Will more guns create a safer society?

Personally I agree with the requirement that everyone be properly trained in the use and storage of firearms. Switzerland does so and that is a model that this nation should follow when it comes to firearms in my opinion.

Yes, others may disagree but the current situation is degenerating. Boot camp for 18 year olds might be the answer.

Well ... You provided statistics that include factors that can be further separated. The study you provided also indicated that 1 in 5 "children" between 14 and 18 had carried a firearm within the last 30 days with the intent of personal protection.

I am a firm believer that older teenagers understand what a firearm will do ... And understand what they want to do with one. Pogo and others have often commented on the gun culture and teen involvement. I am not as scared of the gun culture as I am concerned about the irresponsible gun culture.

There are some 14 year olds I would hand a firearm and go hunting with ... And some 18 year olds I wouldn't let anywhere near a firearm.

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Agreed on those points too.

But I am thinking of a long term cultural shift by requiring all 18 year olds attend boot camp. In 2 decades or so their kids will have grown up with the boot camp graduates and not have had unfettered access to firearms any longer. We aren't going to solve this problem overnight in my opinion.
 
Congress passed the Militia Act of 1792 wherein it explicitly required inspection and accounting of all firearms to be reported to the President on an annual basis. Oh, and before you go off pop and say that only applied to the militia you should understand that it applied to every male aged 18 to 45 that they must be enrolled in the militia.

Not sure why militia regulations from 1792 are important to you. Are you advocating that all male Americans from 18 to 45 maintain a fully functional, select fire, military rifle in their homes?....if you are...I would have to disagree, the 2nd amendment only says the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, it doesn't mandate ownership.....possibly the states could mandate keeping a select fire, military rifle in the home....but I would still be against making it mandatory...

Are you a right wing gun nut or something...or one of those militia types....?

The Militia Act of 1792 required that all firearms be registered with the government.

That's not true

-Geaux
 
A report was provided annually that had nothing to do with'regisration'

-Geaux

VI. And be it further enacted, That there shall be an adjutant general appointed in each state, whose duty it shall be to distribute all orders for the Commander in Chief of the State to the several corps; to attend all publick reviews, when the Commander in Chief of the State shall review the militia, or any part thereof; to obey all orders from him relative to carrying into execution, and perfecting, the system of military discipline established by this Act; to furnish blank forms of different returns that may be required; and to explain the principles of which they should be made; to receive from the several officers of the different corps throughout the state, returns of the militia under their command, reporting the actual situation of their arms, accoutrements, and ammunition, their delinquencies, and every other thing which relates to the general advancement of good order and discipline: All which, the several officers of the division, brigades, regiments, and battalions are hereby required to make in the usual manner, so that the said adjutant general may be duly furnished therewith: From all which returns be shall make proper abstracts, and by the same annually before the Commander in Chief of the State.
 
A report was provided annually that had nothing to do with'regisration'

-Geaux

VI. And be it further enacted, That there shall be an adjutant general appointed in each state, whose duty it shall be to distribute all orders for the Commander in Chief of the State to the several corps; to attend all publick reviews, when the Commander in Chief of the State shall review the militia, or any part thereof; to obey all orders from him relative to carrying into execution, and perfecting, the system of military discipline established by this Act; to furnish blank forms of different returns that may be required; and to explain the principles of which they should be made; to receive from the several officers of the different corps throughout the state, returns of the militia under their command, reporting the actual situation of their arms, accoutrements, and ammunition, their delinquencies, and every other thing which relates to the general advancement of good order and discipline: All which, the several officers of the division, brigades, regiments, and battalions are hereby required to make in the usual manner, so that the said adjutant general may be duly furnished therewith: From all which returns be shall make proper abstracts, and by the same annually before the Commander in Chief of the State.

A rose by any other name!
 
A report was provided annually that had nothing to do with'regisration'

-Geaux

VI. And be it further enacted, That there shall be an adjutant general appointed in each state, whose duty it shall be to distribute all orders for the Commander in Chief of the State to the several corps; to attend all publick reviews, when the Commander in Chief of the State shall review the militia, or any part thereof; to obey all orders from him relative to carrying into execution, and perfecting, the system of military discipline established by this Act; to furnish blank forms of different returns that may be required; and to explain the principles of which they should be made; to receive from the several officers of the different corps throughout the state, returns of the militia under their command, reporting the actual situation of their arms, accoutrements, and ammunition, their delinquencies, and every other thing which relates to the general advancement of good order and discipline: All which, the several officers of the division, brigades, regiments, and battalions are hereby required to make in the usual manner, so that the said adjutant general may be duly furnished therewith: From all which returns be shall make proper abstracts, and by the same annually before the Commander in Chief of the State.

A rose by any other name!

I think not. The report was to ensure the militias had enough weapons and ammo, not a registry for confiscation

-Geaux

The Militia Act of 1792
 
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In effect the government was requiring that (a) all guns in private hands be registered, and (b) that all males between the ages of 18 to 45 must belong to a militia.

Sorry, that's a big leap to a wrong conclusion....they were checking militia members readiness for a call up, not registering weapons....And the Bill of Rights clearly states that the right of the individual shall not be infringed.....so regardless of the militia readiness, the state and federal government could not ban the ownership of weapons....
 
Having the item gives us some benifit which off-sets that harm.

Except that studies on guns in the home prove that they increase the risks significantly, especially for children. The "benefit" is outweighed by the harm.

More children die drowning in five gallon buckets than from firearms. In fact firearms come last in child fatality rates ... And six times lower than drowning.

Maybe we should start legislation to outlaw swimming pools and eliminate a household threat six times more deadly to children than firearms ... Then we can go after cars and ATV's that are 26 times more deadly to children than firearms.

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Accidental deaths of children by firearms;

Causes of Death Accidental Firearm

Unintentional injuries from firearms represent less than two percent of all firearm deaths in the U.S. But of this two percent, children and adolescents are involved in 55% of these deaths. The majority of the injuries occur to children playing with or showing the weapons to friends. The easy availability of firearms is believed to be the number one risk factor for unintentional firearm deaths.

Homicides of children by firearms;

Causes of Death Homicide Firearm

In 2000, 1,242 children in the United States died from intentional firearm-related injuries. Homicides of children are most often murders of teens by other teens.

Youth homicides represent the greatest proportion of all firearm deaths. Each day in the U.S., firearms kill an average of 10 children and teens, even though the number of teens killed by firearms in the U.S. has dropped by 35% in the past four years. In 1999, the Youth Risk Behavior Surveillance Survey reported that almost one-fifth of the 10th and 12th graders indicated that they had carried a firearm within the previous 30 days for self-defense or to settle disputes.

Youth homicide is a serious problem in large urban areas, especially among black males. Homicides are the number one cause of death for black and Hispanic teens. Yet when socio-economic status is held constant, differences in homicide rates by race become insignificant. Major contributing factors in addition to poverty include easy access to handguns, involvement in drug and gang activity, family disruption and school failure. These homicides usually occur in connection with an argument or dispute. They almost always are committed by casual acquaintances of the same gender, race and age, using inexpensive, easily acquired handguns.

Violence prevention research has demonstrated that strategies are most effective when they identify high-risk children in their earliest years and intervene at multiple levels through collaborative community partnerships.

Sacrificing children on the NRA alter of the 2nd Amendment is something that can be prevented. We mandated airbags in vehicles in order to reduce deaths. Why can't we mandate safer firearms too? What is so sacred about a gun that it cannot be made safer?


I just came back from the eye doctor so everything is blurry....did this link state the ages of the alledged "Children" since an anti gun tactic is to group 17,18,19- 25 as "children" which means that child4en those ages are simply hard core gang members engaged in murder and crime.....

Please list the age of children and the numbers who are killed in accidental gun deaths and murder?
 
If you feel safer in France, then by all means stay in France. It's a very nice place.

Meanwhile, here in the USA, I will exercise my 2nd amendment rights.

:thup:
And I will probably never return to America. It is people like you and the other wacko rightwing, gun toting Americans who ruin America: not the blacks, not immigrants, but people like you are destroying the country.

Finally, some good news.
 
I just came back from the eye doctor so everything is blurry....did this link state the ages of the alledged "Children" since an anti gun tactic is to group 17,18,19- 25 as "children" which means that child4en those ages are simply hard core gang members engaged in murder and crime.....

Please list the age of children and the numbers who are killed in accidental gun deaths and murder?

No ... They included children as in not adults 17 and under. They also separated data by different age groups. The data was solid, although I think more factors play a part at older ages.

In a lot of cases data is just data ... And proper interpretation can exist with additional understanding. It is a matter of throwing the baby out with the bath water. Statistics can offer trends or impressions used for any reason.

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Do you realize that 6'2 300 pound thug Michael Brown will be considered a "Child" in most of those statistics....?

As would thug, Trayvon Martin.....
 
And I will probably never return to America. It is people like you and the other wacko rightwing, gun toting Americans who ruin America: not the blacks, not immigrants, but people like you are destroying the country.

So did you find a safe haven country to immigrate to ... Or did you immigrate somewhere that could use more progressive thinking to improve their society?

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Do you realize that 6'2 300 pound thug Michael Brown will be considered a "Child" in most of those statistics....?

As would thug, Trayvon Martin.....

I realize holding people accountable for their actions is far more productive than deciding what demographic they best fit.

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In effect the government was requiring that (a) all guns in private hands be registered, and (b) that all males between the ages of 18 to 45 must belong to a militia.

Sorry, that's a big leap to a wrong conclusion....they were checking militia members readiness for a call up, not registering weapons....And the Bill of Rights clearly states that the right of the individual shall not be infringed.....so regardless of the militia readiness, the state and federal government could not ban the ownership of weapons....

You fallaciously equate registration of firearms with banning of firearms. No one but you has made that erroneous claim.
 
Switzerland does so and that is a model that this nation should follow when it comes to firearms in my opinion.

So...you think the anti gunners will go for mandating that all homes in the States must have a select fire, AR-15 in them.....that would be hilarious to watch...as the anti gunner heads pop...
The study you provided also indicated that 1 in 5 "children" between 14 and 18 had carried a firearm within the last 30 days with the intent of personal protection.

What that indicates is participation in criminal activity....as in gangs....and if they are using guns as part of a gang...their "child" status is much different than little Johnny at homel, finding dads gun.....
 
You fallaciously equate registration of firearms with banning of firearms. No one but you has made that erroneous claim.

Sorry, that is the only reason to register guns...for later gun control measures, usually a ban or mandatory turn in....
 
Having the item gives us some benifit which off-sets that harm.

Except that studies on guns in the home prove that they increase the risks significantly, especially for children. The "benefit" is outweighed by the harm.

More children die drowning in five gallon buckets than from firearms. In fact firearms come last in child fatality rates ... And six times lower than drowning.

Maybe we should start legislation to outlaw swimming pools and eliminate a household threat six times more deadly to children than firearms ... Then we can go after cars and ATV's that are 26 times more deadly to children than firearms.

.

Accidental deaths of children by firearms;

Causes of Death Accidental Firearm

Unintentional injuries from firearms represent less than two percent of all firearm deaths in the U.S. But of this two percent, children and adolescents are involved in 55% of these deaths. The majority of the injuries occur to children playing with or showing the weapons to friends. The easy availability of firearms is believed to be the number one risk factor for unintentional firearm deaths.

Homicides of children by firearms;

Causes of Death Homicide Firearm

In 2000, 1,242 children in the United States died from intentional firearm-related injuries. Homicides of children are most often murders of teens by other teens.

Youth homicides represent the greatest proportion of all firearm deaths. Each day in the U.S., firearms kill an average of 10 children and teens, even though the number of teens killed by firearms in the U.S. has dropped by 35% in the past four years. In 1999, the Youth Risk Behavior Surveillance Survey reported that almost one-fifth of the 10th and 12th graders indicated that they had carried a firearm within the previous 30 days for self-defense or to settle disputes.

Youth homicide is a serious problem in large urban areas, especially among black males. Homicides are the number one cause of death for black and Hispanic teens. Yet when socio-economic status is held constant, differences in homicide rates by race become insignificant. Major contributing factors in addition to poverty include easy access to handguns, involvement in drug and gang activity, family disruption and school failure. These homicides usually occur in connection with an argument or dispute. They almost always are committed by casual acquaintances of the same gender, race and age, using inexpensive, easily acquired handguns.

Violence prevention research has demonstrated that strategies are most effective when they identify high-risk children in their earliest years and intervene at multiple levels through collaborative community partnerships.

Sacrificing children on the NRA alter of the 2nd Amendment is something that can be prevented. We mandated airbags in vehicles in order to reduce deaths. Why can't we mandate safer firearms too? What is so sacred about a gun that it cannot be made safer?


I just came back from the eye doctor so everything is blurry....did this link state the ages of the alledged "Children" since an anti gun tactic is to group 17,18,19- 25 as "children" which means that child4en those ages are simply hard core gang members engaged in murder and crime.....

Please list the age of children and the numbers who are killed in accidental gun deaths and murder?

The link only refers to children and teens. It does not specify ages.

" Each day in the U.S., firearms kill an average of 10 children and teens"
 
But I am thinking of a long term cultural shift by requiring all 18 year olds attend boot camp. In 2 decades or so their kids will have grown up with the boot camp graduates and not have had unfettered access to firearms any longer. We aren't going to solve this problem overnight in my opinion.

Yeah, Germany had a program like that....worked out well for them....
 
The link only refers to children and teens. It does not specify ages.

" Each day in the U.S., firearms kill an average of 10 children and teens"

That is the trick....I don't consider 17-25 year olds involved in gangs as "children" and that is where the majority of those deaths in that age range come from....
 
You fallaciously equate registration of firearms with banning of firearms. No one but you has made that erroneous claim.

That is an interesting assertion though ...

Not saying that government does or doesn't want to confiscate weapons ... Why would a registry be necessary? If they just wanted a list ... What would they do with the list ... What is the reason they need a list?

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Sorry, that is the only reason to register guns...for later gun control measures, usually a ban or mandatory turn in...

Your gun fetish paranoia is no reason to jeopardize the safety of hundreds of millions of American citizens.
 

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