Another school shooting....time to arm the teachers?

[Cecilie1200]

Many, if not most people, who have guns are trained on how to use them and how to treat them safely. Would it surprise you to find out that Adam Lanza was trained in how to use them safely? It would not surprise me at all. From what I have heard, people who knew him are shocked that he would have done this. He simply snapped!

As to whether or not teachers would be anymore mentally unbalanced than professional security people, does it matter? You don't think professional security people can simply snap?

And as to the final bit about your child being safer with a teacher than a crazed gunman... well, first the chances of the teacher actually being able to stop him... remember, the guns are locked up and in this case I understand it was two classes in one room... how do you expect the teacher to get to the "gun cabinet", unlock the cabinet, prepare the weapon to fire (especially since the chances are very great that they would be required to keep the ammunition in a separate location) and shoot the assailant before he kills all the students and the teacher? Follow that up with the fact that a gun in the "home" school in this case, is more likely to hurt or kill a loved one than an intruder and I think you are opening up the floodgates to disaster rather than protecting the children.

Immie

So you devise a system that keeps the weapon away from the kids but the teacher can get to and utilize quickly. It wouldn't be rocket science. I can't believe that American technology is so rusty they couldn't figure out how to do it. But yesterday, I can't imagine any of us would not have wholeheartedly supported any teacher who managed to gun down the gunman before he murdered all those kids.

Sure, that teacher would have been a hero, but then chances are good that the teacher in question would never have accomplished the heroic deeds you speak of without getting him/herself killed and maybe others.

I don't see your scenario as having a snowball's chance in Hell of happening. The guy didn't walk up to the room, knock on the door, say, "excuse me, I am stepping out and in 35 seconds I will return and kill all the children and teachers in the room". Unfortunately, I suspect those poor children were dead before one of the teachers could even have made it to her desk let alone find her keys to unlock the drawer in which the gun would have been stored.

Immie

I am a parent of a 17-year-old and a 4-year-old. I have to tell you that my safety concerns for them are all about the crazed gunmen I KNOW are shooting up schools than they are for some hypothetical "teacher who thinks he's Rambo and kills someone with a stray bullet", or "the teacher who tries to stop the gunman might get killed himself", or whatever other scenarios you and the others have imagined that could go wrong in the process of trying to protect my children from the . . . let me repeat this . . . CRAZED GUNMEN WHO ARE DEFINITELY SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Only with liberals does the imaginary hypothesis require more defense against it than the real danger.

I haven't said a damned thing about "locking it in her desk", by the way. MY belief is that we need to have a trained first-response team of teachers in every school who actually carry a weapon on their persons.

And no, I am also not concerned about the hypothetical possibility that a student might disarm the teacher and shoot up the place. I'm still too busy being concerned about the VERY REAL CRAZED GUNMEN SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Forgive me if my obsession with reality is tiresome to you.

 

[squeeze berry]

teachers have already passed several background checks.

If they already own a gun they passed another check.

All that would be needed is the CCW license and the mandatory course to get the CCW.

The school district may want to have the county sheriff office do another course as well and there is likely the continuing qualification course likely in the form of a workshop.


In all honesty I would not want to carry a gun to work. If they offer the option, I will in good conscience , take the training

it's probably a moot point anyway. Don't see it happening.

 

[squeeze berry]

So you devise a system that keeps the weapon away from the kids but the teacher can get to and utilize quickly. It wouldn't be rocket science. I can't believe that American technology is so rusty they couldn't figure out how to do it. But yesterday, I can't imagine any of us would not have wholeheartedly supported any teacher who managed to gun down the gunman before he murdered all those kids.

Sure, that teacher would have been a hero, but then chances are good that the teacher in question would never have accomplished the heroic deeds you speak of without getting him/herself killed and maybe others.

I don't see your scenario as having a snowball's chance in Hell of happening. The guy didn't walk up to the room, knock on the door, say, "excuse me, I am stepping out and in 35 seconds I will return and kill all the children and teachers in the room". Unfortunately, I suspect those poor children were dead before one of the teachers could even have made it to her desk let alone find her keys to unlock the drawer in which the gun would have been stored.

Immie

I am a parent of a 17-year-old and a 4-year-old. I have to tell you that my safety concerns for them are all about the crazed gunmen I KNOW are shooting up schools than they are for some hypothetical "teacher who thinks he's Rambo and kills someone with a stray bullet", or "the teacher who tries to stop the gunman might get killed himself", or whatever other scenarios you and the others have imagined that could go wrong in the process of trying to protect my children from the . . . let me repeat this . . . CRAZED GUNMEN WHO ARE DEFINITELY SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Only with liberals does the imaginary hypothesis require more defense against it than the real danger.

I haven't said a damned thing about "locking it in her desk", by the way. MY belief is that we need to have a trained first-response team of teachers in every school who actually carry a weapon on their persons.

And no, I am also not concerned about the hypothetical possibility that a student might disarm the teacher and shoot up the place. I'm still too busy being concerned about the VERY REAL CRAZED GUNMEN SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Forgive me if my obsession with reality is tiresome to you.

hold it

Time out

a 17 year old and a 4 year old ???

 

[bodecea]

So you devise a system that keeps the weapon away from the kids but the teacher can get to and utilize quickly. It wouldn't be rocket science. I can't believe that American technology is so rusty they couldn't figure out how to do it. But yesterday, I can't imagine any of us would not have wholeheartedly supported any teacher who managed to gun down the gunman before he murdered all those kids.

Sure, that teacher would have been a hero, but then chances are good that the teacher in question would never have accomplished the heroic deeds you speak of without getting him/herself killed and maybe others.

I don't see your scenario as having a snowball's chance in Hell of happening. The guy didn't walk up to the room, knock on the door, say, "excuse me, I am stepping out and in 35 seconds I will return and kill all the children and teachers in the room". Unfortunately, I suspect those poor children were dead before one of the teachers could even have made it to her desk let alone find her keys to unlock the drawer in which the gun would have been stored.

Immie

I am a parent of a 17-year-old and a 4-year-old. I have to tell you that my safety concerns for them are all about the crazed gunmen I KNOW are shooting up schools than they are for some hypothetical "teacher who thinks he's Rambo and kills someone with a stray bullet", or "the teacher who tries to stop the gunman might get killed himself", or whatever other scenarios you and the others have imagined that could go wrong in the process of trying to protect my children from the . . . let me repeat this . . . CRAZED GUNMEN WHO ARE DEFINITELY SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Only with liberals does the imaginary hypothesis require more defense against it than the real danger.

I haven't said a damned thing about "locking it in her desk", by the way. MY belief is that we need to have a trained first-response team of teachers in every school who actually carry a weapon on their persons.

And no, I am also not concerned about the hypothetical possibility that a student might disarm the teacher and shoot up the place. I'm still too busy being concerned about the VERY REAL CRAZED GUNMEN SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Forgive me if my obsession with reality is tiresome to you.

This is an excellent idea. Lets have all schools have armed teachers for that once in a decade crazed shooter.

 

[Foxfyre]

Many, if not most people, who have guns are trained on how to use them and how to treat them safely. Would it surprise you to find out that Adam Lanza was trained in how to use them safely? It would not surprise me at all. From what I have heard, people who knew him are shocked that he would have done this. He simply snapped!

As to whether or not teachers would be anymore mentally unbalanced than professional security people, does it matter? You don't think professional security people can simply snap?

And as to the final bit about your child being safer with a teacher than a crazed gunman... well, first the chances of the teacher actually being able to stop him... remember, the guns are locked up and in this case I understand it was two classes in one room... how do you expect the teacher to get to the "gun cabinet", unlock the cabinet, prepare the weapon to fire (especially since the chances are very great that they would be required to keep the ammunition in a separate location) and shoot the assailant before he kills all the students and the teacher? Follow that up with the fact that a gun in the "home" school in this case, is more likely to hurt or kill a loved one than an intruder and I think you are opening up the floodgates to disaster rather than protecting the children.

Immie

So you devise a system that keeps the weapon away from the kids but the teacher can get to and utilize quickly. It wouldn't be rocket science. I can't believe that American technology is so rusty they couldn't figure out how to do it. But yesterday, I can't imagine any of us would not have wholeheartedly supported any teacher who managed to gun down the gunman before he murdered all those kids.

Truth. Why not hire teachers with concealed carry training and permits. Even if they were all required to have them it is unlikely more than a few would do so on any given day.
As has been said-it's not recket science and if a teacher is too dumb to learn how to handle and use a firearm safely he/she is too dumb to be teaching my kids anyway. Or driving a car for that matter.

We're almost on the same page here but not quite. Again, I don't think a concealed carry permit or special training in the use of firearms should be a requisite in order to receive teacher certification. But I know enough teachers who DO carry and others who I believe would be quite open to taking the requisite training and I think there would always be enough who would cherish the ability to defend themselves and the kids that such a system would work.

 

[bodecea]

kids might be more respectful to a teacher that has an open carry

There is that!

However, I was no terror, but I was no angel either. I don't think as a kid, I would have even considered that as a problem. Remember, kids think that they are immortal. Also, I don't think we were talking about open carry... like that would ever pass!

Immie

Given that teachers manage not to "snap" and slap the shit out of annoying kids, I don't think they're any more likely to "snap" and shoot them.

But then, I don't go through life with the belief that everyone around me is a ticking time bomb I have to be terrified of, either.

Again, an excellent idea. Maybe parents would treat teachers with a little more respect at parent conference time.

Teachers can even apply the "stand your ground" laws if parents get a little hostile.

 

[KudoZ]

At least give them tazers.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Sure, that teacher would have been a hero, but then chances are good that the teacher in question would never have accomplished the heroic deeds you speak of without getting him/herself killed and maybe others.

I don't see your scenario as having a snowball's chance in Hell of happening. The guy didn't walk up to the room, knock on the door, say, "excuse me, I am stepping out and in 35 seconds I will return and kill all the children and teachers in the room". Unfortunately, I suspect those poor children were dead before one of the teachers could even have made it to her desk let alone find her keys to unlock the drawer in which the gun would have been stored.

Immie

I am a parent of a 17-year-old and a 4-year-old. I have to tell you that my safety concerns for them are all about the crazed gunmen I KNOW are shooting up schools than they are for some hypothetical "teacher who thinks he's Rambo and kills someone with a stray bullet", or "the teacher who tries to stop the gunman might get killed himself", or whatever other scenarios you and the others have imagined that could go wrong in the process of trying to protect my children from the . . . let me repeat this . . . CRAZED GUNMEN WHO ARE DEFINITELY SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Only with liberals does the imaginary hypothesis require more defense against it than the real danger.

I haven't said a damned thing about "locking it in her desk", by the way. MY belief is that we need to have a trained first-response team of teachers in every school who actually carry a weapon on their persons.

And no, I am also not concerned about the hypothetical possibility that a student might disarm the teacher and shoot up the place. I'm still too busy being concerned about the VERY REAL CRAZED GUNMEN SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Forgive me if my obsession with reality is tiresome to you.

hold it

Time out

a 17 year old and a 4 year old ???

I also have a 23-year-old daughter, who has two children. You had a point to make?

 

[squeeze berry]

I am a parent of a 17-year-old and a 4-year-old. I have to tell you that my safety concerns for them are all about the crazed gunmen I KNOW are shooting up schools than they are for some hypothetical "teacher who thinks he's Rambo and kills someone with a stray bullet", or "the teacher who tries to stop the gunman might get killed himself", or whatever other scenarios you and the others have imagined that could go wrong in the process of trying to protect my children from the . . . let me repeat this . . . CRAZED GUNMEN WHO ARE DEFINITELY SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Only with liberals does the imaginary hypothesis require more defense against it than the real danger.

I haven't said a damned thing about "locking it in her desk", by the way. MY belief is that we need to have a trained first-response team of teachers in every school who actually carry a weapon on their persons.

And no, I am also not concerned about the hypothetical possibility that a student might disarm the teacher and shoot up the place. I'm still too busy being concerned about the VERY REAL CRAZED GUNMEN SHOOTING UP SCHOOLS.

Forgive me if my obsession with reality is tiresome to you.

hold it

Time out

a 17 year old and a 4 year old ???

I also have a 23-year-old daughter, who has two children. You had a point to make?

that's quite a point spread

holy cow

 

[JakeStarkey]

An old Manchu airborne knows BS when he smells it, and that is what you are shoveling, 9thIDdoc. No, civilians don't do that: over and over. It's not their life, their profession.

We need honest appraisal, clear thinking, and your statement below is neither.

False analogy. The military accepts friendly fire as a real event and trains for it. Over and over. Civilians don't do that.

Wrong. Some do and there is no reason others can't. Firearms can and should begin in school

 

[koshergrl]

I love the fact that people are acting as if we have to manage teachers carefully lest they kill our children, through stupidity or some crazy snapping behavior.

Fucking ridiculous.

 

[koshergrl]

I have a 27 year old, 26 year old, 10 year old and 9 year old.

Are we not supposed to have children spread out? my oldest was 17 when my youngest was born.

 

[squeeze berry]

I have a 27 year old, 26 year old, 10 year old and 9 year old.

Are we not supposed to have children spread out? my oldest was 17 when my youngest was born.

my question is what happened, or didn't happen, in those intervening 16 years?

or should I just leave that up to my twisted imagination?

 

[Cecilie1200]

hold it

Time out

a 17 year old and a 4 year old ???

I also have a 23-year-old daughter, who has two children. You had a point to make?

that's quite a point spread

holy cow

When the birth control people say their products are "99% effective", they really, REALLY mean it.

And God seemed to think 40 wasn't too old to have a baby, even though I did.

I will tell you, however, that he is the most beautiful, adorable, amusing child who has ever existed, and absolutely the light of his entire family's lives, including the 17-year-old brother, who does a lot of babysitting.

Anyone takes a gun into HIS school, they'd better not thinking killing themselves and going to Hell is going to be enough to save them from ME.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I have a 27 year old, 26 year old, 10 year old and 9 year old.

Are we not supposed to have children spread out? my oldest was 17 when my youngest was born.

My oldest was 19 when her little brother was born, and has a child who is a year older than his Uncle Quinlan. His little sister is a year younger than her Uncle Quinlan.

Funniest thing, though, is that my grandson is black, and my granddaughter and youngest son are both albino-pale blondes. You should see the looks from people when we take them out together, as they try to work out the relationships.

 

[JoeB131]

Of course, we could take the UK or Australian route and confiscate civilian firearms but unfortunately, that only caused violent and gun crime to skyrocket.

So, what's your solution?

58 Murders a Year by Firearms in Britain, 8,775 in US

umber of Murders, United States, 2010: 12,996

Number of Murders by Firearms, US, 2010: 8,775

Number of Murders, Britain, 2011*: 638
(Since Britain's population is 1/5 that of US, this is equivalent to 3,095 US murders)

Number of Murders by firearms, Britain, 2011*: 58

Meanwhile in the land down under....

Gun deaths halved in past 10 years - www.theage.com.au

The number of deaths caused by firearms dropped almost 50 per cent between 1991 and 2001, with the biggest yearly fall in deaths coming after the 1996 Port Arthur massacre.

Homicides dropped to 47 in 2001 from 84 in 1991, accidental deaths dropped to 18 from 29, while other forms of firearm deaths slipped to seven from 11.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I have a 27 year old, 26 year old, 10 year old and 9 year old.

Are we not supposed to have children spread out? my oldest was 17 when my youngest was born.

my question is what happened, or didn't happen, in those intervening 16 years?

or should I just leave that up to my twisted imagination?

I took lots and lots of birth control, and hoped that when I turned forty and had a grandchild, we were done with that whole "childbearing" thing. God had other ideas, and a demented sense of humor.

 

[Samson]

And what point was that ?

It would cost more money on a already taxed educational system. When you trained a few educated teachers in the use of firearm it would cut the cost of hiring new people.

Not about the money anymore, and it shouldn't be..... It should be about getting a better system in place quickly for these vulnerable areas that we have, especially at these schools.. Then we can work on the bad culture problem in America.. We have to many kids living in single parent households anymore, and why is that ? We have to high an unemployment rate among the young adults in this nation anymore, and why is that ? We have to many kids on drugs anymore, and why is that ? We have way to much rebellion anymore, and why is that ? We have no future outlook anymore, and why is that ? Add to this if you like..

Increases in government spending haven't helped.

Wonder why.....



Maybe throwing money at every issue is not effective.....

 

[Samson]

Of course, we could take the UK or Australian route and confiscate civilian firearms but unfortunately, that only caused violent and gun crime to skyrocket.

So, what's your solution?

58 Murders a Year by Firearms in Britain, 8,775 in US

umber of Murders, United States, 2010: 12,996

Number of Murders by Firearms, US, 2010: 8,775

Number of Murders, Britain, 2011*: 638
(Since Britain's population is 1/5 that of US, this is equivalent to 3,095 US murders)

Number of Murders by firearms, Britain, 2011*: 58

Meanwhile in the land down under....

Gun deaths halved in past 10 years - www.theage.com.au

The number of deaths caused by firearms dropped almost 50 per cent between 1991 and 2001, with the biggest yearly fall in deaths coming after the 1996 Port Arthur massacre.

Homicides dropped to 47 in 2001 from 84 in 1991, accidental deaths dropped to 18 from 29, while other forms of firearm deaths slipped to seven from 11.

I wonder if you realize that the demographics of GB and the USA are not the same.

For example; guess what? GB doesn't border Mexico.

 

[Samson]

I love the fact that people are acting as if we have to manage teachers carefully lest they kill our children, through stupidity or some crazy snapping behavior.

Fucking ridiculous.

I like the idea that some would like to create another branch of federal government specifically dedicated to placing armed guards into every school in the USA, a la "Homeland security" at every airport.

I'm hoping to retire early, and I'll need the income as a member of the Education Security Department....$50 K/year. Federal Bennies, and Union Bargaining power should do the trick!