US Jobless claims fall to 4 decade low

[Oldstyle]

Since you claim the Administration didn't simply make numbers up and that jobs created or saved is a "real" economic estimate...perhaps you'd like to share with me what the economic formula was that they used to come up with their estimate?

 

[Rshermr]

Because that's not what they DID...is it! Instead of saying they created 1 million jobs...they said they saved 3 million. Why can't you understand THAT simple concept!

THEY SAID WHATEVER ECONOMIC ESTIMATE SAID.

"1 million" is just an EXAMPLE NUMBER I used.

Obama’s Stimulus Generated Up to 3.3 Million Jobs, CBO Says

President Barack Obama’s stimulus package may have created or saved as many as 3.3 million jobs last quarter and lowered the unemployment rate by as much as 1.8 percentage points, the Congressional Budget Office said.

Now, 3 million is perhaps on the rosy side of estimates, but administration didn't simply make numbers up, they are real economic estimates.

The problem you are running into in trying to get something rational out of oldstyle is something I have run into for three years. He is truly a con troll and everyone who deals with him for some time comes to the same conclusion. He absolutly believes what he WANTS to believe, and he will not accept what economists and impartial people believe. His information library is the conservative talking points and NOTHING else. Generally he will not provide a source, because he does not want you to see where he is getting his info. He knows better, but it feels so good to him and he is a totally loyal con tool.
So, sorry to interrupt, but the crap he pulls pisses me up. I am into facts and truth, and trolls like him who push dogma are, in my personal opinion, equivalent to dog shit.
Not sure what the purpose of oldstyle is. I suspect, but can not prove, he is just trying to kill threads that are not beneficial to cons. Because you have probably noticed, he is not capable of rational conversation.

 

[AntonToo]

3 million is the number that was CREATED by the Obama Administration.

...WTF is wrong with you?

I just showed that the number came from CBO, so wtf makes you think you can just turm around and claim that it was created by the administration???

You are seriously insane.

 

[Faun]

Please don't say you're quoting me, Anton and then not use my words. It's dishonest.

WTF? I DIRECTLY QUOTED YOU.

I'm starting to believe that there is some sort of mental deficiency going on here.

Ding, ding, ding, ding.... we have a winner here! Didn't take you long to figure out what a lying con tool Oldstyle is.

 

[Oldstyle]

3 million is the number that was CREATED by the Obama Administration.

...WTF is wrong with you?

I just showed that the number came from CBO, so wtf makes you think you can just turm around and claim that it was created by the administration???

You are seriously insane.

The CBO takes the numbers that it is given and crunches them to give an estimate. When you give them skewed numbers then you will get a skewed estimate. Which is exactly the way the Obama Administration used the CBO.

 

[AntonToo]

The problem you are running into in trying to get something rational out of oldstyle is something I have run into for three years. He is truly a con troll and everyone who deals with him for some time comes to the same conclusion. He absolutly believes what he WANTS to believe, and he will not accept what economists and impartial people believe. His information library is the conservative talking points and NOTHING else. Generally he will not provide a source, because he does not want you to see where he is getting his info. He knows better, but it feels so good to him and he is a totally loyal con tool.
So, sorry to interrupt, but the crap he pulls pisses me up. I am into facts and truth, and trolls like him who push dogma are, in my personal opinion, equivalent to dog shit.
Not sure what the purpose of oldstyle is. I suspect, but can not prove, he is just trying to kill threads that are not beneficial to cons. Because you have probably noticed, he is not capable of rational conversation.

I dealt with many conservatives by now and the one trait I keep running into is complete disregard for the burden of proof. There is this attitude that if they can come up with it, and it makes sense in their narrow capacity mind, then therefore it is true, without any actual supporting evidence required.

 

[Oldstyle]

3 million is the number that was CREATED by the Obama Administration.

...WTF is wrong with you?

I just showed that the number came from CBO, so wtf makes you think you can just turm around and claim that it was created by the administration???

You are seriously insane.

The three million jobs created or saved didn't come from the CBO...it was a number that was created by the Obama Administration who then asked the CBO to verify that number was possible.

 

[AntonToo]

The CBO takes the numbers that it is given and crunches them to give an estimate. When you give them skewed numbers then you will get a skewed estimate. Which is exactly the way the Obama Administration used the CBO.

BS.

CBO is a nonpartisan congressional economic advisory the Congress of the United States of America.

They will produce requested estimates using requested assumptions, but this policy estimate is not based on provision of any such thing but rather is CBO's best effort estimate on effect of Obamacare.

If you have evidence that the numbers were in ANY WAY manipulated by the Administration please provide it or retract your assertion. Just because you can imagine it, doesn't mean it actually is.

 

[Rshermr]

Because that's not what they DID...is it! Instead of saying they created 1 million jobs...they said they saved 3 million. Why can't you understand THAT simple concept!

THEY SAID WHATEVER ECONOMIC ESTIMATE SAID.

"1 million" is just an EXAMPLE NUMBER I used.

Obama’s Stimulus Generated Up to 3.3 Million Jobs, CBO Says

President Barack Obama’s stimulus package may have created or saved as many as 3.3 million jobs last quarter and lowered the unemployment rate by as much as 1.8 percentage points, the Congressional Budget Office said.

Now, 3 million is perhaps on the rosy side of estimates, but administration didn't simply make numbers up, they are real economic estimates.

3 million is the number that was CREATED by the Obama Administration.

You just claimed that there was no actual difference between jobs created and jobs saved...which is laughable.

NO, ME BOY, IT IS NOT LAUGHABLE. YOU are laughable. And a lying con troll. And loosing your argument, big time.
And laughable includes statements you make like "number that was Created by the Obama Administration". Complete with no source or link. Because even you know you are lying. The number is created by career employees of the BLS. Which, me poor ignorant lying con troll, is not part of the Obama Administration. And never, ever has been a part of any presidents administration.
Really. You are showing your stripes. And you are showing that you lie without compunction.

 

[Oldstyle]

The problem you are running into in trying to get something rational out of oldstyle is something I have run into for three years. He is truly a con troll and everyone who deals with him for some time comes to the same conclusion. He absolutly believes what he WANTS to believe, and he will not accept what economists and impartial people believe. His information library is the conservative talking points and NOTHING else. Generally he will not provide a source, because he does not want you to see where he is getting his info. He knows better, but it feels so good to him and he is a totally loyal con tool.
So, sorry to interrupt, but the crap he pulls pisses me up. I am into facts and truth, and trolls like him who push dogma are, in my personal opinion, equivalent to dog shit.
Not sure what the purpose of oldstyle is. I suspect, but can not prove, he is just trying to kill threads that are not beneficial to cons. Because you have probably noticed, he is not capable of rational conversation.

I dealt with many conservatives by now and the one trait I keep running into is complete disregard for the burden of proof. There is this attitude that if they can come up with it, and it makes sense in their narrow capacity mind, then therefore it is true, without any actual supporting evidence required.

Burden of proof? You mean like providing the formula that the Obama White House used to determine "Jobs Created or Saved"? That kind of proof?

 

[AntonToo]

Burden of proof? You mean like providing the formula that the Obama White House used to determine "Jobs Created or Saved"? That kind of proof?

Old what fucking formula? number comes from CBO, not administration. You can't even grasp basic concepts and you want someone to spend time on you going through formulas?

This is laughable.

 

[Oldstyle]

The CBO takes the numbers that it is given and crunches them to give an estimate. When you give them skewed numbers then you will get a skewed estimate. Which is exactly the way the Obama Administration used the CBO.

BS.

CBO is a nonpartisan congressional economic advisory the Congress of the United States of America.

They will produce requested estimates using requested assumptions, but this policy estimate is not based on provision of any such thing but rather is CBO's best effort estimate on effect of Obamacare.

If you have evidence that the numbers where in ANY WAY manipulated by the Administration please provide it or retract your assertion. just because you can imagine it, doesn't mean it actually is.

Oh, for God's sake! Of course the numbers were "manipulated" by the Obama Administration! If they weren't...they would have simply given us the number of jobs that were created and that would have been it. Lousy job numbers. Sorry folks...we hope it gets better! But they didn't do that...did they? Oh no...they created "Jobs Saved" in about as obvious an attempt to manipulate the numbers as you could POSSIBLY come up with! But you don't see that...do you?

 

[Oldstyle]

Burden of proof? You mean like providing the formula that the Obama White House used to determine "Jobs Created or Saved"? That kind of proof?

Old what fucking formula? number comes from CBO, not administration. You can't even grasp basic concepts and you want someone to spend time on you going through formulas?

This is laughable.

So now you're claiming that the CBO was the origin of the 3 million jobs created or saved number? Really, Anton?

 

[AntonToo]

Oh, for God's sake! Of course the numbers were "manipulated" by the Obama Administration! If they weren't...they would have simply given us the number of jobs that were created and that would have been it.

They did SIMPLY GIVE YOU THE NUMBER - 3 MILLION AS PER CBO.

you can call it jobs saved or jobs created but That's the fucking number CBO estimated you idiot.

I'm done here, clearly no one is home.

 

[Rshermr]

Since you claim the Administration didn't simply make numbers up and that jobs created or saved is a "real" economic estimate...perhaps you'd like to share with me what the economic formula was that they used to come up with their estimate?

So there is oldstyle, trying to get the formula he says does not exist. This is at least fifty times he has asked for it. Now, he made a deal where he would meat a condition with me to get the formula. While he admitted that the Great Republican Recession of 2008 caused a large number of job losses, and it was proven that republicans blocked every effort by the administration to pass bills to help with the economic situation caused by that recession, he said that republicans passed a bill or bills to combat the economic issues. So, he agreed to provide the info on the bills, and in exchange I would provide his equation.
But, being a dishonest player, he was unable to provide info on such a republican bill but would not admit that there was none. And, as a result, I could not provide the formula. As I have explained to him, his refusal requires that I not provide the formula, and that is simply part of honor and integrity which he is lacking.

 

[Oldstyle]

Oh, for God's sake! Of course the numbers were "manipulated" by the Obama Administration! If they weren't...they would have simply given us the number of jobs that were created and that would have been it.

They did SIMPLY GIVE YOU THE NUMBER - 3 MILLION AS PER CBO.

you can call it jobs saved or jobs created but That's the fucking number CBO estimated you idiot.

I'm done here, clearly no one is home.

And when did the CBO estimate that number, Anton? In their May, 2010 report?

Estimated Impact of the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act on Employment and Economic Output from January 2010 Through March 2010

 

[Oldstyle]

If so perhaps you'd like to explain why the Administration was quoting that 3 million jobs created or saved a year earlier?

Estimates of Job Creation from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009

 

[Faun]

Interesting...I just went back through every post I made since you joined the conversation and I didn't find a single one in which I said that the stimulus created "just a few jobs" yet you're quoting me as if I did! So did I miss that, Anton? Or are you making stuff up?

Do you ever stop lying, ya con tool? EVER??

As for the ARRA? With all due respect, Antontoo...if the Obama Stimulus had worked as promised...the Obama Administration wouldn't have had to use "Jobs created and saved" to hide how few net new jobs their programs actually created.

Wow...are you ever an idiot! Someone claims I said "just a few jobs"...I reply by saying that I don't remember saying that and now you claim that I'm lying because I said "few net new jobs"? You do realize those two things are not the same...right? I was misquoted. If you weren't a lying sack of you know what...YOU'D ADMIT THAT! But that's not how you and Georgie operate...is it!

There is no difference between saying a few jobs created versus a few net new jobs created. Either way, you're trying to portrsy job creation as limited to just a "few" new jobs. The key word being, "few". But being the con tool the forum has known you to be, you can't even refrain from lying about something even as silly as this.

Even worse for you -- this isn't even the first time you've made this claim...

It's nothing but smoke and mirrors to hide how few jobs were created.

Of course the numbers were just pulled out of somebody's ass, Pinqy! That was the whole purpose of "Jobs Saved"! It let the Obama Administration avoid having to tell the American public how few jobs they created with the stimulus by substituting a statistic that couldn't be verified!

He did give us the Obama Stimulus...something that turned into a liberal pork fest that created so few jobs that they had to invent a new economic statistic to hide how bad it was!

So yeah, keep denying you said it. Even though you've actually said it time and time again.

All you're doing is proving me right when I say you're nothing but a lying con tool who will make up any lie, no matter how rightarded, to prop up your bullshit.

 

[Rshermr]

Oh, for God's sake! Of course the numbers were "manipulated" by the Obama Administration! If they weren't...they would have simply given us the number of jobs that were created and that would have been it.

They did SIMPLY GIVE YOU THE NUMBER - 3 MILLION AS PER CBO.

you can call it jobs saved or jobs created but That's the fucking number CBO estimated you idiot.

I'm done here, clearly no one is home.

You just witnessed what is apparently the empty brain of a con troll. And he just goes on and on and on. I understand your frustration. I suspect you are used to dealing with people that have integrity.

I am sure you noticed the latest numbers the BLS just published. Here is a quote from their site:
"Quashing worries that job growth was flagging, the government on Friday reported that employers increased payrolls by 287,000 in June. It was an arresting surge in hiring just weeks before the Republican and Democratic conventions where the presidential nominees will present their competing economic visions.
The official unemployment rate did rise to 4.9 percent, from 4.7 percent, but that was largely because more Americans re-entered the work force. And average hourly earnings ticked up again, continuing a pattern of rising wages that brought the yearly gain to 2.6 percent.
“Wow, this one takes my breath away,” said Diane Swonk, an independent economist in Chicago."
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/09/business/economy/jobs-report-unemployment-wages.html?_r=0

 

[Faun]

"If Administration would come out and say "Stimulus created a million jobs" that gives Republicans the stupid one liner "Obama says stimulus made million jobs but since it's passage we are ACTUALLY down 3 million!" So instead of "created" administration switched to "saved" as in "Stimulus saved a million jobs so we lost 3 million instead of 4 million", but that is POLITICS because to the two words are underlied by very same economic facts and are without an actual difference."

So what you're basically admitting is the Obama Administration misled the American people by "switching" from created (which was the previous standard but would have looked terrible because of how many jobs were created) to saved (which allowed them to plug in whatever number they felt like)? But that's OK in your view because it's part of the "politics of delivering economics to layman"...which I assume means spinning a number that ignorant people will accept?

Do you ever stop lying, ya con tool? Ever??

The Obama administration used the term saved or create from the very first day they released their plan to the public. You are lying (again) when you claim they only added "saved" as an after thought because you think they created just a few new jobs.

You've been shown this before so for you to claim it again is nothing short of you bald-faced lying.... again.