Why is the thought of Iran with nukes so threatening

[Mojo2]

Given the overwhelming evidence of Iran's intentions, Israel has every right to not only attack the Iranian facilities, but to IRRADIATE them for a half-life of serveral thousand years. .

Typically I wouldn't give a shit if they were to obliterate each other out.

Unfortunately , which American prostitute is the Commander-in-chief at the time will claim that it is our "duty" to bail the Zionists out.

.

And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Genesis 12:3

 

[legaleagle_45]

Japan never offered to surrender all she offered to do was return to the start lines of 41. The Atomic Bomb and the End of World War II: A Collection of Primary Sources

Not quite correct but close. Prior to the invasion of Okinawa in April of 1945 that was the nature of the Japan peace feelers. In April the so-called "peace cabinet" headed by Suzuki came to power, and prodded by Hirohito, sought to send out different "feelers". The last of these prior to Hiroshima was well short of the unconditional surrender demanded at Potsdam and can be summarized as follows:

1.) The Japanese imperial system (not merely keeping the emperor as a figurehead) would be preserved.
2.) The Japanese would be responsible for disarming their own forces;
3.) The Japanese would handle in War Crimes trials; and either

4 a) No occupation of Japan; (Cabinet military hardliners position) or
4 b.) The Emperor would have veto power over any occupation imposed policy (position of the Cabinet "peace members).

These, of course, were totally unacceptable.

Japan was in fact totally defeated militarily. However, this military defeat failed to translate into a Japanese need to surrender until the shock of the atomic bombings hit them. Surrender was in fact unimaginable for the Japanese.

Even with the atomic bombing it took the unprecedented personal intervention of the Emperor to cast the deciding vote of an otherwise equally divided cabinet. ... and even the personal intervention of the Emperor might not have been enough considering that a coup attempt to prevent surrender from hard-line military elements was only narrowly avoided thanks to the happenstance of the final US bombing raid of the war, which overflew Tokyo, caused a blackout, and resulted in confusion on the part of the coup plotters leading to its failure.

 

[Kondor3]

So, have any of these pissant Revisionists managed to convince anybody yet, that Japan was trying to surrender when we dropped The Bomb on her, and that all we wanted to do was to impress Joe Stalin?

I've seen this before... revisionists, fifth columnists, useful tools and blithering idiots, with shit for brains and an anti-American, anti-Truth, anti-Reality, one-trick pony routine...

 

[velvtacheeze]

While the reality of US nukes scares no one?

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

 

[Kondor3]

While the reality of US nukes scares no one?

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

 

[Contumacious]

If anything, it should be the people in the region that should be upset about Iran's nuclear intentions. They have no way to hit the US. They would only have enough material for a few weapons at best, while Israel is estimated to have anywhere from 80 - 400. Russia has thousands. India and Pakistan also possess them.

I don't get why people are so concerned about Israel and Israel's security. Israel isn't the 51st state or something. They have a very capable military and intelligence apparatus of their own. If they see Iran as a threat, they will take action in accordance with their own national interest.

Unfortunately they controlled media outlets.

They are so powerful that they lied the Country to war.

The new Pentagon papers

A high-ranking military officer reveals how Defense Department extremists suppressed information and twisted the truth to drive the country to war.

.

 

[Antares]

The paranoid zionist government of Israel has manufactured the Iranian nuclear threat for financial and political reasons.

And are miffed that the U.S. government won't buy into their delusion. ...

Tell me what you know about the twelfth imam.

 

[Antares]

The whole we gotta stop Iran from getting a nuke situation is nothing more than a false pretext to invade. If you think it's anything other than that than I'm afraid that you've been taken for the fool.

First we have to put this whole thing in perspective. If you are the leader of Iran and had put together a nuke weapon, why would you bring about the certain destruction of your people by launching it at the U.S. or Israel? Wouldn't be too smart now would it? It's all nonsense if you asked me. Why should ANY nation not have a right to defend itself? How would we see it if China or Russia told us that we can't have a nuclear weapon?

Don't buy into the never ending propaganda over this issue. We have been hearing about this so called threat for at least 20 years now. They are not in the dark ages, if they truly desired to have one than I'm sure they would of already gotten one.

This has NOTHING to do with nukes. It's just the excuse we are using. It's all really about money. There are only 3 nations left that are not slaves to the Rothschild banking trust. The 3 nations without a central bank are. Iran, North Korea, Cuba.

You are a religious illterate.

 

[velvtacheeze]

While the reality of US nukes scares no one?

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

Your side tried this tactic, accusing liberals of being Chamberlains and appeasers, before the Iraq War, and it worked on the American people. But the Iraq War was a mismanaged disaster that most Americans (the non-stupid, non-conservatives) view as a mistake. Now the will of the American people for another war just isn't there, and it's the GOP's fault.

Am I saying that if Iraq gets a nuke that its the GOP's fault? Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

1. The GOP's Iraq flop-a-looza of a war has utterly changed the most Americans' minds about military involvement in the middle east. They oppose it.
2. The GOP's oafish, overly aggressive foreign policy is what has motivated Iran to try to become nuclear weapon capable. They're tying to protect themselves.

 

[Antares]

While the reality of US nukes scares no one?

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

LOL...you are wrong.

 

[velvtacheeze]

While the reality of US nukes scares no one?

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

LOL...you are wrong.

Wow, the most unconvincing reply of all time. It's a little light on the details of how I'm wrong, or what the right policy would be instead. In fact, it's totally devoid of any logical argument at all. It even starts with "LOL" , which is truly embarrassing . How old are you? Ten?

Listen, your wish for a more aggressive foreign policy lost in the Presidential election last year, and you need to get past it, kay? I'm trying to help you. Accept it, move on.

 

[Katzndogz]

A nuclear Iran scares the shit out of the entire middle east which is why the Saudis are buying bombs from Pakistan.

 

[Antares]

Great question. The answer is of course that Iran with nukes is not threatening at all. The idea that they could threaten the US with them is laughable. The idea that they want them in order to make first strikes on Israel or the US is stupid and implausible.

Conservatives' standards for an agreement with Iran on their nuclear program are too stringent for Iran to ever accept, and conservatives know this. Conservatives want war with Iran, regret they didn't start when during the Bush years, and regret that Mitt isn't the President so a war with Iran could be started now.

LOL...you are wrong.

Wow, the most unconvincing reply of all time. It's a little light on the details of how I'm wrong, or what the right policy would be instead. In fact, it's totally devoid of any logical argument at all. It even starts with "LOL" , which is truly embarrassing . How old are you? Ten?

Listen, your wish for a more aggressive foreign policy lost in the Presidential election last year, and you need to get past it, kay? I'm trying to help you. Accept it, move on.

(smile) You are simply wrong....you haven't the foggiest idea of what you speak.

Tell me what you know of the 12th Imam.

 

[Kondor3]

"...Your side tried this tactic, accusing liberals of being Chamberlains and appeasers, before the Iraq War, and it worked on the American people..."

MY side? Newsflash: I, personally, was dead-set against the Iraq War; realizing that (1) the casus belli was a crock of shit and (2) it would take our eye off the ball in Afghanistan.

The difference being that a Nuclear-Armed Theocracy is a totally different animal, and those who would draw false equivalencies between the lack of a threat posed by Iraq and the very real threat of nuclear-armed and theocratic, dogmatic, militant Iran, do no good service to their country, their culture nor The West at-large.

"...But the Iraq War was a mismanaged disaster..."

Absolutely true. We are in complete agreement.

"...that most Americans (the non-stupid, non-conservatives) view as a mistake..."

A great many people of ALL political persuasions believe that the Iraq War was a mistake.

Left, Right and Center.

Including no small number of both intelligent and stupid ones.

"...Now the will of the American people for another war just isn't there, and it's the GOP's fault..."

If Iran gets close to acquiring nukes, to match-up with their existing regional ballistic missile delivery systems, we will probably go to war again.

And America will just have to suck it up until the job is done.

"...Am I saying that if Iraq gets a nuke that its the GOP's fault? Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying..."

I agree completely that the GOP is responsible for Crying Wolf once too often in that region as a casus belli to lead us into war, and that this has had a fatiguing effect upon the American People and their national pocketbook.

But it will be the fault of whatever Party happens to have its hand at the wheel, if it allows a dogmatic, militant, martyr-complex -driven, theocratic Iran to obtain such weaponry.

Regardless of whether that Party is the Democrats or the Republicans.

Oh, and, for the record...

Your first post in this sequence was not saying that it was the GOP's fault...

Your first post in this sequence was saying that a nuclear-armed Iran was not a threat...

Huge difference...

Huge mistake...

One that you (those who think like you in this matter) cannot be allowed to make operative at present in the Real World...

The stakes are far too high to take such foolish and unnecessary chances on such things...

"...The GOP's Iraq flop-a-looza of a war has utterly changed the most Americans' minds about military involvement in the middle east.They oppose it..."

Probably not, actually; America just wants to rest-up a bit and to let its pocketbook cool off. But, if it turns out that we have to jump back in with both feet, before we were fully rested, well, chances are we'll get the job done, regardless, and then rest, safe in the knowledge that a Medieval Theocracy has had its world-class weapons of mass destruction negated before they could be deployed to the far greater injury to The West than it would suffer as a result of a preventive, preemptive war.

"...The GOP's oafish, overly aggressive foreign policy is what has motivated Iran to try to become nuclear weapon capable. They're tying to protect themselves."

Nonsense. Iran has been headed in this direction for many years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_program_of_Iran

 

[velvtacheeze]

Spare me if I find your insistence that you opposed the Iraq War dubious.

If you say you changed your mind about it, say around 2006, then I'd actually believe you. But you didn't, so I don't. Many wingnut chest thumpers like you learned their lesson around that time, although it was thousands of US troops lives too late, sadly.

Bombing Iran will not keep them from getting a nuke, and certainly not forever. In fact, not only will they have an excuse for getting a nuke if they're attacked, they'll have a reason to use it as soon as they do get one. And when Israel gets hit, there will be little sympathy for it outside of the former Confederacy. It will be rightly pointed out that Israel started the war, or demanded the US start the war. And when the war is ended with a big old mushroom cloud over Tel Aviv, then Israel will only have itself to blame.

Face it, there's just not enough fervor for another war among Americans. The right's chance for more aggression in our foreign policy lost the election in 2012. The American voter learned their lesson, and you need to too.

 

[velvtacheeze]

LOL...you are wrong.

Wow, the most unconvincing reply of all time. It's a little light on the details of how I'm wrong, or what the right policy would be instead. In fact, it's totally devoid of any logical argument at all. It even starts with "LOL" , which is truly embarrassing . How old are you? Ten?

Listen, your wish for a more aggressive foreign policy lost in the Presidential election last year, and you need to get past it, kay? I'm trying to help you. Accept it, move on.

(smile) You are simply wrong....you haven't the foggiest idea of what you speak.

Tell me what you know of the 12th Imam.

It's part of Shia Islam. Apparently some Iranians may have said he's coming any day now, so it's become the lastest lame-o excuse that American right wing chickenhawks use to try to gin up another ill-thought war in the Middle East.

Sorry, you gomers & goobers fooled America once with the Iraq War shambles. It ain't working now.

 

[deltex1]

Nothing to do with Iran.

Exactly.

Exhibit A, above, show avengers retaliating because of the US policy to meddle in the internal affairs of middle eastern nations. And its decision to finance the Holocaust of Palestinian Arabs.

.

Sooooo...all the Palestinians are dead by now??? A holocaust doesn't take that long.

 

[deltex1]

Wow, the most unconvincing reply of all time. It's a little light on the details of how I'm wrong, or what the right policy would be instead. In fact, it's totally devoid of any logical argument at all. It even starts with "LOL" , which is truly embarrassing . How old are you? Ten?

Listen, your wish for a more aggressive foreign policy lost in the Presidential election last year, and you need to get past it, kay? I'm trying to help you. Accept it, move on.

(smile) You are simply wrong....you haven't the foggiest idea of what you speak.

Tell me what you know of the 12th Imam.

It's part of Shia Islam. Apparently some Iranians may have said he's coming any day now, so it's become the lastest lame-o excuse that American right wing chickenhawks use to try to gin up another ill-thought war in the Middle East.

Sorry, you gomers & goobers fooled America once with the Iraq War shambles. It ain't working now.

Sooo...you found a way to get your head further up your ass?

 

[velvtacheeze]

The same slack jawed hicks on the right that are demanding we be more aggressive with Iran are the same roly-poly bumpkins that whine non-stop about the skyrocketing gasoline prices that result from aggressive US foreign polices in the Middle East.

We can't have your stupid wingnut wars on "mooslims" as well as cut rate gas for your gas guzzling stand-in for your microscopic penises.

 

[Kondor3]

Spare me if I find your insistence that you opposed the Iraq War dubious...

Suit yourself. It is a matter of complete indifference to me. I was on the MSNBC Politics message board in 2003 in the run-up to the invasion of Iraq, arguing against it. Once we went to war, however, I shut my mouth for some weeks, until the initial victory had been won, in order to avoid giving aid-and-comfort to the enemy in wartime.

"...If you say you changed your mind about it, say around 2006, then I'd actually believe you. But you didn't, so I don't..."

Again... doesn't faze me in the slightest.

"...Many wingnut chest thumpers like you......"

Blow it out your ass, Junior.

"...learned their lesson around that time, although it was thousands of US troops lives too late, sadly..."

They can speak for themselves. I am not one of them.

"...Bombing Iran will not keep them from getting a nuke..."

Correct. We and our friends will have to 'go in there' and sort it out. Boots on the ground. Lots of them. Hard on the heels of lots of pounding from the air.

"...It will be rightly pointed out that Israel started the war, or demanded the US start the war. And when the war is ended with a big old mushroom cloud over Tel Aviv, then Israel will only have itself to blame..."

What a complete crock of shit.

"...Face it, there's just not enough fervor for another war among Americans. The right's chance for more aggression in our foreign policy lost the election in 2012. The American voter learned their lesson, and you need to too."

Fortunately, a large percentage of the American Electorate still dwell within the domain of the Real World and understand what nuclear-armed Ayatollahs mean for The West and for the US.

The support will be there when it's truly needed.

The leadership that takes-on Iran need simply tell the truth to their people this time.

And, unlike Iraq, the Grudge Match between the US and Iran has been in-the-making since 1979...

The collective mentality towards Iran continues to be... "We still owe them one."

We held no such collective grudge towards Iraq.

Push-comes-to-shove, we will re-awaken old animosities, as one of several tactics, to drum-up support in pursuit of the present-day and necessary goal of pulling Iran's nuclear fangs before they can descend.