Will we ever have single payer health care in this country?

[Rustic]

If that is the case, Social Security and Medicare are doing well, why do both have such massive unfunded liabilities?

Because we looted them to pay for tax cuts for billionaires and wars on a credit card.

Lol
Your a fucking retard if you believe that, first of all socialist entitlement programs blow away all other spending there’s no comparison. And tax cuts are just like the money was never there to begin with so shut the fuck up you moron

 

[Maxdeath]

I think the very next time the dems the presidency and both chambers of Congress we’re headed for single payer healthcare.

The biggest problem with single payer healthcare is that very few want to admit to all the problems and see it as being a free service.

 

[danielpalos]

we could solve simple poverty by solving for capitalism's natural rate of unemployment through unemployment compensation in our at-will employment States.

Socialism should nurture Capitalism within Standards, fixed by Government. Capitalism can "float" from within the ease and convenience of that form of nurture for nature.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

As usual, the zealots on both ends of this issue are behaving similarly, egotistically demanding simplistic purity, directly in the face of reason.

Many countries have already figured out that a strong public foundation keeps overall health care costs down and opens access to all citizens, which is the civilized thing to do.

They have also figured out that allowing for a free market presence allows for more choice, competition and innovation.

We already have this kind of system in place with our current public/private Medicare/Medicare Advantage/Medicare Supplement system.

But our wingers just don't want to give a goddamn inch, as usual, because they're terrified of "losing" to people they hate. Getting some of what they want ain't good enough.

Gawd, I'm still wishing our wingers would find another fucking hobby.
.

Really Mac?
So it is only "wingers" that are in the political rock throwing contest?
Only the Republicans that block, spin, obfuscate,obstruct and generally all around do nothing but throw rocks at the other side?
Democrats never do this?

As I have said repeatedly...Obamacare is a perfect example of the kind of legislation we will get from Washington. Has a great namesake, addresses no problems, in fact makes the problems worse, staggering costs and continues to grease the wheels of corporations and special interest that ride the gold train.
I would like NOTHING better than to have the shackles of HIGH premiums with STAGGERING high deductions removed from me and my wife.
WOULD LOVE IT.
However, I am not convinced a system provided by THE most corrupt, inept, inefficient and all around buffons in Washington is who should be in control of said system.
We need a fix. But that fix requires hurting corporations and special interest for the interests of the citizenry. And, as proved by Obamacare, that is NOT going to happen in our lifetimes.
Because depite abysmal approval ratings, 98% of the same fucking rats are voted in year after year.

 

[Cellblock2429]

Free market.

Ah. "Free". So you're big into "freedom".

Me too!

• I'd like to be free from paying significantly higher fees, co-pays and co-insurances because I'm also paying for those who can't or won't cover themselves.
• I'd like to be free from paying more because people who don't have access to preventive/diagnostic services, allowing their conditions to decay, which costs me more later.
• I'd like to be from sitting in a packed Emergency Room with a suffering loved one because those with no coverage are using it as their family doctor.
• I'd like to be free from seeing my business owner clients struggle to provide health insurance for their employees because they know they'll lose them to larger competitors if they don't.
• I'd like to be free from seeing under-regulated health insurers change their plans mid-stream, leaving their participants high and dry with medical bills they should not have to worry about.

For being so into "freedom", you sure are willing to be controlled.
.

/——/ No. Free market as in the home, auto and life insurance markets. Hope that helps.

Yeah, that's what we've been talking about. Car insurance.

Too funny.
.

/----/ Odd that you Progs used the car insurance analogy to defend Obozocare.

 

[Cellblock2429]

They give simplistic dipshits like yourself little bullet points to parrot because you have the intellectual bandwidth of a bumper sticker.

But there is a reality which is going to crush you submissive dumb fucks under its wheels:


]

/----/ No one gave me any talking points. I'm old enough to remember when a person could buy health insurance like car insurance - you bought it and you paid for it.

And how has that been working out as the cost of health has increased over 800 percent in the past 50 years?

I'll tell you. More and more Americans have been priced out of the market. They can't pay for insurance they can't afford.

And so all the sloganeering in the world will not stand up to the truth of that chart. Americans are getting plowed under by reality, and since the Republican plan this entire time has been to do NOTHING, then it is just a matter of time before a majority cry out for single payer.

It is the apathy of people like you which will ensure that happens.

You idiots should be asking yourselves why the GOP or Trump have not come up with a replacement for Obamacare after NINE YEARS since its enactment.

You've been fucking hoaxed. Massively hoaxed. By Trump, by McConnell, by Boehner, and by Ryan. And you STILL have not woken up to that fact.

So here comes single payer whether you like it or not, and you are as much to blame as any goddam commie Democrat.

And, once again, you don't address valid point of the argument. Once again, you and others leave out the most important aspects and facts to argue over political points than what actually is the causation of, and therefore the answer to, skyrocketing cost of healthcare insurance.

In the end, it does not matter. What matters is the fact the Republicans and Trump have offered NOTHING to solve the problem.

Meanwhile, the Democrats have been telegraphing for decades their intention to enact socialized medicine.

So it does not matter if the rising costs are caused by Martians. When one party's response to a problem is NOTHING, and the other party's plan is SOMETHING, then the American people will inevitably choose SOMETHING over NOTHING.

All caught up now?

As a result of their conditioning, the Right remains stuck in this binary, all-or-nothing, win or lose mentality, and this topic is a great example.

So if they "lose" and we end up with Single Payer, the only people they'll be able to blame is themselves.

They won't, of course.

What I wonder is whether they'll wish they had compromised on this.
.

/----/ Pacific Research Institute | Socialized medicine a global failure
Consider Canada’s true single-payer system. Patients must wait an average of more than two months to see a specialist after getting a referral from their general practitioner, according to the Fraser Institute, a nonpartisan Canadian think tank. Patients can expect to wait another 9.8 weeks, on average, before receiving the treatment they need from that specialist.

Overall, Canadians now wait even longer than last year — and 97 percent longer than they did in 1993.

Access to care is so poor, in fact, that 52,000 Canadians flee to the United States each year for medical attention. They refuse to wait in line for care as their health deteriorates.

 

[Markle]

CLEARLY! The countries whose health care you lust for, say Canada and Great Britain, they too have supplemental health insurance and private, cash only, physicians.

I'm sure they do, what's your point?

They don't spend as much as we do, but they have longer life expectancy, lower infant mortality rates and they don't have 63% of bankruptcies linked to medical crisis.

Bottom line, they get inferior care, are forced to wait in line in many cases for months, are forced onto death lists they don't even know about and have shorter life expectancies after the diagnosis of a serious disease.

As for the paragraph I highlighted, the claim of longer life expectancy is misleading, as is the infant mortality rates. And, we don't have anything close to 63% of bankruptcies due, I said due, to medical bills.

Your post does prove that you, intentionally or not, like the vast majority of Progressives are grossly misinformed. Try educating yourself.

 

[Markle]

Because we looted them to pay for tax cuts for billionaires and wars on a credit card.

 

[danielpalos]

markets should function more efficiently when unemployed labor can simply apply for unemployment compensation and we raise the minimum wage to fifteen dollars an hour.

 

[Cellblock2429]

No cherry picking, just took a figure that was easy to work with and below my earnings alone without my wife, a PA.

Do you believe that Americans would accept the waiting lists and unavailable treatment in Canada?

We're a very rich nation, we can afford to spend for our superior health care.

Except our health care is shit compared to Canada and other nations...

We have the lowest life expectancy in the industrialized world.
We have the highest infant mortality rate in the industrialized world.
We have 62% of bankruptcies linked to medical crisis.

And, no 'waiting lists' are a myth promoted by the insurance industry...

/-----/"We have 62% of bankruptcies linked to medical crisis. "
FACT CHECK: Do 643,000 Bankruptcies Occur in the U.S. Every Year Due to Medical Bills?
Well, let's expose this libtard lie once and for all.
“Source: NerdWallet Health Analysis.” No link to the specific analysis referenced was provided, but presumably, the item in question was a 19 July 2013 item published by NerdWallet pertaining to medical bankruptcies. However, in that analysis NerdWallet repeatedly stated that their findings were “estimates” or “extrapolations,” and some of their data were quite old even back in 2013.

BACKGROUND: Our 2001 study in 5 states found that medical problems contributed to at least 46.2% of all bankruptcies. Since then, health costs and the numbers of un- and underinsured have increased, and bankruptcy laws have tightened.

METHODS: We surveyed a random national sample of 2314 bankruptcy filers in 2007, abstracted their court records, and interviewed 1032 of them. We designated bankruptcies as “medical” based on debtors’ stated reasons for filing, income loss due to illness, and the magnitude of their medical debts.

 

[Redfish]

No cherry picking, just took a figure that was easy to work with and below my earnings alone without my wife, a PA.

Do you believe that Americans would accept the waiting lists and unavailable treatment in Canada?

We're a very rich nation, we can afford to spend for our superior health care.

Except our health care is shit compared to Canada and other nations...

We have the lowest life expectancy in the industrialized world.
We have the highest infant mortality rate in the industrialized world.
We have 62% of bankruptcies linked to medical crisis.

And, no 'waiting lists' are a myth promoted by the insurance industry...

/-----/"We have 62% of bankruptcies linked to medical crisis. "
FACT CHECK: Do 643,000 Bankruptcies Occur in the U.S. Every Year Due to Medical Bills?
Well, let's expose this libtard lie once and for all.
“Source: NerdWallet Health Analysis.” No link to the specific analysis referenced was provided, but presumably, the item in question was a 19 July 2013 item published by NerdWallet pertaining to medical bankruptcies. However, in that analysis NerdWallet repeatedly stated that their findings were “estimates” or “extrapolations,” and some of their data were quite old even back in 2013.

BACKGROUND: Our 2001 study in 5 states found that medical problems contributed to at least 46.2% of all bankruptcies. Since then, health costs and the numbers of un- and underinsured have increased, and bankruptcy laws have tightened.

METHODS: We surveyed a random national sample of 2314 bankruptcy filers in 2007, abstracted their court records, and interviewed 1032 of them. We designated bankruptcies as “medical” based on debtors’ stated reasons for filing, income loss due to illness, and the magnitude of their medical debts.

thank you, yes, many bankruptcy filings have unpaid medical bills in them, but the left's claim that they are CAUSED by medical bills is a complete lie.

 

[Markle]

Gawd, I'm still wishing our wingers would find another fucking hobby.

But exposing Progressives for all their hypocrisy and lies is fun!

 

[Cellblock2429]

If that is the case, Social Security and Medicare are doing well, why do both have such massive unfunded liabilities?

Because we looted them to pay for tax cuts for billionaires and wars on a credit card.

/----/

 

[Redfish]

for any of our resident libs and dems


WHY do you want single payer? Tell us exactly what you think it will do for medical care in the USA. This is a serious inquiry, I would like to understand why you want it.

 

[danielpalos]

for any of our resident libs and dems


WHY do you want single payer? Tell us exactly what you think it will do for medical care in the USA. This is a serious inquiry, I would like to understand why you want it.

Government must ensure access to public goods and public services.

The right wing has nothing but repeal, not Any form of better solution at lower cost.

 

[Cellblock2429]

for any of our resident libs and dems


WHY do you want single payer? Tell us exactly what you think it will do for medical care in the USA. This is a serious inquiry, I would like to understand why you want it.

Government must ensure access to public goods and public services.

The right wing has nothing but repeal, not Any form of better solution at lower cost.

/----/ Refute this, Prog
What’s Better: Medicare For All, Or A Free-Market Health-Care System?
A Freer Health Care Market Would Drive Costs Down
The real cost drivers in health care aren’t really insurance companies or big pharma, but the hospital systems that insurers have to have in their networks. Hospitals charge high prices because insurers will pay whatever they ask. Large employers divert employee compensation into tax-free health benefits, pay premiums to insurers who in turn pay hospitals, and patients never know how much anything really costs.

We have to break this cycle. There’s plenty of ways to do it that wouldn’t leave working Americans without coverage or care. In fact, we could ensure every American had government-funded catastrophic coverage—for those times they unexpectedly end up in the ER—while shifting to a competitive market system for most everything else.

Prices for routine medical care would plummet, just like they have for cosmetic procedures not covered by insurance. Thanks to competition and technology, LASIK eye surgery cost $2,200 per eye in 1998 but only costs about $300 per eye today.

 

[danielpalos]

for any of our resident libs and dems


WHY do you want single payer? Tell us exactly what you think it will do for medical care in the USA. This is a serious inquiry, I would like to understand why you want it.

Government must ensure access to public goods and public services.

The right wing has nothing but repeal, not Any form of better solution at lower cost.

/----/ Refute this, Prog
What’s Better: Medicare For All, Or A Free-Market Health-Care System?
A Freer Health Care Market Would Drive Costs Down
The real cost drivers in health care aren’t really insurance companies or big pharma, but the hospital systems that insurers have to have in their networks. Hospitals charge high prices because insurers will pay whatever they ask. Large employers divert employee compensation into tax-free health benefits, pay premiums to insurers who in turn pay hospitals, and patients never know how much anything really costs.

We have to break this cycle. There’s plenty of ways to do it that wouldn’t leave working Americans without coverage or care. In fact, we could ensure every American had government-funded catastrophic coverage—for those times they unexpectedly end up in the ER—while shifting to a competitive market system for most everything else.

Prices for routine medical care would plummet, just like they have for cosmetic procedures not covered by insurance. Thanks to competition and technology, LASIK eye surgery cost $2,200 per eye in 1998 but only costs about $300 per eye today.

solving for simple poverty means markets must be more efficient due to that increase in natural market participation.

 

[Maxdeath]

we could solve simple poverty by solving for capitalism's natural rate of unemployment through unemployment compensation in our at-will employment States.

Socialism should nurture Capitalism within Standards, fixed by Government. Capitalism can "float" from within the ease and convenience of that form of nurture for nature.

All states have unemployment compensation.
Part of the problem with poverty it is tied to the want to work, the want to increase your standards.
You can only give a person so much. After that it is up to them. Unfortunately if you give too much there is only the incentive to collect and not to work.

 

[danielpalos]

we could solve simple poverty by solving for capitalism's natural rate of unemployment through unemployment compensation in our at-will employment States.

Socialism should nurture Capitalism within Standards, fixed by Government. Capitalism can "float" from within the ease and convenience of that form of nurture for nature.

All states have unemployment compensation.
Part of the problem with poverty it is tied to the want to work, the want to increase your standards.
You can only give a person so much. After that it is up to them. Unfortunately if you give too much there is only the incentive to collect and not to work.

You miss the point; capital is a requirement to participate in our markets. Simply paying some Labor to pursue Happiness instead of profit will lead to improved market efficiency.

 

[JoeB131]

/—-/ No one is denied care. Just take your sick child to the ER you cold hearted bastard.

ER's are only required to give you emergency treatment... they do not treat long term issues like Pediatric cancer.

Seriously, are you some kind of a retard? Do I need to use smaller words?

Want to see single payer in action visit the VA.

The VA has been fine whenever I've had dealings with them. The problem with the VA is that it was never designed to handle a 17 year war.