"What To The Slave Is The 4th Of July?"

[Correll]

1. "Whites" made slavery legal? Someone tell that to the Ottomans. For ONE example.

2. If any voters in 1860 thought there was a bigger issue than slavery, they were fools.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

Your post is a bunch of gibberish son. You can't give me a reality check. I said whites made slavery legal. And since Lincoln was not president of the ottoman empire your reference to that shows that you are a dumb ass trying to divert from the subject being discussed.

So like I said, lie to yourself, you have that right.

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

 

[IM2]

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

Your post is a bunch of gibberish son. You can't give me a reality check. I said whites made slavery legal. And since Lincoln was not president of the ottoman empire your reference to that shows that you are a dumb ass trying to divert from the subject being discussed.

So like I said, lie to yourself, you have that right.

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

 

[Correll]

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.




You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

Your post is a bunch of gibberish son. You can't give me a reality check. I said whites made slavery legal. And since Lincoln was not president of the ottoman empire your reference to that shows that you are a dumb ass trying to divert from the subject being discussed.

So like I said, lie to yourself, you have that right.

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

 

[katsteve2012]

Yes you're trying to give credit where It's not deserved.

You need to understand one simple reality correll. Whites made slavery legal. That was a mistake, they fucked up, it was stupid, dumb, a flawed decision. So for you to act like it was some fucking great noble deed for whites to correct their own fuck up is just as stupid. Nobody owes any debt of gratitude to white people for deciding to do what os right. Why should we be grateful? What the fuck s going through your mid? That we backs should be happy because we could still be saves or something? Because that's all you're trying to say here.

The truth s that Lincoln was not elected either time because of his claimed anti slavery stance. The war was fought to preserve the union. The only reason Lincoln was elected a second time was that the north pulled out a couple of victories in the war because the North wanted tp stop fighting. Now you can lie to yourself all you want. You can post extra large pictures all you want, but I know that Lincoln did not fight t end slavery, that he saw blacks as inferior and he was a racist.

1. "Whites" made slavery legal? Someone tell that to the Ottomans. For ONE example.

2. If any voters in 1860 thought there was a bigger issue than slavery, they were fools.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

Yes you're trying to give credit where It's not deserved.

You need to understand one simple reality correll. Whites made slavery legal. That was a mistake, they fucked up, it was stupid, dumb, a flawed decision. So for you to act like it was some fucking great noble deed for whites to correct their own fuck up is just as stupid. Nobody owes any debt of gratitude to white people for deciding to do what os right. Why should we be grateful? What the fuck s going through your mid? That we backs should be happy because we could still be saves or something? Because that's all you're trying to say here.

The truth s that Lincoln was not elected either time because of his claimed anti slavery stance. The war was fought to preserve the union. The only reason Lincoln was elected a second time was that the north pulled out a couple of victories in the war because the North wanted tp stop fighting. Now you can lie to yourself all you want. You can post extra large pictures all you want, but I know that Lincoln did not fight t end slavery, that he saw blacks as inferior and he was a racist.

1. "Whites" made slavery legal? Someone tell that to the Ottomans. For ONE example.

2. If any voters in 1860 thought there was a bigger issue than slavery, they were fools.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

 

[IM2]

Your post is a bunch of gibberish son. You can't give me a reality check. I said whites made slavery legal. And since Lincoln was not president of the ottoman empire your reference to that shows that you are a dumb ass trying to divert from the subject being discussed.

So like I said, lie to yourself, you have that right.

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

 

[katsteve2012]

Your post is a bunch of gibberish son. You can't give me a reality check. I said whites made slavery legal. And since Lincoln was not president of the ottoman empire your reference to that shows that you are a dumb ass trying to divert from the subject being discussed.

So like I said, lie to yourself, you have that right.

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Do you just sit and think of statements to make that have no logical foundation just for the hell of it?

It does not matter if those who fought in the Civil War were alive or not when slavery was started in America. The fact is that there was also an opposing side that fought to KEEP slavery in effect.

Furthermore, as you probably DID NOT know, one the many economic reasons for wanting to stop the expansion of slavery to the north was to protect the white labor force that was already present in that part of the country. So there was absolutely a vested interest beyond "morality" for the Union troops to stop the progression of slavery.

 

[katsteve2012]

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

 

[Correll]

1. "Whites" made slavery legal? Someone tell that to the Ottomans. For ONE example.

2. If any voters in 1860 thought there was a bigger issue than slavery, they were fools.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

1. "Whites" made slavery legal? Someone tell that to the Ottomans. For ONE example.

2. If any voters in 1860 thought there was a bigger issue than slavery, they were fools.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

You are denying people the respect their deserve for their actions and sacrifices because of something someone ELSE did.


YOu are the bad guy here.




Lincoln paid with his life for doing what he thought was morally right, ie ending slavery.

 

[Correll]

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

Didn't care?

Are you insane? You just dismissed the whole abolitionist movement.

 

[Correll]

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Do you just sit and think of statements to make that have no logical foundation just for the hell of it?

It does not matter if those who fought in the Civil War were alive or not when slavery was started in America. The fact is that there was also an opposing side that fought to KEEP slavery in effect.

Furthermore, as you probably DID NOT know, one the many economic reasons for wanting to stop the expansion of slavery to the north was to protect the white labor force that was already present in that part of the country. So there was absolutely a vested interest beyond "morality" for the Union troops to stop the progression of slavery.

Sure, a MINORITY of whites fought to keep slavery alive. I'm not asking you to respect them.

That fact that they shared skin color with their enemies who were fighting and dying to END slavery, does not detract from the NOble Sacrifices of those who were fighting to end slavery.


Lincoln and Davidson were both white. IT is insane of you to think that that shared skin color means that both are responsible for the other's actions.

Also, racist.

 

[Correll]

What's next, a full page ad?

The fact here is that after 200 years whites decided to correct their fuck up and you act like that's something great and should be held in high esteem.

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

 

[katsteve2012]

Those that choose and fought and sacrificed, deserve respect for their choices and battles and sacrifices.

You want to deny them their due, because some one else, long ago, long before them, did something wrong, and had the same skin color.


And that's racist.

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

I dont have a "purpose" here. You are bent out of shape because I am not aligned with your romanticized bullshit.

The southern states were understandably apprehensive. Lincoln, was a threat to their labor force because he wanted to preserve and industrialize the Union.

 

[katsteve2012]

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

So many times you chumps tell me how you were not around at certain times and since you were not around then, you don't know what the real issues were.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

Secondly we are talking about America not the Ottoman empire . So you can stop playing that dumb ass game you white people play when you are presented with the fact that your white asses made slavery legal in these united states.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.

Whites made slavery legal and for whites to have corrected your fuck up is nothing to be happy about nor is it something that should be cherished or bragged about. Whites fucked up and after some 200 years whites finally decided to do something about their fuck up.

Now for you to try bragging about how a war was fought over slavery shows just how stupid whites were in this regard. They fucked up, knew they fucked up from the beginning, but yet refused to fix the fuck up until half a million of you died.

You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

You are denying people the respect their deserve for their actions and sacrifices because of something someone ELSE did.


YOu are the bad guy here.




Lincoln paid with his life for doing what he thought was morally right, ie ending slavery.

Lincoln lost his life because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He did what he said he would do at the outset...preserved the union.
Morality was secondary.

I bet you believe in Santa Claus tok

 

[Correll]

Those people did not pick Lincoln because he wanted to end slavery They did not fight to end slavery. They do not deserve credit for what they did not do,.You don't get to call me a racist because I tell the truth.. I said had they done what you claim, all they were doing was creating their own fuck up and that is nothing to celebrate. I'm quite sure you are of the opinion that Jews should be thankful to the Germans because the Germans stopped gassing them. Your claim is exactly like you saying that.

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

I dont have a "purpose" here. You are bent out of shape because I am not aligned with your romanticized bullshit.

The southern states were understandably apprehensive. Lincoln, was a threat to their labor force because he wanted to preserve and industrialize the Union.

1. Your purpose here is obvious. You want to deconstruct American Nationalism and bolster Black Ethno-nationalism.

2. Lincoln was a threat to their labor force because he was strongly anti-slavery, on moral grounds. And as that person he won the Republican Primary and then the general election, in a franchise limited to white men. A proud day for America.

 

[Correll]

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.




You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

Wow. A supposed academic arguing AGAINST the possibility of understanding something though study....

Incredible.

Anyway, it is absurd to think that slavery was not the primary issue of the elections in 1860 or 1865.

I was responding to what you said. It is fairly common of you lefties to act as though white people invented slavery or it only happened here.

Just giving you a reality check.

Slavery was not invented here. It was pretty much global and normal when white people first started coming to these shores. It was not some new idea that white people came up with here in the Americas.




You talk of those that instituted slavery in the hemisphere, and those that fought to end it in this hemisphere as though they were the same people.


Which has to be dishonest of you, as no one can be that stupid.


Right?


Lincoln, and those that followed him, so often to their deaths, deserve credit for their fight against slavery.

That you can't give it to them, because they are white, is your racism speaking.

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

You are denying people the respect their deserve for their actions and sacrifices because of something someone ELSE did.


YOu are the bad guy here.




Lincoln paid with his life for doing what he thought was morally right, ie ending slavery.

Lincoln lost his life because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He did what he said he would do at the outset...preserved the union.
Morality was secondary.

I bet you believe in Santa Claus tok

You are the one who is believing the politician with every reason to lie, instead of looking at his statements when he was not under the gun and looking at his actions.

 

[katsteve2012]

None of the people that fought the Civil War were alive when slavery was instituted in colonial America.

Your words are utter nonsense.

Racist nonsense, as you are treating all whites as a single entity.

Which is racist and utterly stupid.

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

I dont have a "purpose" here. You are bent out of shape because I am not aligned with your romanticized bullshit.

The southern states were understandably apprehensive. Lincoln, was a threat to their labor force because he wanted to preserve and industrialize the Union.

1. Your purpose here is obvious. You want to deconstruct American Nationalism and bolster Black Ethno-nationalism.

2. Lincoln was a threat to their labor force because he was strongly anti-slavery, on moral grounds. And as that person he won the Republican Primary and then the general election, in a franchise limited to white men. A proud day for America.

"A franchise limited to white men"? "A proud day for America"? Slavery ended, Jim Crow began and the KKK was founded.

And in many ways Jim Crow and Black Codes were just as restrictive and oppressive as slavery.

Now it's obvious that you are a white nationalist loon who actually believes that the war was fought on a moral platfom and that Lincoln was a "humanitarian" who was on a mission of empathy to liberate slsves from captivity. What is even more hilarious is your belief that he was elected by a nation of noble, empathetic white males who believed the same nonsense that you are spinning in this thread.

Slaves were the equivalent of FARM ANIMALS in that era, which means they were not even considered human, and they became an obsolete source of labor in a nation that was being advanced towards industrialization. You can continue to try to convince yourself that the lie you believe is true, but it is not and you can't change history.

 

[katsteve2012]

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

You are denying people the respect their deserve for their actions and sacrifices because of something someone ELSE did.


YOu are the bad guy here.




Lincoln paid with his life for doing what he thought was morally right, ie ending slavery.

Lincoln lost his life because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He did what he said he would do at the outset...preserved the union.
Morality was secondary.

I bet you believe in Santa Claus tok

You are the one who is believing the politician with every reason to lie, instead of looking at his statements when he was not under the gun and looking at his actions.

 

[Correll]

Always an excuse. Those people lived their whole lives in a nation with legalized slavery and didn't care idiot. None of those white people who fought in the civil war fought for slavery. The 200,000 blacks did..I am treating those whites as they were at that time.

You don't get to invent what racism is. Just understand that I and it appears that steve too, will not be crediting people for fixing a fuck up that never should have been. What you think is not going to change that.

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

I dont have a "purpose" here. You are bent out of shape because I am not aligned with your romanticized bullshit.

The southern states were understandably apprehensive. Lincoln, was a threat to their labor force because he wanted to preserve and industrialize the Union.

1. Your purpose here is obvious. You want to deconstruct American Nationalism and bolster Black Ethno-nationalism.

2. Lincoln was a threat to their labor force because he was strongly anti-slavery, on moral grounds. And as that person he won the Republican Primary and then the general election, in a franchise limited to white men. A proud day for America.

"A franchise limited to white men"? "A proud day for America"? Slavery ended and Jin Crow started, you nutcase.

And in many ways Jim Crow and Black Codes were just as restrictive and oppressive as slavery.
.....

1. Yep. Despite the lack of representation for blacks, America choose antislavery.

2. Jim Crow was as bad as slavery? you want to support that odd claim?

 

[katsteve2012]

This post exceeds all boundaries of sincere ignorance and concientous stupudity.

Blah, blah, blah.

No, America did not originate slavery,

Thank you for admitting that. I hope you will be more careful with your language. There are a lot of emotionally invested people on this issue, and that breeds stupidity. Don't encourage it.

however, America HAS acted as the worlds police and has been a self appointed example of what "Democracy" is supposed to look like since it's "ideals" were signed into effect by the so called "Founding Fathers"...some of whom were slave owners themselves.

Couldn't really call the US the world's police man till after World War Two. Prior to that we were pretty isolationists and prior to THAT, Great Britain was more the world's powerhouse.

An example of Freedom and Democracy? Yes, certainly.

Why should any Black citizen living today "give any credit" to anyone for an institution being abolished that should have never even existed in a country that was founded on the principles that it was?

Same reasons ANYONE should respect someone else who is prepared to make such hard choices at such high cost.

That this is hard for you to understand, says a lot about your character and/or upbringing.

That is not racism, and it is FOOLISH to make such a statement.

Denial is proof. Isn't that the rule you lefties use?

As far as this obsession of yours to attempt to reinvent Lincoln as an abolitionist, you should do some reading on the ideology of those who truly were.

The authentic abolitionist of that era not only believed in the moral wrong of slavery, they also believed in those who were slaves having equal rights of citizenship.

That was NOT Lincolns belief system.

"
In the famous Lincoln-Douglas Debates in Charleston, Illinois, Lincoln said:

"I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with White people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality." (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois on September 18, 1858"

I'm sure if you traveled in time to 1870 and told a recently freed black man that Lincoln wasn't really an abolitionist, because he did not support the black man's right to marry a white woman,

he would have responded something like this.

Also,

"Blah Blah Blah" is a common response when someone makes an ignorant statement like you did, and knows how stupid what they stated sounds after they are called out for it.

Everyone knows that slavery did not originate in America, so no need to thank me for making that statement......and as an editorial comment, I do not give a damn about the "emotional investment" of anyone, especially complete strangers on a message board. If someone makes a choice to act stupidly over long ago history, that is not my problem.

As far as the rest of your lame reasoning, "my upbringing" was likely of a much better quality than yours.....mainly because I was taught at an early age that just because a person sells bullshit, I am not obligated to buy it.

So if it bothers you that I do not feel an ounce of gratitude for the events that led to the abolishment of a system that NEVER should have existed, TOO BAD.

And as as far as "a black mans right to marry a white woman"?!

That is yet another stupid as well as humorous statement to add to your growing portfolio of bloopers....you cherry picked ONE. irrelevant thing out of an entire speech that illustrates how far Lincoln was from being the "abolitionist" that exists in your feeble mind.

If it was not obvious that you are actually serious, I would recommend that you take your slapstick comedy on the live performance circuit.

You are denying people the respect their deserve for their actions and sacrifices because of something someone ELSE did.


YOu are the bad guy here.




Lincoln paid with his life for doing what he thought was morally right, ie ending slavery.

Lincoln lost his life because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He did what he said he would do at the outset...preserved the union.
Morality was secondary.

I bet you believe in Santa Claus tok

You are the one who is believing the politician with every reason to lie, instead of looking at his statements when he was not under the gun and looking at his actions.

So Lincoln was actually a closet Abolitionist who did not let onto this fact until he was elected?

 

[katsteve2012]

You may find this link to be interesting. I read this some years ago and shared it on a different board that is now closed. First hand accounts of how Blacks
felt over Lincolns inaugural address in 1861 refusing to repeal the Fugitive Slave Act, as well as his sentiment regarding saving the Union even if it meant "not freeing a single slave".


"In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun.

Immediately following the attack, four more states -- Virginia, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Tennessee -- severed their ties with the Union. To retain the loyalty of the remaining border states -- Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, and Missouri -- President Lincoln insisted that the war was not about slavery or black rights; it was a war to preserve the Union. His words were not simply aimed at the loyal southern states, however -- most white northerners were not interested in fighting to free slaves or in giving rights to black people. For this reason, the government turned away African American voluteers who rushed to enlist. Lincoln upheld the laws barring blacks from the army, proving to northern whites that their race privilege would not be threatened."

Source:
The Civil War

Funny how the Southern states didn't buy his attempts to walk back his earlier anti-slavery statements.


But it serves your purpose to.

I dont have a "purpose" here. You are bent out of shape because I am not aligned with your romanticized bullshit.

The southern states were understandably apprehensive. Lincoln, was a threat to their labor force because he wanted to preserve and industrialize the Union.

1. Your purpose here is obvious. You want to deconstruct American Nationalism and bolster Black Ethno-nationalism.

2. Lincoln was a threat to their labor force because he was strongly anti-slavery, on moral grounds. And as that person he won the Republican Primary and then the general election, in a franchise limited to white men. A proud day for America.

"A franchise limited to white men"? "A proud day for America"? Slavery ended and Jin Crow started, you nutcase.

And in many ways Jim Crow and Black Codes were just as restrictive and oppressive as slavery.
.....

1. Yep. Despite the lack of representation for blacks, America choose antislavery.

2. Jim Crow was as bad as slavery? you want to support that odd claim?

There was no representation for Blacks because that was tbe intentional outcome.

The preservation of the union was first and foremost, and Americas new industrialized business model was set for the future.

As for me wasting my own time attempting to educate you on the subject of Jim Crow, there are a plethora of resources on the internet that you can refer to on your own time.