White students can't compete with asians in NJ school district

[Unkotare]

affluent parents are partitioning their time between sports, technology (video games) and making excuses for their children.

Sports are not a hindrance to education.

Of course it is.......

Absolutely not. Participating in organized sports teaches discipline, time-management, and excuse-free focus on results.

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

 

[Jackson]

There is such a disparity, that just changing the school day time and year to more time in school would be appropriate. The kids do not have to go 6:40 til' 11:00. but 7:40 to 5:00 would work with year round sc
We don't have to be that extreme, but more time on school and time on homework should be established.

Why? Because that's what the Asians do?

I enjoyed summer vacation as a child and enjoy summer vacations with my daughter now.

What is the point of these changes you propose?

Asians are coming here taking US jobs. That can affect you and your children if we don't educate better.

Or we could ban Asians from coming here to take US jobs.

And keep traditional American childhoods, instead of Hell.

I believe in American exceptionalism, not mediocre accomplishments.

We put a man on the moon with scientists who grew up with summer vacations.

The idea that we need to give up summer vacations and happy childhoods in order to continue to be exceptional is unsupported.

And we have 27 countries that rank higher in math, science and reading skills now. They will be taking US jobs.

 

[Correll]

Do we want suicides from poor SAT scores to be an issue in our country?

There are plenty of suicides over cyber bullying on social media. Too bad the kids aren't interested in education as much as Asian families. At least they would have a strong support system with the school and family.

I asked you if your desire to be competitive with Asians on education is such that you are willing to accept one of the negatives from such high pressure learning, ie additional suicides.

Pointing out that we have suicides from cyber bullying is at best a non sequitur.

Do you want suicides from poor SAT scores to be an issue in our country?

I think if we prepared our children for reasonable outcomes and opportunities they fit, suicides would not be a problem. In Asia, the highest scoring students went to the top colleges. But there are still opportunities for lesser colleges for those who didn't score as high, just as it is here.

There are more suicides for those in high school that did not have to work hard or study and then went to college without the proper education and study skills flunking out.

That is not the "Asian" way as you have previously described and would NOT get the results of the much higher pressure you described.

Thus that is just another way to not be "Competitive".

Well, you have to agree that the Asian countries score higher in competitiveness than we do. Longer school days and school year would help.

"In competitiveness"? Which country are you thinking of? Japan? China?

They aren't kicking our asses with competitiveness because of no school vacations.

Unfair Trade Policies and Deals are what are kicking our asses.

 

[Jackson]

Sports are not a hindrance to education.

Of course it is.......

Absolutely not. Participating in organized sports teaches discipline, time-management, and excuse-free focus on results.

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

Oh, here we go...

 

[Correll]

Sports are not a hindrance to education.

Of course it is.......

Absolutely not. Participating in organized sports teaches discipline, time-management, and excuse-free focus on results.

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

Because it would be miserable for our children and ourselves.

If the cost of competition is that the childhoods of our descendants have to be Hell, then let US not compete.

Screw that.

 

[Jackson]

There are plenty of suicides over cyber bullying on social media. Too bad the kids aren't interested in education as much as Asian families. At least they would have a strong support system with the school and family.

I asked you if your desire to be competitive with Asians on education is such that you are willing to accept one of the negatives from such high pressure learning, ie additional suicides.

Pointing out that we have suicides from cyber bullying is at best a non sequitur.

Do you want suicides from poor SAT scores to be an issue in our country?

I think if we prepared our children for reasonable outcomes and opportunities they fit, suicides would not be a problem. In Asia, the highest scoring students went to the top colleges. But there are still opportunities for lesser colleges for those who didn't score as high, just as it is here.

There are more suicides for those in high school that did not have to work hard or study and then went to college without the proper education and study skills flunking out.

That is not the "Asian" way as you have previously described and would NOT get the results of the much higher pressure you described.

Thus that is just another way to not be "Competitive".

Well, you have to agree that the Asian countries score higher in competitiveness than we do. Longer school days and school year would help.

"In competitiveness"? Which country are you thinking of? Japan? China?

They aren't kicking our asses with competitiveness because of no school vacations.

Unfair Trade Policies and Deals are what are kicking our asses.

And their scientists, engineering students are generally more superior.

 

[Jackson]

Of course it is.......

Absolutely not. Participating in organized sports teaches discipline, time-management, and excuse-free focus on results.

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

Because it would be miserable for our children and ourselves.

If the cost of competition is that the childhoods of our descendants have to be Hell, then let US not compete.

Screw that.

Year around school is not hell.

 

[Correll]

Why? Because that's what the Asians do?

I enjoyed summer vacation as a child and enjoy summer vacations with my daughter now.

What is the point of these changes you propose?

Asians are coming here taking US jobs. That can affect you and your children if we don't educate better.

Or we could ban Asians from coming here to take US jobs.

And keep traditional American childhoods, instead of Hell.

I believe in American exceptionalism, not mediocre accomplishments.

We put a man on the moon with scientists who grew up with summer vacations.

The idea that we need to give up summer vacations and happy childhoods in order to continue to be exceptional is unsupported.

And we have 27 countries that rank higher in math, science and reading skills now. They will be taking US jobs.

China is the nation that has the biggest Trade Surplus with US. THe millions of their assembly line workers are not kicking our asses because they score better in math, but because they work much cheaper.

 

[Correll]

I asked you if your desire to be competitive with Asians on education is such that you are willing to accept one of the negatives from such high pressure learning, ie additional suicides.

Pointing out that we have suicides from cyber bullying is at best a non sequitur.

Do you want suicides from poor SAT scores to be an issue in our country?

I think if we prepared our children for reasonable outcomes and opportunities they fit, suicides would not be a problem. In Asia, the highest scoring students went to the top colleges. But there are still opportunities for lesser colleges for those who didn't score as high, just as it is here.

There are more suicides for those in high school that did not have to work hard or study and then went to college without the proper education and study skills flunking out.

That is not the "Asian" way as you have previously described and would NOT get the results of the much higher pressure you described.

Thus that is just another way to not be "Competitive".

Well, you have to agree that the Asian countries score higher in competitiveness than we do. Longer school days and school year would help.

"In competitiveness"? Which country are you thinking of? Japan? China?

They aren't kicking our asses with competitiveness because of no school vacations.

Unfair Trade Policies and Deals are what are kicking our asses.

And their scientists, engineering students are generally more superior.

Really?

I recall when Bush had the ban on Fed Funding for Stem Cell research, and some people were worried that that US would be left behind because of it.

And then SOuth Korean announced a tremendous break though!

And then it was found out to be a fraud.

And no one left US behind.

 

[Correll]

Absolutely not. Participating in organized sports teaches discipline, time-management, and excuse-free focus on results.

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

Because it would be miserable for our children and ourselves.

If the cost of competition is that the childhoods of our descendants have to be Hell, then let US not compete.

Screw that.

Year around school is not hell.

As you describe it with longer hours and more homework, yes it would be.

 

[MarathonMike]

I'm certainly not advocating that every American family be ruled by a Tiger Mom screaming about getting a B. But I think it is fair to say, White kids are generally lazy and would benefit by putting the damn cell phones down for an hour or two a night and studying.

 

[Jackson]

You were impressed with common core? What did you like about it? I thought it was very confusing and not well designed.

The math really threw me for a loop. My grandson had to teach me then I could check his work. The circles, lines and squares were teaching number sense, but it was a headache. Other math problems concentrated on application. He is in fifth grade and he had to do a great deal of algebra as well. It delved into insight for math that was never taught before. Great for those who are math and science geeks, but it was leveled where other children in the class were not taught the same things. They were taught the more traditional math so it wasn't as challenging.

There is a great deal more writing, essays and narratives with different points of view used. I was on a system committee that scored extemporaneous writings from students and Common Core was again more challenging, something I would expect from high school students but very well thought out and detailed steps to do the work.

 

[Jackson]

It also teaches you to work with others, but in Asian countries that is not the case. Schools often start at 6:30 am and finish at 5:00. Then you have homework until 11:00, including Saturdays. School year is much longer as well. No time for sports.

Is this the environment we want in the US, for any children that want to be competitive at high levels?

Why not?

"Competitive" means you compete.

Because it would be miserable for our children and ourselves.

If the cost of competition is that the childhoods of our descendants have to be Hell, then let US not compete.

Screw that.

Year around school is not hell.

As you describe it with longer hours and more homework, yes it would be.

You do know that they still get two months off a year, just not all at once which really is better. Longer hours is not bad and would be economical for working parents. More homework is more practice. At least an hour and a half a night would be acceptable to me.

 

[Correll]

I'm certainly not advocating that every American family be ruled by a Tiger Mom screaming about getting a B. But I think it is fair to say, White kids are generally lazy and would benefit by putting the damn cell phones down for an hour or two a night and studying.

Maybe if we had an education system that put more emphasis on helping bright kids excel instead of focusing on those with learning and behavior problems, you might see some more excelling going on.

 

[Jackson]

BTW, two years ago, the schools did not give homework at all. Parents complained that they had to do it and they were tired of it. What's wrong with that picture?

 

[Jackson]

I'm certainly not advocating that every American family be ruled by a Tiger Mom screaming about getting a B. But I think it is fair to say, White kids are generally lazy and would benefit by putting the damn cell phones down for an hour or two a night and studying.

Maybe if we had an education system that put more emphasis on helping bright kids excel instead of focusing on those with learning and behavior problems, you might see some more excelling going on.

If we had a culture where our education and behavior expectations were higher, we would see more progress.

 

[Jackson]

I'm certainly not advocating that every American family be ruled by a Tiger Mom screaming about getting a B. But I think it is fair to say, White kids are generally lazy and would benefit by putting the damn cell phones down for an hour or two a night and studying.

Maybe if we had an education system that put more emphasis on helping bright kids excel instead of focusing on those with learning and behavior problems, you might see some more excelling going on.

Those students who are educationally challenged can learn, too. Many can learn as well as the average students if not better using the right methods and strategies. For those who don't make the standard, we have to stop passing them anyway.

 

[Jackson]

Asians are coming here taking US jobs. That can affect you and your children if we don't educate better.

Or we could ban Asians from coming here to take US jobs.

And keep traditional American childhoods, instead of Hell.

I believe in American exceptionalism, not mediocre accomplishments.

We put a man on the moon with scientists who grew up with summer vacations.

The idea that we need to give up summer vacations and happy childhoods in order to continue to be exceptional is unsupported.

And we have 27 countries that rank higher in math, science and reading skills now. They will be taking US jobs.

China is the nation that has the biggest Trade Surplus with US. THe millions of their assembly line workers are not kicking our asses because they score better in math, but because they work much cheaper.

That is true, too. We are both right because we are talking about different segments of the population.

 

[Jackson]

My grandsons are expected to get all A's, but when we get as B, we just accept that and tell them if they get all A's, there a hundred dollars waiting for you. All are in AP, Honor and accelerated classes and Beta club.

 

[Unkotare]

In another attempt to address the OP, I believe NJ White students could compete quite well with Asians if they had the same family and cultural reinforcement for education. Also White kids seem to be obsessed with social media more so than Asians. That doesn't help the GPA or the SAT scores either.

Do we want suicides from poor SAT scores to be an issue in our country?

Oh yeah, low expectations are the way to go....