A Prediction. The Dems will romp in the next election.

[bripat9643]

complete the fence Mexicans are too stupid to dig .. better fill up that hole first ...

You'd think no one ever figured out how to prevent people from digging under a fence. One thing we know: a liberal never figured it out.

 

[Siete]

I say complete the fence, spend another 1.2 billion or whatever it takes t finish the fence. That will stop the 10-15 holes illegals cut in the fence EVERY night on the El Paso border ... FENCE COMPLETE ..end of problem.

Idiots.

They won't be cutting any holes in it if it's electrified and it has a guard tower every 440 years. Immigration across the border will drop to virtually zero.

then you pay for the electricity ... making taxpayers pay for shit you want is SSSSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO liberal of YOU.

 

[bripat9643]

As the GOP takes control of both Houses, we have a president that is forcing them to get immigration reform done or he will take unilateral action.

My prediction is that the GOP controlled Congress will send Obama a bill he will sign, that will include some kind of path to citizenship for those illegals already here.

In conservative circles, immigration is a hot button issue. If passed a good many people will either break away from the GOP and form a new party to combat the "Democratic Lite" GOP party, or they will refuse to vote for them in 2016. With this type of split, the Dems are virtually guaranteed to win almost every race.

My hope is that the GOP see's this issue as being absolutely crucial to their hold on power, and they don't do what I think they are going to.

Mark

I'll take your bet. The GOP will never pass such a bill because the vast majority of Americans won't stand for it unless the border is secured first, and Obama will never sign a bill the truly secures the border.

Then it wont happen. You cannot "secure' 2000 miles of border mostly in remote areas.

Sure you can. It's really not that hard. The Israelis built a wall around the entire West Bank that is quite effective. It cut the number of suicide bombers to virtually zero.

You cannot compare the Israeli wall, which was like 500 miles and mostly near inhabited places, to a 2000 mile border mostly in the middle of nowhere. Additionally the Palis tunneled under the wall in many places. Just as the illegals do already here.
The border between Egypt and Gaza is much shorter and they cant control it. The border between China and North Korea is shorter, and the Chinese have no qiualms about shooting people, and they still have an illegal immigration problem.

So the American version of the wall will be 4 times longer. Yeah, we can't afford that. I mean, the United states only has about 50 times the population of Israel.

Most of the wall/fence will also be along the Rio Grande river, which makes it even more effective. It's hard to dig a tunnel when you're standing in a river.

Tunneling can easily be detected by placing microphones under the ground. These issues are all easily solved. Those who claim otherwise really don't want them to be solved. They know the wall will be effective, which is why they wail against it so vociferously.

We don't have to stop every last person from crossing the border, but if it cuts the number by 90%, the fence will have done its job. And a fence can easily do that.

 

[bripat9643]

I say complete the fence, spend another 1.2 billion or whatever it takes t finish the fence. That will stop the 10-15 holes illegals cut in the fence EVERY night on the El Paso border ... FENCE COMPLETE ..end of problem.

Idiots.

They won't be cutting any holes in it if it's electrified and it has a guard tower every 440 years. Immigration across the border will drop to virtually zero.

then you pay for the electricity ... making taxpayers pay for shit you want is SSSSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO liberal of YOU.

You'll have to pay for it also. That's how democracy works.

Sucks, don't it?

 

[Dot Com]

I also predict that Repubs will get a mudhole stomped into them after they do what they always do after getting elected servicing the rich

 

[bripat9643]

I say complete the fence, spend another 1.2 billion or whatever it takes t finish the fence. That will stop the 10-15 holes illegals cut in the fence EVERY night on the El Paso border ... FENCE COMPLETE ..end of problem.

Idiots.

They won't be cutting any holes in it if it's electrified and it has a guard tower every 440 years. Immigration across the border will drop to virtually zero.

That invokes Sowell's fallacy of unlimited resources. Sure, if we threw trillions of dollars we might be able to stop people crossing. But what do we get for that money?

"Unlimited?" How much would it cost to put a guard tower every 1/4 mile? If the fence is 2000 miles, that would mean 8000 men. We sent 4000 men to build Ebola hospitals in Liberia. If it stops 1/2 million illegals from getting through every year, it's cheap when you consider the money saved.

 

[Siete]

I say complete the fence, spend another 1.2 billion or whatever it takes t finish the fence. That will stop the 10-15 holes illegals cut in the fence EVERY night on the El Paso border ... FENCE COMPLETE ..end of problem.

Idiots.

They won't be cutting any holes in it if it's electrified and it has a guard tower every 440 years. Immigration across the border will drop to virtually zero.

then you pay for the electricity ... making taxpayers pay for shit you want is SSSSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO liberal of YOU.

You'll have to pay for it also. That's how democracy works.

Sucks, don't it?

so you admit you're a liberal ... yeah, you suck.

 

[Siete]

border fence is up ... errrr, surf is up ... swim around Juan the rest of the fence is complete.

 

[Papageorgio]

Aww, how nice. that Fascist Dictator Obama is FORCING them to get immigration REFORM done. You see folks Obama hasn't learned a gawddam thing with you kicking his party out of the house first and now the Senate. And as if we needed it Reformed just because he says to needs to be. which will turn out like how he REFORMED our heath care

garbage, expensive, Fascism, etc and then Hopefully the people will ROMP out the Democrats from the Presidency and from ALL power over us, NEXT.

so you don't want anything done about immigration , you just wanted to call the POTUS a few talking point names. .. got it.

if the Republicans really wanted to pass immigration legislation they had THE OPPORTUNITY when 43 was the POTUS and the Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress (remember that - lol)

but nooooooooooooo ... what did the idiots do?????? oh yeah, they built a half ass fence that wound up costing taxpayers a billion bucks. At cost like that I can't see this country affording any more Republican immigration legislation myself.

And when the Democrats had a shot at the same type of legislation in 2009, the had a filibuster proof Senate, the House and the Presidency and they did nothing, now it is something Obama has been wanting to do all along, except he didn't tell anyone. That is what leads me to believe that this is all planned and staged. Political games and Obama likes to play them.

 

[80zephyr]

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

We can't? All Americans have birth certificates. All immigrants should have papers that refer to a paper trail to the government process they went thru to get here.

Mark

That isnt what he proposed and you know it.

I was answering you, not him.

Mark

Not an answer.

Yes, it was. You asked if I was in favor of documenting everyone. I said that they already are. What part of that is not an answer?

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

I honestly can't think of a better use of our military. These "wars" we keep fighting are worthless endeavors that cost us blood and treasure.

Maybe its time we took care of us first.

Mark

Thats not an answer to my question.

OK. What do I think it would cost? Billions less than we spend every year supporting the illegals that are here. Do you think thats a fair trade off?

Mark

The cost of illegal immigration is not easily determined. Plenty of sources say we actually come out better. So we would be spending trillions, because we already spend billions, on something that will bring no real benefit.

Studies huh? You're right. Some studies say that illegals are a net gain to the economy. When I hear differing opinions on a problem, I stand back, open my eyes, and let reality sink in.

Know what reality tells me? That if our own poor are a net drag on society, the illegal poor will be as well. Until someone can point out to me how having more uneducated, poor folks in our country is a help, I will continue to let reality be my guide.

Mark

You missed the fact that most illegals are working jobs and earning money.

No, I didn't. Unless they earn middle class pay, at the very least, they become a net drain. Just like poor Americans with jobs are.

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

I honestly can't think of a better use of our military. These "wars" we keep fighting are worthless endeavors that cost us blood and treasure.

Maybe its time we took care of us first.

Mark

Thats not an answer to my question.

OK. What do I think it would cost? Billions less than we spend every year supporting the illegals that are here. Do you think thats a fair trade off?

Mark

The cost of illegal immigration is not easily determined. Plenty of sources say we actually come out better. So we would be spending trillions, because we already spend billions, on something that will bring no real benefit.

Studies huh? You're right. Some studies say that illegals are a net gain to the economy. When I hear differing opinions on a problem, I stand back, open my eyes, and let reality sink in.

Know what reality tells me? That if our own poor are a net drag on society, the illegal poor will be as well. Until someone can point out to me how having more uneducated, poor folks in our country is a help, I will continue to let reality be my guide.

Mark

Prove that "our own poor" are a "net drag" on the economy.

You're kidding, right? Welfare programs, food stamps, tax breaks, etc. provide a safety net for the poor. As a matter of fact, MOST Americans are a net drain on our "welfare state". The poorer you are the worse it is, obviously.

Mark

 

[bripat9643]

border fence is up ... errrr, surf is up ... swim around Juan the rest of the fence is complete.

How stupid do you imagine people are? How hard would it be to put a guard tower at the end of the fence and arrest anyone coming around?

 

[ScienceRocks]

Our GOP can hold the Congress and take the Presidency if

1. we become more populist and less corporatist in the next year

2. we sincerely keep reaching out to women and minorities

3. we work on sincere immigration reform

4. we keep hitting the neo-con and the extremists of the TPM in the collective nose

If the GOP isn't supporting conservative principles, I don't care if they win elections or not. If my choice is between two liberal parties, I can just admit that the progressives have won and wait until the collapse.

Mark

What exactly do you want?

A return to smaller government. Secure borders. A military thats job is to protect the US and not be the worlds policeman(BTW, a military used for defense is a conservative principle, most people probably don't know about).

Mark

The government has invested in science, r&d and infrastructure since the 19th century. The contiential rail-road, dams, the interstate, etc. America is at a big disadvantage if we are to only rely on the private sector for everything.

Sure, we need common sense policies that demand us to spend more wisely, but small government for the sake of small government is dumb.

A smaller government when it comes to some regulations might be a good idea. More freedom is good! Just that I don't believe in taking a axe to everything.

 

[80zephyr]

As the GOP takes control of both Houses, we have a president that is forcing them to get immigration reform done or he will take unilateral action.

My prediction is that the GOP controlled Congress will send Obama a bill he will sign, that will include some kind of path to citizenship for those illegals already here.

In conservative circles, immigration is a hot button issue. If passed a good many people will either break away from the GOP and form a new party to combat the "Democratic Lite" GOP party, or they will refuse to vote for them in 2016. With this type of split, the Dems are virtually guaranteed to win almost every race.

My hope is that the GOP see's this issue as being absolutely crucial to their hold on power, and they don't do what I think they are going to.

Mark

I'll take your bet. The GOP will never pass such a bill because the vast majority of Americans won't stand for it unless the border is secured first, and Obama will never sign a bill the truly secures the border.

I hope you are right, I sincerely do. But, if history is our guide, they''ll cave.

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

Thats not an answer to my question.

OK. What do I think it would cost? Billions less than we spend every year supporting the illegals that are here. Do you think thats a fair trade off?

Mark

The cost of illegal immigration is not easily determined. Plenty of sources say we actually come out better. So we would be spending trillions, because we already spend billions, on something that will bring no real benefit.

Studies huh? You're right. Some studies say that illegals are a net gain to the economy. When I hear differing opinions on a problem, I stand back, open my eyes, and let reality sink in.

Know what reality tells me? That if our own poor are a net drag on society, the illegal poor will be as well. Until someone can point out to me how having more uneducated, poor folks in our country is a help, I will continue to let reality be my guide.

Mark

Prove that "our own poor" are a "net drag" on the economy.

Our own poor are likely to be elderly and/or disabled. Immigrants tend to be younger and healthier than people at the low end of the scale in this country.

Unless an immigrant is making a "living" wage, I don't care how "healthy" he is. And since most illegals are uneducated, they will not demand enough in pay to not be a net drag.

Mark

 

[JakeStarkey]

Immigrants are a much better deal than our under-educated trash classes that want to sit on their asses.

If the GOP offered a comprehensive immigration program with a sealed border and made it public, Obama would sign it.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Aww, how nice. that Fascist Dictator Obama is FORCING them to get immigration REFORM done. You see folks Obama hasn't learned a gawddam thing with you kicking his party out of the house first and now the Senate. And as if we needed it Reformed just because he says to needs to be. which will turn out like how he REFORMED our heath care

garbage, expensive, Fascism, etc and then Hopefully the people will ROMP out the Democrats from the Presidency and from ALL power over us, NEXT.

so you don't want anything done about immigration , you just wanted to call the POTUS a few talking point names. .. got it.

if the Republicans really wanted to pass immigration legislation they had THE OPPORTUNITY when 43 was the POTUS and the Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress (remember that - lol)

but nooooooooooooo ... what did the idiots do?????? oh yeah, they built a half ass fence that wound up costing taxpayers a billion bucks. At cost like that I can't see this country affording any more Republican immigration legislation myself.

Close the borders and hang anyone that is trespassing in my country without authorization

 

[JakeStarkey]

I can see it now, the movie

"Mr bigrebnc1775 smith goes to Washington (with his lynch rope in hand)"

 

[The Rabbi]

Thats not an answer to my question.

OK. What do I think it would cost? Billions less than we spend every year supporting the illegals that are here. Do you think thats a fair trade off?

Mark

The cost of illegal immigration is not easily determined. Plenty of sources say we actually come out better. So we would be spending trillions, because we already spend billions, on something that will bring no real benefit.

Studies huh? You're right. Some studies say that illegals are a net gain to the economy. When I hear differing opinions on a problem, I stand back, open my eyes, and let reality sink in.

Know what reality tells me? That if our own poor are a net drag on society, the illegal poor will be as well. Until someone can point out to me how having more uneducated, poor folks in our country is a help, I will continue to let reality be my guide.

Mark

You missed the fact that most illegals are working jobs and earning money.

No, I didn't. Unless they earn middle class pay, at the very least, they become a net drain. Just like poor Americans with jobs are.

Mark

And yet one of the complaints is illegals send millions of dollars back home. Where do you think they got millions of dollars from? They stole it?