Which party is mainly responsible for the mess?

[Redfish]

NY carbon

please refer back to the OP. Do you understand the meaning of the word "mainly" ?

I never claimed that republicans were not also responsible, I merely was pointing out that dems have had control for a majority of the time-----so logically they are "mainly" responsible.

You make the fatal error of assuming that everything that happens to a country over a period of time can be traced directly back,

on a verifiable cause and effect basis,

to that country's legislature.

Let me bump this up to remind everyone that the author of this thread has allowed it to go uncontested.

Of course the legislature is responsible, they set the budget, pass the laws, authorize spending, declare war, approve the debt ceiling, pass trade restrictions, et al.

Who do you think is responsible? Oh, I know-----------------Bush.

 

[Redfish]

Look at this chart. Look at the congressional control since FDR. Then ask yourself, which party created the mess in our government?

Party Control of Congress and the Presidency

It's kinda presumptuous of you to state the the American government is a "Mess". We're the most advanced nation militarily, economically, technologically and culturally, that has ever existed. The rest of the world wishes that they were as much of a "mess" as we are.

some of what you say is true. But we are 17 trillion in debt. 20+% of our people do not have jobs, we have more in poverty than ever before, more on food stamps than ever before, more on welfare than ever before, companies are leaving the country and moving to countries that do not punish them for being successful, our culture is in the gutter, we shit on the constitution, PC rules our lives, we are letting people enter and stay in violation of our laws, the rest of the world is laughing at our incompetent president and congress.

We are in a mess and it gets worse every day. Liberalism is turning the entire country into Detroit.

 

[Redfish]

Look at this chart. Look at the congressional control since FDR. Then ask yourself, which party created the mess in our government?

Party Control of Congress and the Presidency

i don't look at what party caused it...I look at what people caused it. we elected these people and they are responsible, not what party they belong too. we have the worst choice of people in washinton that we have ever had.

Thats true, I was merely pointing out that most of them have been democrats.

 

[Redfish]

Well things have gone downhill,,,the last 30 years or so.
The best way to really look at America's downward trend is the decline of the Middle Class which has been 30 years in the making. Since the early 80s the Middle Class has seen flat wages and has become seriously weakened. Prior to that, America was on a continuous upswing because we had a strong Middle Class who drove the economy with their consumer spending. It's kinda tough having an economy that 70% driven by consumer spending, when the biggest consumer group has been losing expendable income for three decades. A chart below that since the 80s, recessions have taken longer and longer to recover. Strange out that coincides with the slide downwards of the Middle Class.
Of course Redfish sees the world only through the eyes of a political hack and therefore the blame directed at just one party. Now there's an example of walking in circles.
If you want an honest answer, let's try both parties.

Sure both parties are to blame. Do you understand the meaning of the word "mainly" ?

 

[Redfish]

Why do you have to mock President Obama's name, of all four?

Because he's black?

Obama is mocked because he is an incompetent, lying, traitor. It has nothing to do with the fact that he is HALF black.

question: since he is half black and half white, why does he call himself black?

The South had a rule, one drop of Black blood and the person is Black. I suspect that was grounds for lynching at one time. Even today, imagine the political fall-out if Obama said he was Irish.

Apparently that rule still applies in Hawaii, Illinois, and DC.

 

[Redfish]

Well things have gone downhill,,,the last 30 years or so.
The best way to really look at America's downward trend is the decline of the Middle Class which has been 30 years in the making. Since the early 80s the Middle Class has seen flat wages and has become seriously weakened. Prior to that, America was on a continuous upswing because we had a strong Middle Class who drove the economy with their consumer spending. It's kinda tough having an economy that 70% driven by consumer spending, when the biggest consumer group has been losing expendable income for three decades. A chart below that since the 80s, recessions have taken longer and longer to recover. Strange out that coincides with the slide downwards of the Middle Class.
Of course Redfish sees the world only through the eyes of a political hack and therefore the blame directed at just one party. Now there's an example of walking in circles.
If you want an honest answer, let's try both parties.

Why? Republicans used reconciliation three times to pass the Bush Tax cuts and Medicare part D. The two biggest contributors to the debt, according to the CBO, have been the Bush Tax Cuts and the two unfunded wars. Wars we were tricked into by Republicans. The other reasons are the failed economy which nose dived after Republican deregulation and the derivative scandal.

The CBO said those are what drove the creation of the deficit. Jesus Christ. We don't need the CBO to tell us that. We just lived through it. We know what happened. The CBO just verified what we already knew.

The Obama stimulus and related spending are a mere 10% of the entire deficit and if the Republicans hadn't ruined the economy, we wouldn't even have needed that.

Hmmm, are you claiming that no dems voted for the tax cuts and medicare? are you claiming that obama did not extend the Bush tax rates when he could have repealed them? tell us again how the dems passed obamacare using reconciliation. tell us how many budget bills Reid has allowed to come to a vote in the senate.

 

[editec]

We talk about the Rep and Dem parties as though they are the same parties they were back 40 or 50 years ago.

They're ARE NOT the same parties, they do have or stand for the same values, either.

The sooner you idiots partisans realize that the sooner we might take back our nation.

OTOH, I suspect it may be too late for that, now.

I suspect the AMERICA that most of us imagine exists (the one we pretend still exists) is dead and gone.

 

[Redfish]

We talk about the Rep and Dem parties as though they are the same parties they were back 40 or 50 years ago.

They're ARE NOT the same parties, they do have or stand for the same values, either.

The sooner you idiots partisans realize that the sooner we might take back our nation.

OTOH, I suspect it may be too late for that, now.

I suspect the AMERICA that most of us imagine exists (the one we pretend still exists) is dead and gone.

It may not be too late, but its close. The real enemy resides in both parties, of course. The real enemy's name is liberalism, progressivism, marxism, socialist or whatever ism you choose.

The enemy is a system that makes being in congress a very lucrative lifetime career rather than a short term sacrifice for your country. the enemy is an ever growing government that is taking over more and more aspects of our freedoms.

But, as said in the OP. The democrat party has been in control MOST of the time so they bear MOST of the blame. No clear thinking person can disagree with that.

 

[NYcarbineer]

You make the fatal error of assuming that everything that happens to a country over a period of time can be traced directly back,

on a verifiable cause and effect basis,

to that country's legislature.

Let me bump this up to remind everyone that the author of this thread has allowed it to go uncontested.

Of course the legislature is responsible, they set the budget, pass the laws, authorize spending, declare war, approve the debt ceiling, pass trade restrictions, et al.

Who do you think is responsible? Oh, I know-----------------Bush.

So who caused the real estate bubble and its consequences?

 

[Redfish]

Let me bump this up to remind everyone that the author of this thread has allowed it to go uncontested.

Of course the legislature is responsible, they set the budget, pass the laws, authorize spending, declare war, approve the debt ceiling, pass trade restrictions, et al.

Who do you think is responsible? Oh, I know-----------------Bush.

So who caused the real estate bubble and its consequences?

who drafted the bill that forced banks to give mortgages to people who could not make the payments? Who are Dodd and Frank? Who ran Freddie and Fannie?

 

[Redfish]

Of course the legislature is responsible, they set the budget, pass the laws, authorize spending, declare war, approve the debt ceiling, pass trade restrictions, et al.

Who do you think is responsible? Oh, I know-----------------Bush.

So who caused the real estate bubble and its consequences?

who drafted the bill that forced banks to give mortgages to people who could not make the payments? Who are Dodd and Frank? Who ran Freddie and Fannie?

bumped for NY carbonpaper. waiting for you answer.

 

[g5000]

Look at this chart. Look at the congressional control since FDR. Then ask yourself, which party created the mess in our government?

Party Control of Congress and the Presidency

Both created the mess.

You seem to be under the impression that a party can't fuck things up in very short order.

Next question.