Who Shot Down Malaysia Airlines Flight 17?

[georgephillip]

I think the Dutch are announcing the results of their preliminary investigation sometime this week (9/8-9/12) but will not apportion blame. The Official Report is due by next July, I think)

So, till next July millions of interner users are going to throw tons of 'arguments' into each other, while the governments will be placing blame on each other and the tension between countries will increase... Sweet perspective.
Or everybody will just forget about the story as it often happens when a tragedy is not needed to manipulate others anymore.

The Dutch released their preliminary report today without assigning blame; their findings indicate a surface-to-air missile with a "proximity warhead" brought down Malaysian Flight 17:

"(Reuters) - Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 broke apart over Ukraine due to impact from a large number of fragments, the Dutch Safety Board said on Tuesday, in a report that Malaysia's prime minister and several experts said suggested it was shot down from the ground.

"The crash over pro-Russian rebel-held territory in eastern Ukraine on July 17 killed 298 people, two thirds of them from the Netherlands.

"Ukraine and Western countries accuse the rebels of shooting it down with an advanced, Russian-made missile. The main rebel leader repeated earlier assertions that his forces did not possess such weapons.

"The report said MH17 crashed due to a 'large number of high-energy objects' penetrating the fuselage. 'There are no indications that the MH17 crash was caused by a technical fault or by actions of the crew,' it said."

I'm afraid everybody will forget this story before putting pressure on the government in Kiev to release the Air Traffic Control cockpit tapes recorded minutes before Flight 17 came down. The fact that this evidence is being suppressed makes it look like Kiev (and the US) have something to hide.

Malaysia Dutch report suggests MH-17 shot down from ground Reuters

 

[BullKurtz]

Here is a piece of the airframe from Flight 17....shrapnel wounds....obviously not cannon fire.

p.s. yesterday I said the "separatist" commander bragged on Twitter his unit had downed an airplane....it was intercepted signal intel not Twitter at that point. His voice was identified.

 

[aaronleland]

Investigators report that MH-17 was shot down by a "high energy object". I suspect space aliens.

 

[georgephillip]

Here is a piece of the airframe from Flight 17....shrapnel wounds....obviously not cannon fire.

Which doesn't tell us whether the missile responsible was fired from the air or ground. Do you think the US is withholding information that would answer this question?

"So far, the Obama administration hasn’t even admitted that they had a satellite overhead, preferring instead to stick with their pathetic propaganda strategy. Fortunately, CounterPunch has published an invaluable article by journalist Andre Vltchek that provides a translation of the Russian press conference to which the WSJ refers. Here’s an excerpt:

“'According to our records from 17:06 till 17:21 Moscow time on the July 17 over the Southeastern territory of Ukraine, a US space satellite flew overhead.

"This is a special device of the experimental space system designed to detect and track various missile launches.

"If the US party has photos made by the satellite, please let us ask them to show them to world community for further investigation….(NOTE: The US satellite system MUST work, because just days later it detected the launching of three ballistic missiles by the Ukrainian government.)

Was Malaysia Flight 17 Shot Down CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

 

[BullKurtz]

Here is a piece of the airframe from Flight 17....shrapnel wounds....obviously not cannon fire.

Which doesn't tell us whether the missile responsible was fired from the air or ground. Do you think the US is withholding information that would answer this question?

"So far, the Obama administration hasn’t even admitted that they had a satellite overhead, preferring instead to stick with their pathetic propaganda strategy. Fortunately, CounterPunch has published an invaluable article by journalist Andre Vltchek that provides a translation of the Russian press conference to which the WSJ refers. Here’s an excerpt:

“'According to our records from 17:06 till 17:21 Moscow time on the July 17 over the Southeastern territory of Ukraine, a US space satellite flew overhead.

"This is a special device of the experimental space system designed to detect and track various missile launches.

"If the US party has photos made by the satellite, please let us ask them to show them to world community for further investigation….(NOTE: The US satellite system MUST work, because just days later it detected the launching of three ballistic missiles by the Ukrainian government.)

Was Malaysia Flight 17 Shot Down CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

Not our dog in that fight....an air-to-air missle strikes the target directly usually in the engine area where there is a heat signature. There is obviously too much shrapnel damage to indicate anything other than an AA munition...much like how our own Patriot system works....by detonating near the target with a heavy shrapnel burst....remember, an airliner skin is thin aluminum.

 

[georgephillip]

Here is a piece of the airframe from Flight 17....shrapnel wounds....obviously not cannon fire.

Which doesn't tell us whether the missile responsible was fired from the air or ground. Do you think the US is withholding information that would answer this question?

"So far, the Obama administration hasn’t even admitted that they had a satellite overhead, preferring instead to stick with their pathetic propaganda strategy. Fortunately, CounterPunch has published an invaluable article by journalist Andre Vltchek that provides a translation of the Russian press conference to which the WSJ refers. Here’s an excerpt:

“'According to our records from 17:06 till 17:21 Moscow time on the July 17 over the Southeastern territory of Ukraine, a US space satellite flew overhead.

"This is a special device of the experimental space system designed to detect and track various missile launches.

"If the US party has photos made by the satellite, please let us ask them to show them to world community for further investigation….(NOTE: The US satellite system MUST work, because just days later it detected the launching of three ballistic missiles by the Ukrainian government.)

Was Malaysia Flight 17 Shot Down CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

Not our dog in that fight....an air-to-air missle strikes the target directly usually in the engine area where there is a heat signature. There is obviously too much shrapnel damage to indicate anything other than an AA munition...much like how our own Patriot system works....by detonating near the target with a heavy shrapnel burst....remember, an airliner skin is thin aluminum.

Obvious to whom?

The current government in Kiev wouldn't even be there without dogs like Victoria Nuland, John McCain, and John Brennan. There was also damage to Flight 17s cockpit that appeared to be from cannon fire. If DC and Kiev have nothing to hide in this matter, why aren't they turning over all relevant evidence to the EU?

 

[BullKurtz]

Here is a piece of the airframe from Flight 17....shrapnel wounds....obviously not cannon fire.

Which doesn't tell us whether the missile responsible was fired from the air or ground. Do you think the US is withholding information that would answer this question?

"So far, the Obama administration hasn’t even admitted that they had a satellite overhead, preferring instead to stick with their pathetic propaganda strategy. Fortunately, CounterPunch has published an invaluable article by journalist Andre Vltchek that provides a translation of the Russian press conference to which the WSJ refers. Here’s an excerpt:

“'According to our records from 17:06 till 17:21 Moscow time on the July 17 over the Southeastern territory of Ukraine, a US space satellite flew overhead.

"This is a special device of the experimental space system designed to detect and track various missile launches.

"If the US party has photos made by the satellite, please let us ask them to show them to world community for further investigation….(NOTE: The US satellite system MUST work, because just days later it detected the launching of three ballistic missiles by the Ukrainian government.)

Was Malaysia Flight 17 Shot Down CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

Not our dog in that fight....an air-to-air missle strikes the target directly usually in the engine area where there is a heat signature. There is obviously too much shrapnel damage to indicate anything other than an AA munition...much like how our own Patriot system works....by detonating near the target with a heavy shrapnel burst....remember, an airliner skin is thin aluminum.

Obvious to whom?

The current government in Kiev wouldn't even be there without dogs like Victoria Nuland, John McCain, and John Brennan. There was also damage to Flight 17s cockpit that appeared to be from cannon fire. If DC and Kiev have nothing to hide in this matter, why aren't they turning over all relevant evidence to the EU?

Ah okay....you're leftist trash who sees the USA as "evil"....I blew up your conspiracy theory with picture evidence....something you avoided because it didn't fit your little pack of lies......hey, maybe BUSH or DIRTY DICK Cheney created the tsunami that hit the Nips too eh?

 

[georgephillip]

Some swallow every load the Empire vomits forth.
Greatest Purveyor of Violence in the World...it's NOT Russia:

"Many writers over the past few days have commented that neither the DPR forces nor Russia had either the equipment in place to hit neither the plane nor the motive to deliberately shoot it down.

"But there is strong circumstantial evidence that the forces of the Kiev regime had the means, the opportunity and the motive.

"They had the equipment and engaged in very suspicious actions; they had BUK anti-aircraft systems in place for unknown reasons since the DPR forces have no aircraft, the Ukraine Air Traffic Control ordered the plane’s crew to divert from the regular more southerly route to go north over the combat zone, a Ukraine jet fighter was recorded by Russian radar climbing rapidly towards it just before it went down, and, within minutes of the crash, it was the Kiev regime and its masters in Washington and London who cried loudly that it was the DPR and Russians who were to blame without a shred of evidence to support the claim.

"And now we know that the Ukraine SBU immediately seized the ATC radar tapes and do not appear to have handed them over to international investigators.

MH17 8211 Sacrificed Airliner CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

 

[katsung47]

848. The crashes of MH17 and MH370 serve for one purpose (8/8/2014)

US has locked two strategy enemies – Russia and China. Both are the threats to the dollar.

The tactic to deal with these two enemies is to weaken them by war.

China has conflicts with its neighbor countries. It has territory problem with Japan in East China Sea and with Vietnam and Philippine in South China Sea. China blames US standing at the side of these three countries. Malaysia has territory problem with China in South China Sea too but it keeps friendship with China. To push Malaysia to join the anti-China front in Asia, MH370 case was created. The mysterious disappearance of the passengers would create a long lasting demanding for the victims from China side because most victims were Chinese citizens. (That is why MH370 case was produced as a mysterious disappearance not an evident crash) Anyhow, China and Malaysia might have realized the plot and haven’t made it a crisis.

The Ukraine crisis started in February when a civil turmoil happened which caused the stepping down of pro-Russia President Yanukovych. The result is there is an upheaval in East Ukraine. Since Russia and Europe both have interest in Ukraine, a war between the two is easy to be ignited. The shooting down of MH17 was created as an ignition. MH17 was well selected – like MH370 – for its passengers. Most of victims in MH17 were Dutch. Holland is a major country of EU and NATO. If Holland is infuriated, the possibility of a covert war between EU and Russia in Ukraine is greatly increased.

I think US is the mastermind of the incidents of MH17 and MH370. The purpose is to push Russia and China into wars with their neighbor countries to weaken them.
See my analysis on MH370: from #822 to #835.
See my analysis on MH17: from #844 to #847.

 

[georgephillip]

848. The crashes of MH17 and MH370 serve for one purpose (8/8/2014)

US has locked two strategy enemies – Russia and China. Both are the threats to the dollar.

The tactic to deal with these two enemies is to weaken them by war.

China has conflicts with its neighbor countries. It has territory problem with Japan in East China Sea and with Vietnam and Philippine in South China Sea. China blames US standing at the side of these three countries. Malaysia has territory problem with China in South China Sea too but it keeps friendship with China. To push Malaysia to join the anti-China front in Asia, MH370 case was created. The mysterious disappearance of the passengers would create a long lasting demanding for the victims from China side because most victims were Chinese citizens. (That is why MH370 case was produced as a mysterious disappearance not an evident crash) Anyhow, China and Malaysia might have realized the plot and haven’t made it a crisis.

The Ukraine crisis started in February when a civil turmoil happened which caused the stepping down of pro-Russia President Yanukovych. The result is there is an upheaval in East Ukraine. Since Russia and Europe both have interest in Ukraine, a war between the two is easy to be ignited. The shooting down of MH17 was created as an ignition. MH17 was well selected – like MH370 – for its passengers. Most of victims in MH17 were Dutch. Holland is a major country of EU and NATO. If Holland is infuriated, the possibility of a covert war between EU and Russia in Ukraine is greatly increased.

I think US is the mastermind of the incidents of MH17 and MH370. The purpose is to push Russia and China into wars with their neighbor countries to weaken them.
See my analysis on MH370: from #822 to #835.
See my analysis on MH17: from #844 to #847.

I've never considered your argument for MH 370; if you are accurate, Evil truly rules this world. Do you have any links?

 

[LogikAndReazon]

Counterpunch? What a mindless derelict.....
Obviously it was the man on the grassy knoll.....

 

[georgephillip]

Counterpunch? What a mindless derelict.....
Obviously it was the man on the grassy knoll.....

Be afraid, Moron!

"So much is at stake!

"Increasing cooperation between Russia, Latin America and China could mean the end of Western neo-colonial control of the world.

"The creation of alternatives to the World Bank can free billions of human beings from market feudalism and its slavery.

"Powerful news organizations broadcasting from Russia (RT), Venezuela (TeleSur) and Iran (Press TV) are consistently breaking the depressing and nihilistic monopoly of Western propaganda and control of people’s brains all over the world.

"The more liberating these trends and waves are for the world, the more panic there is in Washington, London and Paris, but also on Wall Street and in the City, as well as in the newsrooms of the corporate media.

"The West is terrified.

"Its ‘exceptionalism’, tremendous profits from controlling everything that moves on this planet, the kick of being in charge and holding the whip, all this can disappear if these waves of resistance are not reversed!

MH17 8211 Sacrificed Airliner CounterPunch Tells the Facts Names the Names

Go back to sleep, Slave.

 

[LogikAndReazon]

Sure thing communist imbecile

 

[georgephillip]

Sure thing communist imbecile

Greatest Purveyor of Violence in the World?

 

[BullKurtz]

Sure thing communist imbecile

Greatest Purveyor of Violence in the World?

So why are you in Los Angeles instead of Moscow? Is it because Russia has more of a free enterprise economy than Obozo's USA? It always amazes me fools like you listen to trash like Ward Churchill and Bill Ayers (Barry's hero) yet stay right here in the Evil Empire.....what's the matter....are you heading to the next Boston Marathon? Or afraid you're full of shit?
p.s. you're full of shit or drunk.

 

[georgephillip]

Sure thing communist imbecile

Greatest Purveyor of Violence in the World?

So why are you in Los Angeles instead of Moscow? Is it because Russia has more of a free enterprise economy than Obozo's USA? It always amazes me fools like you listen to trash like Ward Churchill and Bill Ayers (Barry's hero) yet stay right here in the Evil Empire.....what's the matter....are you heading to the next Boston Marathon? Or afraid you're full of shit?
p.s. you're full of shit or drunk.

What's your excuse, inbreeding?

 

[katsung47]

850. Plot to frame Russia in shooting down of MH17 failed (8/19/2014)
There is a silence in Western media about the crash of MH17, compare to the noise they made at original hours when MH17 was shot down when the evidence shows there were 30mm bullet holes on fuselage of MH17. The bullet couldn’t reach altitude of 32,000 feet from ground that’s common sense.

First Examination of Malaysian MH-17 Cockpit Photo Shows Ukraine Government Shot that Plane Down
By Eric Zuesse 7/31/2014
On July 30th, a German pilot headlined at anderweltonline, "Shocking Analysis of the 'Shooting Down' of Malaysian MH17," and he provided the first public analysis of the photos that were available immediately after the disaster, of the plane's cockpit, and of a wing.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/First-Examination-of-Malay-by-Eric-Zuesse-Activism-Anti-War_Obama-Administration_Peace_War_President-Barack-Obama-POTUS-140731-170.html

Be noticed it’s from a Germany pilot. German is one who suffered from Ukraine conflict.
Analysis from Malaysia newspaper.

MH17: Pockmarks look like from very, very heavy machine gun fire, says first OSCE monitor on-scene
By Haris Hussain - 7 August 2014

The holes in the wreckage of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 are believed to have come from 30mm cannon fire.
KUALA LUMPUR: INTELLIGENCE analysts in the United States had already concluded that Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was shot down by an air-to-air missile, and that the Ukrainian government had had something to do with it.
This corroborates an emerging theory postulated by local investigators that the Boeing 777-200 was crippled by an air-to-air missile and finished off with cannon fire from a fighter that had been shadowing it as it plummeted to earth.
http://www.nst.com.my/node/20961

 

[georgephillip]

From 28 July 2014:
"Data from the black box flight recorders of Flight MH17 show it was destroyed by shrapnel from a missile strike that caused a 'massive explosive decompression', a Ukrainian official said yesterday.

"Andriy Lysenko, spokesman for Ukraine's Security Council, told a news conference in Kiev the information came from experts analysing the recorders from the plane that came down in rebel-held territory in eastern Ukraine on July 17.

"British air accident specialists have been tasked with downloading the data from two black boxes recovered from the Malaysia Airlines crash site and handing that information over to an investigation led by the Dutch Safety Board."

As far as I know, the tapes that recorded transmissions between the cockpit of MH 17 and the control tower in Kiev are still unreleased.

Maybe Putin didn't do this one?

MH17 Black box reveals Malaysia Airlines suffered massive explosive decompression - Telegraph

 

[katsung47]

851. Why Malaysia airlines was selected as target (8/23/2014)

In #848, I said Malaysia was targeted because it keeps a friendship with China while China is a covert enemy of the US. In #845, I talked about German had sensed that E.U. was provoked by the US for a covert war with Russia. German is unwilling to follow the US instruction. It expelled the CIA Chief from the German as a protest.

Then a Chinese forum offered an information how Malaysia and German were hurt by heavy insurance loss in the two incidents. The insurance company of Malaysia Airline is a Germany.

1. MH370

German insurance company Allianz says it has made initial payments in connection with the missing Malaysian Airlines plane.

Allianz’s global head of communication Hugo Kidston confirmed Wednesday that the Munich-based insurer and “other co-reinsurers of Malaysia Airlines aviation hull and liability policy have made initial payments.”

http://www.worthytoshare.net/insurance-payments-made-malaysian-airlines-disappearance#

2.. MH17

Malaysia Airlines Girds for New Insurance Battle
By Enda Curran Updated July 18, 2014

German insurer Allianz Global Corporate & Specialty is the lead reinsurer of the Malaysia Airlines plane for its so-calleded hull and liability policy, according to a report from insurance broker Aon PLC, which valued the plane itself at $97.3 million.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/malaysia-airlines-girds-for-new-insurance-battle-1405673357

The comment said, “German was shot even it was laying on the ground”.

 

[katsung47]

Dutch Intellectuals Apologize to Putin for Lies on MH17, Syria, Ukraine...
Wednesday, 27 August 2014
A letter sent by a prominent Dutch Professor to Russian president Vladimir Putin has attracted much media attention in Europe. The letter was written by Professor Cees Hamelink and signed by dozens of Dutch intellectuals and professors. Below is the letter in its entirety.

Dear Mr. President Putin,
Please accept our apologies on behalf of a great many people here in the Netherlands for our Government and our Media. The facts concerning MH17 are twisted to defame you and your country.
We are powerless onlookers, as we witness how the Western Nations, led by the United States, accuse Russia of crimes they commit themselves more than anybody else. We reject the double standards that are used for Russia and the West. In our societies, sufficient evidence is required for a conviction. The way you and your Nation are convicted for 'crimes' without evidence, is ruthless and despicable.
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/25981/53/