We get to pay for student loans. Great.

[Red Front]

Communism might have limited success in....small communes.

Beyond that no.

Communism is the future, but before that there will be a process of socializing production. That process is called socialism. Advanced technology ensures that production will become socialist and then communist.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Wrong.
We were not ahead of the rest of the world until after WWII, when we sent all those soldiers to college and made tuition cheap or free for everyone.
It is only then that the US started out producing everyone else.
The constitution not only had almost no impact, but we totally ignore it these days, with the BATF, DEA, FDA, etc.

And the reason for any US success has always been from government investment, like Hoover dam, TVA, the St. Lawrence Seaway, etc.

There is nothing wrong with government investments up to the point they are funding personal investments.

Government funded college is not a social investment. Everybody that works contributes to society, I don't care if you collect garbage for a living, taking orders at McDonalds, washing windows on a high rise.

All our jobs and contributions are of value. To say that only college people are of value and is owed by society is an insult to every working American.

I drove a tractor-trailer for a living. Driving is in the top ten most dangerous jobs in the US; even more so than being a police officer or fire fighter. Without us, you would have no food in your store, no place to buy your big screens, no cars to drive. I consider my job just as important as an engineer or architect. But that doesn't mean society owes me anything. I made the choice to do what I did and all expenses to get there were paid by me, not taxpayers.

 

[SweetSue92]

Communism is the future, but before that there will be a process of socializing production. That process is called socialism. Advanced technology ensures that production will become socialist and then communist.

Okay honey

 

[Red Front]

I mean to say it is not providing the services people pay for with their taxes. Like all govt programs, it is heavily funded and under-delivering. Badly.

Actually, most social programs are underfunded and often defunded due to Republicans and moderate Dems. The politicians under the influence of the private sector are always trying to privatize all functions and services of government, including all of the resources of this country. Expropriating wealth from the American people to private corporations.

 

[SweetSue92]

Actually, most social programs are underfunded and often defunded due to Republicans and moderate Dems. The politicians under the influence of the private sector are always trying to privatize all functions and services of government, including all of the resources of this country. Expropriating wealth from the American people to private corporations.

Ackshually, that's because most private entities do a much better job of all social programs than the bloated federal bureaucrats could ever dream.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

Communism might have limited success in....small communes.

and only there because in communism eke-ing out an existence is considered to be success....btw, I get the feeling the man in red is about to unleash one of his patented 25 paragraph notes on us.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

the 60's is when we started going downhill, it only appears to be the late 90's cuz there was 12-15 year respite after the 60'and 70's where everything was hunky dory...
... and as for tuition going up that's on the schools which is who is really getting bailed out here, as long as the government keeps foot the bill they tuition increases are all but mandatory...
...the solution is to tell the schools to forgive the debt.

The solution is to make a law that nobody can attend college until the age of 21. Let these kids live at home, get a full-time job and save all their money, then pay cash if they want an advanced education.

 

[Red Front]

There is nothing wrong with government investments up to the point they are funding personal investments.

Government funded college is not a social investment. Everybody that works contributes to society, I don't care if you collect garbage for a living, taking orders at McDonalds, washing windows on a high rise.

All our jobs and contributions are of value. To say that only college people are of value and is owed by society is an insult to every working American.

I drove a tractor-trailer for a living. Driving is in the top ten most dangerous jobs in the US; even more so than being a police officer or fire fighter. Without us, you would have no food in your store, no place to buy your big screens, no cars to drive. I consider my job just as important as an engineer or architect. But that doesn't mean society owes me anything. I made the choice to do what I did and all expenses to get there were paid by me, not taxpayers.

All of those menial jobs are going to be replaced with technology within the next ten years. There are going to be tens of millions of unemployed Americans in this country. When automated systems, robots, artificial intelligence, and self-driving vehicles. etc replace wage labor, we are forced to adopt a socialized and democratized form of production, free of markets and the profit motive.

 

[Red Front]

The solution is to make a law that nobody can attend college until the age of 21. Let these kids live at home, get a full-time job and save all their money, then pay cash if they want an advanced education.

Too expensive. Our society through its government can provide a tuition-free higher education to all of its citizens. The return on our investment is 1000-fold.

 

[Mac-7]

Actually, most social programs are underfunded and often defunded due to Republicans and moderate Dems. The politicians under the influence of the private sector are always trying to privatize all functions and services of government, including all of the resources of this country. Expropriating wealth from the American people to private corporations.

Most social programs get more money than they deserve

There are a few people who are unable to provide for themselves THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN

But most adults sucking on the government teat are welfare bums

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Too expensive. Our society through its government can provide a tuition-free higher education to all of its citizens. The return on our investment is 1000-fold.

Bullshit. if people don't pay for their college somebody else has to. We are a country over 30 trillion dollars in debt and growing. We don't have the money to be paying for college for everybody.

 

[Red Front]

Ackshually, that's because most private entities do a much better job of all social programs than the bloated federal bureaucrats could ever dream.

Actually, that's a myth, the government often does a better job.

Myth 5: The private sector is more efficient than the public sector

newint.org

Does Privatization Serve the Public Interest?

For decades prior to the 1980s, governments around the world increased the scope and magnitude of their activities, taking on a variety of tasks that the private sector previously had performed. In the United States, the federal government built highways and dams, conducted research, increased...

hbr.org

​

All of the studies show that the public sector is often just as efficient as the private sector, if not more so. It's often more cost-effective and able to meet objectives better than private companies. Private companies can be just as bureaucratic, even more so, than the government.

 

[Red Front]

Bullshit. if people don't pay for their college somebody else has to. We are a country over 30 trillion dollars in debt and growing. We don't have the money to be paying for college for everybody.

There is no real "debt", that's a misnomer, it's simply a ledger of how much money assets are in the economy, being saved in treasury bonds. The federal government can't go insolvent because it is the exclusive issuer of the dollar. You're confusing micro and macro economics, household debt, with a government with a sovereign currency. They're both not the same.

​

More, tuition-free college, is an investment that will benefit the country tremendously. Having a well-educated and skilled populace benefits everyone.

 

[Red Front]

Most social programs get more money than they deserve

There are a few people who are unable to provide for themselves THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN

But most adults sucking on the government teat are welfare bums

The billionaires, the big companies, they're the welfare bums. Social programs should be adequately funded and we will increase public health, education, and productivity. We will get rid of poverty.

 

[LeftofLeft]

No because then only the rich will be able to go to college. Loans are so everyone can.

The actual true answer is FREE COLLEGE like Europe.

I specifically called for eliminating EGREGIOUS loans where students and their families assume 6 digit loans, going to private school 3 time zones away and majoring in a concentration of study for which there is no job prospects or low salaries resulting in student loan defaults. It’s like putting a homeowner in an $800k house when they can only qualify for a $400k house.

That said, I’m all for providing loans or even free college for qualifying students to attend local community college, trade school, state universities, and certain areas of studies for which there is demand for good paying jobs so that the loan can be repaid.

Yet that may not be good enough for the socialist and communist mindset here in the US but too bad. I went to state and local college and majored in a field for which I could get a good job so that I would not saddle myself or my parents with debt while some of my high school peers didn’t worry about a penny to attend a private college far away and major in whatever they wanted because their families were that wealthy. This is not a complaint on my part. In my eyes, I got the opportunity to go to college and make more money today (35 years later) than the wealthy kids I knew.

I’m all for higher education assistance but there must be caps and restrictions to avoid the mess we are in now.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

The solution is to make a law that nobody can attend college until the age of 21. Let these kids live at home, get a full-time job and save all their money, then pay cash if they want an advanced education.

The schools are the problem Ray, all the money flows to and through them, and the term debt forgiveness is just a transfer of debt, the debt isn't forgiven at all, just transferred to a government with deep pockets,.
... as long as the schools know they can count on this they will be incentivized to shoot for the stars when charging tuition, that is why they want the government to back the loans.
Real debt forgiveness would be if the schools forgave the debt

 

[j-mac]

Actually, that's a myth, the government often does a better job.

Myth 5: The private sector is more efficient than the public sector

newint.org

Does Privatization Serve the Public Interest?

For decades prior to the 1980s, governments around the world increased the scope and magnitude of their activities, taking on a variety of tasks that the private sector previously had performed. In the United States, the federal government built highways and dams, conducted research, increased...

hbr.org

​

All of the studies show that the public sector is often just as efficient as the private sector, if not more so. It's often more cost-effective and able to meet objectives better than private companies. Private companies can be just as bureaucratic, even more so, than the government.

Beware of ANY thought that starts out with “All of the…”

 

[Deplorable Yankee]

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The schools are the problem Ray, all the money flows to and through them, and the term debt forgiveness is just a transfer of debt, the debt isn't forgiven at all, just transferred to a government with deep pockets,.
... as long as the schools know they can count on this they will be incentivized to shoot for the stars when charging tuition, that is why they want the government to back the loans.
Real debt forgiveness would be if the schools forgave the debt

I think we have too many people in college anyway. Once you work for a few years, actually pay taxes, you learn the value of a dollar. Some kid that never worked a job in his or her life doesn't fully understand what they are getting into when they take a loan for college. By the time you hit 21 years old you are more mature and responsible. When they take out credit, they learn how difficult it can be to pay back money and may consider trade school over college. Much cheaper and you get out into the work force faster.

When I was working I can't tell you how many other truck drivers I talked to that were college graduates. They chose driving over the career they studied for because it paid better money and there was (and still is) a huge demand for drivers. If they would have chose driving in the first place, they'd have tens of thousands of dollars back in their pocket.

 

[22lcidw]

We all know that college education is overpriced by a large margin. Way to costly. The sheepskin is worth much more than then what is taught.