Why I don't believe in God

[Mudda]

I really don't see much difference between what ancient people believed and the religious beliefs that we see today except that, of course, they have toned down their "rituals." Most Christians would abide by the NT but not the OT. The belief system and how it developed, IMO, is pretty much the same. I think all gods were created by men to explain away things they couldn't understand and things that seemed "unbelievable," like the earth opening up and swallowing things during an earthquake, or a Tsunami washing away entire villages and towns and killing everyone.

But they didn't invent something imaginary "to explain away things they couldn't understand" because we just went through how utterly crazy that would be. You're not following your own logic here.

No, that was about a 100 dollar bill suddenly appearing in my purse. They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

Yes!!!!

Because we just went through how you'd be a crazy person to do that. Are you not following?

There is much historical evidence that people did just that! I don't really know why you keep arguing this point. It has been settled.

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

 

[Boss]

Why do you think they burned people for being "witches" and other such things.

Again... because human beings are spiritually-connected creatures who have strong spiritual awareness. It doesn't mean we are correct in our perception of our spirituality... just that we do have it.

But witches were fake, so we were satisfying our fake spirituality? Ok, I'll agree with that.

What do you mean by "fake" ??? Because the usage of the word indicates something was deliberately staged and I don't believe people who believed or even practiced witchcraft were faking it. I think they really did believe it. Were they correct? No, but it doesn't mean they didn't think they were.

 

[Boss]

But they didn't invent something imaginary "to explain away things they couldn't understand" because we just went through how utterly crazy that would be. You're not following your own logic here.

No, that was about a 100 dollar bill suddenly appearing in my purse. They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

Yes!!!!

Because we just went through how you'd be a crazy person to do that. Are you not following?

There is much historical evidence that people did just that! I don't really know why you keep arguing this point. It has been settled.

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

 

[Mudda]

Why do you think they burned people for being "witches" and other such things.

Again... because human beings are spiritually-connected creatures who have strong spiritual awareness. It doesn't mean we are correct in our perception of our spirituality... just that we do have it.

But witches were fake, so we were satisfying our fake spirituality? Ok, I'll agree with that.

What do you mean by "fake" ??? Because the usage of the word indicates something was deliberately staged and I don't believe people who believed or even practiced witchcraft were faking it. I think they really did believe it. Were they correct? No, but it doesn't mean they didn't think they were.

Fake witches, fake spirituality, because people were pretty ignorant back then. That you believe something that's fake is real doesn't change the equation. And it would have been faked on purpose since self proclaimed witches knew that they couldn't conjure up squat.

 

[Mudda]

No, that was about a 100 dollar bill suddenly appearing in my purse. They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

Yes!!!!

Because we just went through how you'd be a crazy person to do that. Are you not following?

There is much historical evidence that people did just that! I don't really know why you keep arguing this point. It has been settled.

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

 

[Boss]

Why do you think they burned people for being "witches" and other such things.

Again... because human beings are spiritually-connected creatures who have strong spiritual awareness. It doesn't mean we are correct in our perception of our spirituality... just that we do have it.

But witches were fake, so we were satisfying our fake spirituality? Ok, I'll agree with that.

What do you mean by "fake" ??? Because the usage of the word indicates something was deliberately staged and I don't believe people who believed or even practiced witchcraft were faking it. I think they really did believe it. Were they correct? No, but it doesn't mean they didn't think they were.

Fake witches, fake spirituality, because people were pretty ignorant back then. That you believe something that's fake is real doesn't change the equation. And it would have been faked on purpose since self proclaimed witches knew that they couldn't conjure up squat.

People are pretty ignorant today.

I'm not arguing that witches are real or that any incarnation of god is real. Never have. Human spirituality is real because you keep presenting me evidence of it. Over and over again. The fact that our spirituality leads us to the wrong conclusions is what doesn't change the equation.

 

[Boss]

They most certainly did make things up to explain away things they could not understand. Are you denying this fact?

Yes!!!!

Because we just went through how you'd be a crazy person to do that. Are you not following?

There is much historical evidence that people did just that! I don't really know why you keep arguing this point. It has been settled.

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

How would you create God? What is God made of?

 

[Mudda]

There is much historical evidence that people did just that! I don't really know why you keep arguing this point. It has been settled.

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

How would you create God? What is God made of?

I didn't invent the invisible Big Guy, but I guess I'd have to make him... well... invisible. He's made up of whatever invisible is made up of.

 

[Mudda]

Why do you think they burned people for being "witches" and other such things.

Again... because human beings are spiritually-connected creatures who have strong spiritual awareness. It doesn't mean we are correct in our perception of our spirituality... just that we do have it.

But witches were fake, so we were satisfying our fake spirituality? Ok, I'll agree with that.

What do you mean by "fake" ??? Because the usage of the word indicates something was deliberately staged and I don't believe people who believed or even practiced witchcraft were faking it. I think they really did believe it. Were they correct? No, but it doesn't mean they didn't think they were.

Fake witches, fake spirituality, because people were pretty ignorant back then. That you believe something that's fake is real doesn't change the equation. And it would have been faked on purpose since self proclaimed witches knew that they couldn't conjure up squat.

People are pretty ignorant today.

I'm not arguing that witches are real or that any incarnation of god is real. Never have. Human spirituality is real because you keep presenting me evidence of it. Over and over again. The fact that our spirituality leads us to the wrong conclusions is what doesn't change the equation.

That people invented spirituality and think it's real doesn't make it so. Only a scientific method can give it any legitimacy. The rest is all hot air.

 

[Boss]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

 

[Boss]

Chris, there is NO such historical evidence. No, it has certainly NOT been settled. I hear it CLAIMED a lot... all the time, as a matter of fact. I've never seen one single shred of evidence to support this OPINION.

But again... We just went through an example of exactly what you claim happened. If you find a $100 bill in your purse, you do NOT create some imaginary explanation to satisfy your puzzlement. Humans most certainly did not imagine something to explain the unexplained. It doesn't make rational sense. Creating imaginary entities doesn't help explain things or console you in any way. You recognized this and said it would be crazy to do that... yet that is exactly what you believe happened.

You say, oh I'm talking about a different scenario but it's equally crazy regardless of the scenario.

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

How would you create God? What is God made of?

I didn't invent the invisible Big Guy, but I guess I'd have to make him... well... invisible. He's made up of whatever invisible is made up of.

Dark Matter?

 

[Mudda]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

 

[Mudda]

Creating imaginary entities helped humans explain and not fear the world and universe around them.

Again just as I told Chris... it's a stupid notion. I understand it's what you think, I've heard it a million times and don't need it repeated. I get the concept... it doesn't make rational sense. We do not create imaginary things to explain what we cannot explain.. .we just fucking don't unless we're mental patients. Now you can SAY we did... you can BELIEVE we did... but you've not convinced me and you've not shown a damn bit of evidence to support your theory and I predict you can't.

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

How would you create God? What is God made of?

I didn't invent the invisible Big Guy, but I guess I'd have to make him... well... invisible. He's made up of whatever invisible is made up of.

Dark Matter?

 

[Boss]

That people invented spirituality and think it's real doesn't make it so. Only a scientific method can give it any legitimacy. The rest is all hot air.

And you are free to believe whatever your little ol' heart desires, baby! That also doesn't make it so.

Physical science is of absolutely no use in examining spiritual things. Two different types of nature.

We DO know that human beings have been spiritually-driven creatures for all their known civilized existence. The fossil records don't lie. If you are a believer in Darwinian theory, it is a big glaring conflict if this attribute is completely meaningless. No other living organism we have ever studied exhibits fundamental behaviors without a purpose and reason important to the species. If you can find an example to prove me wrong, I welcome it.

We must conclude, human spirituality exists and the attribute is of fundamental importance to the species. That does not prove a deity exists.

 

[Boss]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

 

[Mudda]

That people invented spirituality and think it's real doesn't make it so. Only a scientific method can give it any legitimacy. The rest is all hot air.

And you are free to believe whatever your little ol' heart desires, baby! That also doesn't make it so.

Physical science is of absolutely no use in examining spiritual things. Two different types of nature.

We DO know that human beings have been spiritually-driven creatures for all their known civilized existence. The fossil records don't lie. If you are a believer in Darwinian theory, it is a big glaring conflict if this attribute is completely meaningless. No other living organism we have ever studied exhibits fundamental behaviors without a purpose and reason important to the species. If you can find an example to prove me wrong, I welcome it.

We must conclude, human spirituality exists and the attribute is of fundamental importance to the species. That does not prove a deity exists.

The earliest "gods" were extra terrestrials. They were not spiritual beings. Learn your history.

 

[Mudda]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

There is a rational explanation to spirituality: to explain the unexplainable. Built on faith, the belief in the unprovable.

 

[OZman]

We DO know that human beings have been spiritually-driven creatures for all their known civilized existence.

Are you sure about that? Would you consider the idea that man was superstitious initially and then evolved to a spiritual understanding?

 

[ChrisL]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

I've given you many, many examples now. Yes, that is what people did in the old days. OBVIOUSLY.

 

[ChrisL]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

Grown people believed in ALL kinds of superstitions and still do. Exhibit A.