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For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.We get it. The Nazis did very bad things. Can we get back to gun control in the 21st century US now?One of your comrades just admitted that, despite claims that the founding fathers wanted citizens to arm themselves against an oppressive government, we don't need to worry about that anymore so it doesn't matter what they intended. You two need to sort this out and then attempt to present a united argument, such as it may be.
We need to worry about our government....just ask the Germans...they registered their guns using the same dumb ass arguments you are using right now....the exact same arguments.....when they trusted their government, and expected it to protect them.....20 years later....their government sent 12 million Europeans to the gas chambers....unarmed Europeans....
That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
Wrong.......the German government used the exact same arguments you are using.......the exact same arguments............they registered the guns for the exact same reason you have here......20 years later those registration lists were used to disarm gun owners and Jews...........they gassed them.........the communists disarmed the people of the Balkans....and then after the Soviet Union fell in the 90s........the military mirdered their ethnic enemies.....who were already disarmed........
Mexico disarmed its people.....and now the police and military are helping the drug cartels murder Mexicans in the 10s of thousands...right now...today....right across our border...
I read the 2nd amendment and no where does it say high capacity mags are a right.gun ownership is a Right...driving or flying is not.......
For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.We get it. The Nazis did very bad things. Can we get back to gun control in the 21st century US now?We need to worry about our government....just ask the Germans...they registered their guns using the same dumb ass arguments you are using right now....the exact same arguments.....when they trusted their government, and expected it to protect them.....20 years later....their government sent 12 million Europeans to the gas chambers....unarmed Europeans....
That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
The only reason to register guns is to ban and confiscate them.....that is why we are talking about it now.....
We register automobiles. We already ban some types of guns. No one is talking about banning or confiscating all guns or even most.[/QUOTE
You would be surprised what isnt banned. Most stuff the military uses is perfectly legal.
Flame thowers, armored cars, automatic weapons... Is there no end?Whatever cops and soldiers use...we get...since we are the ones who pay their salaries...they do not run us....we hire and fire them....
When you know who the registered owner of a firearm is, you know who isn't. Penalizing possession of a firearm not registered to the bearer is one of the three gun control steps I explained at the git-go, oh so long ago, before we we got off-track into a 2nd Amendment argument.How does the government knowing where all the LEGAL guns are "promote the general welfare"?"... shall not be infringed" needs to be taken in context. The foundation for the entire constitution is encapsulated in its preamble, where it sets forth the function of our government to "promote the common welfare". It's hard to rationalize blocking public safety efforts as being in the spirit of promoting our welfare, but some folks sure manage to twist and torture its meaning to promote their agenda of fear.
How has background checks promoted the general welfare?
More to the point, just how much freedom and liberty are you willing to give up to feel safe? Me, I'll feel pretty safe with a Glock on my hip, but you go ahead and do what you do to feel safe.
I think that if you were capable of reading what is written rather than what you wish were written, you'd have thrown in the towel long ago.So now you want me to agree with you or die. Seems legit.The court has modified its position on issues as we evolve as a society. Remember the old days, when only human beings had personhood status, not corporations?So, you are in support of an end run around the COTUS. I guess I'm not surprised...Not necessary. Our court will clarify its purpose and meaning as it is applied to 21st century America.View attachment 85287
Good luck repealing that one...
Things change as judicial wisdom changes. Adapt, or die.
The fact is that we do exercise gun control in this country and the only argument is over his much is necessary. We have differing opinions and the prevailing view will become the law of the land.
Suck it up. Times change. We don't get to own slaves anymore. As a matter of fact, Black people (and even women!) can vote now. Homosexuals are free to marry and raise families and children can divorce their parents.
We register motor vehicles, regulate their use and license their operators all in the name of public safety. That doesn't make all vehicles safe to operate or prevent anyone from driving without a license, but it does make our public thoroughfares much safer than the absence of these modest regulations. And none of it interferes with any good citizen owning and operating a motor vehicle.
I expect that there will come a day before too long when we'll regulate the acquisition and use of firearms with an equivalent eye to public safety. I don't see how any special interest can prevent it.
For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.We get it. The Nazis did very bad things. Can we get back to gun control in the 21st century US now?We need to worry about our government....just ask the Germans...they registered their guns using the same dumb ass arguments you are using right now....the exact same arguments.....when they trusted their government, and expected it to protect them.....20 years later....their government sent 12 million Europeans to the gas chambers....unarmed Europeans....
That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
The only reason to register guns is to ban and confiscate them.....that is why we are talking about it now.....
We register automobiles. We already ban some types of guns. No one is talking about banning or confiscating all guns or even most.
Now you're switching to arrests? No.I don't see how it could. What an extraordinary question.If your going to quote me, don't respond to something altogether different. I said registration keeps people in possession of unregistered firearms off the streets.No...it hasn't ....you said if you register guns it keeps unregistered guns off the street.....and provided no explanation as to how that happens.....
I say if you sprinkle pixie dust in the woods during a full moon it will keep guns off the streets....and that is as valid a method as registering guns.........
Again......do you acknowledge that criminals...felons do not have to register illegal guns under Haynes v. United States.....?
How does requiring law abiding gun owners to do paperwork keep criminals, who cannot legally own guns in the first place, from getting illegal guns....
I am calling you out....explain the mechanics of gun registration....how it physically stops a criminal or mass shooter from getting an illegal gun.........
How? There are felons right now...shooting people in Chicago with guns they cannot own or carry......who are not requir d to register those guns...and yet they are carrying them...right now...and shooting people with them....
How does registration physically stop anyone from carrying an unregistered gun?
See post #10: ... serious penalties for possession of firearm not registered the bearer...
Again.......that doesn't answer my question.......we can already arrest criminals who have guns...they do not need to be registered to do that...we can do that right now.......
If a normal gun owner decides to take his gun....even if it is registered like you want...and commit a crime.....we can arrest them...and registering the gun did not stop the crime or help to arrest the guy....he committed a crime with the gun...he can be arrested already...no need to register gums.....
Despite what someone may be convicted of, if he was also in possession of an unregistered firearm he can be put away for much longer. That's the point of registering firearms.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.We get it. The Nazis did very bad things. Can we get back to gun control in the 21st century US now?We need to worry about our government....just ask the Germans...they registered their guns using the same dumb ass arguments you are using right now....the exact same arguments.....when they trusted their government, and expected it to protect them.....20 years later....their government sent 12 million Europeans to the gas chambers....unarmed Europeans....
That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
Wrong.......the German government used the exact same arguments you are using.......the exact same arguments............they registered the guns for the exact same reason you have here......20 years later those registration lists were used to disarm gun owners and Jews...........they gassed them.........the communists disarmed the people of the Balkans....and then after the Soviet Union fell in the 90s........the military mirdered their ethnic enemies.....who were already disarmed........
Mexico disarmed its people.....and now the police and military are helping the drug cartels murder Mexicans in the 10s of thousands...right now...today....right across our border...
The German government did not have our Constitutional right to have arms, a right which has been strongly supported in court rulings. Given that, I think the claim that they're going to disarm the populace similar to Nazi Germany is fear mongering.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
And you think you are trustworthy? You aren't a patriot or the 'defender' of anything. All this nonsense is just a bunch of mems you and your paranoid brethren pass around to each other. You aren't 'real americans', you don't know the Constitution better than anyone else, you don't have any more claim to any part of it than any other American.
And it says right in the 2nd amendment 'well regulated'. That you want to twist the wording in any or all of the amendments doesn't mean you are right or even worth listening to.
Sorry charlie.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
And you think you are trustworthy? You aren't a patriot or the 'defender' of anything. All this nonsense is just a bunch of mems you and your paranoid brethren pass around to each other. You aren't 'real americans', you don't know the Constitution better than anyone else, you don't have any more claim to any part of it than any other American.
And it says right in the 2nd amendment 'well regulated'. That you want to twist the wording in any or all of the amendments doesn't mean you are right or even worth listening to.
Sorry charlie.
The 2nd is written in ink...and you guys still can't read it....but abortion isn't in there and you see it as if it was written on stone...........
This is why we don't trust you..........and never will....
No other country has this right enshrined in the Constitution. Big difference.For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.We get it. The Nazis did very bad things. Can we get back to gun control in the 21st century US now?
That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
The only reason to register guns is to ban and confiscate them.....that is why we are talking about it now.....
We register automobiles. We already ban some types of guns. No one is talking about banning or confiscating all guns or even most.
Yeah...that's what they said in Germany, Britain and Australia...you guys act like there are no examples of this.......all through human history the governments around the world have ended up disarming the people.........you can keep saying you don't want to ban and confiscate guns...history shows you are wrong.
No other country has this right enshrined in the Constitution. Big difference.For the umpteenth time, registration and background checks today in the US is unrelated to disarming Europeans in days of yore.That is getting back to gun control in the 21st century.........they disarmed their people and 20 years later murdered them...because the people didn't have guns..........same thing happened in the Balkans in the 90s...and Rwanda in the 90s.....and it is happening right now in Mexico.....today........again and again unarmed people are murdered by their governments...or the government can't stop one group from slaughtering another group......and you guys pretend like that has no bearing on current discussions......
If all you want to talk about is disarmament, start a thread on that. Some of us are still focused on the subject of this thread.
The only reason to register guns is to ban and confiscate them.....that is why we are talking about it now.....
We register automobiles. We already ban some types of guns. No one is talking about banning or confiscating all guns or even most.
Yeah...that's what they said in Germany, Britain and Australia...you guys act like there are no examples of this.......all through human history the governments around the world have ended up disarming the people.........you can keep saying you don't want to ban and confiscate guns...history shows you are wrong.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
And you think you are trustworthy? You aren't a patriot or the 'defender' of anything. All this nonsense is just a bunch of mems you and your paranoid brethren pass around to each other. You aren't 'real americans', you don't know the Constitution better than anyone else, you don't have any more claim to any part of it than any other American.
And it says right in the 2nd amendment 'well regulated'. That you want to twist the wording in any or all of the amendments doesn't mean you are right or even worth listening to.
Sorry charlie.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
And you think you are trustworthy? You aren't a patriot or the 'defender' of anything. All this nonsense is just a bunch of mems you and your paranoid brethren pass around to each other. You aren't 'real americans', you don't know the Constitution better than anyone else, you don't have any more claim to any part of it than any other American.
And it says right in the 2nd amendment 'well regulated'. That you want to twist the wording in any or all of the amendments doesn't mean you are right or even worth listening to.
Sorry charlie.
I don't know how many times you people have to be told but the term "well regulated" in the 18th century vernacular meant, disciplined or in good order not government controlled
In fact the militia was meant to be a control on placed on the government.
I will allow you only lemon frosting on sponge cake for your birthdays. No vanilla cake, no vanilla or chocolate frosting. You can have fancy fringe frosting but no roses and no writing on your cake. It must look like a plain generic birthday cake you'd find at a supermarket bakery.
What do I want? I want every single human to never again bitch about a 'war on Christmas' and instead just enjoy the godd#$mn holiday and allow the rest of us to do the same. No bitching about cups, or nativity scenes or lack of nativity scenes or nativity scenes with halloween characters standing in for the wise men and the baby Jesus. And since we're here no whining about Halloween, the costumes, the fake 'it's satanic blah blah' nonsense, and just let children have a day where they can dress up and forget the adults exist.
As for guns, high powered rifles a 5 round clip maximum, no sale of weapons designed for military use sold to the public (you have a burning desire to use them join the Marines), extreme background checks and psych evaluations, a 90 day waiting period, and the gun owner forfeits his/her entire financial worth to anyone they wrongly point a gun at or anyone they shoot outside the law, in addition to the criminal charges. There are more but get started on that, I'll be eating delicious vanilla birthday cake with vanilla frosting and watching skeet shooting in RIO.
Thank you ........this is why we don't trust you assholes....
And you think you are trustworthy? You aren't a patriot or the 'defender' of anything. All this nonsense is just a bunch of mems you and your paranoid brethren pass around to each other. You aren't 'real americans', you don't know the Constitution better than anyone else, you don't have any more claim to any part of it than any other American.
And it says right in the 2nd amendment 'well regulated'. That you want to twist the wording in any or all of the amendments doesn't mean you are right or even worth listening to.
Sorry charlie.
I don't know how many times you people have to be told but the term "well regulated" in the 18th century vernacular meant, disciplined or in good order not government controlled
In fact the militia was meant to be a control on placed on the government.
Right you are the expert.
You twist it into whatever fits your world view. That's all.
And that's not going to change. The only way to lose that ability is to seriously break the law, the same way you lose the ability to vote.And that is the only reason we still have the ability to own guns.
And that's not going to change. The only way to lose that ability is to seriously break the law, the same way you lose the ability to vote.And that is the only reason we still have the ability to own guns.
Just about every activity we engage in and every product we use is regulated. Has that led to prohibition or confiscation? Obviously not. Regulation maintains product and consumer safety.
Yet, in your mind, you equate regulation of firearms with some sort of barrier to you, a law-abiding citizen, to continue to enjoy ownership and use.
Why? What in the world is so special about this particular tool that so consumes you? What is it that makes you think that this particular item, this particular activity, is subject to extreme measures unlike anything we've ever experienced in the past?
And please express what you think with something more substantial than regurgitating your pathetic fear of "gun-grabbers". Give us some examples of our past regulatory behavior relevant to this issue. What other product or activity have we ever first regulated, then prohibited? And how was this product or activity equivalent to the constitutionally-protected bearing of arms?
