Why am I a liberal?

[Skull Pilot]

The thing that bonds conservatives together is a desire to protect inherited position in life, they wish to protect the great families from losing wealth.

The thing that bonds conservatives together is a desire to protect EARNED position in life.

All should earn their way, even those with rich parents, even if the parents would do otherwise, after all what parent wouldn't?

So you are going to kick your kids out of the house at 18 and let them pay for their own college educations. housing etc etc?

And no federal money is allowed because you shouldn't want tax payers subsidizing your kids because they have to earn their own way 100%.

And if everyone should earn their own way how do you justify tax write offs for having kids so people without kids have to pay more in taxes to subsidize your reproductive choices?

You talk a good game but you like all liberals don't want your rules to apply to you

FYI I am probably the most liberal person you'd ever meet because I actually believe in liberty including economic liberty where you obviously only believe in a perverted definition of freedom where you arbitrarily apply rules to ensure your desired outcome

 

[GreatDay]

The thing that bonds conservatives together is a desire to protect EARNED position in life.

All should earn their way, even those with rich parents, even if the parents would do otherwise, after all what parent wouldn't?

So you are going to kick your kids out of the house at 18 and let them pay for their own college educations. housing etc etc?

And no federal money is allowed because you shouldn't want tax payers subsidizing your kids because they have to earn their own way 100%.

And if everyone should earn their own way how do you justify tax write offs for having kids so people without kids have to pay more in taxes to subsidize your reproductive choices?

You talk a good game but you like all liberals don't want your rules to apply to you

Building a straw man are you?

You can't attack anything I actually said so you make a bunch of shit up, typical for a con.

 

[Ariux]

why am I a liberal?

You're a liberal because you have shit for brains. Everything else is just BS.

I do have some specific suggestions that I feel would be helpful long term:

Public financing for public elections
Flat rate Social Security Tax, first dollar to last all forms of income
Index minimum wage to the average increase in CEO pay for the S&P 500

That’s about it, that shouldn’t be too hard to do, right?

Shithead, public financing for public elections is just another way for our Republican/Democrat one-party system to keep out 3rd parties. Already, third parties are practically barred from raising enough funds and the government doesn't give them "matching funds".

Actually, I don't oppose your flat-rate Social Security tax.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

 

[freedombecki]

Too much at one time? Here... Just address one...

The wealthy have stuck about 50 trillion away from all the stimulating we been doing to the economy over the past thirty years or so, you got a problem with them at least paying the 16 trillion dollar debt they ran up doing it?

Oh, for God's sake! The wealthy have paid taxes for the past thirty years. They are not the cause of the 16 trillion dollar debt that this nation has. We've become an entitlement society over the past thirty years. That's the problem!!! We've reached the point where our entitlement obligations are SO huge that we can't possibly pay them...but idiots like you two STILL think that the solution is to take all of the money that the wealthy has and give it to an even bigger government.

Maybe instead, we should start insuring the Lower 48% pay a minimum Federal Income Tax. Everyone should Pay a Minimum Federal Income Tax. It's only fair, right? You don't want to be cheating Any One, right?

That truly makes good sense, Intense, and thanks for a worthy idea. If I were really, really on the skids, I'd still like to pay a few dollars to the government as my share of the rites of citizenship could well require without anyone starving.

 

[Skull Pilot]

All should earn their way, even those with rich parents, even if the parents would do otherwise, after all what parent wouldn't?

So you are going to kick your kids out of the house at 18 and let them pay for their own college educations. housing etc etc?

And no federal money is allowed because you shouldn't want tax payers subsidizing your kids because they have to earn their own way 100%.

And if everyone should earn their own way how do you justify tax write offs for having kids so people without kids have to pay more in taxes to subsidize your reproductive choices?

You talk a good game but you like all liberals don't want your rules to apply to you

Building a straw man are you?

You can't attack anything I actually said so you make a bunch of shit up, typical for a con.

Everyone should earn their way isn't that what you said?

So that means that tax payers should not subsidize anyone at all. You already have stated that people shouldn't be able to leave in inheritance to their kids so I am not using a straw man at all just a logical extension of your own arguments that everyone should earn their own way.

After all if you are taking someone else's money to pay for your life choices then you are not earning your way are you?

So as long as you are consistent (which I have no doubt that you're not) you would want to end all federal programs that give tax payer money to those who don't earn it.

 

[Skull Pilot]

why am I a liberal?

You're a liberal because you have shit for brains. Everything else is just BS.

I do have some specific suggestions that I feel would be helpful long term:

Public financing for public elections
Flat rate Social Security Tax, first dollar to last all forms of income
Index minimum wage to the average increase in CEO pay for the S&P 500

That’s about it, that shouldn’t be too hard to do, right?

Shithead, public financing for public elections is just another way for our Republican/Democrat one-party system to keep out 3rd parties. Already, third parties are practically barred from raising enough funds and the government doesn't give them "matching funds".

Actually, I don't oppose your flat-rate Social Security tax.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

He thinks that people who don't study and get a D on a test should be given an A simply because another more diligent student earned an A

 

[kaz]

I am a parent.
As a parent I will do anything within my power to advantage my child

So you consider a government check to advantage your child more than a job?

 

[GreatDay]

I am a parent.
As a parent I will do anything within my power to advantage my child

So you consider a government check to advantage your child more than a job?

A government check?

The people getting the "government checks" are the ones holding the debt, and we need to close that credit card account, and there is not a damn thing wrong with telling them to pay the damn bill they ran up.

Where do I say anything about getting a government check?

I swear if you cons couldn't build straw men you would have nothing to say, you can't even address what has been said, like Obama saying you didn't build the roads and bridges, you guys turn that into him saying you didn’t build your business so you would have something to oppose without sounding like the idiots you are.

 

[Oldstyle]

A rejection of emotion in favor of reason is the hallmark of the liberal. As I said in my intro, I started out as a conservative. All children do. It's the infant's philosophy. And as most children tend to do, I grew out of conservatism. Being in the military, being employed, those factors almost always create liberals.

Liberalism is just common sense. We don't have hysterical emotional attachments to any position. If it works, then we do it. (To a certain extent. We also understand the dangers of pure utilitarianism, and thus understand that practicality has to be tempered with a little idealism.)

Now, compare that to conservatism. Supply-side economics has been a dismal failure for decades ... and they demand more! There's a whole list of politically correct party planks that good conservatives are required to believe, upon penality of being purged from TheParty. Abortion, global warming, immigration, gay marriage, taxation ... a conservative _must_ believe them all. Because TheParty so orders.

In contrast, I can and do disagree with the Democrats on several major points ... and no one cares. No screaming that I'm a DINO, no purges. That's because the Democrats aren't a political cult like the Republicans are.

You have such a stunted view of the Republican Party it's almost farcical. I'm a conservative who is pro-choice and has no problem with gay marriage and I've not been "purged" from the Republican Party. What people like you can't seem to understand is that the overwhelming thing that bonds the modern conservative movement together is fiscal conservatism. Things like abortion and gay marriage are wedges that liberals continually attempt to use to drive the Republican Party apart, usually without success. I'm a Republican because the Democratic Party believes that it's fine to take from those who have worked hard to give to those who have not.

The thing that bonds conservatives together is a desire to protect inherited position in life, they wish to protect the great families from losing wealth. They do this by consistently pushing for lower taxes, the conservatives and the Republican Party at large have given up on the concept of homeostasis, other wise know as balance, they have adopted a strategy of fighting for all tax cuts as long as they include the very wealthy and opposing all tax increases, this is like a doctor that will only lower your temp, eventually you will die if you don';t change directions, the Republican Party refuses to change direction no matter what.

Can you tell me what you see in the GOP that tells you that should we fix our current problem and start to pay down on this debt that the GOP would not run all over Washington shooting about Washington taking in too much money and cutting taxes again as they did in 2001?

They say we must fix it with spending cuts, lets say we do, then one quarter the GOP sees a surplus and slashes taxes, aren't we right back where we started?

The thing that binds conservatives together is fiscal sanity, Great. Look, the realities of economics don't change simply because you desire "fairness" and decide to MAKE them change. To use your doctor analogy...if a patient is running high fever but you artificially change the temperature on the thermometer by dunking it in ice water then you're going to misdiagnose their medical condition. Examples of this abound in the way this government functions.

Can we start by agreeing that our government IS bloated and wasteful? Right now that government is like an 800 pound man sitting on a broken down couch in a cramped house and people are complaining that someone has suggested he stop eating twenty boxes of Hostess cup cakes every day as a start to getting his problem under control. His diet isn't the problem, those people contend. What he needs is a bigger house and a stronger couch!!!

That's insanity...yet it's what we're doing every single day.

 

[GreatDay]

why am I a liberal?

You're a liberal because you have shit for brains. Everything else is just BS.

I do have some specific suggestions that I feel would be helpful long term:

Public financing for public elections
Flat rate Social Security Tax, first dollar to last all forms of income
Index minimum wage to the average increase in CEO pay for the S&P 500

That’s about it, that shouldn’t be too hard to do, right?

Shithead, public financing for public elections is just another way for our Republican/Democrat one-party system to keep out 3rd parties. Already, third parties are practically barred from raising enough funds and the government doesn't give them "matching funds".

Actually, I don't oppose your flat-rate Social Security tax.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

He thinks that people who don't study and get a D on a test should be given an A simply because another more diligent student earned an A

You think if you played for the Bills your son should play for the Bills.

I think every body even the ones born rich should have to earn their way, I know as parents the folk won't have the heart or ego to do that but it's still the right thing to do, right now the problem is too many people with great power that didn't earn it.

Class Matters - Social Class in the United States of America - The New York Times

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

A rejection of emotion in favor of reason is the hallmark of the liberal. As I said in my intro, I started out as a conservative. All children do. It's the infant's philosophy. And as most children tend to do, I grew out of conservatism. Being in the military, being employed, those factors almost always create liberals.

Liberalism is just common sense. We don't have hysterical emotional attachments to any position. If it works, then we do it. (To a certain extent. We also understand the dangers of pure utilitarianism, and thus understand that practicality has to be tempered with a little idealism.)

Now, compare that to conservatism. Supply-side economics has been a dismal failure for decades ... and they demand more! There's a whole list of politically correct party planks that good conservatives are required to believe, upon penality of being purged from TheParty. Abortion, global warming, immigration, gay marriage, taxation ... a conservative _must_ believe them all. Because TheParty so orders.

In contrast, I can and do disagree with the Democrats on several major points ... and no one cares. No screaming that I'm a DINO, no purges. That's because the Democrats aren't a political cult like the Republicans are.

You have such a stunted view of the Republican Party it's almost farcical. I'm a conservative who is pro-choice and has no problem with gay marriage and I've not been "purged" from the Republican Party. What people like you can't seem to understand is that the overwhelming thing that bonds the modern conservative movement together is fiscal conservatism. Things like abortion and gay marriage are wedges that liberals continually attempt to use to drive the Republican Party apart, usually without success. I'm a Republican because the Democratic Party believes that it's fine to take from those who have worked hard to give to those who have not.

The thing that bonds conservatives together is a desire to protect inherited position in life, they wish to protect the great families from losing wealth. They do this by consistently pushing for lower taxes, the conservatives and the Republican Party at large have given up on the concept of homeostasis, other wise know as balance, they have adopted a strategy of fighting for all tax cuts as long as they include the very wealthy and opposing all tax increases, this is like a doctor that will only lower your temp, eventually you will die if you don';t change directions, the Republican Party refuses to change direction no matter what.

Can you tell me what you see in the GOP that tells you that should we fix our current problem and start to pay down on this debt that the GOP would not run all over Washington shooting about Washington taking in too much money and cutting taxes again as they did in 2001?

They say we must fix it with spending cuts, lets say we do, then one quarter the GOP sees a surplus and slashes taxes, aren't we right back where we started?

No. Now buzz the fuck off.

 

[GreatDay]

why am I a liberal?

You're a liberal because you have shit for brains. Everything else is just BS.

I do have some specific suggestions that I feel would be helpful long term:

Public financing for public elections
Flat rate Social Security Tax, first dollar to last all forms of income
Index minimum wage to the average increase in CEO pay for the S&P 500

That’s about it, that shouldn’t be too hard to do, right?

Shithead, public financing for public elections is just another way for our Republican/Democrat one-party system to keep out 3rd parties. Already, third parties are practically barred from raising enough funds and the government doesn't give them "matching funds".

Actually, I don't oppose your flat-rate Social Security tax.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

One of the biggest complaints I hear about minimum wage is that it gives government bureaucrats control over too much of the market place. I am just suggesting that yes we have a minimum wage, because there is great overall benefit to having one and we let the market place decide what it should be, after all are CEOs not rewarded on how well their companies are doing and if we take an average of the top 500 we will have a good measure of the overall economy as decided by true market forces not government bureaucrats.

we'll deal with rest if you respond shithead

 

[GreatDay]

Libs want everyone to start at the bottom...and stay there

I'm sure you're familiar with bottoms frank, kissing them

 

[Skull Pilot]

You're a liberal because you have shit for brains. Everything else is just BS.

Ii

Shithead, public financing for public elections is justj another way for our Republican/Democrat one-party system to keep out 3rd parties. Already, third parties are practically barred from raising enough funds and the government doesn't give them "matching funds".

Actually, I don't oppose your flat-rate Social Security tax.

Indexing minimum wage to CEO pay is totally idiotic, to such a degree that I can't imagine you being serious.

He thinks that people who don't study and get a D on a test should be given an A simply because another more diligent student earned an A

You think if you played for the Bills your son should play for the Bills.

I think every body even the ones born rich should have to earn their way, I know as parents the folk won't have the heart or ego to do that but it's still the right thing to do, right now the problem is too many people with great power that didn't earn it.

Class Matters - Social Class in the United States of America - The New York Times

Typical idiot confusing football with real life.

Tell me are you planning to leave any property to your kids?

 

[GreatDay]

He thinks that people who don't study and get a D on a test should be given an A simply because another more diligent student earned an A

You think if you played for the Bills your son should play for the Bills.

I think every body even the ones born rich should have to earn their way, I know as parents the folk won't have the heart or ego to do that but it's still the right thing to do, right now the problem is too many people with great power that didn't earn it.

Class Matters - Social Class in the United States of America - The New York Times

Typical idiot confusing football with real life.

Tell me are you planning to leave any property to your kids?

and here I thought the NFL was a real business, billions of dollars and no "real life" anywhere not even in how they do business? I think you are just another com that just got his ass kicked and he knows it.

 

[Skull Pilot]

You think if you played for the Bills your son should play for the Bills.

I think every body even the ones born rich should have to earn their way, I know as parents the folk won't have the heart or ego to do that but it's still the right thing to do, right now the problem is too many people with great power that didn't earn it.

Class Matters - Social Class in the United States of America - The New York Times

Typical idiot confusing football with real life.

Tell me are you planning to leave any property to your kids?

and here I thought the NFL was a real business, billions of dollars and no "real life" anywhere not even in how they do business? I think you are just another com that just got his ass kicked and he knows it.

Running a football team is business playing football isn't. But then again you wouldn't know the difference.

So tell me are you planning to leave any property or money to your kids?

 

[GreatDay]

Typical idiot confusing football with real life.

Tell me are you planning to leave any property to your kids?

and here I thought the NFL was a real business, billions of dollars and no "real life" anywhere not even in how they do business? I think you are just another com that just got his ass kicked and he knows it.

Running a football team is business playing football isn't. But then again you wouldn't know the difference.

So tell me are you planning to leave any property or money to your kids?

cons are always trying to make things personal, it's the only shot they have really, but getting back to policy

It is the business end of the game that decides who should start at quarterback, you think that if you are the quarterback your son should be too, the example works whither you are quarterbacking a football team or running a company, not really that different if you are born to your position America suffers, sorry daddy I know you want to leave a Kingdom....

 

[kaz]

cons are always trying to make things personal, it's the only shot they have really, but getting back to policy

If you meant this, you would also say it to liberals, you don't.

It is the business end of the game that decides who should start at quarterback, you think that if you are the quarterback your son should be too, the example works whither you are quarterbacking a football team or running a company, not really that different if you are born to your position America suffers, sorry daddy I know you want to leave a Kingdom....

You're right that sons of business owners and quarterbacks are not guaranteed to be successful, but because of genetics certainly there is a strong correlation. No one thinks Peyton or Eli got their position because they were "born" to it.

Another difference with business and quarterbacks is that the quarterback role is a lot more specific. There are a lot of ways that companies can be run, business owner sons could change direction to suit their skills and still be effective.

Also, the business belongs to the son and the team doesn't belong to the quarterback.

America may "suffer" in the instance where a father leaves the reins to a son not up to the job, but there is no system where removing people's choice over their own assets yields across the board a better solution then giving them choice over their own assets. And a lot of sons don't want the job.

I'm a business owner, I have two daughters, so far neither is expressing any interest in ultimately taking over. Of course that could change.

 

[Skull Pilot]

and here I thought the NFL was a real business, billions of dollars and no "real life" anywhere not even in how they do business? I think you are just another com that just got his ass kicked and he knows it.

Running a football team is business playing football isn't. But then again you wouldn't know the difference.

So tell me are you planning to leave any property or money to your kids?

cons are always trying to make things personal, it's the only shot they have really, but getting back to policy

It is the business end of the game that decides who should start at quarterback, you think that if you are the quarterback your son should be too, the example works whither you are quarterbacking a football team or running a company, not really that different if you are born to your position America suffers, sorry daddy I know you want to leave a Kingdom....

The business end of the game is the money the coach decides who will play where. Idiot.

And leaving an inheritance to ones children has nothing to do with football. If I leave an inheritance to a child then he can do whatever the fuck he wants.

Now will you answer the question

Do you plan to leave anything to your kids?

But you know damn well that you will keep dodging the question because the answer will reveal you for the hypocrite you are.

 

[Skull Pilot]

cons are always trying to make things personal, it's the only shot they have really, but getting back to policy

If you meant this, you would also say it to liberals, you don't.

It is the business end of the game that decides who should start at quarterback, you think that if you are the quarterback your son should be too, the example works whither you are quarterbacking a football team or running a company, not really that different if you are born to your position America suffers, sorry daddy I know you want to leave a Kingdom....

You're right that sons of business owners and quarterbacks are not guaranteed to be successful, but because of genetics certainly there is a strong correlation. No one thinks Peyton or Eli got their position because they were "born" to it.

Another difference with business and quarterbacks is that the quarterback role is a lot more specific. There are a lot of ways that companies can be run, business owner sons could change direction to suit their skills and still be effective.

Also, the business belongs to the son and the team doesn't belong to the quarterback.

America may "suffer" in the instance where a father leaves the reins to a son not up to the job, but there is no system where removing people's choice over their own assets yields across the board a better solution then giving them choice over their own assets. And a lot of sons don't want the job.

I'm a business owner, I have two daughters, so far neither is expressing any interest in ultimately taking over. Of course that could change.

That's not the point Great Gay thinks that no one should be able to leave anything to their kids because everyone should have to earn their own way.

But of course he won't answer the question as to whether or not he is planning to leave his kids anything.