Torture, or whatever you want to call it, "justified" by majority

[bodecea]

May or may not have done something??

WOW guess being on a battlefield trying to kill US troops is a nothing in your eyes??

Oh and there are no "Innocent" Muslims. The "innocent" Muslims do nothing to rein in the jihadist among them so one has to assume they agree with and condone what the jihadists do in Allah's name.

Oh and they were the "innocent" Muslims cheering on 9-11.

There are No "innocent" Muslims and I could care if they stand on broken bones, get waterboarded or are kept from sleeping.

They get a better deal than the 3,000 dead did on 9-11.

Actually, it's not a question of feeling better....it's about admitting reality and not really caring what happens to those being tortured.

Call it whatever the hell you want to call it.

I CALL IT DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE.

Most people understand that "a word" never saved a single life in war.

I admire my fellow Americans who take the steps required to keep my children safe, and I abhor those that question their deeds.

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

Just curious....what do you think would happen to someone going to small town USA and start shouting a love for Allah at the top of their lungs?

 

[Pop23]

Call it whatever the hell you want to call it.

I CALL IT DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE.

Most people understand that "a word" never saved a single life in war.

I admire my fellow Americans who take the steps required to keep my children safe, and I abhor those that question their deeds.

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

What does your Iraq stuff have to do with America? Are you saying you want America to be MORE like that? Or that demonstrates the American values that so many AMERICANS have died to preserve?

Look - you're scared. I get it. But man up and take a stand for AMERICA and what WE value - not Iraq.

Man up? Give me a freaking break. War is hell.

Deal with that

 

[bodecea]

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

There is a huge difference between us and Iraq.

Should we act like Iraq in order to protect our freedoms?

How far are you willing to go?

It's been answered

If it takes nuking the barbarians......

Proceed

What is your suggestion for Ground Zero?

 

[nodoginnafight]

Call it whatever the hell you want to call it.

I CALL IT DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE.

Most people understand that "a word" never saved a single life in war.

I admire my fellow Americans who take the steps required to keep my children safe, and I abhor those that question their deeds.

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

Just curious....what do you think would happen to someone going to small town USA and start shouting a love for Allah at the top of their lungs?

Maybe something like this:

Oklahoma Muslims Rally against ISIS KFOR.com

 

[Pop23]

Call it whatever the hell you want to call it.

I CALL IT DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE.

Most people understand that "a word" never saved a single life in war.

I admire my fellow Americans who take the steps required to keep my children safe, and I abhor those that question their deeds.

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

Just curious....what do you think would happen to someone going to small town USA and start shouting a love for Allah at the top of their lungs?

Yelled at?

Then you'd call that torture.

 

[Meathead]

I guess if liberals kill them outright nothing to talk about?

Sure. Start a topic on it.

However...I'm not seeing this as a liberal/conservative issue.

If you actually read the article you would have found that conservatives and moderates, even Democrats, found the interrogations justified while liberals did not.

My comment was directed not at what was found in the article (which I read) but rather at the fact that I don't think torture itself is or should be a left/right issue. Maybe it is, but I would think it should bother people on both sides of the ideological divide. Fear certainly allows us to justify a lot of things that later we deeply regret and were found to be unnecessary and served no useful purpose - for example the internment of the Japanese-Americans.

While many regret the internment of Japanese-Americans, most do not seem to be sorry for the interrogation techniques used on people like KSM. This is the guy's testimony, "I decapitated with my blessed right hand the head of the American Jew,"

Sorry, your equivalency is BS.

Many regret it NOW - years after the fact. How long did it take to even grant the reparations? "Regret" is easy, long after the deed when rationality takes over isn't it? And there are still people who justify it even now.

KSM was only one person. Many of those tortured were of dubious value who may or may not have done anything worth torturing. And even then - no useful informatioin was gained. So what's the real purpose of the torture? Punative?

KSM was only one person? Didn't we already have a short chat about grasping the obvious and spewing platitudes?

As for the rest, how the hell do you know these things? Based on a highly partisan report which has the legitimacy of a Rolling Stone article and has been roundly disavowed by all in the actual intelligence community?

If I need a conscience or feel like self-flagellating, I'll let you know. In the meantime I call BS once again.

 

[Ame®icano]

 

[Pop23]

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

There is a huge difference between us and Iraq.

Should we act like Iraq in order to protect our freedoms?

How far are you willing to go?

It's been answered

If it takes nuking the barbarians......

Proceed

What is your suggestion for Ground Zero?

It only takes one. Do I get to pick it?

Believe me......

I'd be happy to

 

[PoliticalChic]

Stop tap-dancing: yes or no.

...if you could save the 80-90 children slaughtered by the savages, would you have acquiesced to the enhanced interrogations?

Sure we would. Let's just not pretend that it isn't torture. Let's just not pretend that we as a country are any better than them.

1. None of the methods used rise to the level of 'torture.'

2. "The Constitution is not a suicide pact"

3. For comparison....this is torture:
From “Magnifico: The Brilliant Life and Violent Times of Lorenzo De Medici,” by Miles Unger, p. 227-228.

"An incident recorded by the diarist Luca Landucci vividly illustrated the dangers awaiting those who threatened bodily harm to the leading citizens of the regime:

27th September [1481]. A certain hermit came to the house of Lorenzo de’ Medici at the Poggio a Caiano; and the servants declared that he intended to murder Lorenzo, so they took him and sent him to the Bargello, and he was put to the rack.

15th October. This hermit died at Santa Maria Novella, having been tortured in various ways. It was said that they skinned the soles of his feet, and then burnt them by holding them in the fire till the fat dripped off them; after which they set him upright and made him walk across the hall; and these things caused his death. Opinions were divided as to whether he were guilty or innocent."

You're in denial. Of course we torture. Meh. So what. Don't pretend we don't and move on.

I see you've memorized the bumper-sticker of the America-haters.

People who embrace torture hate America

Good thing America doesn't torture, huh.

 

[bodecea]

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

Just curious....what do you think would happen to someone going to small town USA and start shouting a love for Allah at the top of their lungs?

Yelled at?

Then you'd call that torture.

So, you think they would just be yelled at?

 

[nodoginnafight]

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

What does your Iraq stuff have to do with America? Are you saying you want America to be MORE like that? Or that demonstrates the American values that so many AMERICANS have died to preserve?

Look - you're scared. I get it. But man up and take a stand for AMERICA and what WE value - not Iraq.

Man up? Give me a freaking break. War is hell.

Deal with that

What a coward.

Thank God our country was founded and has been protected by people made of sterner stuff.

You don't protect America by turning it into Iraq!

 

[BullKurtz]

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

Well, we were in pretty much the same place after Pearl Harbor that we were after 9/11...not knowing what was coming next. It's easy to criticize after the smoke has cleared.....forgetting to thank those who cleared the smoke for us. Should the Japanese have been put in camps? Nobody knows how much sabotage and insurgency was prevented but there would have been some. The difference between interning the Japanese but not the German Americans was one of simple reality....our Germans never believed Hitler was a deity like the Japs believed Hirohito was....no German pilot was ever involved in a planned kamikaze attack...they were fanatics of a whole different stripe.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Let's preserve America for people who love America and appreciate the ideals and values that make us great.

Let's preserve America.....ban Liberals.

 

[Discombobulated]

Torture, or whatever you want to call it, "justified" by majority of Americans.

New poll finds majority of Americans believe torture justified after 9 11 attacks - The Washington Post

By an almost 2-1 margin, or 59-to-31 percent, those interviewed support the CIA’s brutal methods, with the vast majority of supporters saying they produced valuable intelligence.

Shows just how far this country has fallen.

 

[bodecea]

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

There is a huge difference between us and Iraq.

Should we act like Iraq in order to protect our freedoms?

How far are you willing to go?

It's been answered

If it takes nuking the barbarians......

Proceed

What is your suggestion for Ground Zero?

It only takes one. Do I get to pick it?

Believe me......

I'd be happy to

It only takes one? You think all the bad guys are within range of one nuke? Ok, what would you pick as Ground Zero? And why?

 

[rightwinger]

People who embrace torture hate America

Don't let the door hit ya in the ass on your way to Cuba, Benedict.

Odd that you should choose Cuba ....a haven for torture

Maybe our Conservatives should consider it

 

[bodecea]

Let's preserve America for people who love America and appreciate the ideals and values that make us great.

Let's preserve America.....ban Liberals.

How would you manage that logistically?

 

[rightwinger]

Sure we would. Let's just not pretend that it isn't torture. Let's just not pretend that we as a country are any better than them.

1. None of the methods used rise to the level of 'torture.'

2. "The Constitution is not a suicide pact"

3. For comparison....this is torture:
From “Magnifico: The Brilliant Life and Violent Times of Lorenzo De Medici,” by Miles Unger, p. 227-228.

"An incident recorded by the diarist Luca Landucci vividly illustrated the dangers awaiting those who threatened bodily harm to the leading citizens of the regime:

27th September [1481]. A certain hermit came to the house of Lorenzo de’ Medici at the Poggio a Caiano; and the servants declared that he intended to murder Lorenzo, so they took him and sent him to the Bargello, and he was put to the rack.

15th October. This hermit died at Santa Maria Novella, having been tortured in various ways. It was said that they skinned the soles of his feet, and then burnt them by holding them in the fire till the fat dripped off them; after which they set him upright and made him walk across the hall; and these things caused his death. Opinions were divided as to whether he were guilty or innocent."

You're in denial. Of course we torture. Meh. So what. Don't pretend we don't and move on.

I see you've memorized the bumper-sticker of the America-haters.

People who embrace torture hate America

Good thing America doesn't torture, huh.

We didn't used to.....There was a time when America stood on the moral high ground
How quickly we gave that up

 

[Ame®icano]

Call it whatever the hell you want to call it.

I CALL IT DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE.

Most people understand that "a word" never saved a single life in war.

I admire my fellow Americans who take the steps required to keep my children safe, and I abhor those that question their deeds.

How far are you willing to go in "DOING WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PROTECT OUR FUTURE"?

Don't be fooled - this isn't about protecting "our future." THAT would include honoring and sacrificing to preserve the ideals and principles that make America a beacon to the world.

This is all about protecting the hide of bedwetters who shit on the sacrifices that others have made to protect American values in order to create an illusion of security for themselves and their own quivering asses.

It's a fine line when one of the things we value is a free and open society - how far are people really willing to go, and sacrifice those freedoms, in order to have "security"?

Most of the time - like the internment of the Japanese, people are perfectly willing to sacrifice the rights and freedoms of "others" - as long as it's not their own. Same with torture - it doesn't matter that information can be gained another way, or that the people being tortured may or may not have done anything wrong - they aren't "us" so we're willing to sacrifice them thinking it will make us safer because we're afraid.

There's been a huge upsurge in school shootings and random gun violence - should the rights of gun owners be sacrificed for public safety?

You don't understand.

Stopping these barbarians IS PROTECTING OUR FREEDOMS.

Here's a test. Go to Iraq. Start shouting at the top of your lungs a love for Jesus. Report back.

There is a huge difference between us and Iraq.

Should we act like Iraq in order to protect our freedoms?

How far are you willing to go?

When in Rome do as Roman do. When in Iraq...

 

[BullKurtz]

Odd that you should choose Cuba ....a haven for torture

Maybe our Conservatives should consider it

Incoherent as usual.