Where FDR Went Wrong

[Moonglow]

But, they had communists in their ranks that made them thar folks thank that a-way.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. This guy I know went to a club, where he met a very attractive blonde. After a few drinks, they went back to his apartment, where, filled with anticipation, they wound up in bed. And he discovered that 'she' had a penis.

"I thought you wouldn't care." He did. His words to me: 'It's always somethin.'"





2. In a way, this is the problem with FDR's role in American history. Just like the blonde, he had a number of attractive features....but one glaring problem: a misunderstanding of geopolitical reality.
'It's always somethin.'"

a. That 'somethin' resulted in the United States becoming, for all intents and purposes, a vassal of the Soviet Union. It caused the Korean War. It is the reason that China became Maoist, with 75 million deaths. And if the United States ever goes to war with China....the 'somethin' will have been the provenance.

3. Roosevelt laughed off, literally, all of the revelations of Soviet agents in his administration. He never cared if his conversations were bugged by the Russians. He sent the USSR materials necessary to build the atomic bomb. One of his first official acts was the United States recognizing the Soviet Union, November 20th, 1933. The list of goes on and on, leading many to believe the was an agent of the Soviet Union.

That wasn't the case.






4. To understand what happened, recognize that a distinguishing characteristic of Liberals and Leftists is an aversion to acknowledging evil and its permutations, i.e., communism. Leftist believe that people are essentially good, and the result is the proclivity to appease evil and ignore the sad facts of life.
It is a form of child-like wishful thinking.
It infected all of FDR's policies.






5. Dennis J. Dunn writes in "Caught Between Roosevelt & Stalin: America's Ambassadors to Moscow," that FDR believed in a theory of convergence that applied to the USSR and the US, i.e., that capitalism and Communism would each take on characteristics of the other. They would converge. FDR's contribution toward convergence was expanding the powers and reach of centralized government.

a. Dunn explains FDR's thinking: convergence theory "held that Soviet Russia and the United States were on convergent paths, where the United States was moving from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism and the Soviet Union was evolving from totalitarianism to social democracy."

b. Since FDR himself had moved the United States from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism....well, FDR was half right.

But....if only one half is doing all the converging....it is simply capitulation.

6. And so, Dunn explains, FDR's dogmatic belief in a point of convergence up the road is what allowed Roosevelt to discount and overlook all the violent contradictory evidence, the spying, the manipulation, the justification for the brutality of genocidal famines and gulags and every act of police-state repression.

The theory is what made FDR, if not a participant, at least an accomplice.
In our name.






7. In memoirs, both Representative Martin Dies, [p. 144-148] an earlier incarnation of Senator Joseph McCarthy, and, on the other side, Roosevelt ally Cardinal Spellman, [p. 222-225] both describe conversations with Roosevelt in which he speaks of his belief in convergence of the two nations. Dunn describes an interview with Averell Harriman, in which Harriman "emphasized the importance of the theory of convergence in explaining Roosevelt's policies."




8. "Adopting the "pseudoprofound theory of convergence," Rooseveltians claimed that the Soviet Union "was moving ineluctably toward democracy" (pp. 3-4). The author alleges that "moral relativism" prompted Roosevelt to mislead the American public and ignore his foreign policy advisors in order to prove that Stalin was an evolving democrat, not "a genocidal megalomaniac guided by the higher power of revolutionary inevitability ..." (p. 4, 6).

In contrast, "Traditionalists" rejected the theory of convergence. ... they viewed Stalin as "a murderer, a liar, and a vicious opponent of the United States and of pluralism generally."...." Traditionalists wanted Roosevelt to compel the Soviets to adopt democracy and "the minimum standards of moral behavior that were outlined in the world's principal religions and moral codes." These pleas, however, went unheeded as Roosevelt remained intent on pursuing "his policy of uncritical friendship toward Stalin" (pp. 8-9)."
H-Net Reviews





Today, it seems we have so very many Leftists who are still enchanted with the blonde's better feature.....

...and are willing to ignore 'somethin'......

But that 'blonde' has a different name, but the ideology of FDR remains, if not more ferocious as we stand on the precipice of becoming what the old guard Soviet once was.

Was it intentional? Was it naivete? Ignorance? All the above?

He had to have known what was happening in the USSR. Duranty at the New York Times was complicit in covering up the murder of millions of my ancestors in the Ukraine by starvation.

All the top dogs knew what was going on. Including the President. I have a very special reason to hate FDR.

Yup....they knew.

FDR's US ambassador to the Soviet Union, Joseph E. Davies, simply a Soviet apologist, wrote of the show trials in which Stalin liquidated his political rivals on bogus charges, "there was proof beyond reasonable doubt to justify the verdict of guilty of treason."
Andrew and Mitrokhin, "The Sword and the Shield," p. 546.

BTW, Davies remained senior advisor to Truman, as well.


One can clearly see the fingerprints of Liberalism every time human being are sacrificed for their policies.

DDT banned, millions die of malaria

ObamaCare death panels will prove to be of the same design.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Same deal as the FIRST Pub corruption/cronyism Great World Depression, the greedy idiot GOP biotching about Dems helping the GOP's victims, and with the most popular social refom EVER. You're out of your tiny brainwashed minds...

"Same deal as the FIRST Pub corruption/cronyism Great World Depression,..."

1. Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., liberal New Deal historian wrote in The National Experience, in 1963, “Though the policies of the Hundred Days had ended despair, they had not produce recovery…” He also wrote honestly about the devastating crash of 1937- in the midst of the “second New Deal” and Roosevelt’s second term. “The collapse in the months after September 1937 was actually more severe than it had been in the first nine months of the depression: national income fell 13 %, payrolls 35 %, durable goods production 50 %, profits 78% .


2. In 1935, the Brookings Institution (left-leaning) delivered a 900-page report on the New Deal and the National Recovery Administration, concluding that “ on the whole it retarded recovery.”
The Real Deal - Society and Culture - AEI

 

[PoliticalChic]

Obama the commie!! LOL

Not 'the' commie, blanco.



"A" commie.



And you are "A" dunce.

 

[PoliticalChic]

If we really want to talk about "bad things" those camps took the cake.

I bet if you pulled a "man on the street" right now, no one under 40 would have learned about the internment camps in school. And that's a sin unto itself.

FDR's firs Supreme Court nominee was Hugo Black, in 1937.
This KKK Senator from Alabama wrote the majority decision on Korematsu v. US; in 1967, he said ‘They all look alike to a person not a Jap.” Engage: Conversations in Philosophy: "They all look alike to a person not a Jap"*: The Legacy of Korematsu at OSU

 

[PoliticalChic]

Appointed a Klansman to SCOTUS

That was his first....

...his sixth Supreme Court Justice, in 1941, was James F. Byrnes.

Later, Byrnes became the segregationist governor of South Carolina.

 

[PoliticalChic]

This I will ask about.

At what point do you think FDR decided to give eastern Europe to the commies? Churchill who considered war against the Soviets was in on it?

At least say FDR was intimidated by the Red Army in '42.

Hitler had run rampant over the east. Stalin wasn't about to be left out of the spoils and he knew he had to have favor with Churchill and FDR. It happened towards the end of the war.

I still do not understand.

Was it Truman at Potsdam? Yalta? Tehran? What would you have done? Bumped the Red Army from the land they just took from the Germans?

By Potsdam we had the bomb. But FDR was dead....you would think the Cold War starting under Truman would remove him from the conversation....

This is a plan Churchill I guess considered before folks quickly told him it was fool hardy. If not for Gallipoli maybe he would have pursued it further. Patton would have loved it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable

The initial primary goal of the operation was declared as follows: "to impose upon Russia the will of the United States and the British Empire. Even though 'the will' of these two countries may be defined as no more than a square deal for Poland, that does not necessarily limit the military commitment".[4] The word "Russia" is used heavily throughout the document, as during the Imperial period the term was used as pars pro toto for the Czarist Empire, with which the USSR was almost coterminous.

The Chiefs of Staff were concerned that given the enormous size of Soviet forces deployed in Europe at the end of the war, and the perception that the Soviet leader Joseph Stalin was unreliable, there existed a Soviet threat to Western Europe. The Soviet numerical superiority was roughly 4:1 in men and 2:1 in tanks at the end of hostilities in Europe.[1]

Here is more of Churchill preparing for war against the Russians

Operation Pike - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Even overflew Russian territory scouting.


And supported British (and I presume the American) troops fighting against the socialists in the Russian revolution

Russian Civil War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I just do not see the favor. At some point you just could not deal with the Red Army and it was time to have faith in our system to win out economically in the long run.

"I still do not understand."


I hope you have a tattoo of that.....

 

[Old Rocks]

It may come as a shock to you, but for most American voters now, President Roosevelt is just as far removed from them as President Lincoln. And your rants about him make just as much sense as a rant concerning the Whigs. Most wonder why you are refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago.

 

[PoliticalChic]

It may come as a shock to you, but for most American voters now, President Roosevelt is just as far removed from them as President Lincoln. And your rants about him make just as much sense as a rant concerning the Whigs. Most wonder why you are refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago.

They're not rants.....they're facts.

That's why you never post other than 'is not, is not....'


I really don't mind you posting, largely, about me....my fav subject...but
love to have you address the material I provide.


Some day.



"...refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago"

So...all you want is to let the truth pass?
Typical of Liberal desires.

There's no statute of limitations on culpability for murder.
FDR was responsible for the Korean War, and for turning China over to Mao.

 

[Old Rocks]

They are rants. Irrelevant for present politics, unimportant in the context of what the present voters concerns are. You people lost then, you are losing now. Your desire to return to the 18th century do not resonate with most voting Americans.

 

[Old Rocks]

FDR top rated in this poll;

http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/...research/Presidents 2010 Rank by Category.pdf

And this one, Wall Street Journal;

Professor helps decide who was greatest American president

Sienna College;

https://www.siena.edu/pages/179.asp?item=2566

Leadership - Rating The Presidents - Washington To Clinton | The Choice 2004 | FRONTLINE | PBS

 

[Dutch]

It may come as a shock to you, but for most American voters now, President Roosevelt is just as far removed from them as President Lincoln. And your rants about him make just as much sense as a rant concerning the Whigs. Most wonder why you are refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago.

They're not rants.....they're facts.

That's why you never post other than 'is not, is not....'


I really don't mind you posting, largely, about me....my fav subject...but
love to have you address the material I provide.


Some day.



"...refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago"

So...all you want is to let the truth pass?
Typical of Liberal desires.

There's no statute of limitations on culpability for murder.
FDR was responsible for the Korean War, and for turning China over to Mao.

No, the rants are just the latest con book you have read were you post footnotes and try to pass them off as your own ideas. Your psycophants then flood the thread congratulating you on someone elses research and opinions.

 

[Unkotare]

I have a very special reason to hate FDR.

There are plenty to choose from.

 

[PoliticalChic]

It may come as a shock to you, but for most American voters now, President Roosevelt is just as far removed from them as President Lincoln. And your rants about him make just as much sense as a rant concerning the Whigs. Most wonder why you are refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago.

They're not rants.....they're facts.

That's why you never post other than 'is not, is not....'


I really don't mind you posting, largely, about me....my fav subject...but
love to have you address the material I provide.


Some day.



"...refighting a political fight that your philosophy lost 80 years ago"

So...all you want is to let the truth pass?
Typical of Liberal desires.

There's no statute of limitations on culpability for murder.
FDR was responsible for the Korean War, and for turning China over to Mao.

No, the rants are just the latest con book you have read were you post footnotes and try to pass them off as your own ideas. Your psycophants then flood the thread congratulating you on someone elses research and opinions.

Once I read them....they become my ideas.

That's known as learning.

You should consider trying same.

Bet someone will help you to get a library card.


BTW....I notice you were unable to confront any of those ideas.

 

[PoliticalChic]

FDR top rated in this poll;

http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/...research/Presidents 2010 Rank by Category.pdf

And this one, Wall Street Journal;

Professor helps decide who was greatest American president

Sienna College;

https://www.siena.edu/pages/179.asp?item=2566

Leadership - Rating The Presidents - Washington To Clinton | The Choice 2004 | FRONTLINE | PBS

Dr. Phyllis Chesler explained why academics write what they do.


"Academic feminists who received tenure, promotion, and funding, tended to be pro-abortion, pro-pornography (anti-censorship), pro-prostitution (pro-sex workers), pro-surrogacy, and anti-colonialist, anti-imperialist, and anti-American…proponents of simplistic gender-neutrality (women and men are exactly the same) or essentialist: men and women are completely different, and women are better.

They are loyal to their careers and their cliques, not to the truth. [In their writing, they] have pretended that brilliance and originality can best be conveyed in a secret, Mandarin language that absolutely no one, including themselves, can possibly understand…and this obfuscation of language has been employed to hide a considerable lack of brilliance and originality and to avoid the consequences of making oneself clear."
“The Death of Feminism,” by Phyllis Chesler



Seems one can't get/keep a job in academia without toeing the Liberal line.


That clear things up for you?

 

[PoliticalChic]

They are rants. Irrelevant for present politics, unimportant in the context of what the present voters concerns are. You people lost then, you are losing now. Your desire to return to the 18th century do not resonate with most voting Americans.

But they're true, aren't they.

 

[eagle7_31]

1. This guy I know went to a club, where he met a very attractive blonde. After a few drinks, they went back to his apartment, where, filled with anticipation, they wound up in bed. And he discovered that 'she' had a penis.

"I thought you wouldn't care." He did. His words to me: 'It's always somethin.'"





2. In a way, this is the problem with FDR's role in American history. Just like the blonde, he had a number of attractive features....but one glaring problem: a misunderstanding of geopolitical reality.
'It's always somethin.'"

a. That 'somethin' resulted in the United States becoming, for all intents and purposes, a vassal of the Soviet Union. It caused the Korean War. It is the reason that China became Maoist, with 75 million deaths. And if the United States ever goes to war with China....the 'somethin' will have been the provenance.

3. Roosevelt laughed off, literally, all of the revelations of Soviet agents in his administration. He never cared if his conversations were bugged by the Russians. He sent the USSR materials necessary to build the atomic bomb. One of his first official acts was the United States recognizing the Soviet Union, November 20th, 1933. The list of goes on and on, leading many to believe the was an agent of the Soviet Union.

That wasn't the case.






4. To understand what happened, recognize that a distinguishing characteristic of Liberals and Leftists is an aversion to acknowledging evil and its permutations, i.e., communism. Leftist believe that people are essentially good, and the result is the proclivity to appease evil and ignore the sad facts of life.
It is a form of child-like wishful thinking.
It infected all of FDR's policies.






5. Dennis J. Dunn writes in "Caught Between Roosevelt & Stalin: America's Ambassadors to Moscow," that FDR believed in a theory of convergence that applied to the USSR and the US, i.e., that capitalism and Communism would each take on characteristics of the other. They would converge. FDR's contribution toward convergence was expanding the powers and reach of centralized government.

a. Dunn explains FDR's thinking: convergence theory "held that Soviet Russia and the United States were on convergent paths, where the United States was moving from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism and the Soviet Union was evolving from totalitarianism to social democracy."

b. Since FDR himself had moved the United States from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism....well, FDR was half right.

But....if only one half is doing all the converging....it is simply capitulation.

6. And so, Dunn explains, FDR's dogmatic belief in a point of convergence up the road is what allowed Roosevelt to discount and overlook all the violent contradictory evidence, the spying, the manipulation, the justification for the brutality of genocidal famines and gulags and every act of police-state repression.

The theory is what made FDR, if not a participant, at least an accomplice.
In our name.






7. In memoirs, both Representative Martin Dies, [p. 144-148] an earlier incarnation of Senator Joseph McCarthy, and, on the other side, Roosevelt ally Cardinal Spellman, [p. 222-225] both describe conversations with Roosevelt in which he speaks of his belief in convergence of the two nations. Dunn describes an interview with Averell Harriman, in which Harriman "emphasized the importance of the theory of convergence in explaining Roosevelt's policies."




8. "Adopting the "pseudoprofound theory of convergence," Rooseveltians claimed that the Soviet Union "was moving ineluctably toward democracy" (pp. 3-4). The author alleges that "moral relativism" prompted Roosevelt to mislead the American public and ignore his foreign policy advisors in order to prove that Stalin was an evolving democrat, not "a genocidal megalomaniac guided by the higher power of revolutionary inevitability ..." (p. 4, 6).

In contrast, "Traditionalists" rejected the theory of convergence. ... they viewed Stalin as "a murderer, a liar, and a vicious opponent of the United States and of pluralism generally."...." Traditionalists wanted Roosevelt to compel the Soviets to adopt democracy and "the minimum standards of moral behavior that were outlined in the world's principal religions and moral codes." These pleas, however, went unheeded as Roosevelt remained intent on pursuing "his policy of uncritical friendship toward Stalin" (pp. 8-9)."
H-Net Reviews





Today, it seems we have so very many Leftists who are still enchanted with the blonde's better feature.....

...and are willing to ignore 'somethin'......

Blog: FDR's Traitor?

Here is one place FDR may well have gone wrong

 

[PoliticalChic]

FDR top rated in this poll;

http://www.siena.edu/uploadedfiles/...research/Presidents 2010 Rank by Category.pdf

And this one, Wall Street Journal;

Professor helps decide who was greatest American president

Sienna College;

https://www.siena.edu/pages/179.asp?item=2566

Leadership - Rating The Presidents - Washington To Clinton | The Choice 2004 | FRONTLINE | PBS

See if you can learn who the historians are from this:

a. "The Commintern, the Communist International, was founded in Moscow in March, 1919. Not far behind it, the Communist Party, USA (CPUSA) was founded in Chicago in September, 1919. While the archives are rich with their literature, they are rarely studied, as most academic historians are on the left and have little interest in revealing or discussing the revelations or machinations therein."
Dr. Paul Kengor, Hoover Institution, Stanford “DUPES: How America's Adversaries Have Manipulated Progressives for a Century”




b. "The leading academics find that the greatest modern Presidents are those that have made government bigger and more powerful, and have expanded the reach of the presidency, i.e., Woodrow Wilson and FDR. By the same token, those Presidents with a limited-government POV, such as Harding, Coolidge and Reagan, are treated dismissively by journalists and historians."
Hayward, "The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Presidents: From Wilson to Obama"






c. "The same political correctness showed up in a planned exhibit to mark the 50th anniversary of the atomic bombing of Hiroshima. The commentary on the exhibit included: “For most Americans…it was a war of vengeance. For most Japanese, it was a war to defend their unique culture against Western imperialism.” Smithsonian historians didn’t care to comment on the blood war of aggression against China, atrocities in the Philippines and the surprise attack on Pearl Harbor."
Goldberg, "Liberal Fascism"





d. "Liberals have their pantheon of presidents, established by the New Deal historians. "Great presidents," in their view, are those who expand the size and scope of the federal government..."
Michael Barone, Opinion, Editorials, Columns, Op-Ed, Letters to the Editor, Commentary - Wall Street Journal - Wsj.com



And these are the folks that Liberals allow to do their thinking for them.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. This guy I know went to a club, where he met a very attractive blonde. After a few drinks, they went back to his apartment, where, filled with anticipation, they wound up in bed. And he discovered that 'she' had a penis.

"I thought you wouldn't care." He did. His words to me: 'It's always somethin.'"





2. In a way, this is the problem with FDR's role in American history. Just like the blonde, he had a number of attractive features....but one glaring problem: a misunderstanding of geopolitical reality.
'It's always somethin.'"

a. That 'somethin' resulted in the United States becoming, for all intents and purposes, a vassal of the Soviet Union. It caused the Korean War. It is the reason that China became Maoist, with 75 million deaths. And if the United States ever goes to war with China....the 'somethin' will have been the provenance.

3. Roosevelt laughed off, literally, all of the revelations of Soviet agents in his administration. He never cared if his conversations were bugged by the Russians. He sent the USSR materials necessary to build the atomic bomb. One of his first official acts was the United States recognizing the Soviet Union, November 20th, 1933. The list of goes on and on, leading many to believe the was an agent of the Soviet Union.

That wasn't the case.






4. To understand what happened, recognize that a distinguishing characteristic of Liberals and Leftists is an aversion to acknowledging evil and its permutations, i.e., communism. Leftist believe that people are essentially good, and the result is the proclivity to appease evil and ignore the sad facts of life.
It is a form of child-like wishful thinking.
It infected all of FDR's policies.






5. Dennis J. Dunn writes in "Caught Between Roosevelt & Stalin: America's Ambassadors to Moscow," that FDR believed in a theory of convergence that applied to the USSR and the US, i.e., that capitalism and Communism would each take on characteristics of the other. They would converge. FDR's contribution toward convergence was expanding the powers and reach of centralized government.

a. Dunn explains FDR's thinking: convergence theory "held that Soviet Russia and the United States were on convergent paths, where the United States was moving from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism and the Soviet Union was evolving from totalitarianism to social democracy."

b. Since FDR himself had moved the United States from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state socialism....well, FDR was half right.

But....if only one half is doing all the converging....it is simply capitulation.

6. And so, Dunn explains, FDR's dogmatic belief in a point of convergence up the road is what allowed Roosevelt to discount and overlook all the violent contradictory evidence, the spying, the manipulation, the justification for the brutality of genocidal famines and gulags and every act of police-state repression.

The theory is what made FDR, if not a participant, at least an accomplice.
In our name.






7. In memoirs, both Representative Martin Dies, [p. 144-148] an earlier incarnation of Senator Joseph McCarthy, and, on the other side, Roosevelt ally Cardinal Spellman, [p. 222-225] both describe conversations with Roosevelt in which he speaks of his belief in convergence of the two nations. Dunn describes an interview with Averell Harriman, in which Harriman "emphasized the importance of the theory of convergence in explaining Roosevelt's policies."




8. "Adopting the "pseudoprofound theory of convergence," Rooseveltians claimed that the Soviet Union "was moving ineluctably toward democracy" (pp. 3-4). The author alleges that "moral relativism" prompted Roosevelt to mislead the American public and ignore his foreign policy advisors in order to prove that Stalin was an evolving democrat, not "a genocidal megalomaniac guided by the higher power of revolutionary inevitability ..." (p. 4, 6).

In contrast, "Traditionalists" rejected the theory of convergence. ... they viewed Stalin as "a murderer, a liar, and a vicious opponent of the United States and of pluralism generally."...." Traditionalists wanted Roosevelt to compel the Soviets to adopt democracy and "the minimum standards of moral behavior that were outlined in the world's principal religions and moral codes." These pleas, however, went unheeded as Roosevelt remained intent on pursuing "his policy of uncritical friendship toward Stalin" (pp. 8-9)."
H-Net Reviews





Today, it seems we have so very many Leftists who are still enchanted with the blonde's better feature.....

...and are willing to ignore 'somethin'......

Blog: FDR's Traitor?

Here is one place FDR may well have gone wrong

I've read a number of those books.....and highly.....highly!.....recommend Diana West's book.

It is dynamite!

 

[LordBrownTrout]

They are rants. Irrelevant for present politics, unimportant in the context of what the present voters concerns are. You people lost then, you are losing now. Your desire to return to the 18th century do not resonate with most voting Americans.

They are facts not rants. Internment camps for the japanese, ceding europe to the soviets, longest depression ever in the us, trying to stack the supreme court, running experiments on black airmen. These are the dark truths under FDR.