11 Facts About Obamacare That No Conservative Knows About, Cares About, Or Will Read

[GHook93]

1. By 2022, the Congressional Budget Office estimates (pdf) the Affordable Care Act will have extended coverage to 33 million Americans who would otherwise be uninsured.

LOL, so in 10 years the plan will be a success! LOL, why wouldn't it be right away. These projects and the charge mean nothing they are bullshit. If they are off in even 2013 no one will remember or give a fuck. Project my ass!

What are your thoughts on endless, unpaid for wars in foreign countries?

Look at the wars we have been in and most have a Democrat leading the charge. My view on wars are some are worth fighting others are not. But since your a liberal by wars you mean Iraq and Afghanistan (you will ignore Libya).

(1) Afghanistan: NOT a war of choice. They attacked us and we needed to respond. I would have faulted our government for doing nothing if they didn't attack. However, I don't like the way are fighting this war. We are trying to nation-build a country that never had any infrastructure whatsoever! Before we went in they were a country stuck in the middle ages, yet we think we could build a country from that? We needed to learn two lessons from Russia: (A) You can't nation build in Afghanistan, because there is no base to build on and (B) If a 3rd world country attacks, you go in hit they hard with everything, leave, let they clean up the mess and warn them never to do that again (aka Georgia isn't messing with the Russian Bear anytime soon).

(2) Iraq: Boneheaded invasion from the beginning. When we finally exit the country entirely it will be a 3 front secular civil war. Like in Libya a worse Islamist will emerge. Sadam was a bad guy in every sense of the word, but at least he stabilized Iraq (the best anyone could) and he was a polarizing force in the ME to Iran. It was a failure in every sense of the word and should be used to taint W's legacy in the history books? Happy!

(3) Libya: The outcome isn't looking that good, since Islamist are replacing Gaddifi. But at least the method can be used as a blueprint to take out other dictators. Without the no fly NATO enforcement, the rebellion would have been brutally put down in a month. With it the revolution was a success. Gaddiffi is not ideal, but again he was better than what is seeming to emerge out of the ashes of the revolution!

 

[ConservaDerrps]

LOL, so in 10 years the plan will be a success! LOL, why wouldn't it be right away.

Any government program which does not realize its full benefit within 60 seconds of its passage is just wasteful and stupid.


Like you.

Red Herring response. If you are passing a bill to cover all Americans then they shouldn't make bullshit projects 10 years out?

And yes if a program like this doesn't add all the people to the payroll within a year of kicking in it's a failure and it only takes 10 secs to figure out Obaminationcare is wasteful and a failure!

Oh, okay. So you're going to admit that the Iraq war was a failure too, right? And that Bush's part of the Afghan war was an abject failure too, yes?

Goddamn you're a sycophant, ain't ya?

 

[GHook93]

1. By 2022, the Congressional Budget Office estimates (pdf) the Affordable Care Act will have extended coverage to 33 million Americans who would otherwise be uninsured.

LOL, so in 10 years the plan will be a success!

Don't wingnuts say that if we start drilling in ANWR we can have a new source of gas in 10 years?

Hypocrite.

LOL, that was one of the weakest red herring argument I have ever heard! You wanted to compare PROVEN oil reservest that liberals won't let us touch to BULL SHIT projects that everyone know is bull shit except that libtrash!

anwr.org - Arctic National Wildlife Refuge

 

[Oldstyle]

You still haven't told me who's going to pay for the huge increase in Medicaid spending that the States are going to be responsible for, Conserva. You know...the one that ObamaCare pays most of for the first year and then less the next and even less the next until suddenly it's the States that will have to pay for it all?

States never pay for more than 10 percent of those new costs. The federal share dials down from 100 percent at the beginning to 90 percent in perpetuity.

... the Federal medical assistance percentage for a State that is one of the 50 States or the District of Columbia, with respect to amounts expended by such State for medical assistance for newly eligible individuals ... shall be equal to—

‘‘(A) 100 percent for calendar quarters in 2014, 2015, and 2016;
‘‘(B) 95 percent for calendar quarters in 2017;
‘‘(C) 94 percent for calendar quarters in 2018;
‘‘(D) 93 percent for calendar quarters in 2019; and
‘‘(E) 90 percent for calendar quarters in 2020 and each year thereafter.​

That's going to add billions to the cost of each State, Green...if it isn't going to be paid for by tax increases then how WILL it be paid for? We're talking massive amounts of money for States that are already strapped for cash. How IS California and Illinois going to pay their share when they're already teetering on insolvency?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

You still haven't told me who's going to pay for the huge increase in Medicaid spending that the States are going to be responsible for, Conserva. You know...the one that ObamaCare pays most of for the first year and then less the next and even less the next until suddenly it's the States that will have to pay for it all?

States never pay for more than 10 percent of those new costs. The federal share dials down from 100 percent at the beginning to 90 percent in perpetuity.

... the Federal medical assistance percentage for a State that is one of the 50 States or the District of Columbia, with respect to amounts expended by such State for medical assistance for newly eligible individuals ... shall be equal to—

‘‘(A) 100 percent for calendar quarters in 2014, 2015, and 2016;
‘‘(B) 95 percent for calendar quarters in 2017;
‘‘(C) 94 percent for calendar quarters in 2018;
‘‘(D) 93 percent for calendar quarters in 2019; and
‘‘(E) 90 percent for calendar quarters in 2020 and each year thereafter.​

That's going to add billions to the cost of each State, Green...if it isn't going to be paid for by tax increases then how WILL it be paid for? We're talking massive amounts of money for States that are already strapped for cash. How IS California and Illinois going to pay their share when they're already teetering on insolvency?

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

LOL, so in 10 years the plan will be a success! LOL, why wouldn't it be right away. These projects and the charge mean nothing they are bullshit. If they are off in even 2013 no one will remember or give a fuck. Project my ass!

What are your thoughts on endless, unpaid for wars in foreign countries?

Look at the wars we have been in and most have a Democrat leading the charge. My view on wars are some are worth fighting others are not. But since your a liberal by wars you mean Iraq and Afghanistan (you will ignore Libya).

(1) Afghanistan: NOT a war of choice. They attacked us and we needed to respond. I would have faulted our government for doing nothing if they didn't attack. However, I don't like the way are fighting this war. We are trying to nation-build a country that never had any infrastructure whatsoever! Before we went in they were a country stuck in the middle ages, yet we think we could build a country from that? We needed to learn two lessons from Russia: (A) You can't nation build in Afghanistan, because there is no base to build on and (B) If a 3rd world country attacks, you go in hit they hard with everything, leave, let they clean up the mess and warn them never to do that again (aka Georgia isn't messing with the Russian Bear anytime soon).

(2) Iraq: Boneheaded invasion from the beginning. When we finally exit the country entirely it will be a 3 front secular civil war. Like in Libya a worse Islamist will emerge. Sadam was a bad guy in every sense of the word, but at least he stabilized Iraq (the best anyone could) and he was a polarizing force in the ME to Iran. It was a failure in every sense of the word and should be used to taint W's legacy in the history books? Happy!

(3) Libya: The outcome isn't looking that good, since Islamist are replacing Gaddifi. But at least the method can be used as a blueprint to take out other dictators. Without the no fly NATO enforcement, the rebellion would have been brutally put down in a month. With it the revolution was a success. Gaddiffi is not ideal, but again he was better than what is seeming to emerge out of the ashes of the revolution!

Oh, we can count Libya if you want. But call me in about 25 years when we've spent the same amount of money in Libya as we did in Iraq. And what in the holy-living-fuck are you talking about when it comes to "Democrats leading the charge?" We're not talking about WW2 and Korea or even Vietnam. We're talking about the two completely unfunded wars that GW started and that we still HAVE NOT paid for.

 

[Oldstyle]

States never pay for more than 10 percent of those new costs. The federal share dials down from 100 percent at the beginning to 90 percent in perpetuity.

That's going to add billions to the cost of each State, Green...if it isn't going to be paid for by tax increases then how WILL it be paid for? We're talking massive amounts of money for States that are already strapped for cash. How IS California and Illinois going to pay their share when they're already teetering on insolvency?

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

That's going to add billions to the cost of each State, Green...if it isn't going to be paid for by tax increases then how WILL it be paid for? We're talking massive amounts of money for States that are already strapped for cash. How IS California and Illinois going to pay their share when they're already teetering on insolvency?

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

You don't know ANY of that. Unless you're willing to present a degree that would make you eligible to be on the economic advisory team that has done the analysis of this, and has ALREADY FUNDED THE BILL THE FIRST 10 YEARS, you're just grasping at what you THINK is true. Where am I pulling the 97% figure from?

CBO Estimates Only 1.2% of Americans Will Have to Pay Healthcare Penalty ‹ I Acknowledge Class Warfare Exists

Edit: Wait, that's jut the penalty tax, though that should tell you something. I'm still looking for the other article I saw on it too, but I think that CBO estimate kind of says it all. If you're not going to be hit by the penalty tax, that means you're either insured or you make too little money to be qualified to pay the tax. So again: A bunch of noise and hot air that is completely false and misleading.

 

[Papageorgio]

That's going to add billions to the cost of each State, Green...if it isn't going to be paid for by tax increases then how WILL it be paid for? We're talking massive amounts of money for States that are already strapped for cash. How IS California and Illinois going to pay their share when they're already teetering on insolvency?

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

No kidding, there is no way that raising taxes on just those making over $250k will cover this new spending. It won't even cover the current deficit.
Where is the money going to come from?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

No kidding, there is no way that raising taxes on just those making over $250k will cover this new spending. It won't even cover the current deficit.
Where is the money going to come from?

Oh, you mean you want to reduce the deficit? Cool, end the Bush Tax Cuts.

And they're not JUST raising taxes on top earners. They're also taxing the Insurance Companies. You keep skipping over that.

 

[Oldstyle]

Oh, there will be tax increases, but 97% of those filing taxes will NOT see in an increase. The tax increase will be on those making $250k+ and on the Insurance companies.

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

You don't know ANY of that. Unless you're willing to present a degree that would make you eligible to be on the economic advisory team that has done the analysis of this, and has ALREADY FUNDED THE BILL THE FIRST 10 YEARS, you're just grasping at what you THINK is true. Where am I pulling the 97% figure from?

CBO Estimates Only 1.2% of Americans Will Have to Pay Healthcare Penalty ‹ I Acknowledge Class Warfare Exists

Edit: Wait, that's jut the penalty tax, though that should tell you something. I'm still looking for the other article I saw on it too, but I think that CBO estimate kind of says it all. If you're not going to be hit by the penalty tax, that means you're either insured or you make too little money to be qualified to pay the tax. So again: A bunch of noise and hot air that is completely false and misleading.

Why did you even bother to waste my time with that?

 

[Oldstyle]

Simple stuff, Conserva...show me where it's written that the States portion of the increase in Medicaid spending will be paid for by people making over $250,000 a year.

 

[Oldstyle]

The truth is...HOW the States make up that additional cost has been left up to them. So tell me how it is that California is going to pay the billions of dollars it's going to be responsible for?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Simple stuff, Conserva...show me where it's written that the States portion of the increase in Medicaid spending will be paid for by people making over $250,000 a year.

Look, buddy, I'm not going to digging into that massive piece of legislation to find that information. What I am going to do is repeat to you that this bill is FULLY FUNDED for the first ten years, at least. So you figure out in your own head what that means, okay? Remember: FULLY FUNDED.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

You don't know ANY of that. Unless you're willing to present a degree that would make you eligible to be on the economic advisory team that has done the analysis of this, and has ALREADY FUNDED THE BILL THE FIRST 10 YEARS, you're just grasping at what you THINK is true. Where am I pulling the 97% figure from?

CBO Estimates Only 1.2% of Americans Will Have to Pay Healthcare Penalty ‹ I Acknowledge Class Warfare Exists

Edit: Wait, that's jut the penalty tax, though that should tell you something. I'm still looking for the other article I saw on it too, but I think that CBO estimate kind of says it all. If you're not going to be hit by the penalty tax, that means you're either insured or you make too little money to be qualified to pay the tax. So again: A bunch of noise and hot air that is completely false and misleading.

Why did you even bother to waste my time with that?

Oh, you didn't read my edit that I made, right? It's important to note that if 97% of those filing taxes won't pay the penalty, that should tell you about what will happen to their other tax rates, dummy.

 

[Oldstyle]

I'm still waiting for you to show me the plan that States have in place to pay that additional cost, Conserva. If you're quoting statistics on the percentage of people who will pay it I can only assume that you're doing so with access to that plan? Because if you're NOT...then you're talking out of your ass and you know it.

 

[kwc57]

If you think for two seconds people are going to stop being doctors, or that we won't have enough doctors to meet demand, you're crazy sauce. There's actually a section in the ACA setting aside slots for training primary care doctors.

Ya'all need to educate before you masturbate.

Why is this so difficult for liberals to understand.

If Obama forces health care insurance companies, drug makers, and medical providers to lose money, they will stop providing the service and products.

Unless they work for the government no company can consistently keep operating at a loss.

That is the point of the free market system.

Heavy handed government interference will create disaster to Americans' health care.

How exactly is hand-delivering millions of new customers to the insurance companies making them turn less profit, exactly?

You really don't understand how businesses work do you. Part of those millions of customers being handed to them include people with pre-existing conditions. Add in no caps in payout and you have a money lending proposition. Think of it this way. If you run an all you eat buffet, it is limited to the time you come in and pay and when you leave or closing time, whichever comes first. If the government said that you had to allow that person to return everyday and eat as much as they want, you're eventually going to go out of business when everyone in town learns they only have to pay you once for unlimited product. Sure, the insurance company gets more customers......but they aren't necessarily customers that help the bottom line.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Why is this so difficult for liberals to understand.

If Obama forces health care insurance companies, drug makers, and medical providers to lose money, they will stop providing the service and products.

Unless they work for the government no company can consistently keep operating at a loss.

That is the point of the free market system.

Heavy handed government interference will create disaster to Americans' health care.

How exactly is hand-delivering millions of new customers to the insurance companies making them turn less profit, exactly?

You really don't understand how businesses work do you. Part of those millions of customers being handed to them include people with pre-existing conditions. Add in no caps in payout and you have a money lending proposition. Think of it this way. If you run an all you eat buffet, it is limited to the time you come in and pay and when you leave or closing time, whichever comes first. If the government said that you had to allow that person to return everyday and eat as much as they want, you're eventually going to go out of business when everyone in town learns they only have to pay you once for unlimited product. Sure, the insurance company gets more customers......but they aren't necessarily customers that help the bottom line.

You really don't understand how insurance works, do you? Yes, there will be millions of people with pre-existing conditions. However, when inserted into the pools with millions of totally healthy people, the rates will remain where they are, if not lower dramatically. This, my dear stupid, is the key to the entire deal. The more people in the pools, the lower they can keep the costs.

Of course those customers help the bottom line. The insurance companies are STOKED about Obamacare. They helped lobby for it. It's actually, as this fucking BREITBART piece points out, something they really need to stick around because at the end of the day, Obamacare is like a Health Care industry stimulus package.

Health Insurance Companies Are Praying ObamaCare Will Stand

Man, did you guys even read up on this shit at ALL before you let Fox News tell you what to think of it?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I'm still waiting for you to show me the plan that States have in place to pay that additional cost, Conserva. If you're quoting statistics on the percentage of people who will pay it I can only assume that you're doing so with access to that plan? Because if you're NOT...then you're talking out of your ass and you know it.

The first three years, the Federal government is paying for ALL of the costs. That gives every state that participated three years to figure out how to do it. Maybe it will mean tax increases, but maybe it won't. Who knows? I'm not every state's accountant. But you're proving just how much of a Boogey Man Conservatives are trying to make this bill when you have zero actual knowledge of how it's going to work.

 

[Papageorgio]

Where is it that the STATES have promised THAT, Conserva? First of all, we're talking amounts of money that couldn't be paid with just tax increases on the "wealthy". Where is it that you're pulling that 97% figure from...the same people who estimated the costs of ObamaCare and missed by almost 50%? This is the same tactic that Democrats used to get ObamaCare passed in the first place...namely lie and tell the Middle Class that "someone else" will be picking up the cost, not them.

No kidding, there is no way that raising taxes on just those making over $250k will cover this new spending. It won't even cover the current deficit.
Where is the money going to come from?

Oh, you mean you want to reduce the deficit? Cool, end the Bush Tax Cuts.

And they're not JUST raising taxes on top earners. They're also taxing the Insurance Companies. You keep skipping over that.

I'm all for ending the tax cuts, if we cut spending, dollar for dollar, but the won't happen and anyone with a brain knows that. It is not the intent of Congress to cut spending.

Obama has had over three years to end the Bush tax cuts and has failed to do so, I really wonder why.

Ending the Bush tax cuts will not reduce the deficit, because government keeps spending more and more. Tax the insurance companies, right that is the answer, they are already capped at earnings over health care, their profit margins are less than 3% as it is, but go on take more and watch premiums go up and health care go up.