Are Children A Part Of The Gay Marriage Conversation?

[elektra]

Oh puhleeze. I can't believe anyone is puerile enough to argue about this shit. Is there any detail of human relations, no matter how sordid and distasteful, that you aren't willing to bring up in your quest to give homos a privilege that serves no social purpose in their case?

Stable families is not a social purpose? More people able to access rights is not a social purpose? Decreasing stigma and reducing hateful discrimination is not a social purpose? There are plenty of social purposes served by granting same-sex couples the right to marriage, and there are plenty of social harms inflicted on them by not doing so.

There is not a single valid interest in denying them that right, and there is not a single harm caused to them by granting it.

Yes, no valid interests, coming from a Heterosexual who has no insight through personal experience.

The ignorant close minded will never see nor admit, "valid interests".

What is the valid interest in denying same-sex couples the right to marriage, then? What harm is caused by allowing same-sex couples to marry?

Adoption of heterosexual children.

Gay couples can adopt and raise children together regardless of whether or not they are married.

More on point, how is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

Where is your evidence that children will choose homosexuality over heterosexuality.

Where is your evidence that children have a voice.

 

[elektra]

Adoption of heterosexual children.

You realize that even though SSCM is currently only recognized in - IIRC - 19 states. Homosexual individuals can adopt in about all states.

Kind of blows the rataionlization of "Block SSCM to prevent adoption".

LGBT adoption in the United States - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


States that allow homosexual individuals adoption = 50
States that allow or have no prohibition for same-sex couple adoption = 38


>>>>

I know, Homosexuals can have my children if me and my wife die

A sad state our Nation is in.

Why would homosexuals have your children if you and your wife died?

One of the first things my wife and I did when we had children was make legal arrangements for our children if something were to happen to both of us. Documents for legal guardianship pending adoption. A will including Executorship for existing real property and it's sale. Proceeds of the equity in the home and life insurance - after all bills were paid off - going into a trust with an annual allowance to their new parents to defray their increased costs, and the balance of the trust funding college or being made available to them at age 21. Working with a financial adviser, a 5% rate of return on the initial trust after insurance and home sale would have provided about $5,000 to $10,000 per year for maintenance and $100,000 each for college.

This was all setup while I was an enlisted man in the Navy and the income of my wife and I combined was about $60,000 per year.

It truly is a sad state of our nation if someone is a parent and doesn't plan for their child's life if something happens to them.


>>>>

My personal situation is not the issue.

I come from a broken family of extreme abuse. Family is out of the question.

I work in an industry which is 100% travel, does not leave much time to establish friends where I live, part time.

Finances are tough, I supported homes in two countries while paying thousands to the government for visas. Thousands because of government worker mistakes.

My industry has been getting ruled and regulated out of business by the government, my work has dropped over 50%. That leaves me zero money now, for something like life insurance.

I can go on, but how much of my specifics did you know of when you replied to me.

yes, it is a sorry state of our nation, but not because of me or parents, but because of government.

did you even realize that heterosexual children are being exposed to homosexuals, that the adoption became so widespread, without a single vote at the ballot.

should you not be more concerned with this than my personal situation and the blame you seem to lay at my feet.

You blame the government for issues with your family, but want to use its power to prohibit other families from even existing. The essence of hypocrisy, right there.

Bullshit, you can not answer one question asked of you, so the issue is me, not homosexuality.

Another Bullshit deflection which ignores the voice of the children.

 

[elektra]

Adoption of heterosexual children.

You realize that even though SSCM is currently only recognized in - IIRC - 19 states. Homosexual individuals can adopt in about all states.

Kind of blows the rataionlization of "Block SSCM to prevent adoption".

LGBT adoption in the United States - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


States that allow homosexual individuals adoption = 50
States that allow or have no prohibition for same-sex couple adoption = 38


>>>>

I know, Homosexuals can have my children if me and my wife die

A sad state our Nation is in.

Why would homosexuals have your children if you and your wife died?

One of the first things my wife and I did when we had children was make legal arrangements for our children if something were to happen to both of us. Documents for legal guardianship pending adoption. A will including Executorship for existing real property and it's sale. Proceeds of the equity in the home and life insurance - after all bills were paid off - going into a trust with an annual allowance to their new parents to defray their increased costs, and the balance of the trust funding college or being made available to them at age 21. Working with a financial adviser, a 5% rate of return on the initial trust after insurance and home sale would have provided about $5,000 to $10,000 per year for maintenance and $100,000 each for college.

This was all setup while I was an enlisted man in the Navy and the income of my wife and I combined was about $60,000 per year.

It truly is a sad state of our nation if someone is a parent and doesn't plan for their child's life if something happens to them.


>>>>

My personal situation is not the issue.

I come from a broken family of extreme abuse. Family is out of the question.

I work in an industry which is 100% travel, does not leave much time to establish friends where I live, part time.

Finances are tough, I supported homes in two countries while paying thousands to the government for visas. Thousands because of government worker mistakes.

My industry has been getting ruled and regulated out of business by the government, my work has dropped over 50%. That leaves me zero money now, for something like life insurance.

I can go on, but how much of my specifics did you know of when you replied to me.

yes, it is a sorry state of our nation, but not because of me or parents, but because of government.

did you even realize that heterosexual children are being exposed to homosexuals, that the adoption became so widespread, without a single vote at the ballot.

should you not be more concerned with this than my personal situation and the blame you seem to lay at my feet.

You blame the government for issues with your family, but want to use its power to prohibit other families from even existing. The essence of hypocrisy, right there.

You want to give homosexuals heterosexual children through the power of the government.

Funny how ShackledNation demonstrates ShackledNation's hypocrisy while accusing others of being a hypocrite.

Solely through the force of government without a vote, without the media reporting. Homosexuals can adopt heterosexual children.

Hypocrite!!!!!!

 

[ShackledNation]

You realize that even though SSCM is currently only recognized in - IIRC - 19 states. Homosexual individuals can adopt in about all states.

Kind of blows the rataionlization of "Block SSCM to prevent adoption".

LGBT adoption in the United States - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


States that allow homosexual individuals adoption = 50
States that allow or have no prohibition for same-sex couple adoption = 38


>>>>

I know, Homosexuals can have my children if me and my wife die

A sad state our Nation is in.

Why would homosexuals have your children if you and your wife died?

One of the first things my wife and I did when we had children was make legal arrangements for our children if something were to happen to both of us. Documents for legal guardianship pending adoption. A will including Executorship for existing real property and it's sale. Proceeds of the equity in the home and life insurance - after all bills were paid off - going into a trust with an annual allowance to their new parents to defray their increased costs, and the balance of the trust funding college or being made available to them at age 21. Working with a financial adviser, a 5% rate of return on the initial trust after insurance and home sale would have provided about $5,000 to $10,000 per year for maintenance and $100,000 each for college.

This was all setup while I was an enlisted man in the Navy and the income of my wife and I combined was about $60,000 per year.

It truly is a sad state of our nation if someone is a parent and doesn't plan for their child's life if something happens to them.


>>>>

My personal situation is not the issue.

I come from a broken family of extreme abuse. Family is out of the question.

I work in an industry which is 100% travel, does not leave much time to establish friends where I live, part time.

Finances are tough, I supported homes in two countries while paying thousands to the government for visas. Thousands because of government worker mistakes.

My industry has been getting ruled and regulated out of business by the government, my work has dropped over 50%. That leaves me zero money now, for something like life insurance.

I can go on, but how much of my specifics did you know of when you replied to me.

yes, it is a sorry state of our nation, but not because of me or parents, but because of government.

did you even realize that heterosexual children are being exposed to homosexuals, that the adoption became so widespread, without a single vote at the ballot.

should you not be more concerned with this than my personal situation and the blame you seem to lay at my feet.

You blame the government for issues with your family, but want to use its power to prohibit other families from even existing. The essence of hypocrisy, right there.

You want to give homosexuals heterosexual children through the power of the government.

Funny how ShackledNation demonstrates ShackledNation's hypocrisy while accusing others of being a hypocrite.

Solely through the force of government without a vote, without the media reporting. Homosexuals can adopt heterosexual children.

Hypocrite!!!!!!

People's life decisions do not have to be put up to popular vote. You are advocating tyranny whereby people can only do something if others vote that they can. That goes against the American rule of law, where by rights cannot be voted away. It also demonstrates your double standard once again. Did anyone have to vote on whether or not heterosexual couples could adopt children? Nope.

Meanwhile, you still haven't answered my question.

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

 

[elektra]

Should orphaned heterosexual children have a right to refuse adoption by homosexuals?

The answer is yes.

Should parents have a vote, deciding if orphaned children can choose heterosexual parents. The answer is no, it has been decided already.

Parents had no voice nor vote.

Children had no voice.

The issue is a moot point, government force has dictated homosexuals will have access to heterosexual children. Zero debate or discussion.

 

[ShackledNation]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

 

[elektra]

I know, Homosexuals can have my children if me and my wife die

A sad state our Nation is in.

Why would homosexuals have your children if you and your wife died?

One of the first things my wife and I did when we had children was make legal arrangements for our children if something were to happen to both of us. Documents for legal guardianship pending adoption. A will including Executorship for existing real property and it's sale. Proceeds of the equity in the home and life insurance - after all bills were paid off - going into a trust with an annual allowance to their new parents to defray their increased costs, and the balance of the trust funding college or being made available to them at age 21. Working with a financial adviser, a 5% rate of return on the initial trust after insurance and home sale would have provided about $5,000 to $10,000 per year for maintenance and $100,000 each for college.

This was all setup while I was an enlisted man in the Navy and the income of my wife and I combined was about $60,000 per year.

It truly is a sad state of our nation if someone is a parent and doesn't plan for their child's life if something happens to them.


>>>>

My personal situation is not the issue.

I come from a broken family of extreme abuse. Family is out of the question.

I work in an industry which is 100% travel, does not leave much time to establish friends where I live, part time.

Finances are tough, I supported homes in two countries while paying thousands to the government for visas. Thousands because of government worker mistakes.

My industry has been getting ruled and regulated out of business by the government, my work has dropped over 50%. That leaves me zero money now, for something like life insurance.

I can go on, but how much of my specifics did you know of when you replied to me.

yes, it is a sorry state of our nation, but not because of me or parents, but because of government.

did you even realize that heterosexual children are being exposed to homosexuals, that the adoption became so widespread, without a single vote at the ballot.

should you not be more concerned with this than my personal situation and the blame you seem to lay at my feet.

You blame the government for issues with your family, but want to use its power to prohibit other families from even existing. The essence of hypocrisy, right there.

You want to give homosexuals heterosexual children through the power of the government.

Funny how ShackledNation demonstrates ShackledNation's hypocrisy while accusing others of being a hypocrite.

Solely through the force of government without a vote, without the media reporting. Homosexuals can adopt heterosexual children.

Hypocrite!!!!!!

People's life decisions do not have to be put up to popular vote. You are advocating tyranny whereby people can only do something if others vote that they can. That goes against the American rule of law.

Meanwhile, you still haven't answered my question.

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

Every question I put to you, you answer with an related question.

It is against the rule of law? People's life decisions? Strawman arguments.

A homosexual adopting an orphaned heterosexual child is a life decision the general public has no say in, not even the children have a voice, and to put this issue to a vote would be tyranny?

Yes, what harm can come from the government dictating law without a discussion with the people effected, let alone a vote.

Tyranny.

 

[elektra]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

 

[ShackledNation]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

No, the burden is on you. Since you are so vehemently opposed to same sex marriage, surely you should be able to back up your views. How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

 

[elektra]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

No, the burden is on you. Since you are so vehemently opposed to same sex marriage, surely you should be able to back up your views. How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

If the standard is, "vehemently", and it is plane to see you are vehemently stating and repeatedly demanding, than by your own words the burden is on you to prove your assertion.

 

[ShackledNation]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

No, the burden is on you. Since you are so vehemently opposed to same sex marriage, surely you should be able to back up your views. How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

If the standard is, "vehemently", and it is plane to see you are vehemently stating and repeatedly demanding, than by your own words the burden is on you to prove your assertion.

So you can't provide a single reason why adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples is a harm to anyone? And not one shred of evidence to support it?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Elektra realizes that we are giving children to heterosexuals, when it is heterosexuals who abuse children by many hundreds the time of that of heterosexual adults.

So either end marriage period, or grant marriage equality and step up efforts to go after adult abusers.

 

[JakeStarkey]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

No, the burden is on you. Since you are so vehemently opposed to same sex marriage, surely you should be able to back up your views. How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

If the standard is, "vehemently", and it is plane to see you are vehemently stating and repeatedly demanding, than by your own words the burden is on you to prove your assertion.

So you can't provide a single reason why adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples is a harm to anyone? And not one shred of evidence to support it?

Of course not.

 

[elektra]

Elektra realizes that we are giving children to heterosexuals, when it is heterosexuals who abuse children by many hundreds the time of that of heterosexual adults.

So either end marriage period, or grant marriage equality and step up efforts to go after adult abusers.

Your post makes no sense, did you make a mistake?

 

[elektra]

Elektra realizes that we are giving children to heterosexuals, when it is heterosexuals who abuse children by many hundreds the time of that of heterosexual adults.

So either end marriage period, or grant marriage equality and step up efforts to go after adult abusers.

Heterosexuals are given children? So it's government that creates children?

 

[bodecea]

By your logic, men who masturbate couldn't get erections because they are not sexually attracted to their own hand.

You do not have 100% control over what your small little penis does. If it is physically stimulated enough, it very well could become erect at the hands of another man. Furthermore, gay men in the closet often want to be straight, so it is quite easy to fake it. And unless you have no imagination, fantasizing about gay sex while with a woman is quite possible.

Oh puhleeze. I can't believe anyone is puerile enough to argue about this shit. Is there any detail of human relations, no matter how sordid and distasteful, that you aren't willing to bring up in your quest to give homos a privilege that serves no social purpose in their case?

Stable families is not a social purpose? More people able to access rights is not a social purpose? Decreasing stigma and reducing hateful discrimination is not a social purpose? There are plenty of social purposes served by granting same-sex couples the right to marriage, and there are plenty of social harms inflicted on them by not doing so.

There is not a single valid interest in denying them that right, and there is not a single harm caused to them by granting it.

Yes, no valid interests, coming from a Heterosexual who has no insight through personal experience.

The ignorant close minded will never see nor admit, "valid interests".

What is the valid interest in denying same-sex couples the right to marriage, then? What harm is caused by allowing same-sex couples to marry?

Adoption of heterosexual children.

Marriage doesn't effect that. What about the damage to the children of gay couples who are NOT allowed to marry?

 

[bodecea]

What is the valid interest in denying same-sex couples the right to marriage, then? What harm is caused by allowing same-sex couples to marry?

Adoption of heterosexual children.

You realize that even though SSCM is currently only recognized in - IIRC - 19 states. Homosexual individuals can adopt in about all states.

Kind of blows the rataionlization of "Block SSCM to prevent adoption".

LGBT adoption in the United States - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia


States that allow homosexual individuals adoption = 50
States that allow or have no prohibition for same-sex couple adoption = 38


>>>>

I know, Homosexuals can have my children if me and my wife die

A sad state our Nation is in.

Why would homosexuals have your children if you and your wife died?

One of the first things my wife and I did when we had children was make legal arrangements for our children if something were to happen to both of us. Documents for legal guardianship pending adoption. A will including Executorship for existing real property and it's sale. Proceeds of the equity in the home and life insurance - after all bills were paid off - going into a trust with an annual allowance to their new parents to defray their increased costs, and the balance of the trust funding college or being made available to them at age 21. Working with a financial adviser, a 5% rate of return on the initial trust after insurance and home sale would have provided about $5,000 to $10,000 per year for maintenance and $100,000 each for college.

This was all setup while I was an enlisted man in the Navy and the income of my wife and I combined was about $60,000 per year.

It truly is a sad state of our nation if someone is a parent and doesn't plan for their child's life if something happens to them.


>>>>

My personal situation is not the issue.

I come from a broken family of extreme abuse. Family is out of the question.

I work in an industry which is 100% travel, does not leave much time to establish friends where I live, part time.

Finances are tough, I supported homes in two countries while paying thousands to the government for visas. Thousands because of government worker mistakes.

My industry has been getting ruled and regulated out of business by the government, my work has dropped over 50%. That leaves me zero money now, for something like life insurance.

I can go on, but how much of my specifics did you know of when you replied to me.

yes, it is a sorry state of our nation, but not because of me or parents, but because of government.

did you even realize that heterosexual children are being exposed to homosexuals, that the adoption became so widespread, without a single vote at the ballot.

should you not be more concerned with this than my personal situation and the blame you seem to lay at my feet.

Wills can be cheaply made...if you spent the time you spend whining about gay marriage simply getting your affairs in order "just in case".....

 

[elektra]

How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

You are making the repeated assertion that their is no harm, the burden is on you to prove your claim, not for me to disprove.

No, the burden is on you. Since you are so vehemently opposed to same sex marriage, surely you should be able to back up your views. How is adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples a harm to anyone? Who is being harmed? How? Where is your evidence to back this up?

If the standard is, "vehemently", and it is plane to see you are vehemently stating and repeatedly demanding, than by your own words the burden is on you to prove your assertion.

So you can't provide a single reason why adoption of heterosexual children by homosexual married couples is a harm to anyone? And not one shred of evidence to support it?

It is shacklednation's assertion, given all the posts and resources ShackledNation has given, if there was evidence of ShackledNation's assertion, ShackledNation would post it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Elketra's low IQ is having trouble following the discussion.

She attacks marriage, because some adults, hetero and homo, attack children. Therefore, he argument leads to a conclusion that marriage as an institution should be ended. She does not want to admit, though she does understand, her logic is insane.

 

[elektra]

Elketra's low IQ is having trouble following the discussion.

She attacks marriage, because some adults, hetero and homo, attack children. Therefore, he argument leads to a conclusion that marriage as an institution should be ended. She does not want to admit, though she does understand, her logic is insane.

Liar, quote the post, false assertions are typically made without a quotes.