Women have to PROVE they were raped

[thereisnospoon]

And for those of you who want to deny welfare to women and children altogether because of your tax burden.....really?
Do you really think you're going to see a decrease in your taxes if welfare was completely abolished?
I kinda tend to think they'll just find some other uses for the extra money saved.

Hardly the point.
The fact that slightly more than 50% of the federal budget is earmarked for social programs should alert any thinking person to the reality that social spending is out of control.
It's out of control because so many recipients of the taxpayer largess are gaming the system.
The "drop in the bucket' argument is invalid.

 

[Barb]

And for those of you who want to deny welfare to women and children altogether because of your tax burden.....really?
Do you really think you're going to see a decrease in your taxes if welfare was completely abolished?
I kinda tend to think they'll just find some other uses for the extra money saved.

Hardly the point.
The fact that slightly more than 50% of the federal budget is earmarked for social programs should alert any thinking person to the reality that social spending is out of control.
It's out of control because so many recipients of the taxpayer largess are gaming the system.
The "drop in the bucket' argument is invalid.

The drop in the bucket argument is completely honest, you deceitful hack.

"social programs" include public education, higher education grants and loan programs, health, FEMA, social security, medicare, medicaid, the fucking COURT system, police, fire, rescue, and on and on. Needs-tested aid accounts for 1.7% of the entire federal budget.

 

[Noomi]

It's nothing new that sometimes people have claimed to have been raped just to get even with the man in their lives .... and it was a lie.

You will have your day in Court to prove it., and if you can not prove it will be dismissed.

That is the Law,

There have been times when a rape victim has not been believed and the rapist has walked free.

There have also been cases where the "victim" simply made the whole thing up, and utterly ruined the life of a man who did nothing wrong except go out with a psychotic bitch.

That is true, but in the majority of cases, the woman is telling the truth.

 

[Darkwind]

The burden of proof for any crime has always been on the accuser.

I'm not sure what the OP is babbling about....

 

[Claudette]

Yes it has. You have to prove rape just like any other crime.

The cops aren't going to just take your word for it and nor should they.

 

[thereisnospoon]

And for those of you who want to deny welfare to women and children altogether because of your tax burden.....really?
Do you really think you're going to see a decrease in your taxes if welfare was completely abolished?
I kinda tend to think they'll just find some other uses for the extra money saved.

Hardly the point.
The fact that slightly more than 50% of the federal budget is earmarked for social programs should alert any thinking person to the reality that social spending is out of control.
It's out of control because so many recipients of the taxpayer largess are gaming the system.
The "drop in the bucket' argument is invalid.

The drop in the bucket argument is completely honest, you deceitful hack.

"social programs" include public education, higher education grants and loan programs, health, FEMA, social security, medicare, medicaid, the fucking COURT system, police, fire, rescue, and on and on. Needs-tested aid accounts for 1.7% of the entire federal budget.

Umm. No they do not...Social programs that take up half the budget are entitlement and assistance programs.
Know your role here sister. Watch read and learn before posting.
Law enforcement, public protection ( fire, rescue, first responders) Courts are funded locally. The federal education budget is but a very small portion of total public education expenditures. The fact is the federal government has no business involving itself in public schools. Now should it be involved in higher learning.
Now, you don't have a fucking clue what defines the drop in the bucket...
Here it is.....We have a mythical mile of roadway..Each day 100,000 vehicles use this road.
One driver on his way to work after finishing his Sausage and egg Mc Muffin, decides it's ok to throw the wrapper out onto the road. A police officer sees this, pulls over the driver. The officer asks the driver why he did this....The driver retorts in an agitated tone, "why are you giving me a ticket?!! It's just one little piece of paper!!!!!"..
The drop in the bucket....Suppose that all 100,000 driver decide to throw their Sausage and Egg Mc Muffin wrapper on to the road.... Ya know what we have?...A big fucking MESS..
So when one you libs attempts to justifiy the next social entitlement by stating "It's only this much!"..I turn your attention to that one mile of roadway..
Now,You greedy liberal slime child woman , shut your pie hole.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The burden of proof for any crime has always been on the accuser.

I'm not sure what the OP is babbling about....

That the accused might "get away with it"..Sheesh..
I find it remarkable how libs use the rationalization process to make issues fit their socialist agenda.

 

[skye]

This thread is unbelievable ..how some want to put in jail a man with only hearsay.... I mean ...don't people already know that is not acceptable? don't people understand yet? (and I am not a liberal ok?)

Some are thick as a brick!

 

[buckeye45_73]

The burden of proof for any crime has always been on the accuser.

I'm not sure what the OP is babbling about....

Look liberals are crazy, they only think political. They thought they would box in republicans by saying just exempt rape, so we say ok, then they spring their trap of, well now a woman has to prove she's been raped...well no shit.....the thing about this is it can be good in that women would now go to a hospital or police asap.....which is a GOOD thing.

 

[ilia25]

So should unplanned/oops babies that occur within a marriage or with a woman who can support herself also be financed by the government or do only poor women get the benefit of having oops babies?

Stop making excuses for lazy ass women and men too selfish to prevent pregnancies.

Yup. Also the government should stop wasting our money on those highway dividers.

 

[thereisnospoon]

So should unplanned/oops babies that occur within a marriage or with a woman who can support herself also be financed by the government or do only poor women get the benefit of having oops babies?

Stop making excuses for lazy ass women and men too selfish to prevent pregnancies.

Yup. Also the government should stop wasting our money on those highway dividers.

WTF are you babbling about?

 

[Conservative]

The bill is designed to remove the incentive of low income women who are on assistance to have more children they cant afford.

That is not a bad thing.

You know, in the short time you've been here, you've proven to be possibly the most open minded, level headed and fair liberal leaning poster on the board. I am impressed.

 

[AmyNation]

The bill is designed to remove the incentive of low income women who are on assistance to have more children they cant afford.

That is not a bad thing.

You know, in the short time you've been here, you've proven to be possibly the most open minded, level headed and fair liberal leaning poster on the board. I am impressed.

Lol!

And now start the parade of posters who couldn't disagree with you more!

 

[Conservative]

The bill is designed to remove the incentive of low income women who are on assistance to have more children they cant afford.

That is not a bad thing.

by removing support for the sibling ? - justice in a "nut" shell.

No, dumb ass, by not increasing support because of a new child while they are on assistance. If families (notice I am not putting all the responsibility on women) on public assistance know that they will NOT get additional money for having more children, they will be less likely to HAVE more children.

This is not a bad thing.

 

[Conservative]

so yuou are okay if a woman says she was raped and she wasnt? is that okay to al the other victims because if it were revered, youd be screaming it.

i think the point is they should give the extra assistance for the baby, regardless.

there is nothing unusual with government fostering certain societal mores. it's why there is a tax benefit to marriage.

but if there's a value on children, then the children should be cared for.

people aren't going to stop bonking if you a) make abortion illegal; and then b) starve the women and their kids.

or do you want to create a permanent underclass?

But, to much of our population, children have no value. And yes, its obviously the rabid right who do not value children. Fetuses yes, children - They want to punish the mother so they let them go hungry.

And yes, they not only DO want a permanent underclass, they already believe that certain humans are intrinsically worthless.

The fact that they cannot control boinking and the boinkers is a driving force in their actions. They're not getting laid so they don't want anyone else getting laid either.

Speaking of which, g'night.

I really hope you never procreate. It would be a shame to pass on those genes.

 

[Conservative]

so yuou are okay if a woman says she was raped and she wasnt? is that okay to al the other victims because if it were revered, youd be screaming it.

Sorry, but considering what happens to many women who are raped and then report it, I have problems with having to "prove" you were raped. Remember that woman that Kennedy's cousin raped. Apparently she "asked" for it by taking him home at 2am and agreeing to a tour of the Kennedy estate.

No, until things change, no woman should have to "prove" rape. Remember Juanita Broderick? How many lawyers did she go through before she was forced to give up her claim? And you want her to have to "prove" it before she gets help? No, as far is rape is concerned our society is still in the dark ages. No woman should have to "prove" it. Today, even reporting a rape can ruin your job, you reputation, your life. And this is the 21st century.

Their word should be enough? Think Duke perhaps? Um not going fly with most people. Read the proposed bill. They are hardly asking for anything unreasonable.

Elimination of benefits under subsection (d) shall not
4
apply to any child conceived as a result of rape or incest if
5
the department:
6
(1) receives a non-notarized, signed statement from the
7
pregnant woman stating that she was a victim of rape or incest,
8
as the case may be, and that she reported the crime, including
9
the identity of the offender, if known, to a law enforcement
10
agency having the requisite jurisdiction or, in the case of
11
incest where a pregnant minor is the victim, to the county child
12
protective service agency and stating the name of the law
13
enforcement agency or child protective service agency to which
14
the report was made and the date such report was made;
15
(2) receives the signed statement of the pregnant woman
16
which is described in this subsection. The statement shall bear
17
the notice that any false statements made therein are punishable
18
by law and shall state that the pregnant woman is aware that
19
false reports to law enforcement authorities are punishable by
20
law; and
21
(3) verifies with the law enforcement agency or child
22
protective service agency named in the statement of the pregnant
23
woman whether a report of rape or incest was filed with the
24
agency in accordance with the statement. The Commonwealth agency
25
shall report any evidence of false statements or of fraud in the
26
procurement or attempted procurement of any payment from Federal
27
or State funds appropriated by the Commonwealth pursuant to this
28
subsection to the district attorney of appropriate jurisdiction
29
and, where appropriate, to the Attorney General.

Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. of course, I have a working brain and an open mind.

 

[Conservative]

Something a lot of people don't know about me: I was sexually assaulted by someone I thought was a friend at the age of 17. I have never made a police report, as back then, I was told that they would think it was my fault. It took me over ten years to realise it wasn't, and now it is too late to do anything.

Does this mean the assault didn't happen and that I shouldn't be taken seriously? Of course not. I have no physical evidence, but I have the mental scars, which will be with me forever.

I am sorry what happened to you and I do understand and sympathise with your pain.


But if you go to Court you need your evidence, forensic material, DNA in order to prove your case. that's the Law.

If the rapist uses a condom, there is no physical evidence. Often there isn't, and cases can rely only on the testimony of the victim.

you have GOT to be fucking kidding. A rapist who says 'Hold on while I open and apply this condom before I rape you' ????

 

[Conservative]

If the rapist uses a condom, there is no physical evidence. Often there isn't, and cases can rely only on the testimony of the victim.

Forensic evidence is a must, fibres, hair, anything. You see... you have to prove it. Otherwise is your word against the other one.

Often there IS no physical evidence. You wear gloves, so no fingerprints, a ski mask takes care of any loose hairs, a condom prevents semen so no DNA. A rapist can be very careful in this day and age. Many rapists won't leave any DNA at all, yet they are still caught and jailed.

Do you think a rapist who doesn't leave any physical evidence behind should walk free because his victim failed to find some DNA?

link?

 

[Conservative]

You are wrong on the law, though. We have sent people to prison for which there was only circumstantial evidence, and no physical evidence. It is NOT a matter of law that there is physical evidence, because our legal system know that there will not always BE that physical evidence.

ok then SHOW THE EVIDENCE!!!!!!!

What if the freaking evidence doesn't exist? You are not paying attention to me. You are blinded by ignorance here.

I have no physical evidence that I was raped. I had no physical evidence even back then, but it happened. It is my word now against his - I assume you think he should walk free because I can't prove he attacked me?

This is making my stomach churn.

She's not paying attention? She is blinded by ignorance?

And yes, if you can't prove you were raped, he should not go to jail.

What makes you so fucking special that your word is to be given more credence than physical evidence or a confession?

Nothing.

 

[Conservative]

What if the freaking evidence doesn't exist? You are not paying attention to me. You are blinded by ignorance here.

I have no physical evidence that I was raped. I had no physical evidence even back then, but it happened. It is my word now against his - I assume you think he should walk free because I can't prove he attacked me?

This is making my stomach churn.

With all respect Noomi...... if you don't have proof it never happened according to the Law.


That's how it is Noomi, I am sorry to break it to you but that's how it is. Go talk to any Defense Lawyer and he will tell you more.

If you don't have evidence, then why do the police believe every single victim when she makes a report? Shouldn't they tell her to bugger off and find some evidence?

No, dumb ass, because that is not the role of the police. That is the role of the court system. Bring to trial... defense... prosecution... jury or judge decision.... etc. etc etc