was arrested for assault AFTER the officer who was in the process of making another arrest identified himself as an officer and showed Zimmerman his badge. The charges were reduced because of acceptance into a pre-trial diversion program instead of processing him for a felony conviction. The charges were reduced and finally dismissed after mandatory counseling.

​

​

Zimmerman accused of domestic violence, fighting with a police officer - U.S. News
George Zimmerman: Prelude to a shooting | Reuters

Fuck You.

Zimmerman's response to the police officer after he identified himself.

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/exhibit_list_redacted.pdf



>>>>

It's in that last http, Luissa...anything else I can do to help get you up to speed on this?

I thought you stated he didn't know it was a Law Enforcement Officer? And what does a short struggle mean? Maybe shoving?

It sounds like he did a little more to him than push his hands away, and that he actually knew they were law enforcement officers. I will admit I haven't followed the thread closely in the last hour, did you admit you were wrong about that?

 

[Oldstyle]

It was an undercover agent with a State agency responsible for business and alcohol enforcement (I don't remember if it was called "ATF").

Zimmerman was arrested for assault AFTER the officer who was in the process of making another arrest identified himself as an officer and showed Zimmerman his badge. The charges were reduced because of acceptance into a pre-trial diversion program instead of processing him for a felony conviction. The charges were reduced and finally dismissed after mandatory counseling.

​

​

Zimmerman accused of domestic violence, fighting with a police officer - U.S. News
George Zimmerman: Prelude to a shooting | Reuters

​

Zimmerman's response to the police officer after he identified himself.

http://www.flcourts18.org/PDF/Press_Releases/exhibit_list_redacted.pdf



>>>>

It's in that last http, Luissa...anything else I can do to help get you up to speed on this?

I thought you stated he didn't know it was a Law Enforcement Officer? And what does a short struggle mean? Maybe shoving?

It sounds like he did a little more to him than push his hands away, and that he actually knew they were law enforcement officers. I will admit I haven't followed the thread closely in the last hour, did you admit you were wrong about that?

I'm a big fan of most law enforcement officials, Luissa. The only one's I'm not real keen on are the ATF folks, especially on the State level. They used to pull things like coming into the club I managed, declaring that they thought there were under aged patrons being served and demanding that the bar be cleared as they carded each person leaving to make sure that they had proper ID. So even though we carded religiously they would end up with six or seven people who stated that they didn't have any ID. Why? Because under aged kids only get in trouble for using a fake ID if they get caught with it by the police. If they say that they never were carded (even though they were!) they are free to go and it's the bar that gets written up for serving minors. When I say there was no love lost between the State Alcohol agents and bars I'm not exaggerating. They acted like the Gestapo. We had to spend big money on a photo system that recorded each ID that was given to us when we carded and even THEN those pricks would try to nail us for serving minors. It's essentially a "raid" like in the old Prohibition days and the first moment of them were always a complete cluster you know what because they weren't in uniform and nobody knew what was going down.

 

[Luissa]

It's in that last http, Luissa...anything else I can do to help get you up to speed on this?

I thought you stated he didn't know it was a Law Enforcement Officer? And what does a short struggle mean? Maybe shoving?

It sounds like he did a little more to him than push his hands away, and that he actually knew they were law enforcement officers. I will admit I haven't followed the thread closely in the last hour, did you admit you were wrong about that?

I'm a big fan of most law enforcement officials, Luissa. The only one's I'm not real keen on are the ATF folks, especially on the State level. They used to pull things like coming into the club I managed, declaring that they thought there were under aged patrons being served and demanding that the bar be cleared as they carded each person leaving to make sure that they had proper ID. So even though we carded religiously they would end up with six or seven people who stated that they didn't have any ID. Why? Because under aged kids only get in trouble for using a fake ID if they get caught with it by the police. If they say that they never were carded (even though they were!) they are free to go and it's the bar that gets written up for serving minors. When I say there was no love lost between the State Alcohol agents and bars I'm not exaggerating. They acted like the Gestapo. We had to spend big money on a photo system that recorded each ID that was given to us when we carded and even THEN those pricks would try to nail us for serving minors. It's essentially a "raid" like in the old Prohibition days and the first moment of them were always a complete cluster you know what because they weren't in uniform and nobody knew what was going down.

So you didn't admit you were wrong, got it.

 

[Oldstyle]

The law enforcement official claims to have identified himself...Zimmerman says he didn't do so. The undercover agent turned someone pushing their arm away into an "assault of a police officer" charge. It's typical behavior for them. These guys are cowboys and they get off on the whole undercover bust thing. The fact that the charge was reduced like it was should tell you that the assault charge was a joke in the first place. The sad part is that it very well would have stuck if Zimmerman's father wasn't a judge.

 

[Luissa]

The law enforcement official claims to have identified himself...Zimmerman says he didn't do so. The undercover agent turned someone pushing their arm away into an "assault of a police officer" charge. It's typical behavior for them. These guys are cowboys and they get off on the whole undercover bust thing. The fact that the charge was reduced like it was should tell you that the assault charge was a joke in the first place. The sad part is that it very well would have stuck if Zimmerman's father wasn't a judge.

He got off because he entered a diversion program. And you are going to believe the word of a proven liar over an ATF agent... Because you don't like ATF agents? And assume he was lying?

 

[Oldstyle]

I thought you stated he didn't know it was a Law Enforcement Officer? And what does a short struggle mean? Maybe shoving?

It sounds like he did a little more to him than push his hands away, and that he actually knew they were law enforcement officers. I will admit I haven't followed the thread closely in the last hour, did you admit you were wrong about that?

I'm a big fan of most law enforcement officials, Luissa. The only one's I'm not real keen on are the ATF folks, especially on the State level. They used to pull things like coming into the club I managed, declaring that they thought there were under aged patrons being served and demanding that the bar be cleared as they carded each person leaving to make sure that they had proper ID. So even though we carded religiously they would end up with six or seven people who stated that they didn't have any ID. Why? Because under aged kids only get in trouble for using a fake ID if they get caught with it by the police. If they say that they never were carded (even though they were!) they are free to go and it's the bar that gets written up for serving minors. When I say there was no love lost between the State Alcohol agents and bars I'm not exaggerating. They acted like the Gestapo. We had to spend big money on a photo system that recorded each ID that was given to us when we carded and even THEN those pricks would try to nail us for serving minors. It's essentially a "raid" like in the old Prohibition days and the first moment of them were always a complete cluster you know what because they weren't in uniform and nobody knew what was going down.

So you didn't admit you were wrong, got it.

In what way was "I" wrong, Luissa? I've taken so many fake ID's from kids over the years they would fill dozens of bushel baskets. Youngsters want to get into bars. Bar's want to keep them out. If anything happens and it turns out a minor is involved it's the kiss of death. You lose your license to serve alcohol which means you might as well lock the doors because you're done.

 

[Oldstyle]

The law enforcement official claims to have identified himself...Zimmerman says he didn't do so. The undercover agent turned someone pushing their arm away into an "assault of a police officer" charge. It's typical behavior for them. These guys are cowboys and they get off on the whole undercover bust thing. The fact that the charge was reduced like it was should tell you that the assault charge was a joke in the first place. The sad part is that it very well would have stuck if Zimmerman's father wasn't a judge.

He got off because he entered a diversion program. And you are going to believe the word of a proven liar over an ATF agent... Because you don't like ATF agents? And assume he was lying?

No, I'm going to take the agent's report on what happened with a very large grain of salt having been on the receiving end of a few of those and knowing only too well the games that they play when they need to cover their asses.

 

[Luissa]

The law enforcement official claims to have identified himself...Zimmerman says he didn't do so. The undercover agent turned someone pushing their arm away into an "assault of a police officer" charge. It's typical behavior for them. These guys are cowboys and they get off on the whole undercover bust thing. The fact that the charge was reduced like it was should tell you that the assault charge was a joke in the first place. The sad part is that it very well would have stuck if Zimmerman's father wasn't a judge.

He got off because he entered a diversion program. And you are going to believe the word of a proven liar over an ATF agent... Because you don't like ATF agents? And assume he was lying?

No, I'm going to take the agent's report on what happened with a very large grain of salt having been on the receiving end of a few of those and no only too well the games that they play when they need to cover their asses.

But you aren't going to take Zimmerman's account of what happened with a grain salt even though he has been proven to be a liar?
Sounds legit.

 

[Oldstyle]

He got off because he entered a diversion program. And you are going to believe the word of a proven liar over an ATF agent... Because you don't like ATF agents? And assume he was lying?

No, I'm going to take the agent's report on what happened with a very large grain of salt having been on the receiving end of a few of those and no only too well the games that they play when they need to cover their asses.

But you aren't going to take Zimmerman's account of what happened with a grain salt even though he has been proven to be a liar?
Sounds legit.

What has he testified to about that night that's been proven to be a lie? Educate me!

 

[Oldstyle]

People who ARE lying invariably trip themselves up because they can't keep their story straight. George Zimmerman's story about what happened that night hasn't changed despite being questioned on numerous occasions.

In general, I take EVERYONE'S account about things like this with a grain of salt. If only the main stream media had done that!

 

[Luissa]

People who ARE lying invariably trip themselves up because they can't keep their story straight. George Zimmerman's story about what happened that night hasn't changed despite being questioned on numerous occasions.

In general, I take EVERYONE'S account about things like this with a grain of salt. If only the main stream media had done that!

But on Wednesday night’s broadcast, Zimmerman changed his story from what he told the dispatcher that night. He also said there was no way Martin was afraid of him. Here’s part of the transcript prepared by FOX News:

HANNITY: Why do you think that he was running then?
ZIMMERMAN: Maybe I said running, but he was more —

HANNITY: You said he’s running.

ZIMMERMAN: Yes. He was like skipping, going away quickly. But he wasn’t running out of fear.

HANNITY: You could tell the difference?

ZIMMERMAN: He wasn’t running.

HANNITY: So he wasn’t actually running?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir.

HANNITY: OK. Because that’s what you said to the dispatcher, that you thought he was running.
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/07/george_zimmerman_changes_story_fox.php?m=1