A Prediction. The Dems will romp in the next election.

[The Rabbi]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

why not? we went terrorist huntin' 9000 miles from home under the same damn guise ...

Thats not really an answer.

 

[mudwhistle]

As the GOP takes control of both Houses, we have a president that is forcing them to get immigration reform done or he will take unilateral action.

My prediction is that the GOP controlled Congress will send Obama a bill he will sign, that will include some kind of path to citizenship for those illegals already here.

In conservative circles, immigration is a hot button issue. If passed a good many people will either break away from the GOP and form a new party to combat the "Democratic Lite" GOP party, or they will refuse to vote for them in 2016. With this type of split, the Dems are virtually guaranteed to win almost every race.

My hope is that the GOP see's this issue as being absolutely crucial to their hold on power, and they don't do what I think they are going to.

Mark

 

[The Rabbi]

bullshit ...

and the Mexicans wouldn't cut holes in a full fence and help themselves to American soil?

enforce the damn laws on the books TO THE LETTER OR stfu about immigration LAWS ... PERIOD!

I favour a machine gun every 300 yards, until this shit stops.

I'd also like to see workers get to go through a gate, get photo ID, finger printed, and iris scanned.

If things got better, I'd forgo the microchipping for now.

What do you suppose it would cost to man a machine gun every 300 yards? By my reckoning that's nearly 12,000 machine guns, not to mention the supply, transportation etc.

far more than it would cost to provide meds for idiots like you ...

Link?

your breath and a pair of dirty socks are linked together, so

OK so you've taken yourself out of serious discussion because you've never thought about these issues beyond bumer sticker slogans.
Thanks for playing. You're dismissed.

 

[westwall]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

Every American is already documented at the State level. What we don't have is a national data base. That's all you need is the State level ID's. The criminal element would be the easiest to send back, obviously. But the rest aren't nearly as hard as you think. Additionally the majority of identity theft in this country is to support the illegal population. My social security number is being used by 7
illegals as it is. Every one of them is committing a crime in addition to their merely being here. That shit needs to stop.

 

[The Rabbi]

Aww, how nice. that Fascist Dictator Obama is FORCING them to get immigration REFORM done. You see folks Obama hasn't learned a gawddam thing with you kicking his party out of the house first and now the Senate. And as if we needed it Reformed just because he says to needs to be. which will turn out like how he REFORMED our heath care

garbage, expensive, Fascism, etc and then Hopefully the people will ROMP out the Democrats from the Presidency and from ALL power over us, NEXT.

so you don't want anything done about immigration , you just wanted to call the POTUS a few talking point names. .. got it.

if the Republicans really wanted to pass immigration legislation they had THE OPPORTUNITY when 43 was the POTUS and the Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress (remember that - lol)

but nooooooooooooo ... what did the idiots do?????? oh yeah, they built a half ass fence that wound up costing taxpayers a billion bucks. At cost like that I can't see this country affording any more Republican immigration legislation myself.

The only reform that needs to be done is streamline the existing process. Seal the border. Deport all who are here illegally. Anything else is an attack on the sovereignty of the USA promulgated by a bunch of corrupt Mexican plutocrats who foist off their problems on us. Mexico is the 5th wealthiest country in the world in terms of mineral wealth and they have a small ruling elite that fuck over campesinos and send them north to relive the pressure.

Fuck that. Let Mexico have a proper revolution and get rid of those scumbags.

What would it cost to deport 11M people? It's about $20k per so do the math. What would we get in exchange? Keep in mnd some people have been deported 2 and 3 times.

The problem is they don't STAY deported. Because there's no border defense. At 20k each to deport that is cheaper than the environmental, economic, and criminal damage that they inflict on the US. At least four hospitals along the border have been closed due to losses thanks to the illegal problem. BILLIONS of dollars are squandered every year to support those who haven't paid a dime into the system.

As I stated earlier, a 20 foot high wall, with an 8 foot tubular steel structure along the top and anchored at least 20 feet deep in areas that are readily accessible, and troops in training, supported by technology, along the border where access isn't easy would serve to protect our borders.

The troops have to be trained anyway, and this way they get to do double duty at the same time.

The actual cost of illegal immigrants is hotly debated and by no means settled. By one account they benefit the country since often they work with fake documents, pay witholding but of course never claim the benefits.
Spending that much with uncertain benefit is ludicrous.

 

[The Rabbi]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

Every American is already documented at the State level. What we don't have is a national data base. That's all you need is the State level ID's. The criminal element would be the easiest to send back, obviously. But the rest aren't nearly as hard as you think. Additionally the majority of identity theft in this country is to support the illegal population. My social security number is being used by 7
illegals as it is. Every one of them is committing a crime in addition to their merely being here. That shit needs to stop.

OK so you want a Nazi or Soviet style system where every American is able to tracked via unique IDs. And you expect that the goverment, which never abuses its power via the IRS, ICE, EPA or Dept of Labor will also not abuse this information.
No thanks.

 

[Siete]

phone taps
Overhead drones
cameras on every corner

and finally a picture ID filed in a national data base

BRILLIANT !

who said Republicans want smaller government anyway?

oh yeah, the Republicans said that.

 

[Siete]

I favour a machine gun every 300 yards, until this shit stops.

I'd also like to see workers get to go through a gate, get photo ID, finger printed, and iris scanned.

If things got better, I'd forgo the microchipping for now.

What do you suppose it would cost to man a machine gun every 300 yards? By my reckoning that's nearly 12,000 machine guns, not to mention the supply, transportation etc.

far more than it would cost to provide meds for idiots like you ...

Link?

your breath and a pair of dirty socks are linked together, so

OK so you've taken yourself out of serious discussion because you've never thought about these issues beyond bumer sticker slogans.
Thanks for playing. You're dismissed.

land mines and machine guns along the border, and you expect a serious discussion?

ok then, seriously. GFY.

 

[80zephyr]

A path to citizenship will split the party in two.

Mark

A lot of people will scream "Amnesty" but cooler heads will prevail.
If the radical anti immigration were so powerful Tom Tancredo would have been the presidential candidate.

What do you consider "radical"?

Mark

Build a fence, mine it, turn America into a police state.

Is protecting your borders a police state? If true, we already are a police state.

Mark

yes or no ?

To what?

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

A path to citizenship will split the party in two.

Mark

A lot of people will scream "Amnesty" but cooler heads will prevail.
If the radical anti immigration were so powerful Tom Tancredo would have been the presidential candidate.

What do you consider "radical"?

Mark

Build a fence, mine it, turn America into a police state.

Is protecting your borders a police state? If true, we already are a police state.

Mark

Protecting the border is not the same as militarizing it. Look at places that have high walls, mines and soldiers trained to shoot. China. North Korea. The old Soviet Union. Is that really what we want here?
Change the law so people who legitimately want to come here to work can. That will cut illegal crossings by a serious magnitude.

Um, those walls are used to keep their people in. Not a valid comparison.

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

phone taps
Overhead drones
cameras on every corner

and finally a picture ID filed in a national data base

BRILLIANT !

who said Republicans want smaller government anyway?

oh yeah, the Republicans said that.

Projecting all of that on simple protection of our borders is just that. Projecting.

Mark

 

[The Rabbi]

A lot of people will scream "Amnesty" but cooler heads will prevail.
If the radical anti immigration were so powerful Tom Tancredo would have been the presidential candidate.

What do you consider "radical"?

Mark

Build a fence, mine it, turn America into a police state.

Is protecting your borders a police state? If true, we already are a police state.

Mark

Protecting the border is not the same as militarizing it. Look at places that have high walls, mines and soldiers trained to shoot. China. North Korea. The old Soviet Union. Is that really what we want here?
Change the law so people who legitimately want to come here to work can. That will cut illegal crossings by a serious magnitude.

Um, those walls are used to keep their people in. Not a valid comparison.

Mark

It prevents free movement of people, which is a basic conservative principle.

 

[80zephyr]

The Republicans should have built a full-assed fence when they had the chance.

bullshit ...

and the Mexicans wouldn't cut holes in a full fence and help themselves to American soil?

enforce the damn laws on the books TO THE LETTER OR stfu about immigration LAWS ... PERIOD!

I favour a machine gun every 300 yards, until this shit stops.

I'd also like to see workers get to go through a gate, get photo ID, finger printed, and iris scanned.

If things got better, I'd forgo the microchipping for now.

What do you suppose it would cost to man a machine gun every 300 yards? By my reckoning that's nearly 12,000 machine guns, not to mention the supply, transportation etc.

I honestly can't think of a better use of our military. These "wars" we keep fighting are worthless endeavors that cost us blood and treasure.

Maybe its time we took care of us first.

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

Aww, how nice. that Fascist Dictator Obama is FORCING them to get immigration REFORM done. You see folks Obama hasn't learned a gawddam thing with you kicking his party out of the house first and now the Senate. And as if we needed it Reformed just because he says to needs to be. which will turn out like how he REFORMED our heath care

garbage, expensive, Fascism, etc and then Hopefully the people will ROMP out the Democrats from the Presidency and from ALL power over us, NEXT.

so you don't want anything done about immigration , you just wanted to call the POTUS a few talking point names. .. got it.

if the Republicans really wanted to pass immigration legislation they had THE OPPORTUNITY when 43 was the POTUS and the Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress (remember that - lol)

but nooooooooooooo ... what did the idiots do?????? oh yeah, they built a half ass fence that wound up costing taxpayers a billion bucks. At cost like that I can't see this country affording any more Republican immigration legislation myself.

No need to deport them. If conditions are right, they'll leave on their own.

Mark



The only reform that needs to be done is streamline the existing process. Seal the border. Deport all who are here illegally. Anything else is an attack on the sovereignty of the USA promulgated by a bunch of corrupt Mexican plutocrats who foist off their problems on us. Mexico is the 5th wealthiest country in the world in terms of mineral wealth and they have a small ruling elite that fuck over campesinos and send them north to relive the pressure.

Fuck that. Let Mexico have a proper revolution and get rid of those scumbags.

What would it cost to deport 11M people? It's about $20k per so do the math. What would we get in exchange? Keep in mnd some people have been deported 2 and 3 times.

 

[80zephyr]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

We can't? All Americans have birth certificates. All immigrants should have papers that refer to a paper trail to the government process they went thru to get here.

Mark

 

[The Rabbi]

The Republicans should have built a full-assed fence when they had the chance.

bullshit ...

and the Mexicans wouldn't cut holes in a full fence and help themselves to American soil?

enforce the damn laws on the books TO THE LETTER OR stfu about immigration LAWS ... PERIOD!

I favour a machine gun every 300 yards, until this shit stops.

I'd also like to see workers get to go through a gate, get photo ID, finger printed, and iris scanned.

If things got better, I'd forgo the microchipping for now.

What do you suppose it would cost to man a machine gun every 300 yards? By my reckoning that's nearly 12,000 machine guns, not to mention the supply, transportation etc.

I honestly can't think of a better use of our military. These "wars" we keep fighting are worthless endeavors that cost us blood and treasure.

Maybe its time we took care of us first.

Mark

Thats not an answer to my question.

 

[The Rabbi]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

We can't? All Americans have birth certificates. All immigrants should have papers that refer to a paper trail to the government process they went thru to get here.

Mark

That isnt what he proposed and you know it.

 

[80zephyr]

What do you consider "radical"?

Mark

Build a fence, mine it, turn America into a police state.

Is protecting your borders a police state? If true, we already are a police state.

Mark

Protecting the border is not the same as militarizing it. Look at places that have high walls, mines and soldiers trained to shoot. China. North Korea. The old Soviet Union. Is that really what we want here?
Change the law so people who legitimately want to come here to work can. That will cut illegal crossings by a serious magnitude.

Um, those walls are used to keep their people in. Not a valid comparison.

Mark

It prevents free movement of people, which is a basic conservative principle.

It doesn't nothing to stop our own people from travel that want to do so. Stopping an illegal activity is also a conservative principle, don't you think?

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

The Republicans should have built a full-assed fence when they had the chance.

bullshit ...

and the Mexicans wouldn't cut holes in a full fence and help themselves to American soil?

enforce the damn laws on the books TO THE LETTER OR stfu about immigration LAWS ... PERIOD!

I favour a machine gun every 300 yards, until this shit stops.

I'd also like to see workers get to go through a gate, get photo ID, finger printed, and iris scanned.

If things got better, I'd forgo the microchipping for now.

What do you suppose it would cost to man a machine gun every 300 yards? By my reckoning that's nearly 12,000 machine guns, not to mention the supply, transportation etc.

I honestly can't think of a better use of our military. These "wars" we keep fighting are worthless endeavors that cost us blood and treasure.

Maybe its time we took care of us first.

Mark

Thats not an answer to my question.

OK. What do I think it would cost? Billions less than we spend every year supporting the illegals that are here. Do you think thats a fair trade off?

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

The GOP doesnt have to do anything on immigration. They probably will. And with any luck they will dodge the two extremes. Those would be the "Build a bigger fence and deport all illegals" on one side and "let everyone in and sign them up for welfare at the door" on the other.

I say let them in and let them work, no welfare for them, no welfare for any American that refuses a job an immigrant applies for.

If we can track every Americans entire medical life through PP/ACA, we can keep track of who wants to work, and who wants to starve.

OK so you're basically in favor of documenting every American as well. Because you can't really distinguish an illegal immigrant from a legal American any other way.

We can't? All Americans have birth certificates. All immigrants should have papers that refer to a paper trail to the government process they went thru to get here.

Mark

That isnt what he proposed and you know it.

I was answering you, not him.

Mark