Why do so many people deny climate change

[Toddsterpatriot]

So Toddster is actually claiming that there wasn't any new data since 1965. His mindless cult allegiance has turned him into a retard. Is he capable of understanding that, or is he too much of a retard now to understand it?

Now, more on that figure. It was in IPCC 1990, but gone by 1992, replaced by better figures. Denialists should probably adjust their 'tard conspiracy. Do they now claim the conspiracy extends back to 1992? Understand that Dr. Mann didn't get involved with IPCC until around 1996, so they'll have to find another personality to demonize as Satan incarnate. Denialists, exactly who forged the data in 1992?

I'm laughing at the idea that Mann found better data. Did he really?

Who had better data before him?

The guys who didn't lie to fabricate a hockey stick.

 

[mamooth]

And you can type on any board for a million posts talking about the evil of fossil fuels, but unless you can tell me in the here and now that you are posting depending on a windmill or solar you are a hypocrite.

That's retarded. It's idiot logic, and makes it tough to take anything you say seriously.

If someone had said, "all must stop using electricity now", you'd have a point. But since no one said that, you're just babbling crap so you have an excuse to call people hypocrites and thus ignore what they say.

In summary, you being stupid and dishonest does not make us hypocrites. If you're incapable of addressing the actual issues, just say so, instead of pulling sleaze like that.

 

[bripat9643]

Why don't you post a link to the original so we can determine the facts for ourselves?

No problem.

Description of the Medieval Warm Period and Little Ice Age in IPCC reports - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The original:

The altered:

And from the wiki page, dating back prior to the 2010 scam graph:
---
The graph had no clear source (but can be traced to publications by Hubert Lamb representing the Central England Temperature; those publications have no explicit calibration against instrumental data, [and are] just Lamb’s qualitative judgement and interpretation of what he refers to as the ‘evidence’ [1]), and disappeared from the 1992 supplementary report.
---

And where can I find the "2010 scam graph?"

 

[mamooth]

And where can I find the "2010 scam graph?"

Again, here.

When the IPCC ?disappeared? the Medieval Warm Period | Watts Up With That?

 

[mamooth]

The guys who didn't lie to fabricate a hockey stick.

Much like Muslims chanting "Allahu Akbar!" loudly in public, denialists also have some sacred lines they repeatedly chant at maximum volume. The purpose of them is not to convince others, since no one outside the cult is dumb enough to fall for it. The purpose is a display of group solidarity, to identify themselves to others of their own religion, and to show how loyal to that religion they are.

 

[PMZ]

And still applicable today.

There is no global warming. Not since 1998. And climate change is natural.

Instead of spending all our resources trying to "fix the climate" brought to you by the same politicians who can't "fix a pot hole" or can't "fix an economy" I'd like to invest in science that can and will help us deal with our issues in the here and now but also in the future with realistic predictions on how the changing climate will affect us locally and also globally.

And take a pro active stance on doing something instead of predicting the end of the world as we know ad nauseaum and milking the crap out of the tax paying populace of the planet in a money grabbing scheme called "save the earth give me your money now".

If you knew science you'd know that science has found no alternative to AGW at the GHG concentrations we measure today. Politics has. Do nothing and push the consequences off on the future. Good for us, bad for everyone else. Potholes and the economy pale in comparison. Not to mention that it was conservative politics that gave us the economy that caused the need to recover.

So what you're selling is to be irresponsible. We received the benefit of fossil fuels. Let's dump the cost on others.

That's not the America that we've always been proud to be a part of.

I'm married to a man who graduated from the University of Toronto with degrees in biology and chemistry.

He's my go to guy. Well apart from other things.

I've also gone completely primitive in my lifetime. Nothing but a woodstove, fireplace, kerosene lamps and battery operated radio. Oh and having to pump water.

And you can type on any board for a million posts talking about the evil of fossil fuels, but unless you can tell me in the here and now that you are posting depending on a windmill or solar you are a hypocrite.

Unless you can tell me you are going to cook on a wood stove tonight or heat your home that way, you are a hypocrite.

Sorry as I can be, but if you are right now using the same fossil fuels that you love to hate, you are a hypocrite.

Get off the grid for a couple of years and get back to me on how evil fossil fuels are. Use only solar or wind.

I'll be waiting.

I don't know if your go to guy read your post or not. If he did, he probably told you that it's nonsensical.

Our economy, thanks to the Industrial Revolution, is fueled by energy. No going back to the earlier times that you like to emulate. I do too, when backpacking and camping.

We've discovered threats to our ongoing economic success. We are moving giga tons of carbon from underground, to the atmosphere, recreating the pre Carboniferous climate, replacing the one that we built our present civilization around. And in roughly the time that it would take to change to sustainable energy, we will have used up all of the underground carbon anyway.

If we put all of the carbon back from whence it came, in the atmosphere, we will maximise the necessary costs to civilization of adapting to a new climate. Trillions on top of the trillions it will unavoidably cost to convert to sustainable energy.

Science can help us find the least expensive path forward. Politics will not.

Because we have no models that can predict long term weather, the details of the cost of adapting civilization to a new climate are unknowable. They could be smaller or much greater than anyone's guess.

Anyone in the risk management field would advise that the riskiest alternative now is to do nothing. The safest, pay for better information. Both for the risk of climate change and it's attendant mitigation costs, and for the sustainable energy technology.

Exactly the path that we are on and you are obfuscating.

 

[tinydancer]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The guys who didn't lie to fabricate a hockey stick.

Much like Muslims chanting "Allahu Akbar!" loudly in public, denialists also have some sacred lines they repeatedly chant at maximum volume. The purpose of them is not to convince others, since no one outside the cult is dumb enough to fall for it. The purpose is a display of group solidarity, to identify themselves to others of their own religion, and to show how loyal to that religion they are.

I know I shouldn't mock Mann, he is, after all, a Nobel prize recipient.

http://legaltimes.typepad.com/files/michael-mann-complaint.pdf (page 3)

 

[PMZ]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

''Climate change is normal.''

Cancer is normal too. Merely undesirable. And caused by different things. Fortunately the condition that burning fossil fuels is recreating has been here before and has been studied. The pre Carboniferous climate. So we know in general what the climate will do. We can predict only generally what the weather will do. The new climate will require civilization to adapt.

''It's not the end of the world.''

Probably. Humanity, if we react quickly enough, is still in control. We broke it, we can fix it. Probably.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

''Climate change is normal.''

Cancer is normal too. Merely undesirable. And caused by different things. Fortunately the condition that burning fossil fuels is recreating has been here before and has been studied. The pre Carboniferous climate. So we know in general what the climate will do. We can predict only generally what the weather will do. The new climate will require civilization to adapt.

''It's not the end of the world.''

Probably. Humanity, if we react quickly enough, is still in control. We broke it, we can fix it. Probably.

the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures.

How much warmer? How deep?

 

[bripat9643]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

You mean the AGW magicians invented some new excuses for their predictions being dead wrong.

 

[PMZ]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

You mean the AGW magicians invented some new excuses for their predictions being dead wrong.

We're dealing with a topic here out of your reach.

Facts.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[PMZ]

There has been no warming since 1998. Climate change is normal. It's not the end of the world.

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

''Climate change is normal.''

Cancer is normal too. Merely undesirable. And caused by different things. Fortunately the condition that burning fossil fuels is recreating has been here before and has been studied. The pre Carboniferous climate. So we know in general what the climate will do. We can predict only generally what the weather will do. The new climate will require civilization to adapt.

''It's not the end of the world.''

Probably. Humanity, if we react quickly enough, is still in control. We broke it, we can fix it. Probably.

the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures.

How much warmer? How deep?

Use your science. Oh, excuse me. You have none.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[bripat9643]

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

You mean the AGW magicians invented some new excuses for their predictions being dead wrong.

We're dealing with a topic here out of your reach.

Facts.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

Your pretensions of superior knowledge are hysterical!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

'' There has been no warming since 1998.''

Just not true. The rate of warming has slowed. That's been studied and determined to be due to how the world warms, the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures. That is temporary as the only physical resolution to higher GHG concentrations are higher surface temperatures.

''Climate change is normal.''

Cancer is normal too. Merely undesirable. And caused by different things. Fortunately the condition that burning fossil fuels is recreating has been here before and has been studied. The pre Carboniferous climate. So we know in general what the climate will do. We can predict only generally what the weather will do. The new climate will require civilization to adapt.

''It's not the end of the world.''

Probably. Humanity, if we react quickly enough, is still in control. We broke it, we can fix it. Probably.

the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures.

How much warmer? How deep?

Use your science. Oh, excuse me. You have none.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

Run away from your silly claims, again.

 

[PMZ]

the current status being warmer deep ocean temperatures.

How much warmer? How deep?

Use your science. Oh, excuse me. You have none.

Run away from your silly claims, again.

Makes you wish that you had some science, doesn't it?
Making claims without facts is a tough position to be in except if you're talking politics. Then, it's an advantage.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Use your science. Oh, excuse me. You have none.

Run away from your silly claims, again.

Makes you wish that you had some science, doesn't it?
Making claims without facts is a tough position to be in except if you're talking politics. Then, it's an advantage.

It's been an advantage for Al Gore.

Let me know when you find how much warmer and how deep.

 

[PMZ]

Run away from your silly claims, again.

Makes you wish that you had some science, doesn't it?
Making claims without facts is a tough position to be in except if you're talking politics. Then, it's an advantage.

It's been an advantage for Al Gore.

Let me know when you find how much warmer and how deep.

I know learning is hard for you but here's a start. Maybe if you lay down some of the pain will be alleviated.

From http://news.discovery.com/earth/oceans/deep-oceans-warming-at-alarming-rate-130711.htm

Despite mixed signals from warming ocean surface waters, a new re-analysis of data from the depths suggests dramatic warming of the deep sea is underway because of anthropogenic climate change. The scientists report that the deep seas are taking in more heat than expected, which is taking some of the warming off the Earth’s surface, but it will not do so forever.

"Some of the heat (from human-caused global warming) is going into melting sea ice and heating the surface, but the bulk is going into the oceans,” said climate researcher Kevin Trenberth of the National Center for Atmospheric Research, a coauthor on a new research paper reporting on the deep ocean warming in the journal Geophysical Research Letters.
How Global Warming Will Change Your Life

The study involved the bringing together of a diverse suite of data, ranging from satellite measurements of the surface waters to ship observations at all depths, instruments mounted on elephant seals, ARGO profilers (a large collection of small, drifting-robotic probes deployed worldwide), and data-gathering instruments moored in place. The data includes temperature, salinity, depth, and altimetry of the ocean surface, going back decades.
Ocean heat content from zero to 300 meters deep (grey), 700 meters deep (blue), and total depth (violet). The vertical colored bars indicate a two year interval following volcanic eruptions with a six month and the 1997–1998 El Niño event. On lower right, the linear slopes for a set of global heating rates is given.


Piecing together different kinds of data from different times and sometimes from sparse data sets was the key challenge, Trenberth explains, but that is the specialty of his coauthors at the European Centre for Medium Range Weather Forecasts in the U.K

“They have one of the most sophisticated data assimilation systems,” Trenberth said. That has allowed for a new view of not only how the deep sea is heating up, but how winds and El Niño events play into it all.

Winds blowing on the oceans can drive water into the deep ocean as well as cause upwelling of deep waters, which can release massive amounts of heat. The 1998 El Niño year, for instance, was the hottest on record because the oceans were releasing a lot of heat from the ocean into the atmosphere, Trenberth explained to DNews.
Think the Planet Isn't Warming? Check the Ocean: Analysis

The new re-analysis of ocean data is not the last word on what's happening in the deep seas, but the best estimate of what is happening.

“It's more than speculation and suggestion,” agrees climate scientist Gavin Schmidt of NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, “and it's probably right to a reasonable degree. The fact of the matter is we'll never be able to get data from below 400 meters in the middle of the Pacific Ocean” because there is not enough money invested in ocean sensors to cover such places. “So we have to use physics to fill in the gaps.”

The bottom line, says Trenberth is that the heat of global warming is going to different places. “So global warming is continuing even though it’s not always manifested as a strong surface temperature increase. It’s just manifesting itself in different ways.”

 

[edthecynic]

There is no global warming. Not since 1998. And climate change is natural. .

And the mindless drones parrot their programming. It's amazing how many fools will repeat any bullshit they are fed by GOP hate media without even bothering to fact check it!!

So please explain how the decade following 1998 was the warmest in the history of direct instrument measurement if warming STOPPED in 1998??????

Past decade hottest on record, marked by extremes: UN | Fox News

The first decade of the 21st century was the hottest on record, marked by unprecedented climate and weather extremes that killed more than 370,000 people, the United Nations weather agency said Wednesday.
The period from 2001 to 2010 was the warmest decade for both hemispheres since records began in 1850, was the second-wettest since 1901 and saw the most tropical cyclones since 1855, the World Meteorological Organization said in a new report.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Makes you wish that you had some science, doesn't it?
Making claims without facts is a tough position to be in except if you're talking politics. Then, it's an advantage.

It's been an advantage for Al Gore.

Let me know when you find how much warmer and how deep.

I know learning is hard for you but here's a start. Maybe if you lay down some of the pain will be alleviated.

From Deep Oceans Warming at Alarming Rate : Discovery News

Despite mixed signals from warming ocean surface waters, a new re-analysis of data from the depths suggests dramatic warming of the deep sea is underway because of anthropogenic climate change. The scientists report that the deep seas are taking in more heat than expected, which is taking some of the warming off the Earth’s surface, but it will not do so forever.

"Some of the heat (from human-caused global warming) is going into melting sea ice and heating the surface, but the bulk is going into the oceans,” said climate researcher Kevin Trenberth of the National Center for Atmospheric Research, a coauthor on a new research paper reporting on the deep ocean warming in the journal Geophysical Research Letters.
How Global Warming Will Change Your Life

The study involved the bringing together of a diverse suite of data, ranging from satellite measurements of the surface waters to ship observations at all depths, instruments mounted on elephant seals, ARGO profilers (a large collection of small, drifting-robotic probes deployed worldwide), and data-gathering instruments moored in place. The data includes temperature, salinity, depth, and altimetry of the ocean surface, going back decades.
Ocean heat content from zero to 300 meters deep (grey), 700 meters deep (blue), and total depth (violet). The vertical colored bars indicate a two year interval following volcanic eruptions with a six month and the 1997–1998 El Niño event. On lower right, the linear slopes for a set of global heating rates is given.


Piecing together different kinds of data from different times and sometimes from sparse data sets was the key challenge, Trenberth explains, but that is the specialty of his coauthors at the European Centre for Medium Range Weather Forecasts in the U.K

“They have one of the most sophisticated data assimilation systems,” Trenberth said. That has allowed for a new view of not only how the deep sea is heating up, but how winds and El Niño events play into it all.

Winds blowing on the oceans can drive water into the deep ocean as well as cause upwelling of deep waters, which can release massive amounts of heat. The 1998 El Niño year, for instance, was the hottest on record because the oceans were releasing a lot of heat from the ocean into the atmosphere, Trenberth explained to DNews.
Think the Planet Isn't Warming? Check the Ocean: Analysis

The new re-analysis of ocean data is not the last word on what's happening in the deep seas, but the best estimate of what is happening.

“It's more than speculation and suggestion,” agrees climate scientist Gavin Schmidt of NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, “and it's probably right to a reasonable degree. The fact of the matter is we'll never be able to get data from below 400 meters in the middle of the Pacific Ocean” because there is not enough money invested in ocean sensors to cover such places. “So we have to use physics to fill in the gaps.”

The bottom line, says Trenberth is that the heat of global warming is going to different places. “So global warming is continuing even though it’s not always manifested as a strong surface temperature increase. It’s just manifesting itself in different ways.”

I took your advice, but the pain of your ignorance remains unchanged.

Thanks for the awesome link. There was one tiny thing missing, temperature.
Thanks for the laugh.