US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds.

[oreo]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

Yeah, clearly Putin did not expect this kind of response. He wanted Trump expecting Trump would lift current U.S. Sanctions, and that has clearly backfired on him. The last thing Putin wanted was more U.S. Sanctions which Republicans in the Senate have already promised. Obama kicking out all Russian diplomats is historic. They go along with their families that may have been rooted in this country for decades. Prior to all this a Russian diplomat did admit that they had contact with the Trump campaign.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=

Putin has already stated that he won't kick out American diplomats. So he has to repair the damage done, because all gains over the last 20 years, or since the cold war are now GONE. He knows he did it by interfering in our National election, something they've never done before. But they went after the Pentagon recently.
Russian hack almost brought the U.S. military to its knees

It's going to be very interesting to see what Putin does over the next few weeks. Obama is to release more information over the next few weeks, but it looks like Obama and Senate Republicans are intent on diminishing the credibility of the Trump administration long before he is sworn in. Trump won't even be able to blink at Russia without suspicion.

Personally, I hope this ass clown gets impeached.
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

 

[Flopper]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

You mean the way Obama turned on Netanyahu?

What do you mean by turn? Obama hasn't been supportive of Netanyahu since he made it clear that he would not support any compromise, a position that will eventually lead to more fighting and conflict in the middle east. Abandoning the idea of a Palestinian state alongside Israel will simply lead to unending conflict.

 

[oreo]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

You mean the way Obama turned on Netanyahu?

What do you mean by turn? Obama hasn't been supportive of Netanyahu since he made it clear that he would not support any compromise, a position that will eventually lead to more fighting and conflict in the middle east. Abandoning the idea of a Palestinian state alongside Israel will simply lead to unending conflict.

Agreed 100%. This is another thing Comrade Trump did. Without knowing jack shit nor with any regard to a Palestinian state he turned to his tweety account to make another dumbass comment. Making certain we're at war for the next 50 years.

 

[Constructive Anarchy]

I'm apparently not following this. What's the problem again? What did Russian hackers do? Did they hack voting machines or something that directly effects the election? White House spokesmen seem kind of vague about what's actually occurred. Perhaps you can shed some light on that, because so far, all that seems to have happened is some embarrassing e-mails have been made public.

To me it's not so much what was hacked, but why they hacked. They didn't do it to get 'transparency and for the good of the US public'. IF they did it - and I have no reason to believe they didn't - they did it solely to undermine your democracy. From what I understand, this doesn't appear to bother righties because 'the win' is far more important than an outside country trying to interfere in your election process. And if you're okay with that, then so be it.

I'm still not seeing the problem here. Information like that could have been acquired from many sources. I wonder how hard it is to hack an unprotected private server? You know, like the one Hilary Clinton had. Or even more likely it came directly from an inside source. Could it be more obvious that some kind of internal power struggle is going on?

 

[Flopper]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

Yeah, clearly Putin did not expect this kind of response. He wanted Trump expecting Trump would lift current U.S. Sanctions, and that has clearly backfired on him. The last thing Putin wanted was more U.S. Sanctions which Republicans in the Senate have already promised. Obama kicking out all Russian diplomats is historic. They go along with their families that may have been rooted in this country for decades. Prior to all this a Russian diplomat did admit that they had contact with the Trump campaign.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=

Putin has already stated that he won't kick out American diplomats. So he has to repair the damage done, because all gains over the last 20 years, or since the cold war are now GONE. He knows he did it by interfering in our National election, something they've never done before. But they went after the Pentagon recently.
Russian hack almost brought the U.S. military to its knees

It's going to be very interesting to see what Putin does over the next few weeks. Obama is to release more information over the next few weeks, but it looks like Obama and Senate Republicans are intent on diminishing the credibility of the Trump administration long before he is sworn in. Trump won't even be able to blink at Russia without suspicion.

Personally, I hope this ass clown gets impeached.
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

If Trump tries to cover up his involvement with Putin or bury information about the hacking, he will end up going the same way Nixon did. Republicans in congress would be perfectly happy with Pence as president, he would be far easier to deal with than Trump and lot less likely to do something really stupid that would hurt the party in the midterms.

 

[Constructive Anarchy]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

Yeah, clearly Putin did not expect this kind of response. He wanted Trump expecting Trump would lift current U.S. Sanctions, and that has clearly backfired on him. The last thing Putin wanted was more U.S. Sanctions which Republicans in the Senate have already promised. Obama kicking out all Russian diplomats is historic. They go along with their families that may have been rooted in this country for decades. Prior to all this a Russian diplomat did admit that they had contact with the Trump campaign.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=

Putin has already stated that he won't kick out American diplomats. So he has to repair the damage done, because all gains over the last 20 years, or since the cold war are now GONE. He knows he did it by interfering in our National election, something they've never done before. But they went after the Pentagon recently.
Russian hack almost brought the U.S. military to its knees

It's going to be very interesting to see what Putin does over the next few weeks. Obama is to release more information over the next few weeks, but it looks like Obama and Senate Republicans are intent on diminishing the credibility of the Trump administration long before he is sworn in. Trump won't even be able to blink at Russia without suspicion.

Personally, I hope this ass clown gets impeached.
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

If Trump tries to cover up his involvement with Putin or bury information about the hacking, he will end up going the same way Nixon did. Republicans in congress would be perfectly happy with Pence as president, he would be far easier to deal with than Trump and lot less likely to do something really stupid that would hurt the party in the midterms.

I wonder when we can have some indication that an actual secret report even exists? Maybe we could get at least one of the seventeen intelligence agencies to provide the public with a secret summery of the secret report. Some kind of verification of at least that much would be nice. Or are we just supposed to take their word for it?

 

[Constructive Anarchy]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

You mean the way Obama turned on Netanyahu?

What do you mean by turn? Obama hasn't been supportive of Netanyahu since he made it clear that he would not support any compromise, a position that will eventually lead to more fighting and conflict in the middle east. Abandoning the idea of a Palestinian state alongside Israel will simply lead to unending conflict.

Agreed 100%. This is another thing Comrade Trump did. Without knowing jack shit nor with any regard to a Palestinian state he turned to his tweety account to make another dumbass comment. Making certain we're at war for the next 50 years.

It's 1984 already. How do you like being a member of the Outer Party.......comrade.

 

[Constructive Anarchy]

Trump will allow the diplomats back in 3 weeks, most likely.

This was a very bad move by Obama that is not going to accomplish anything positive.

If anyone thinks this lame gesture will stop anyone from spying, they are very stupid.

What Obama did was the right thing to do. You don't give Russia a free pass. Politically it's also a good movie for Obama because it boxes Trump into a position of allying himself with Putin, a position that most his party does not support. The interest of US and Russian are about as far apart as you can get. Eventually Putin will turn on Trump.

How would Obama or Clinton know what the right thing is?

 

[Tilly]

If you were born in Miami,
why you say
'too much traitors'???

Why does it matter? You're attacking someone on their english skills?

English should be capitalized.

Indeed. So you think you make important points by attacking people's language skills?

No, I thought it was funny to attack your English skills when you were chastising someone else for them attacking someone's English. It doesn't actually bother me.

Good.

Did you think it funny that the person attacking Charwin's English skills (see I got it right that time) - deployed similarly poor English skills?

I'm just mad because of too much traitors in my country.

If you were born in Miami,
why you say
'too much traitors'???

Why does it matter? You're attacking someone on their english skills?

English should be capitalized.

Indeed. So you think you make important points by attacking people's language skills?

No, I thought it was funny to attack your English skills when you were chastising someone else for them attacking someone's English. It doesn't actually bother me.

OMG, I was just teasing Charwin, which I'm sure he knows
I was also using pidgin English - as in - 'why you say'
(like - I love you long time) to indicate I was joking. Lol.
Maybe it was all too subtle. Some people seem to be as miserable as sin around here!
Guess it's cos they're feeling things are STILL not going the leftard way. Oh well!
Oh, and just in case, charwin95 - I was just teasing, and though you indicated you had no problem whatsoever, I hope I didn't upset you xxx
There. All better now

 

[Tilly]

Indeed. So you think you make important points by attacking people's language skills?

No, I thought it was funny to attack your English skills when you were chastising someone else for them attacking someone's English. It doesn't actually bother me.

Good.

Did you think it funny that the person attacking Charwin's English skills (see I got it right that time) - deployed similarly poor English skills?

It didn't bother me.

You missed the transitive verb "is" in your previous post. It should be "Do you think it IS funny...."

You velly velly funny

 

[EverCurious]

I find "reactions" of our government quite interesting. Just last year our 17 security agencies went off on China for hacking:

April 2015 - China likely behind hack of US data, says House homeland security chair
July 2015 - http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/01/world/asia/us-decides-to-retaliate-against-chinas-hacking.html
August 2015 - U.S. developing sanctions against China over cyberthefts
September 2015 - US should sanction China for hacking: Rackspace exec

Obama's response there?
October 2016 - In a rare bit of good cyber security news, Chinese hacking thefts of American corporate secrets have plummeted in the 13 months since China signed an agreement with the Obama administration to curb economic espionage, U.S. officials and outside experts say. - Russia is hacking the U.S. more, but China is hacking the U.S. much less

A few questions:
1. Why isn't /CHINA/ under suspicion for the 2014 and 2015 phishing of the DNC?
2. Why wasn't a similar "agreement" offered to Russia?
3. Why not tie Trump to Chinese hacking while you're at it?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
I'm still not seeing the problem here. Information like that could have been acquired from many sources. I wonder how hard it is to hack an unprotected private server? You know, like the one Hilary Clinton had. Or even more likely it came directly from an inside source. Could it be more obvious that some kind of internal power struggle is going on?

Clinton's server was protected, but hacked. No. I think i'll listen to the intelligence agencies take on what happened. They seem more reliable than your average message board poster.

 

[Iceweasel]

Obama has often been criticized of being slow to react. As we have seen sometimes he waits months for evidence before he reacts to anything, almost like he has to be convinced 100% of something before he'll make a move.

Yeah we know. She waits and waits and then makes the wrong move every time. She screws up everything she touches.

 

[beagle9]

Not necessarily. For one thing - this has been going on for a while with no serious repercussions to Russia and giving our intelligence people time to gather evidence. Spies get caught, even under the most careful regimes. Why would Russia be any different?

Point is --- that kind of intel doesn't generally get released to the public if it can be TRACED back to specific operatives or agents. Especially if they were sloppy enough to leave evidence of their methods. The whole point of gathering it is to hold it secret and use it as leverage in "negotiations". You could burn entire groups that collect that stuff by exposing it without cleaning up.

Looks to me like someone Internally burned the Kremlin. The way that Snowden did here in the US.

And it's not just one affair. You have Hillary's stupid ass home brewed system which I'm SURE was browsed by 4 or 6 foreign nations. Then you have the DNC hacks which were interesting but not even close to fatal for Clinton personally. And Finally, you have the idiot Podesta running an entire campaign out of Gmail account on his commercial phone. Those are all different stories. And the DNC and media are just balling them up into one big "Russia did it" excuse...

See I don't think so, and the reason is - there appears to be a long history of hacking attempts from Russia on us and other western governments aimed at election processes. Releasing it can influence things as much as holding it, especially through a proxy like Wikileaks.

We've been spying on Russian politicos for 35 years or more. This is from a book, not my "personal" experience, but in the 1980s we could tell you exactly how much Vodka the Kremlin was ordering and what brands. So if they were interested in where Podesta got his pizza from --- you shouldn't be surprised.

NONE of that info ever makes it to public domain unless someone gets blackmailed with it in exchange for negotiating concessions. That's what is "not right" about this "blame it on the Russians" deal..

You don't want the other guessing how they know what they know. Was it satellite interception, an antenna on an embassy, an asset working on the ground, a group for hire in Romania??? You don't want to widely EXPOSE those methods. Because they can be neutralized. And people could get killed.

I disagree. Russia was using Wikileaks to cover it's track. There is substantial agreement among diverse authorities that Russia was behind the hacking. There is zero evidence that it was the DNC insider. There is nothing substantial in the hacked emails - nothing outright illegal. What's there is stuff that can be implied, misconstrued or is embarressing. It's not "blackmail worthy" but it can - when released at strategic intervals - cause havoc.

WHICH hacking were they behind? The DNC hack was a simple spearfishing attack. ANYONE could have done it. Getting a Gmail account from a phone is a little trickier, but there were reports that Podesta had LOST a phone.

The assumption seems to be that ONLY the Russians were in those 3 separate attacks. But I assure you, there were other breaches on those stupid systems. There were just too tempting as targets.

In classified session, with the DNC and RNC, the FBI probably told them HOW MANY hacking attempts or successes had been made. It's not likely at all that ONLY the Russians were into those systems. And the only one of the 3 that had "the good stuff" on Clinton was Podesta's phone. And maybe the other "not publicly released" classified info that came from Clintons' "security workaround" server. But her lawyers and contractors damaged the evidence so badly on that one, that no can assess how many unauthorized leaks there were on that system.

Media and govt are wrapping all of these together in attempt to confuse folks.. The problem was -- DNC and Clinton and Podesta did not LISTEN to security advice. There's your fundamental issue..

. Yeah and speaking of damaging things, don't forget that Hillary was deleting, bleaching, covering up, and lying while her media was claiming the win for her way before anyone had a chance to know just how bad it all was. Now as always the whistle blowers are the focus instead of the criminals. This is why Obama looks so bad at what he is doing, because it goes against the knowledge of what everybody has learned in this thing, and the Democrats are using the thinking that Americans have a super short memory, but not this time they don't.

 

[beagle9]

[
I'm still not seeing the problem here. Information like that could have been acquired from many sources. I wonder how hard it is to hack an unprotected private server? You know, like the one Hilary Clinton had. Or even more likely it came directly from an inside source. Could it be more obvious that some kind of internal power struggle is going on?

Clinton's server was protected, but hacked. No. I think i'll listen to the intelligence agencies take on what happened. They seem more reliable than your average message board poster.

. Ok, so why are you hear acting as if you know so much, if you don't know squat ?? You people reveal your bull crap daily, and you think that the average poster is to dum to see it, but that's where you fool your ownselves.

 

[beagle9]

Am I the only one who thinks Obama is trying to start a war with Russia?

. Scorched earth policy here maybe, but Putin has seen what Obama and the crew are up to, and he isn't falling for it over there. He will hold until Obama is out, and Trump restores international relations with the world and them.

 

[Dr Grump]

. Ok, so why are you hear acting as if you know so much, if you don't know squat ?? You people reveal your bull crap daily, and you think that the average poster is to dum to see it, but that's where you fool your ownselves.

I don't know much. That is my point. However, the likes of you and your ilk just listen to Briefart, Infowars, and the Orange One himself and take it as fact. And to be honest, anybody who types 'hear' instead of 'here' and 'dum' instead of 'dumb' and makes up words like 'ownselves' I don't really think has any right having a go at others. I mean, if you made one typo, I get that. But several? You're a dumb fuck.

 

[beagle9]

See I don't think so, and the reason is - there appears to be a long history of hacking attempts from Russia on us and other western governments aimed at election processes. Releasing it can influence things as much as holding it, especially through a proxy like Wikileaks.

We've been spying on Russian politicos for 35 years or more. This is from a book, not my "personal" experience, but in the 1980s we could tell you exactly how much Vodka the Kremlin was ordering and what brands. So if they were interested in where Podesta got his pizza from --- you shouldn't be surprised.

NONE of that info ever makes it to public domain unless someone gets blackmailed with it in exchange for negotiating concessions. That's what is "not right" about this "blame it on the Russians" deal..

You don't want the other guessing how they know what they know. Was it satellite interception, an antenna on an embassy, an asset working on the ground, a group for hire in Romania??? You don't want to widely EXPOSE those methods. Because they can be neutralized. And people could get killed.

I disagree. Russia was using Wikileaks to cover it's track. There is substantial agreement among diverse authorities that Russia was behind the hacking. There is zero evidence that it was the DNC insider. There is nothing substantial in the hacked emails - nothing outright illegal. What's there is stuff that can be implied, misconstrued or is embarressing. It's not "blackmail worthy" but it can - when released at strategic intervals - cause havoc.

WHICH hacking were they behind? The DNC hack was a simple spearfishing attack. ANYONE could have done it. Getting a Gmail account from a phone is a little trickier, but there were reports that Podesta had LOST a phone.

The assumption seems to be that ONLY the Russians were in those 3 separate attacks. But I assure you, there were other breaches on those stupid systems. There were just too tempting as targets.

In classified session, with the DNC and RNC, the FBI probably told them HOW MANY hacking attempts or successes had been made. It's not likely at all that ONLY the Russians were into those systems. And the only one of the 3 that had "the good stuff" on Clinton was Podesta's phone. And maybe the other "not publicly released" classified info that came from Clintons' "security workaround" server. But her lawyers and contractors damaged the evidence so badly on that one, that no can assess how many unauthorized leaks there were on that system.

Media and govt are wrapping all of these together in attempt to confuse folks.. The problem was -- DNC and Clinton and Podesta did not LISTEN to security advice. There's your fundamental issue..

That is A fundamental issue. Among others. I can't see all 17 intelligence agencies colluding to pinpoint Russia if they didn't have substantial evidence - they're notoriously cagy about committing to something like that. No one is saying it was ONLY Russia - but that the evidence points to Russia.

Obama has often been criticized of being slow to react. As we have seen sometimes he waits months for evidence before he reacts to anything, almost like he has to be convinced 100% of something before he'll make a move. This is historic, it is the most severe sanction against Russia since the Cuban missile crisis. Republicans are promising more sanctions.

Clearly Putin did not expect this kind of reaction. If he would have foresaw this, he would have never done it. Russia has never intervened into our election process before, but they have done major damage with hacking into the Pentagon recently, almost bringing the U.S. Military down. Putin got into the Joint Chiefs of staffs emails. Putin is former KGB, he's a spy.
Russian hack almost brought the U.S. military to its knees

Trump and his physco-babble interpreters that have surrounded him through-out this campaign are now in a position of arguing with the entire U.S. Senate--the intelligence committee there, 17 different intelligence agencies, including the CIA & the FBI. His lazy fair attitude, well I'll see if I can make it to an intelligence briefing next week, when there is one held daily, everyday at 9 a.m., that he has refused to attend. Even at one time stating he didn't need to be there. He made a statement that he knows more than our generals do because he watches T.V. shows. Obviously he believes that.

So what kind of a President do Trump supporters think they're getting? Right now there isn't a General/Admiral or anyone in military uniform in this country that respects him. The Joint Chiefs of Staff that depend on our intelligence agencies to advise the POTUS. It's really incomprehensible to imagine that Donald Trump will be the Commander and Chief of this country and will have nuclear codes in hand. You have the entire Senate going against him. They aren't going to protect him. Trump and his supporters have made so many Republican enemies in both houses, they aren't going to work with someone who denies this kind of intelligence, nor respect him. He is clearly not qualified to be President of the United States.
Graham: 99 percent of senators believe Russia interfered in election

And you all knew this long before you voted for this T.V. reality star. Now you own this nightmare.

. You can leave anytime you want, no one is holding you back.

 

[Tehon]

You would have to presume that 99 members of the Senate are lying, along with the FBI, CIA and 17 other intelligence agencies, including Barack Obama. And the ONLY one who is telling the truth is Trump, and it's some fat guy sitting on his bed doing all of this--LOL

I am not presuming anything......that would be you.

To hack into a private or public computer is a FELONY in this country that comes with prison time. Anyone wanting to risk doing that is going to have a reward for taking that risk.

What was Snowden's reward......or Manning's?

 

[beagle9]

. Ok, so why are you hear acting as if you know so much, if you don't know squat ?? You people reveal your bull crap daily, and you think that the average poster is to dum to see it, but that's where you fool your ownselves.

I don't know much. That is my point. However, the likes of you and your ilk just listen to Briefart, Infowars, and the Orange One himself and take it as fact. And to be honest, anybody who types 'hear' instead of 'here' and 'dum' instead of 'dumb' and makes up words like 'ownselves' I don't really think has any right having a go at others. I mean, if you made one typo, I get that. But several? You're a dumb fuck.

Typo's is all you got ? LOL. Does your comprehension skills go lacking when someone makes a typo or misspelled a word ? No, but that to is another way to belittle your opponent, but for those who would rather comprehend the content instead of the petty things you speak of, then they are the smarter ones who are here I'd say. I've seen posters make many mistakes over the years, and many that were caused by Google choosing words for the poster based upon typo errors that still aren't corrected by Google, but the content is what I'm after, and not some petty typo worries like you have.