Trump, the 14th and barring from office

[DigitalDrifter]

Careful what you wish for. The only way Biden wins re-election is if Trump is his opponent.

 

[Dadoalex]

See post 215 before you make yourself look more ignorant. BTW, all criminal laws require conviction for there to be consequences.

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How could I look ignorant in front of you?

The 14th doesn't define any process so to claim any action taken under the 14th is "unconstitutional" is silly on its face and just plain dumb everywhere else.

Did the SCOTUS reverse the action?
No?
Then a majority vote in Congress could indeed disqualify a person with a 2/3 vote required to undo the ban.

That is the current precedent.

 

[Rawley]

Ahhh
so anyone with any education then.

Makes your ignorance inexcusable.

 

[Dadoalex]

Makes your ignorance inexcusable.

There's some reflection for ya!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[OKTexas]

How could I look ignorant in front of you?

The 14th doesn't define any process so to claim any action taken under the 14th is "unconstitutional" is silly on its face and just plain dumb everywhere else.

Did the SCOTUS reverse the action?
No?
Then a majority vote in Congress could indeed disqualify a person with a 2/3 vote required to undo the ban.

That is the current precedent.

Section 5 of the 14th defines the process. It's really simple. And I'll be damned if I can find and exception for section 3. But I guess you're too simple to understand.

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[Dadoalex]

Section 5 of the 14th defines the process. It's really simple. And I'll be damned if I can find and exception for section 3. But I guess you're too simple to understand.

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And?
Speaking of simple, since Congress never made any laws on this to whom does enforcement fall? (Think 10th)

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I'd say "don't be stupid" but, what's the use?

I'd say your ignorant and a waste of oxygen.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

And?
Speaking of simple, since Congress never made any laws on this to whom does enforcement fall? (Think 10th)

Congress determines an insurrection.
Congress created the 14th amendment as a restriction on the states. The states have no say over the 14th amendment. You really want to go with the 10th amendment?

 

[Rawley]

Section 5 of the 14th defines the process. It's really simple. And I'll be damned if I can find and exception for section 3. But I guess you're too simple to understand.

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Interestingly, during the Civil War, Congress passed an Act giving the President the power to declare a state of insurrection.

Page 284

https://tile.loc.gov/storage-services/service/ll/llsl//llsl-c37/llsl-c37.pdf

 

[Rawley]

There's some reflection for ya!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

QED. The word you are looking for is "projection"

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Interestingly, during the Civil War, Congress passed an Act giving the President the power to declare a state of insurrection.

Page 284

https://tile.loc.gov/storage-services/service/ll/llsl//llsl-c37/llsl-c37.pdf

Yes they did and it was suggested that he used that authority in 2020 but he didn't

 

[OKTexas]

And?
Speaking of simple, since Congress never made any laws on this to whom does enforcement fall? (Think 10th)

They did make a law to address section 3 specifically and it's a criminal law. So wrong again. Of course you have a link to prove me wrong, RIGHT!

.

 

[Rawley]

Yes they did and it was suggested that he used that authority in 2020 but he didn't

And even with over 3,000 charges, his DOJ has refused to charge anyone with insurrection.

 

[OKTexas]

Interestingly, during the Civil War, Congress passed an Act giving the President the power to declare a state of insurrection.

Page 284

https://tile.loc.gov/storage-services/service/ll/llsl//llsl-c37/llsl-c37.pdf

Not page 284, that deals with trustees for DC and Georgetown.

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[Rawley]

Not page 284, that deals with trustees for DC and Georgetown.

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?? on page 284

CHAP. XXXII.—An Act in addition to an Act entitled "An Act further to provide for the Collection of Duties on Imports and for other Purposes," approved July thirteenth,
A. D. eighteen hundred and sixty-one.
Be it enacted by the Senate and States of America in Congress assembled, That the power of the President to declare the inhabitants of any State, or any part thereof, in a state of insurrection, as provided in the fifth section of the act to which this is an addition, shall extend to and include the inhabitants of any State or part thereof, where such insurrection against the United States shall be found by the President at any time to exist.

Lincoln used this power to declare an insurrection

Now, therefore, I, Abraham Lincoln, President of the United States, in pursuance of an act of Congress approved July 13, 1861, do hereby declare that the inhabitants of the said States of Georgia, South Carolina, Virginia, North Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama, Louisiana, Texas, Arkansas, Mississippi, and Florida (except the inhabitants of that part of the State of Virginia lying west of the Alleghany Mountains and of such other parts of that State and the other States hereinbefore named as may maintain a loyal adhesion to the Union and the Constitution or may be from time to time occupied and controlled by forces of the United States engaged in the dispersion of said insurgents) are in a state of insurrection against the United States.

Proclamation 86—Prohibiting Commercial Trade with States in Rebellion | The American Presidency Project

www.presidency.ucsb.edu

 

[OKTexas]

?? on page 284

CHAP. XXXII.—An Act in addition to an Act entitled "An Act further to provide for the Collection of Duties on Imports and for other Purposes," approved July thirteenth,
A. D. eighteen hundred and sixty-one.
Be it enacted by the Senate and States of America in Congress assembled, That the power of the President to declare the inhabitants of any State, or any part thereof, in a state of insurrection, as provided in the fifth section of the act to which this is an addition, shall extend to and include the inhabitants of any State or part thereof, where such insurrection against the United States shall be found by the President at any time to exist.

Lincoln used this power to declare an insurrection

Now, therefore, I, Abraham Lincoln, President of the United States, in pursuance of an act of Congress approved July 13, 1861, do hereby declare that the inhabitants of the said States of Georgia, South Carolina, Virginia, North Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama, Louisiana, Texas, Arkansas, Mississippi, and Florida (except the inhabitants of that part of the State of Virginia lying west of the Alleghany Mountains and of such other parts of that State and the other States hereinbefore named as may maintain a loyal adhesion to the Union and the Constitution or may be from time to time occupied and controlled by forces of the United States engaged in the dispersion of said insurgents) are in a state of insurrection against the United States.

Proclamation 86—Prohibiting Commercial Trade with States in Rebellion | The American Presidency Project

www.presidency.ucsb.edu

When you post a PDF with 507 pages, you give the PDF page which is page 30 not 284. In your numbers there is no page 283. Regardless no such declaration has been made concerning Jan 6.

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[bigrebnc1775]

When you post a PDF with 507 pages, you give the PDF page which is page 30 not 284. In your numbers there is no page 283. Regardless no such declaration has been made concerning Jan 6.

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Trump could have used in in 2020. But he didn't.

 

[Cellblock2429]

Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office​

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

First, the Ballots

I don't see anything in the text that calls for, permits, or forbids removing a person's name from the ballots. In the primaries this is solely a State decision and in the General this still falls to the states although Federal jurisdiction may be inferred via the VRA.

I don't see that SCOTUS has any jurisdiction in the primary prospect and its jurisdiction in the General is "iffy."

Certification at the State

This is the first place I see that Trump could be excluded. State legislatures, under the 14th, could refuse to certify a Trump win and decide to submit a different slate of electors or no electors at all.

The Congress

One of three places Trump could be declared an insurrectionist. Courts, and State Legislatures being the others. My reading says that a majority of each House, any State legislature, or any Federal court has the authority to declare Trump an insurrectionist at which time Trump can only enter any Federal office, elected or not, upon a 2/3 vote of each house of Congress.

Not sure how it would work in the Congress. Would each House hold a separate vote as to whether Trump is an insurrectionist? Would the VP declare Trump ineligible and the collective Congress vote?

My thinking favors the latter as the VP is "in charge" during the certification process.

My own thinking here is that Trump is ineligible to hold any Federal office with the actual events and the numbers of people convicted for their actions under Trump's direction/banner.

I'd like to discuss how such a ban would be implemented.

/——/

 

[Dadoalex]

I'd say your ignorant and a waste of oxygen.

So?
Stop wasting oxygen.

 

[Dadoalex]

Congress determines an insurrection.
Congress created the 14th amendment as a restriction on the states. The states have no say over the 14th amendment. You really want to go with the 10th amendment?

I thought you said the courts did that?

Perhaps you could show us your SCOTUS creds?