Walmart on Welfare: We support their employees so they don't have to.

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

I don't get it....how is there any connection between what Walmart pays and wether or not people who work for them apply for welfare...???

.the same as when Walmart has a bad year, the employees don't care unless it means they lose their job...

Liberals think funny...

Want to know why, for instance, Toyota and Honda were able to enter late and kick the shit out of the Big3? Go study the history of how they treated and still treat THEIR employees, compared to how American companies treat theirs.

I'm aware that you have invested yourself completely in your ideological beliefs here, but I'd ask you to HONESTLY look at the situation and realize raising the fucking minimum wage shouldn't be a conservative/liberal issue.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

And granting legal status to illegals is going to help raise wages? Liberals think funny...

and for 40 years the democrats controlled the house of Representatives...

and if so called conservatives don't start looking for ways to you know actually give people what they want, Dems will control the federal government for 40 more.

 

[dblack]

I'm aware that you have invested yourself completely in your ideological beliefs here, but I'd ask you to HONESTLY look at the situation and realize raising the fucking minimum wage shouldn't be a conservative/liberal issue.

Indeed. Government shouldn't have the power to set wages or prices at all.

 

[2aguy]

raising the fucking minimum wage shouldn't be a conservative/liberal issue.

So do I but the liberals keep doing it...it should be the choice of the business...right?

 

[rightwinger]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

Further.

Can one of these idiots who claim that , for instance McDonalds, would have to raise prices or go broke if the min wage were raised please explain to me a few things.

1. Prices are WAY fucking higher now than they were when the minimum wage was worth 122% of what is was then

2. McDonalds, again as an example, THRIVED in the 60s when the minimum wage was 122% of what it is now.

It's clear to me why some of these idiots are only posting about things on the internet , rather than actually doing them.

 

[Peach]

WalMart also puts has a game wherein one week items, most often produce, and are available, the next week none to be found.Also, my local walMart moved from the center of town to near the interstate, three-four miles away. Adding up gas, time, and considering the shifting inventory...........Winn Dixie is cheaper for grocery shopping. I go to WalMart a couple times a month.

 

[rightwinger]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

Further.

Can one of these idiots who claim that , for instance McDonalds, would have to raise prices or go broke if the min wage were raised please explain to me a few things.

1. Prices are WAY fucking higher now than they were when the minimum wage was worth 122% of what is was then

2. McDonalds, again as an example, THRIVED in the 60s when the minimum wage was 122% of what it is now.

It's clear to me why some of these idiots are only posting about things on the internet , rather than actually doing them.

A minimum wage earner has about half the buying power I had when I made $2.10 an hour

The wage needs to at least double

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

Further.

Can one of these idiots who claim that , for instance McDonalds, would have to raise prices or go broke if the min wage were raised please explain to me a few things.

1. Prices are WAY fucking higher now than they were when the minimum wage was worth 122% of what is was then

2. McDonalds, again as an example, THRIVED in the 60s when the minimum wage was 122% of what it is now.

It's clear to me why some of these idiots are only posting about things on the internet , rather than actually doing them.

A minimum wage earner has about half the buying power I had when I made $2.10 an hour

The wage needs to at least double

That's just not true

The minimum wage had the peak buying power in 1964 when it was $1.25 an hour, adjusted for inflation that is $9.75 an hour. Conversely $7.25 an hour today was worth $.97 and hour in 1964 dollars.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Nobody is forced to work at Walmart.

They are if there is nowhere else for them to go.

That describes prisoners only. Everyone else can go somewhere. Look at the influx into North Dakota, where WM cashiers earn $17/hr.

More conservative economic fantasy

They act like there is a steady stream of positions open for all workers to advance. We are talking about 30 million workers needing government assistance to survive. If they can't survive on $10 an hour, can you point to the 30 million jobs at $20 an hour waiting to be filled?
Is North Dakota ready to accept 30 million workers streaming across their border?

That's why there's a North Dakota fenced border with guards, right?
You're such a clueless moron. People move for jobs all the time. The fantasy that WalMart is the only employer anywhere is just that. Liberals live in the 19th century.

Show me the 30 million open jobs that pay more than $20 an hour

That is your economic solution. Can't cut it making $10 an hour, get a better paying job. Show me the economic data where 30 million better paying jobs are out there in any state. You want them to move? Show the 30 million jobs they can move to

Show me the jobs that pay 100/hr. There can't be enough 100/hr jobs for the entire workforce. We need to institute a 100/hr min wage and welfare benefits to match. Every man a king!

Damn Rabbi

I am used to your usual dodges, but that one is just plain pathetic

It is YOUR solution. You claim that 30 million workers who need government assistance should just go out and get a better job

I merely asked you to provide the data showing that there are 30 million better paying jobs available. Shouldn't we be sure of that before we implement "The Rabbi Plan"?

I dont recall ever writing that. Please post it. Oh yeah, you cant because you made it up.

My solution is that we eliminate the min wage and allow employers and employees to negotiate with each other like free people.

The employer employee lawyers to negotiate with workers, yet the workers are denied represntation to negoitiate with

Dunce!
If WalMart didnt hire them the taxpayer would be on the hook for their entire subsistence. WalMart subsidizes the state, not the other way around.

Damn you're stupid. Small town once had butchers, bakers and candlestick makers, the small businesses which employed millions of Americans; stores located in small shops, generally rented by the shop keeper from real estate investors. What makes you think these jobs didn't disappear when Wal-Mart moved in, cut prices to eliminate competition and soon, Main St., USA, became a ghost town.

BTW, notice how many products Wal-Mart imports from China? Damn you're stupid, but I repeat myself.

You call me stupid an fail to respond to what I wrote, subsituting your own fantasy instead. SMH.

Everything you write is stupid, framed by biases, prejudices and a closed mind unable to think pan-optically.

 

[Andylusion]

And granting legal status to illegals is going to help raise wages? Liberals think funny...

and for 40 years the democrats controlled the house of Representatives...

and if so called conservatives don't start looking for ways to you know actually give people what they want, Dems will control the federal government for 40 more.

If the Dems give people what they want, the result will be an economic crash, that will make the Great Depression look like a bad hair day.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

And granting legal status to illegals is going to help raise wages? Liberals think funny...

and for 40 years the democrats controlled the house of Representatives...

and if so called conservatives don't start looking for ways to you know actually give people what they want, Dems will control the federal government for 40 more.

If the Dems give people what they want, the result will be an economic crash, that will make the Great Depression look like a bad hair day.

Then perhaps the Republicans should start using their fucking heads and start giving the people at least SOME of what they want; because I hate to break it to you but our very government was set up to give the people what they want, or rather give the peoples' representatives what they want.

The job of the conservatives needs to change from constantly saying "no no no no" like a bunch of god damned petulant to children to .."look , we can't do this and here is why..... but, how about if we do this instead"

if you tell a man he can't have a steak and punch him in the face he isn't going to ask you to come around any more, but if you tell a guy he can't have a steak but he can have a hamburger, he's likely to ask you around again.

DUH

 

[Andylusion]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

First off, the part of the reason the prices of automobiles have gone up, is because of Federal regulations. In 1974, there were still dozens of independent auto manufacturers. By the 1990s, there were three.... and that was pretty much it. All the regulations and controls of the Federal government, killed all competition, and as a result, the big three did not have to compete with all the independent makers.

Second, EPA emission requirements, and the use of plastics and aluminum, instead of steel, and the need to design extensive safety measures, to make up for lack of steel, all of which is due to CAFE standards, all drive up the cost of the automobile.

Third, cars today have many features and abilities and functions, that cars back then didn't have. You could in fact buy a much cheaper car, if you decided to get a stripped down car.

Back in 2006, people forget about the Detroit Auto Show, in which Geely, a Chinese Auto Manufacturer, showed off their sub-$10,000 car.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/automobiles/autospecial/10geely.html

Now the interesting part of this article, is that Geely has been selling cars for just under $5,000 across the world. Middle East, Africa, and Eastern Europe.

But.... in the US, not one of the models they sell, meets the US environmental and safety standards.

Geely has announced plans to sell a 4-door model in the US.... for just under $10,000.

Now think about that. Just meeting the regulations, makes the price double.

We're paying for that when we buy a car. Now you can say, all those regulations are required and necessary. And maybe you are even right.

But when you complain that "you can't buy a car on minimum wage!" this is why. You have caused your own problem.

Fourth, the credit culture. Back in the 70s even, we had a culture of, if you want something, you have to save up and buy it. In the 80s, unfortunately, we turned into a credit culture. Everyone turned into the "I want it now" people.

The entire industry, when they spend millions of dollars designing and creating a new vehicle, they do so with a specific target price, and target buyer in mind. Before, when people had to save up money to buy a product, the auto makers understood this, and had a target price in mind, that was reasonable for the buyers they wished to get.

This dramatically shifted when consumers moved to using credit instead of cash, to buy cars. Now people could afford to buy a much more expensive car, on payments, than they could if they were purchasing with cash.

People showed up with saying "oh you mean for only $2,000 down, I can buy this expensive model, instead of the $5,000 car I can afford?". This shifted manufacturers to build more expensive models, knowing people are going to buy on credit, not cash.

So, while it's true you can't buy a bran new car, for a comparable amount of money, most of that is due to government regulations and controls, and most of the rest is due to culture.

As for education, you still can pay for an education on minimum wage. I know people who have done it. Of course you can't go to an expensive school, and you are not going to be living in luxury.

See, the problem here is the same. if you look at old dorms, and the facilities of Universities decades ago... they were pretty sparse. I found these old photos from the University of Wisconsin, 1945.

That's not a military boot camp barracks. That's the dorm room. Not a ton of extras. Not a whole lot of amenities. Don't see any dorm refrigerators here. Total cost for the month? $13 a month. In today's dollars, that would be $170.

Today's dorms have of course electricity, and heating and air conditioning, but then you also have phone and high speed internet, and then all the other extras.

Now when you compare this, to dorms today.... it's not even remotely comparable. Even if you compared them to dorms in the 1970s, it's not all that comparable. Dorms with individual rooms. Dorms with 19 by 16 floor plans. Dorms with "game rooms" and "lounge rooms". 24-hour professional assistance, claims OSU Dorm services. That costs money don't you think?

Check out this article.
The Luxification of College Dorms New Republic

Granite counter tops. Large Flat screen TVs. Fire pits. Swimming pools, pool tables, Arcades, and Stainless Steel Kitchen appliances.

And you wonder why dorms now cost $3,000 a quarter?

Somehow, I am not shocked. And again, this goes back to culture. When everyone is paying for education on credit, then universities are geared towards the highest bidder. You have students, who have never worked a day in their whole lives honestly, and most are going to school 100% on loans. Without a concept of the hard work required to earn money, to them which ever school has the best stuff, wins.

There's a reason they have "top party schools" lists that come out every other year or whatever.

Regardless, the real point is what we've been saying for ages now. The minimum wage kills jobs. It always has, it always will. Every time the minimum wage goes up, people lose their jobs. Every single report I have ever read, says the same. Even reports that support the minimum wage, say as much, they just say the benefits outweigh the negatives, which is ridiculous.

If the minimum wage does not kill jobs, then why not just make the minimum wage a million dollars, and now everyone, everywhere, from youngest to oldest, from every race, from every culture, from every part of the country, New Jersey to Mississippi, everyone throughout the entire country will be millionaires and rich, and wealthy?

Well of course, anyone who really considers that, understands that is ridiculous. No one is going to pay a million dollars for a McDonald's burger, just because the minimum wage for the guy flipping the burger over, is a Million an hour.

 

[GWV5903]

Why doesn't Walmart pay a living wage? Answer: because the owners are greedy and want taxpayers to subsidize their employees.

And there is no better evidence than this statement that you have been on the reservation too long...

 

[Andylusion]

And granting legal status to illegals is going to help raise wages? Liberals think funny...

and for 40 years the democrats controlled the house of Representatives...

and if so called conservatives don't start looking for ways to you know actually give people what they want, Dems will control the federal government for 40 more.

If the Dems give people what they want, the result will be an economic crash, that will make the Great Depression look like a bad hair day.

Then perhaps the Republicans should start using their fucking heads and start giving the people at least SOME of what they want; because I hate to break it to you but our very government was set up to give the people what they want, or rather give the peoples' representatives what they want.

The job of the conservatives needs to change from constantly saying "no no no no" like a bunch of god damned petulant to children to .."look , we can't do this and here is why..... but, how about if we do this instead"

if you tell a man he can't have a steak and punch him in the face he isn't going to ask you to come around any more, but if you tell a guy he can't have a steak but he can have a hamburger, he's likely to ask you around again.

DUH

Huh? That was completely backwards. The people who are "god damned petulant to children", are the people who think they deserve everything, running around going 'gimme gimme gimme', and then screaming and turning red faced, flopping around on the ground like they are doing a break dance move, because you didn't give them the sucker they demanded.

Adults are the people who say "no, sorry little timmy, you can't have free health care, free food, free rent, and $80/hr because you suck air are a McDonald's".

Children make demands based on feelings.

Adults examine ramifications, and make choices that don't destroy the country.

Children blame banks, when they run out of money and people refuse to lend anymore to them.

Adults blame spending more than you make, and except responsibility for bad choices.

Children find excuses for their failures, and do them over and over, getting bitter over the same result.

Adults learn from their failures, and try not to do them again.



But somewhere along the line, you changed. You stopped being you. When things got hard, you started looking for something to blame.

Let me tell you something you already know. The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a vary mean nasty place, and I don't care how tough you are, it will beat you to your knees, and keep you there permanently if you let it.

You, me, and no body, is going to hit as hard as life. But it isn't about how hard your hit, it's about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!

Now if you know what you are worth, then go out and get what you are worth, but you got to be willing to take the hits, and not pointing fingers saying you ain't where you want to be because of Walmart, or McDonald's or the Minimum wage, or the GOP. Cowards and Leftists do that! And that ain't you... or is it?

To some people, Obama is the best thing to happen in this life. But until you grow up, and start working for your own life, you are not going to have a life.

Every once in a while, even Hollywood gets it right.

 

[rightwinger]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

First off, the part of the reason the prices of automobiles have gone up, is because of Federal regulations. In 1974, there were still dozens of independent auto manufacturers. By the 1990s, there were three.... and that was pretty much it. All the regulations and controls of the Federal government, killed all competition, and as a result, the big three did not have to compete with all the independent makers.

Second, EPA emission requirements, and the use of plastics and aluminum, instead of steel, and the need to design extensive safety measures, to make up for lack of steel, all of which is due to CAFE standards, all drive up the cost of the automobile.

Third, cars today have many features and abilities and functions, that cars back then didn't have. You could in fact buy a much cheaper car, if you decided to get a stripped down car.

Back in 2006, people forget about the Detroit Auto Show, in which Geely, a Chinese Auto Manufacturer, showed off their sub-$10,000 car.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/automobiles/autospecial/10geely.html

Now the interesting part of this article, is that Geely has been selling cars for just under $5,000 across the world. Middle East, Africa, and Eastern Europe.

But.... in the US, not one of the models they sell, meets the US environmental and safety standards.

Geely has announced plans to sell a 4-door model in the US.... for just under $10,000.

Now think about that. Just meeting the regulations, makes the price double.

We're paying for that when we buy a car. Now you can say, all those regulations are required and necessary. And maybe you are even right.

But when you complain that "you can't buy a car on minimum wage!" this is why. You have caused your own problem.

Fourth, the credit culture. Back in the 70s even, we had a culture of, if you want something, you have to save up and buy it. In the 80s, unfortunately, we turned into a credit culture. Everyone turned into the "I want it now" people.

The entire industry, when they spend millions of dollars designing and creating a new vehicle, they do so with a specific target price, and target buyer in mind. Before, when people had to save up money to buy a product, the auto makers understood this, and had a target price in mind, that was reasonable for the buyers they wished to get.

This dramatically shifted when consumers moved to using credit instead of cash, to buy cars. Now people could afford to buy a much more expensive car, on payments, than they could if they were purchasing with cash.

People showed up with saying "oh you mean for only $2,000 down, I can buy this expensive model, instead of the $5,000 car I can afford?". This shifted manufacturers to build more expensive models, knowing people are going to buy on credit, not cash.

So, while it's true you can't buy a bran new car, for a comparable amount of money, most of that is due to government regulations and controls, and most of the rest is due to culture.

As for education, you still can pay for an education on minimum wage. I know people who have done it. Of course you can't go to an expensive school, and you are not going to be living in luxury.

See, the problem here is the same. if you look at old dorms, and the facilities of Universities decades ago... they were pretty sparse. I found these old photos from the University of Wisconsin, 1945.

That's not a military boot camp barracks. That's the dorm room. Not a ton of extras. Not a whole lot of amenities. Don't see any dorm refrigerators here. Total cost for the month? $13 a month. In today's dollars, that would be $170.

Today's dorms have of course electricity, and heating and air conditioning, but then you also have phone and high speed internet, and then all the other extras.

Now when you compare this, to dorms today.... it's not even remotely comparable. Even if you compared them to dorms in the 1970s, it's not all that comparable. Dorms with individual rooms. Dorms with 19 by 16 floor plans. Dorms with "game rooms" and "lounge rooms". 24-hour professional assistance, claims OSU Dorm services. That costs money don't you think?

Check out this article.
The Luxification of College Dorms New Republic

Granite counter tops. Large Flat screen TVs. Fire pits. Swimming pools, pool tables, Arcades, and Stainless Steel Kitchen appliances.

And you wonder why dorms now cost $3,000 a quarter?

Somehow, I am not shocked. And again, this goes back to culture. When everyone is paying for education on credit, then universities are geared towards the highest bidder. You have students, who have never worked a day in their whole lives honestly, and most are going to school 100% on loans. Without a concept of the hard work required to earn money, to them which ever school has the best stuff, wins.

There's a reason they have "top party schools" lists that come out every other year or whatever.

Regardless, the real point is what we've been saying for ages now. The minimum wage kills jobs. It always has, it always will. Every time the minimum wage goes up, people lose their jobs. Every single report I have ever read, says the same. Even reports that support the minimum wage, say as much, they just say the benefits outweigh the negatives, which is ridiculous.

If the minimum wage does not kill jobs, then why not just make the minimum wage a million dollars, and now everyone, everywhere, from youngest to oldest, from every race, from every culture, from every part of the country, New Jersey to Mississippi, everyone throughout the entire country will be millionaires and rich, and wealthy?

Well of course, anyone who really considers that, understands that is ridiculous. No one is going to pay a million dollars for a McDonald's burger, just because the minimum wage for the guy flipping the burger over, is a Million an hour.

Shall we go further on what I could buy on my $2.10 minimum wage salary in 1974....

A gallon of gas cost 30 cents. I could buy seven gallons of gas for that $2.10. Today's min wage worker can buy two

I could rent an apartment for $150 a month. Less than a half months pay. Can't do that today

Conservatives scream that minimum wage is a "starter wage" not a living wage. I could get started on minimum wage. Pay for college, buy a car, rent an apartment

Today's young workers cant

 

[Redfish]

This is why I believe the Republicans should push for a $10/hr minimum wage and tell the liberals to shut the fuck up. $7.25 an hour is NOT a reasonable wage, it just isn't. But this "living wage" crap is ridiculous.

Of course if you bump the minimum wage to $10 an hour you better be ready to see all the low skilled barely do enough to get by employees get let go. Companies will not pay that for employees who aren't worth it.

What is unreasonable about it? What kid needs more money when they are living at home, eating their parents food, sleeping in their parents bed, and have no significant bills?

That is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. If you have 85 kids, 3 mistresses (all demanding money), two houses, and a BMW 320i and you have just the minimum wage job, then you have issues.

I did

As a 16 year old entering the workforce at minimum wage, I was saving money for college. I was able, making $2.10 an hour, to pay for four years of college working just summers

THAT is what a starting job with minimum wage is designed to do. Get you a start in life. Pay for college, get you a car so you can get to work, maybe get you started in an apartment.

Minimum wage used to do that, it no longer does

Interesting how that worked out, isn't it?

Yes it is

Kids of my generation had access to a minimum wage where they could pay for college, buy a new car, get an apartment.....Get a start on life

Republicans have blocked minimum wage increases so that is no longer possible

horseshit. No one paid for college and a car on minimum wage. Supply and demand should set the price of labor, not some radical teary eyed libtardian.

Poor misguided conservative

Yes you could pay for college with minimum wage. I paid my tuition making $2.10 an hour over the summer

In 1974, you could buy a brand new Chevy Nova for $2400. That would take you a little over six months at minimum wage

Today, at $7.25 an hour you would earn $7250 in six months. What kind of car would that buy you at the dealership?

First off, the part of the reason the prices of automobiles have gone up, is because of Federal regulations. In 1974, there were still dozens of independent auto manufacturers. By the 1990s, there were three.... and that was pretty much it. All the regulations and controls of the Federal government, killed all competition, and as a result, the big three did not have to compete with all the independent makers.

Second, EPA emission requirements, and the use of plastics and aluminum, instead of steel, and the need to design extensive safety measures, to make up for lack of steel, all of which is due to CAFE standards, all drive up the cost of the automobile.

Third, cars today have many features and abilities and functions, that cars back then didn't have. You could in fact buy a much cheaper car, if you decided to get a stripped down car.

Back in 2006, people forget about the Detroit Auto Show, in which Geely, a Chinese Auto Manufacturer, showed off their sub-$10,000 car.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/automobiles/autospecial/10geely.html

Now the interesting part of this article, is that Geely has been selling cars for just under $5,000 across the world. Middle East, Africa, and Eastern Europe.

But.... in the US, not one of the models they sell, meets the US environmental and safety standards.

Geely has announced plans to sell a 4-door model in the US.... for just under $10,000.

Now think about that. Just meeting the regulations, makes the price double.

We're paying for that when we buy a car. Now you can say, all those regulations are required and necessary. And maybe you are even right.

But when you complain that "you can't buy a car on minimum wage!" this is why. You have caused your own problem.

Fourth, the credit culture. Back in the 70s even, we had a culture of, if you want something, you have to save up and buy it. In the 80s, unfortunately, we turned into a credit culture. Everyone turned into the "I want it now" people.

The entire industry, when they spend millions of dollars designing and creating a new vehicle, they do so with a specific target price, and target buyer in mind. Before, when people had to save up money to buy a product, the auto makers understood this, and had a target price in mind, that was reasonable for the buyers they wished to get.

This dramatically shifted when consumers moved to using credit instead of cash, to buy cars. Now people could afford to buy a much more expensive car, on payments, than they could if they were purchasing with cash.

People showed up with saying "oh you mean for only $2,000 down, I can buy this expensive model, instead of the $5,000 car I can afford?". This shifted manufacturers to build more expensive models, knowing people are going to buy on credit, not cash.

So, while it's true you can't buy a bran new car, for a comparable amount of money, most of that is due to government regulations and controls, and most of the rest is due to culture.

As for education, you still can pay for an education on minimum wage. I know people who have done it. Of course you can't go to an expensive school, and you are not going to be living in luxury.

See, the problem here is the same. if you look at old dorms, and the facilities of Universities decades ago... they were pretty sparse. I found these old photos from the University of Wisconsin, 1945.

That's not a military boot camp barracks. That's the dorm room. Not a ton of extras. Not a whole lot of amenities. Don't see any dorm refrigerators here. Total cost for the month? $13 a month. In today's dollars, that would be $170.

Today's dorms have of course electricity, and heating and air conditioning, but then you also have phone and high speed internet, and then all the other extras.

Now when you compare this, to dorms today.... it's not even remotely comparable. Even if you compared them to dorms in the 1970s, it's not all that comparable. Dorms with individual rooms. Dorms with 19 by 16 floor plans. Dorms with "game rooms" and "lounge rooms". 24-hour professional assistance, claims OSU Dorm services. That costs money don't you think?

Check out this article.
The Luxification of College Dorms New Republic

Granite counter tops. Large Flat screen TVs. Fire pits. Swimming pools, pool tables, Arcades, and Stainless Steel Kitchen appliances.

And you wonder why dorms now cost $3,000 a quarter?

Somehow, I am not shocked. And again, this goes back to culture. When everyone is paying for education on credit, then universities are geared towards the highest bidder. You have students, who have never worked a day in their whole lives honestly, and most are going to school 100% on loans. Without a concept of the hard work required to earn money, to them which ever school has the best stuff, wins.

There's a reason they have "top party schools" lists that come out every other year or whatever.

Regardless, the real point is what we've been saying for ages now. The minimum wage kills jobs. It always has, it always will. Every time the minimum wage goes up, people lose their jobs. Every single report I have ever read, says the same. Even reports that support the minimum wage, say as much, they just say the benefits outweigh the negatives, which is ridiculous.

If the minimum wage does not kill jobs, then why not just make the minimum wage a million dollars, and now everyone, everywhere, from youngest to oldest, from every race, from every culture, from every part of the country, New Jersey to Mississippi, everyone throughout the entire country will be millionaires and rich, and wealthy?

Well of course, anyone who really considers that, understands that is ridiculous. No one is going to pay a million dollars for a McDonald's burger, just because the minimum wage for the guy flipping the burger over, is a Million an hour.

Shall we go further on what I could buy on my $2.10 minimum wage salary in 1974....

A gallon of gas cost 30 cents. I could buy seven gallons of gas for that $2.10. Today's min wage worker can buy two

I could rent an apartment for $150 a month. Less than a half months pay. Can't do that today

Conservatives scream that minimum wage is a "starter wage" not a living wage. I could get started on minimum wage. Pay for college, buy a car, rent an apartment

Today's young workers cant

What's really foolish with this entire thread is that Walmart does not pay minimum wage. Neither do most fast food ourlets. Second, when you were making $2.10/hr you did not get any benefits with that job, Walmart employees get insurance, retirement, profit sharing, vacations, and sick leave.

The whole minimum wage narrative is nothing but another left wing attempt to divide the country.

 

[paulitician]

I shop at Walmart as little as possible. The stores are dirty, stinky, and loud. I recommend all who have a problem with Walmart to do the same. There are other businesses worth supporting. So you pay a little more, it's worth it. You get better quality service and products. And you don't have to put up with the dirt, stank, and ignorance.

True. But when you are in need of cheap, unnecessary plastic objects from China - Walmart is just the ticket.

True. But Walmart is so dank. It's Third World stinky mayhem. Shopping there is an all-around unpleasant experience. I shop elsewhere. You do pay more, but it's so worth it.

 

[Redfish]

I shop at Walmart as little as possible. The stores are dirty, stinky, and loud. I recommend all who have a problem with Walmart to do the same. There are other businesses worth supporting. So you pay a little more, it's worth it. You get better quality service and products. And you don't have to put up with the dirt, stank, and ignorance.

True. But when you are in need of cheap, unnecessary plastic objects from China - Walmart is just the ticket.

True. But Walmart is so dank. It's Third World stinky mayhem. Shopping there is an all-around unpleasant experience. I shop elsewhere. You do pay more, but it's so worth it.

walmart provides a money saving option for low income people. Those on the left want to eliminate that option and make the poor suffer more than they already do.

 

[paulitician]

Clearly a civil servant mandated minimum living wage is required.

People Before Profits Comrades !!!

Actually, 'People before Profits' sounds like a really honorable creed to me. It's what Jesus would want. America has lost its way. Greed kills. And it's definitely killing America.