Why I don't believe in God

[Boss]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

There is a rational explanation to spirituality: to explain the unexplainable. Built on faith, the belief in the unprovable.

Sorry, that makes no sense. You're claiming the rational explanation is an illogical behavior.

We've gone through it... Gnomes didn't put the $100 in your wallet, that's illogical. Remember? Inventing an imaginary gnome who puts money in your wallet, doesn't explain the $100. Even if you manage to trick yourself into thinking it... still doesn't explain it. Where is the gnome? Where did it come from? Why don't you see him? You see? No explanations.

You've developed a completely baseless and illogical fallacy and you believe you've nailed it. You haven't because your explanation is illogical.

 

[Boss]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

Grown people believed in ALL kinds of superstitions and still do. Exhibit A.

Tooth Fairy isn't a superstition. It's a fairy tale. No serious adult person believes in a Tooth Fairy.

Spirituality is not superstition or it would have died out in ancient Greece. Religions can sometimes have superstitious beliefs but religions are not human spirituality, they are simply the product of it.

 

[Boss]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

I've given you many, many examples now. Yes, that is what people did in the old days. OBVIOUSLY.

Yes, and I've explained how your examples are illogical. People in the old days had the same ability to reason as people today they just lacked our knowledge. You are literally trying to say that back then, if they found $100 in their purse they would assume a gnome left it there. But they had the same capacity for reason and would have thought that to be kinda... crazy.

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

 

[Dr Grump]

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

We evolved because we learned from our mistakes.

 

[Boss]

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

We evolved because we learned from our mistakes.

Oh, but we didn't learn not to make up imaginary things to explain the unexplained?

 

[Dr Grump]

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

We evolved because we learned from our mistakes.

Oh, but we didn't learn not to make up imaginary things to explain the unexplained?

Some of us have...;o)

 

[Boss]

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

We evolved because we learned from our mistakes.

Oh, but we didn't learn not to make up imaginary things to explain the unexplained?

Some of us have...;o)

Well no, it's illogical. We can go through it again if you like. You can't imagine something that isn't real to explain what you can't explain. Doesn't work.... try it out if you don't believe me.

Look... I can't explain the origin of the universe and neither can you. We can have theories but we don't have a way to confirm if our theories are correct. So this is something we cannot explain... let's try your explanation here... We create in our minds, an invisible deity in the sky who created the universe. Have we explained the origin of the universe? No. It doesn't explain a thing.

 

[ChrisL]

We created an invisible guy we call god to explain how the universe was made and by whom. What don't you get?

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

I've given you many, many examples now. Yes, that is what people did in the old days. OBVIOUSLY.

Yes, and I've explained how your examples are illogical. People in the old days had the same ability to reason as people today they just lacked our knowledge. You are literally trying to say that back then, if they found $100 in their purse they would assume a gnome left it there. But they had the same capacity for reason and would have thought that to be kinda... crazy.

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

Arguing with you is useless. I've given you numerous examples of how people most certainly did associate natural events with supernatural activity. NUMEROUS.

 

[Boss]

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

I've given you many, many examples now. Yes, that is what people did in the old days. OBVIOUSLY.

Yes, and I've explained how your examples are illogical. People in the old days had the same ability to reason as people today they just lacked our knowledge. You are literally trying to say that back then, if they found $100 in their purse they would assume a gnome left it there. But they had the same capacity for reason and would have thought that to be kinda... crazy.

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

Arguing with you is useless. I've given you numerous examples of how people most certainly did associate natural events with supernatural activity. NUMEROUS.

No, you gave me your opinion they did this.
Unfortunately, your opinion is irrational and illogical as you admitted with the $100 in your purse example.

Now... associating events with spiritual beliefs is not the same as creating a belief to explain an event. You can understand that, correct? One precedes the other. It's perfectly logical for something you believe in to rationally be the cause of something you can't explain. So we go back to your $100 bill example, if you believe your husband is a gnome.. maybe a gnome DID leave it there? That becomes a rational explanation.

 

[Dr Grump]

Well no, it's illogical. We can go through it again if you like. You can't imagine something that isn't real to explain what you can't explain. Doesn't work.... try it out if you don't believe me.

Look... I can't explain the origin of the universe and neither can you. We can have theories but we don't have a way to confirm if our theories are correct. So this is something we cannot explain... let's try your explanation here... We create in our minds, an invisible deity in the sky who created the universe. Have we explained the origin of the universe? No. It doesn't explain a thing.

And yet people imagine a god as their answers to these inexplicable things that occur. So, are you saying you agree with me? A god is nothing more that something people have invented to explain things that can't be explained? Cool.

The Big Bang Theory pretty much explains the origins of the universe. What caused the BBT? That has yet to be answered. I'm pretty sure some supernatural being is not the answer.

 

[LittleNipper]

It doesn't make rational sense. We don't invent imaginary beings to explain anything.... ever.
It simply doesn't work because our minds know if we invented it from imagination so we can't trick our minds into believing the product of our imagination is a real thing other than in our head.

I gave Chris an example, I guess you're too lazy to go back a page and read it but here it is again...

If you found $100 in your wallet you couldn't explain... would you imagine gnomes or pixies had put it there? Chris said, of course not, that would be crazy. And I agree. You would rationalize an explanation. It would serve you NO useful purpose to imagine gnomes and pixies that didn't exist.

The same principle applies to God. We wouldn't have invented God to explain the unexplained because imaginary figments don't explain things. Gnomes and pixies don't explain the $100 in your wallet.

You have gotten this backwards. It is our human spirituality that causes us to fear what happens after we die. It is our spirituality driving human inspiration that causes us to ponder questions that need answers. It is through this same spiritual inspiration that we invented Science to explain the unexplained.

There's already a logical explanation why the C-note is there, like you forgot it was there, which is likely the case. Or a friend/partner put it there... But for the big questions like about the universe... there is no easy logical explanation, well, aside from an invisible superbeing who created everything.
And trying to say that humans just wouldn't invent imaginary figments goes against human history. Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, god...

Right... but you're proving my point. There IS a rational explanation, even if you don't know what it is. The extremely ILLOGICAL explanation is some imaginary thing you created in your mind put it there.

I never said that we couldn't imagine things that aren't real... that was never the argument.
Santa Clause is based on Saint Nicholas who was a real person. The Tooth Fairy is literally a fairy tale and I've never met any grown adult who believed in a Tooth Fairy... have you? We certainly didn't invent the Tooth Fairy as an explanation for something we didn't understand.

I've given you many, many examples now. Yes, that is what people did in the old days. OBVIOUSLY.

Yes, and I've explained how your examples are illogical. People in the old days had the same ability to reason as people today they just lacked our knowledge. You are literally trying to say that back then, if they found $100 in their purse they would assume a gnome left it there. But they had the same capacity for reason and would have thought that to be kinda... crazy.

So this is certainly NOT obvious to me and you've not explained how we evolved from crazy people who exhibited illogical behavior.

Arguing with you is useless. I've given you numerous examples of how people most certainly did associate natural events with supernatural activity. NUMEROUS.

And you don't believe that God can cause a tornado to not kill anyone sheltered in a elementary school when they are praying for protection? You don't believe that God cannot intervene to allow a little boy to walk home and make it there before a major thunder storm breaks. Terrible things happen. Presently Satan is controlling the climate because the world is under the curse of the Fall of Adam. I still associate natural events with supernatural activity. I do believe Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of grievous sin. I fully believe San Francisco has faced terrible earthquakes as a result of sin. And at the very same time people have been spared due to God's intervention and mercy. I believe that God does intervene where people repent and plead for mercy. Remember Nineveh!

 

[Boss]

Well no, it's illogical. We can go through it again if you like. You can't imagine something that isn't real to explain what you can't explain. Doesn't work.... try it out if you don't believe me.

Look... I can't explain the origin of the universe and neither can you. We can have theories but we don't have a way to confirm if our theories are correct. So this is something we cannot explain... let's try your explanation here... We create in our minds, an invisible deity in the sky who created the universe. Have we explained the origin of the universe? No. It doesn't explain a thing.

And yet people imagine a god as their answers to these inexplicable things that occur. So, are you saying you agree with me? A god is nothing more that something people have invented to explain things that can't be explained? Cool.

The Big Bang Theory pretty much explains the origins of the universe. What caused the BBT? That has yet to be answered. I'm pretty sure some supernatural being is not the answer.

And yet people imagine a god...
LOL... But they don't. That's the point. I explain it to you and you still don't seem to be getting it. You can't create something imaginary and have it explain anything... imaginary things do not explain real things.

You say the BBT is yet to be answered? Okay... let's me and you put YOUR theory to the test here and imagine some fake thing that doesn't exist to explain it! Think really hard and conjure up something in your mind, and let me know when you've come up with something from imagination that satisfies you as a valid, logical and rational explanation.

 

[Dr Grump]

[
And yet people imagine a god...
LOL... But they don't. That's the point. I explain it to you and you still don't seem to be getting it. You can't create something imaginary and have it explain anything... imaginary things do not explain real things.

You say the BBT is yet to be answered? Okay... let's me and you put YOUR theory to the test here and imagine some fake thing that doesn't exist to explain it! Think really hard and conjure up something in your mind, and let me know when you've come up with something from imagination that satisfies you as a valid, logical and rational explanation.

Of course they do. God is nothing but an imaginary being/entity/call it what you will. A god explains nothing, so in that instance you are right. A god cannot explain a real thing because a god is not real.

 

[Boss]

[
And yet people imagine a god...
LOL... But they don't. That's the point. I explain it to you and you still don't seem to be getting it. You can't create something imaginary and have it explain anything... imaginary things do not explain real things.

You say the BBT is yet to be answered? Okay... let's me and you put YOUR theory to the test here and imagine some fake thing that doesn't exist to explain it! Think really hard and conjure up something in your mind, and let me know when you've come up with something from imagination that satisfies you as a valid, logical and rational explanation.

Of course they do. God is nothing but an imaginary being/entity/call it what you will. A god explains nothing, so in that instance you are right. A god cannot explain a real thing because a god is not real.

LMAO... You're right... A god explains NOTHING!

So how can a human create an imaginary god in their head to explain the unexplained?

This is the point I am making. Your theory is invalid because it's illogical.

It is your opinion God is imaginary. However, if that is true it renders your theory illogical. We can't imagine something and have it explain anything. We both agree that is crazy and illogical. In order to have any explanatory power there has to be true belief in something real and not imaginary. Otherwise, it can't explain anything because it's illogical.

I will reiterate.... Humans, for all of their civilized existence, have shown demonstrable evidence of spirituality. Everything we have discovered in archaeology and paleontology shows us this with clear indisputable forensic evidence.

This existed BEFORE we began asking questions and trying to explain things. We didn't invent it TO explain things, it already existed. In fact, it is our human spirituality that causes us to ask questions and seek to explain the unexplained. You don't see chimps trying to figure out nuclear fission, do you?

 

[Dr Grump]

LMAO... You're right... A god explains NOTHING!

So how can a human create an imaginary god in their head to explain the unexplained?

This is the point I am making. Your theory is invalid because it's illogical.

It is your opinion God is imaginary. However, if that is true it renders your theory illogical. We can't imagine something and have it explain anything. We both agree that is crazy and illogical. In order to have any explanatory power there has to be true belief in something real and not imaginary. Otherwise, it can't explain anything because it's illogical.

I will reiterate.... Humans, for all of their civilized existence, have shown demonstrable evidence of spirituality. Everything we have discovered in archaeology and paleontology shows us this with clear indisputable forensic evidence.

This existed BEFORE we began asking questions and trying to explain things. We didn't invent it TO explain things, it already existed. In fact, it is our human spirituality that causes us to ask questions and seek to explain the unexplained. You don't see chimps trying to figure out nuclear fission, do you?

Not really with regard to God being imaginary. There is nothing to explain otherwise. What I do know, is that over time science has explained A LOT of things that couldn't be explained in the past. A belief in a God has explained nothing since the first human decided some Ju-Ju monster in the sky was responsible for thunder and lightning....

 

[Boss]

A god explains nothing,

One more point... Whether a God is real or imaginary... it still doesn't explain anything.

I have always been puzzled by this assumption. "God did it" tells me nothing... If I believe in God, then of course God did it, who else? It doesn't answer my question of HOW. It simply explains nothing. So again, we run into a problem with common sense reasoning and logic.

That seems to be a running theme with Secularists.

 

[Dr Grump]

A god explains nothing,

One more point... Whether a God is real or imaginary... it still doesn't explain anything.

I have always been puzzled by this assumption. "God did it" tells me nothing... If I believe in God, then of course God did it, who else? It doesn't answer my question of HOW. It simply explains nothing. So again, we run into a problem with common sense reasoning and logic.

That seems to be a running theme with Secularists.

I agree with a lot of what you say...

 

[Boss]

Not really with regard to God being imaginary. There is nothing to explain otherwise. What I do know, is that over time science has explained A LOT of things that couldn't be explained in the past. A belief in a God has explained nothing since the first human decided some Ju-Ju monster in the sky was responsible for thunder and lightning....

But again... You say some human "decided" a Ju-Ju monster was responsible... HOW?

We just went over how this is illogical. You can't invent something out of imagination and have it explain something real.... We both agreed above... Right????

And let me turn this back around on your science id and pose a question... Can you explain the reason why some atoms become electrically charged to create electromagnetism? Can you explain why the friction of a lightning bolt moving through our atmosphere creates sound waves to cause thunder? How about why 2 atoms of hydrogen can bond with 1 atom of oxygen to create a compound essential for life? Can you explain why our universe has 41 cosmological constants that math says is virtually impossible to calculate the odds of them all being precise?

You see; I can't answer those questions either, and neither can science.

 

[Dr Grump]

But again... You say some human "decided" a Ju-Ju monster was responsible... HOW?

We just went over how this is illogical. You can't invent something out of imagination and have it explain something real.... We both agreed above... Right????

And let me turn this back around on your science id and pose a question... Can you explain the reason why some atoms become electrically charged to create electromagnetism? Can you explain why the friction of a lightning bolt moving through our atmosphere creates sound waves to cause thunder? How about why 2 atoms of hydrogen can bond with 1 atom of oxygen to create a compound essential for life? Can you explain why our universe has 41 cosmological constants that math says is virtually impossible to calculate the odds of them all being precise?

You see; I can't answer those questions either, and neither can science.

Nobody can explain those things....yet. Just as nobody could explain how reproduction happened, or lightning, or how fish breath underwater.

But for some people to turn around and say, "some supernatural being clicked its fingers and it just happened" begs the question "but how did the clicking of the fingers cause it to happen?"

 

[Mudda]

You can't invent something out of imagination and have it explain something real.... We both agreed above... Right????

The god of war, the god of thunder, god of the sea... Man has invented a lot of imagined people to explain all kinds of things. Please take some history lessons.