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Gov't IS capturedMy attitude in life has been that no amount of beat-down is going to keep me down.
It's how I've survived for 60 years.
You covet the riches of others, I build strength in my own riches. Which, BTW, do not include money.
I agree.
Every time I see a thread on the rich and how they have made all their money on the backs of the middle class I want to LMAO.
All I see from the posters is a bunch of jealous fucks who wish they were all rich.
I too have my own wealth and it ain't money baby.
This isn't about how the rich made their money on the backs of the middle class.
This is about how the government colludes (somewhat unknowingly) with big business to create barriers to entry.
This thread has turned into the same stupid light beer commercial every other thread turns into.
Don't hate the rich.
Hate the Govt. and it tax loopholes, tax breaks and everything else they offer companies and the rich.
Don't know about you but if I were rich I'd take every advantage I could get. Just human nature.
Gov't IS captured by money, how do we fix that? Oh right get money out of politics and start governing FOR the people again, NOT the top 1/10th of 1% of US
Sure and get rid of the freeloaders living off the taxpayers.
It would be nirvana then.
I knew the inherited part would come up.MOST of the uber wealthy, like Trump and Romney, INHERITED their wealth.
THEY DID NOT WORK FOR IT.
THEY DID NOT EARN IT.
Yes there are exceptions such as Jobs who created wildly successful companies.
But they are a distinct minority when it comes to the super rich club.
Most of the wealthy inherited it.
I don't believe I am jealous.
I retired when I was 54.
I live in a gated community with private security.
I've lived a damn good life but I was one of the LUCKY ones.
========
This shows some serious jealousy on your part.Oh let's see what do the rich receive that the poorer people don't?
How about gated estates with their private security?
How about yachts?
How about Around the World Cruises for their whole family?
How about private Chefs and Dieticians who work ONLY for their family?
How many of those things DO YOU HAVE?
========
please list the items in society that the rich are receiving in greater quantities than those that make less.
Try to keep it to real tangible assets.
Gated estate with private security. They pay for that with money they earned from working
yachts? they payed for that with money they earned from working
Cruises? they paid for that with money they earned from working
Chefs? I think they paid for that with money the earned from working.
See a common thing here?
but, did they pay to have that estate built? do the pay someone to maintain it? pay for the security?
Did someone go to work and build that yacht? how about all the people that work at factories that supply components for that yacht
How many people are employed by Cruise lines that are collecting a paycheck because some people can afford to travel.
Do you think the Chef makes more than he would at McDonalds?
These are not things provided by society, these are things that help society by putting people to work in the respective industries.
God bless the rich guys that can afford to support all of these people and keep them employed.
Try again, you failed to show anything with substance.
so tell me, what is it about someone that makes them think they have any right to someone elses money?
between savings, a couple (weak) investments and property I will leave better than a million in net worth to my daughter when I die, why does someone like Pooky in the ghetto that never did a damn thing in life have more or even any claim to that money over my own daughter?
As far as what Trump inherited? its a far cry less than what he has today, so obviously he earned what he has.
Jealousy is a terrible thing
oh, and I semi retired at 46, went to part time just to keep busy, I just last month retired at 55 and am back into college on a full time basis. You see, I'm tired of working in the field Ive been in since the early 80s, so Im not doing it any more, however I cant deal with not working so Im going to complete my Psych degree and see what I can do with that.
I guess you and I don't deserve anything we have either since we most likely have not worked for it.
Gov't IS capturedI agree.
Every time I see a thread on the rich and how they have made all their money on the backs of the middle class I want to LMAO.
All I see from the posters is a bunch of jealous fucks who wish they were all rich.
I too have my own wealth and it ain't money baby.
This isn't about how the rich made their money on the backs of the middle class.
This is about how the government colludes (somewhat unknowingly) with big business to create barriers to entry.
This thread has turned into the same stupid light beer commercial every other thread turns into.
Don't hate the rich.
Hate the Govt. and it tax loopholes, tax breaks and everything else they offer companies and the rich.
Don't know about you but if I were rich I'd take every advantage I could get. Just human nature.
Gov't IS captured by money, how do we fix that? Oh right get money out of politics and start governing FOR the people again, NOT the top 1/10th of 1% of US
Sure and get rid of the freeloaders living off the taxpayers.
It would be nirvana then.
How many of them are there?
I knew the inherited part would come up.MOST of the uber wealthy, like Trump and Romney, INHERITED their wealth.
THEY DID NOT WORK FOR IT.
THEY DID NOT EARN IT.
Yes there are exceptions such as Jobs who created wildly successful companies.
But they are a distinct minority when it comes to the super rich club.
Most of the wealthy inherited it.
I don't believe I am jealous.
I retired when I was 54.
I live in a gated community with private security.
I've lived a damn good life but I was one of the LUCKY ones.
========
This shows some serious jealousy on your part.Oh let's see what do the rich receive that the poorer people don't?
How about gated estates with their private security?
How about yachts?
How about Around the World Cruises for their whole family?
How about private Chefs and Dieticians who work ONLY for their family?
How many of those things DO YOU HAVE?
========
please list the items in society that the rich are receiving in greater quantities than those that make less.
Try to keep it to real tangible assets.
Gated estate with private security. They pay for that with money they earned from working
yachts? they payed for that with money they earned from working
Cruises? they paid for that with money they earned from working
Chefs? I think they paid for that with money the earned from working.
See a common thing here?
but, did they pay to have that estate built? do the pay someone to maintain it? pay for the security?
Did someone go to work and build that yacht? how about all the people that work at factories that supply components for that yacht
How many people are employed by Cruise lines that are collecting a paycheck because some people can afford to travel.
Do you think the Chef makes more than he would at McDonalds?
These are not things provided by society, these are things that help society by putting people to work in the respective industries.
God bless the rich guys that can afford to support all of these people and keep them employed.
Try again, you failed to show anything with substance.
so tell me, what is it about someone that makes them think they have any right to someone elses money?
between savings, a couple (weak) investments and property I will leave better than a million in net worth to my daughter when I die, why does someone like Pooky in the ghetto that never did a damn thing in life have more or even any claim to that money over my own daughter?
As far as what Trump inherited? its a far cry less than what he has today, so obviously he earned what he has.
Jealousy is a terrible thing
oh, and I semi retired at 46, went to part time just to keep busy, I just last month retired at 55 and am back into college on a full time basis. You see, I'm tired of working in the field Ive been in since the early 80s, so Im not doing it any more, however I cant deal with not working so Im going to complete my Psych degree and see what I can do with that.
I guess you and I don't deserve anything we have either since we most likely have not worked for it.
DUMBFUK, YOU'D OWE NOTHING. You could have an estate of $5.4+ million EACH (HUBBY/WIFE) AND NOT OWE A PENNY
Walton/Kochs however, the 6 of 10 richest people in the US, inherited their money AND work to gut the safety nets and lower wages fop the workers!
Build a res
If the 1%'ers get 80% of the nations income they should pay 80% of the taxes.
Each income level should pay the same percentage in taxes( as a group ... not individuals ) that they get of the nations income.
If a group gets 80% of the income they pay 80% of the taxes it takes to run the country.
If a group gets 10% of the income they pay 10% of the taxes it takes to run the country.
The wealthy receive far more FROM society therefore they owe more TO society.
What could be more fair than that?
========
All men are created equal, and that means they should have equal protection, equal taxes and equal opportunity to either excel or fail.
you can't claim equality if you start to punish someone simply because they took the initiative to succeed in life.
Besides, today its those that make a million, when that fails to supply enough revenue it will be those that make over 500k, when that fails it might be 250, then 100 then those 30 or 40 people that are still middle class and not in poverty.
Please provide the income distribution as you see it.
Right now, something like 45% of the people in this country pay no taxes. They have SOME income. According to your model (even if it were only 2%), they should be paying 2% of the taxes.
And I agree.
On second thought, don't go back to school. Just get a fucking job.
I do have a job.
It pays well and I have my own insurance.
I have many friends who try to start small businesses and the government has made it very tough for them.
That is government along with the wealthy class.
I don't believe the wealthy class does this maliciously. I think they simply see it as business.
Starting a small business is easy. Unless you can be specific about how tha government made it tough for your friends, you are guilty of bullshit again.
I know people who have a local dairy.
They had it at the size they wanted. The cost of regulation (selling milk) forced them to expand so they could cover the costs of running it through an economy of scale.
I want safe milk as much as the next guy. They didn't really wind up doing much more to protect milk. They just had a ton of legal requirements (i.e. paperwork).
They expanded buy buying out some other dairies that simply tossed in the towel.
Good job FDA !
I don't have figures for how many are in each income grouping.
That's for the statisticians to figure out. That's what they get paid for.
But we currently have different levels of taxation according to how much Adjusted Gross Income a person has.
Someone with more experience than I would have to figure how many income groupings and where to draw the demarcation lines.
But we constantly see things like " the top 1% gets 80% of the wealth ".
It shouldn't be too difficult to determine who the top 1% and 10% are.
Just as in Trump's plan where he says the couples with below 50K would pay nothing, they would draw up groups based on income level ( gross not adjusted gross ) I would take away all deductions.
No deductions for anyone ... well possibly one for charitable contributions.
But the people should pay the same percentage of the cost to run the country as their income level gets of the national income.
If they are super rich and get 80% they should pay 80% of the cost to run the country, they get 80% of the wealth so why shouldn't they pay 80% of the costs. As a group, individual tax could vary. Not everyone with say $50 million gross income would pay the same amount, because of the charitable deduction and also very few would have exactly the same income. But everyone in the group would have between say 70 - 80 % of the nations total income. And that group, as a group, should pay 80% of the nation's bills.
This would follow right down the line and the bottom income levels might well end up paying only 2% as a group and the group might be everyone with income below 30K -- just as an example.
I'm not a statistician nor a math whiz --- just a thinker.
If 10 people go to dinner and one is a pro football player and he orders champagne and filet mignon and the others order different dinners according to what they feel they can afford and one guy just gets a hamburger ... shouldn't the football player pay more than the others? Of course he would ... they would never divide the check into 10 and everyone pay the same because they didn't all get the same.
========
Please provide the income distribution as you see it.
Right now, something like 45% of the people in this country pay no taxes. They have SOME income. According to your model (even if it were only 2%), they should be paying 2% of the taxes.
And I agree.
I love this question.
why does the left VOTE FOR WEALTY to be their masters?
Seven of the top ten RICHEST member's of congress, DEMOCRATS
You would think they would get tired of asking this stupid question
You sure do display a lot of anger for someone who has been so successful.
You post the same kind of crap that gas station attendant Republicans do.
========
MOST of the uber wealthy, like Trump and Romney, INHERITED their wealth.
THEY DID NOT WORK FOR IT.
THEY DID NOT EARN IT.
Yes there are exceptions such as Jobs who created wildly successful companies.
But they are a distinct minority when it comes to the super rich club.
Most of the wealthy inherited it.
I don't believe I am jealous.
I retired when I was 54.
I live in a gated community with private security.
I've lived a damn good life but I was one of the LUCKY ones.
========
Private property has always been at the heart of this nation.
You want to take that from them. They'll just give it away early.
We don't need to take it. We need to allow people a chance to compete for it.
I watched a show the other night where a government asshole said,when confronted with the all the regs that were killing small businesses in one area......."They don't have a very good business model".
I would have decked the guy if I could have gotten at him.
Gov't IS capturedMy attitude in life has been that no amount of beat-down is going to keep me down.
It's how I've survived for 60 years.
You covet the riches of others, I build strength in my own riches. Which, BTW, do not include money.
I agree.
Every time I see a thread on the rich and how they have made all their money on the backs of the middle class I want to LMAO.
All I see from the posters is a bunch of jealous fucks who wish they were all rich.
I too have my own wealth and it ain't money baby.
This isn't about how the rich made their money on the backs of the middle class.
This is about how the government colludes (somewhat unknowingly) with big business to create barriers to entry.
This thread has turned into the same stupid light beer commercial every other thread turns into.
Don't hate the rich.
Hate the Govt. and it tax loopholes, tax breaks and everything else they offer companies and the rich.
Don't know about you but if I were rich I'd take every advantage I could get. Just human nature.
Gov't IS captured by money, how do we fix that? Oh right get money out of politics and start governing FOR the people again, NOT the top 1/10th of 1% of US
Sure and get rid of the freeloaders living off the taxpayers.
It would be nirvana then.
Why does the left defend the sloths?Thom Hartmann: How America Killed Its Middle Class
Not a big fan of Alternet.....but this one makes a statement I think begs a question.
Piketty is right, especially about the importance of high marginal tax rates and inheritance taxes being necessary for the creation of a middle class that includes working-class people. Progressive taxation, when done correctly, pushes wages down to working people and reduces the incentives for the very rich to pillage their companies or rip off their workers. After all, why take another billion when 91 percent of it just going to be paid in taxes?
This is the main reason why, when GM was our largest employer and our working class were also in the middle class, CEOs only took home 30 times what working people did. The top tax rate for all the time America's middle class was created was between 74 and 91 percent. Until, of course, Reagan dropped it to 28 percent and working people moved from the middle class to becoming the working poor.
#############################
So, as we continue to let the rich just go nuts...what is it that isn't there to prevent them.
Why does the far right vote to protect the interest of the rich ?
The answer lies, in part, in the fact that the far left is no better. First, they suck off the rich like others.
Next, they won't make a rational case. They need conservatives to join them. And yet they, like some of the assholes on this board, do nothing but antagonize them.
And the rich just eat it up......
######################################
This thread originally got moved to Europe because I led in with an article about the European middle class.
But the comparison is bright as the day is long.
I bash the left.
I bash the right.
Regardless, this is a huge issue in my mind.
Now, if the left starts squawking about how the rich screw them over...I'd ask how they get away with it. They only get away with it because the government protects them.
The right yells...hands off. But this article flies in the face of that.
The more complex discussion is around the formation and maintenance of the middle class.
Somehow, the left things Obama will save it while he and Reid (a very wealthy Reid) are only adding to wage compression.
In right wing world, Obama should've fixed 30+ years of RESULTS of right wing think tank policy (think Ronnie's NAFTA, tax cuts for the rich, amnesty, etc)...
um his motto was "change" you mindless moron.; why shouldnte we have believed him???
I don't believe you could be more wrong if you tried.
Federal contracts, by law, get spread out throughout the community.
Construction contracts employ many smaller contractors and sub-contractors.
Even things like contracts to supply forms and paper get divided up among many companies.
You have no phucking idea what you are talking about.
But then, you're a right winger so why would we expect any better?
========
But, from there, there needs to be close scrutiny of how this money makes it's way "back into the system". When we pay for infrastructure, who gets those bids ? Big companies with high paid CEO's. Essentially, more wealth distribution back into the hands of the rich.
The contracts and legal issues don't allow small guys to play. The deck is already stacked in the favor of the rich.
How am I a right winger. Please explain the basis of that statement ?
Let's see it.
C'mon Arizona Willie ....lets see your proof.
You moron.
Would a right winger start this thread ?
Idiot.
The idiot right winger who started this thread plays a "moderate" about 70% of the time,but is NEVER honest when the rubber hits the road!
How could the "job creators" who haven't had this low of a SUSTAINED tax "burden" (effective) since before the GOP's great depression, haven't created tens of millions jobs the past 15 years?
you conflate total tax burden and make a case that others arent paying enough federal income tax. it's an apples and oranges comparison and you do it every day here
you need to STFU bout others not being honest when the rubber hits the road
\I love this question.
why does the left VOTE FOR WEALTY to be their masters?
Seven of the top ten RICHEST member's of congress, DEMOCRATS
You would think they would get tired of asking this stupid question
somehow left-wing losers think their own filthy riches dont count because they are ranting about the wealth of others
libs are mental-cases
I know it. they've swallowed that line of how Democrats are for the little people. well how easy is that to be when it's NOT THEIR MONEY they are promising everyone in their base. they keep their monies in their offshore accounts. look at the Clintons. 160MILLON dollars since Billy boy left the Presidency
poor idiot
left-wing losers insist we are in good times out of one side of their mouths; cry food is being taken away from people that really need it; all 13 MILLION MORE ON FOOD STAMPS UNDER OBAMA
anyone else thinks he might just spend too much time blowing to start with?anybody else think Dad2Three is about to blow a gasket???
