Well I am about to get screwed, another case of middle class getting the shaft.

[iamwhatiseem]

I was fortunate to work for a company that had REAL pensions. The old fashion kind. The real deal.
They stopped contributing to, and stopped offering it to new employees back in 2008.
But I was vested, and had built up funds for 22 years.
My last statement had the value at $2200/mo assuming I began taking the money at age 65. (I will be 59 next month)
I received a letter saying they are fully terminating the plan.
For those who have not started receiving funds - we will get 100% of the value given to us by law.
But... that value is only what the vested share was in 2008. Not the 16 years worth of interest. You see - our corrupt government allowed companies to terminate a plan, at any time, and are only required to pay out the value of the plan when they stopped contributing. They can keep the interest.
If I lived to 85, I would have received about $528,000 in payments to me.
In 2008, that value was barely $140,000. So, it looks like, and I know how to read, that is the amount they will pay out.
Mother Fuckers. There is no way I can turn $140k into a tax deferred vehicle and make that have gains to be $528k while also withdrawing funds.
The original family members that owned the company were great. They could have terminated the plan back in 2008 but stated very clearly that they will not do so because they appreciate all the years people worked for their company, and will not renegue on pension responsibilities.
But most of those folks are dead. Now it is their children. Most of which never spent a day working for the company. In fact, never spent a day working anywhere. They have lived off of the earnings of their parents.
They just said fuck you to all of us.

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

I was fortunate to work for a company that had REAL pensions. The old fashion kind. The real deal.
They stopped contributing to, and stopped offering it to new employees back in 2008.
But I was vested, and had built up funds for 22 years.
My last statement had the value at $2200/mo assuming I began taking the money at age 65. (I will be 59 next month)
I received a letter saying they are fully terminating the plan.
For those who have not started receiving funds - we will get 100% of the value given to us by law.
But... that value is only what the vested share was in 2008. Not the 16 years worth of interest. You see - our corrupt government allowed companies to terminate a plan, at any time, and are only required to pay out the value of the plan when they stopped contributing. They can keep the interest.
If I lived to 85, I would have received about $528,000 in payments to me.
In 2008, that value was barely $140,000. So, it looks like, and I know how to read, that is the amount they will pay out.
Mother Fuckers. There is no way I can turn $140k into a tax deferred vehicle and make that have gains to be $528k while also withdrawing funds.
The original family members that owned the company were great. They could have terminated the plan back in 2008 but stated very clearly that they will not do so because they appreciate all the years people worked for their company, and will not renegue on pension responsibilities.
But most of those folks are dead. Now it is their children. Most of which never spent a day working for the company. In fact, never spent a day working anywhere. They have lived off of the earnings of their parents.
They just said fuck you to all of us.

Welcome to Capitalism 101.
You are at the mercy of the owners...and the Govt. fully supports that.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Welcome to Capitalism 101.
You are at the mercy of the owners...and the Govt. fully supports that.

No
That is corruption 101.
And laws are only as good as the system that makes and enforces them.
Numerous changed have been made to allow businesses to renege on pension requirements that USE to be illegal. And, we received notice of those laws many years ago.
But, because they can, the government changed the laws to make it no longer illegal to benefit the corporations who have paid them to make those changes.
That is not "Capitalism 101"... that is corruption 101. Every form of governance or societal organization can be made corrupt. All of them.

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

No
That is corruption 101.
And laws are only as good as the system that makes and enforces them.
Numerous changed have been made to allow businesses to renege on pension requirements that USE to be illegal. And, we received notice of those laws many years ago.
But, because they can, the government changed the laws to make it no longer illegal to benefit the corporations who have paid them to make those changes.
That is not "Capitalism 101"... that is corruption 101. Every form of governance or societal organization can be made corrupt. All of them.

Tomato-Tomahtoe. Corruption is an integral component of Laissez-faire Capitalism--and it always has been.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Tomato-Tomahtoe. Corruption is an integral component of Laissez-faire Capitalism--and it always has been.

Yeah... and there is no such corruption in Socialism....

It's like blaming the currency for being used to buy illegal drugs.

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

Yeah... and there is no such corruption in Socialism....

It's like blaming the currency for being used to buy illegal drugs.

Corruption is always a part of Govt. whatever -ism you care to name.
But your issue..pensions...have always been a PITA to the shareholder class. They fought them tooth and nail a hundred years ago..along with Unions, minimum wage and the 40 hour work week.
They fight them still.

 

[MarathonMike]

I was fortunate to work for a company that had REAL pensions. The old fashion kind. The real deal.
They stopped contributing to, and stopped offering it to new employees back in 2008.
But I was vested, and had built up funds for 22 years.
My last statement had the value at $2200/mo assuming I began taking the money at age 65. (I will be 59 next month)
I received a letter saying they are fully terminating the plan.
For those who have not started receiving funds - we will get 100% of the value given to us by law.
But... that value is only what the vested share was in 2008. Not the 16 years worth of interest. You see - our corrupt government allowed companies to terminate a plan, at any time, and are only required to pay out the value of the plan when they stopped contributing. They can keep the interest.
If I lived to 85, I would have received about $528,000 in payments to me.
In 2008, that value was barely $140,000. So, it looks like, and I know how to read, that is the amount they will pay out.
Mother Fuckers. There is no way I can turn $140k into a tax deferred vehicle and make that have gains to be $528k while also withdrawing funds.
The original family members that owned the company were great. They could have terminated the plan back in 2008 but stated very clearly that they will not do so because they appreciate all the years people worked for their company, and will not renegue on pension responsibilities.
But most of those folks are dead. Now it is their children. Most of which never spent a day working for the company. In fact, never spent a day working anywhere. They have lived off of the earnings of their parents.
They just said fuck you to all of us.

That is a violation of the Pension Protection Act. You and your fellow pensioners should file a class action.

 

[White 6]

I was fortunate to work for a company that had REAL pensions. The old fashion kind. The real deal.
They stopped contributing to, and stopped offering it to new employees back in 2008.
But I was vested, and had built up funds for 22 years.
My last statement had the value at $2200/mo assuming I began taking the money at age 65. (I will be 59 next month)
I received a letter saying they are fully terminating the plan.
For those who have not started receiving funds - we will get 100% of the value given to us by law.
But... that value is only what the vested share was in 2008. Not the 16 years worth of interest. You see - our corrupt government allowed companies to terminate a plan, at any time, and are only required to pay out the value of the plan when they stopped contributing. They can keep the interest.
If I lived to 85, I would have received about $528,000 in payments to me.
In 2008, that value was barely $140,000. So, it looks like, and I know how to read, that is the amount they will pay out.
Mother Fuckers. There is no way I can turn $140k into a tax deferred vehicle and make that have gains to be $528k while also withdrawing funds.
The original family members that owned the company were great. They could have terminated the plan back in 2008 but stated very clearly that they will not do so because they appreciate all the years people worked for their company, and will not renegue on pension responsibilities.
But most of those folks are dead. Now it is their children. Most of which never spent a day working for the company. In fact, never spent a day working anywhere. They have lived off of the earnings of their parents.
They just said fuck you to all of us.

Sounds like the company was taken over by assholes, that simply do not value commitment by employees. I would have thought, the vested were vested.

 

[Blues Man]

I was fortunate to work for a company that had REAL pensions. The old fashion kind. The real deal.
They stopped contributing to, and stopped offering it to new employees back in 2008.
But I was vested, and had built up funds for 22 years.
My last statement had the value at $2200/mo assuming I began taking the money at age 65. (I will be 59 next month)
I received a letter saying they are fully terminating the plan.
For those who have not started receiving funds - we will get 100% of the value given to us by law.
But... that value is only what the vested share was in 2008. Not the 16 years worth of interest. You see - our corrupt government allowed companies to terminate a plan, at any time, and are only required to pay out the value of the plan when they stopped contributing. They can keep the interest.
If I lived to 85, I would have received about $528,000 in payments to me.
In 2008, that value was barely $140,000. So, it looks like, and I know how to read, that is the amount they will pay out.
Mother Fuckers. There is no way I can turn $140k into a tax deferred vehicle and make that have gains to be $528k while also withdrawing funds.
The original family members that owned the company were great. They could have terminated the plan back in 2008 but stated very clearly that they will not do so because they appreciate all the years people worked for their company, and will not renegue on pension responsibilities.
But most of those folks are dead. Now it is their children. Most of which never spent a day working for the company. In fact, never spent a day working anywhere. They have lived off of the earnings of their parents.
They just said fuck you to all of us.

You shouldn't have trusted anyone else to plan for your retirement.

Weren't you saving anything outside your pension plan?

 

[iamwhatiseem]

That is a violation of the Pension Protection Act. You and your fellow pensioners should file a class action.

It use to be.
The Pension protection plan act provides legal protection differently, depending on two things:
1) If you are already receiving funds then they are required by law to continue making payments to you until your death with no deduction in amounts. Must continue to pay full amount.
2) If you have NOT began receiving funds, then you are only protected as to the value of your plan to the date the company stopped the plan. (NOTE - stopping a plan is not the same as terminating a plan)

They stopped the plan in 2008. They are only required to pay out non receivers what the value was the day the plan ended. Any and all gains after that date, they are not required to pay.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

You shouldn't have trusted anyone else to plan for your retirement.

Weren't you saving anything outside your pension plan?

Of course - that is irrelevant to the promises and legal requirements of a pension.

 

[Donald H]

And we'll all still wavel the flag down at the courthouse,

cause it's wots goodest thing of all.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Sounds like the company was taken over by assholes, that simply do not value commitment by employees. I would have thought, the vested were vested.

You are still vested. But if you have not started receiving money yet - they are only required to pay you what the value of your vested amount was when they stopped the plan.
Again - note stopping a plan is not the same as terminating a plan.

 

[Moonglow]

Welcome to Capitalism 101.
You are at the mercy of the owners...and the Govt. fully supports that.

Which is why I was self-employed for 35 years.

 

[Moonglow]

Yeah... and there is no such corruption in Socialism....

It's like blaming the currency for being used to buy illegal drugs.

The US has 5% of the world's population but consumes 50% of the world's pharmaceuticals.

 

[MarathonMike]

It use to be.
The Pension protection plan act provides legal protection differently, depending on two things:
1) If you are already receiving funds then they are required by law to continue making payments to you until your death with no deduction in amounts. Must continue to pay full amount.
2) If you have NOT began receiving funds, then you are only protected as to the value of your plan to the date the company stopped the plan. (NOTE - stopping a plan is not the same as terminating a plan)

They stopped the plan in 2008. They are only required to pay out non receivers what the value was the day the plan ended. Any and all gains after that date, they are not required to pay.

Stopping the plan is not the same as terminating the plan? Wow talk about legal double speak.

 

[Blues Man]

Of course - that is irrelevant to the promises and legal requirements of a pension.

Well it seems what they are doing to you is legal also.

Maybe you didn't read all the fine print

 

[MarathonMike]

And we'll all still wavel the flag down at the courthouse,

cause it's wots goodest thing of all.

Drinking already Donald?

 

[1srelluc]

In before a class action lawyer hits you up.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Well it seems what they are doing to you is legal also.

Maybe you didn't read all the fine print

Maybe you don't understand that the laws have changed significantly in the past 30 years pertaining to pensions.
The "fine print" is only good until it is changed again.

And why are you being an ass anyway?
Jesus Christ