Austrialians forced to answer intrusive "census" questions at gunpoint.

[Noomi]

I heard one of our Australians in another thread saying that their gun laws worked!

"We have ways of making you talk!"

- Muhammad Khan, The Lives of Bengal Lancer

They have.

 

[Darkwind]

I heard one of our Australians in another thread saying that their gun laws worked!

"We have ways of making you talk!"

- Muhammad Khan, The Lives of Bengal Lancer

They have.

In fact, they haven't. There has been ample proof of that posted on these forums. I'm sure you just ignored it though.

I really could care less. But the more often people state that people like you are wrong, the better off the world is.

Good night...er morning.

 

[Noomi]

I heard one of our Australians in another thread saying that their gun laws worked!

"We have ways of making you talk!"

- Muhammad Khan, The Lives of Bengal Lancer

They have.

In fact, they haven't. There has been ample proof of that posted on these forums. I'm sure you just ignored it though.

I really could care less. But the more often people state that people like you are wrong, the better off the world is.

Good night...er morning.

So...when was our last mass shooting?
In fact, when was America's last mass shooting? Last week, wasn't it?

 

[Darkwind]

They have.

In fact, they haven't. There has been ample proof of that posted on these forums. I'm sure you just ignored it though.

I really could care less. But the more often people state that people like you are wrong, the better off the world is.

Good night...er morning.

So...when was our last mass shooting?
In fact, when was America's last mass shooting? Last week, wasn't it?

Gun crime and freedom is NOT measured in isolated incidents like mass shootings....but then, you knew that. Or you should have known that.

Good morning to you.

 

[Noomi]

In fact, they haven't. There has been ample proof of that posted on these forums. I'm sure you just ignored it though.

I really could care less. But the more often people state that people like you are wrong, the better off the world is.

Good night...er morning.

So...when was our last mass shooting?
In fact, when was America's last mass shooting? Last week, wasn't it?

Gun crime and freedom is NOT measured in isolated incidents like mass shootings....but then, you knew that. Or you should have known that.

Good morning to you.

Stop saying we have lost our freedom, because we haven't. Like I said, we are not paranoid fucks like you lot. We are happy to have given up our guns because we have prevented another massacre. Unlike you lot. You keep going on like you have been, in a 100 years, Americans will be extinct.

 

[idb]

My understanding is that Australians can, and do, own guns.
I'm not sure where the "Government has taken away their guns" meme comes from.

 

[JoeB131]

[

they had the stats compiled by the FBI and local police.....the people on the panel were Chiefs of Police and DA's from various cities.....there was like 10 of them....it was on Gun Violence in California ......ill go by what they say Joe....you cant tell me that shootings by Gangs weekly in the Country dont add up to some pretty good numbers.....gun violence by Gangs adds a lot to the numbers....

"In any given year from 2002 to 2009, from 1,000 to 1,300 gang-related homicides are documented and reported in the largest cities in the NYGS."

We have 15,000 homicides a year (11,000 of them with guns). Gang violence makes up less than 10% of them.

How many gang related deaths occur within the US each year

 

[JoeB131]

Joey is armored against facts as well as a battleship is against rifle fire.

Well, if you presented facts, you might have a point.

How many gang related deaths occur within the US each year

Oh, wait, only 1000 of Americas 15,000 homicides are "gang-related".

 

[S.J.]

Joey is armored against facts as well as a battleship is against rifle fire.

Well, if you presented facts, you might have a point.

How many gang related deaths occur within the US each year

Oh, wait, only 1000 of Americas 15,000 homicides are "gang-related".

What about criminals who aren't gang members?

 

[JoeB131]

Joey is armored against facts as well as a battleship is against rifle fire.

Well, if you presented facts, you might have a point.

How many gang related deaths occur within the US each year

Oh, wait, only 1000 of Americas 15,000 homicides are "gang-related".

What about criminals who aren't gang members?

what about them?

And how do you define a criminal?

I guess anyone who commits a homicide is a "criminal". So is anyone who commits suicide, for that matter.

The question is, how many gun homicides are

People with extensive criminal records.

vs.

People who happened to have a gun lying around the house when a domestic argument went horribly wrong.

My guess- the latter number is probably the larger one. But of course, the two sets probably overlap.

 

[Saigon]

My understanding is that Australians can, and do, own guns.
I'm not sure where the "Government has taken away their guns" meme comes from.

It comes from people who have never been to Australia, and whose only experience of Australia comes from watching Kylie.

Of course Australians can and do own guns - they just do so within a legal system that takes the civil rights of non-gun owners into consideration.

 

[Skull Pilot]

My understanding is that Australians can, and do, own guns.
I'm not sure where the "Government has taken away their guns" meme comes from.

It comes from people who have never been to Australia, and whose only experience of Australia comes from watching Kylie.

Of course Australians can and do own guns - they just do so within a legal system that takes the civil rights of non-gun owners into consideration.

Are you implying that the choice to own a gun is somehow a threat to the civil rights of a person who does not choose to own a gun?

 

[Saigon]

Are you implying that the choice to own a gun is somehow a threat to the civil rights of a person who does not choose to own a gun?

Yes.

We have discussed this before and I do not mean to insult you personally as a gun owner, but statistically those living in a home where firearms are kept are more at risk than those who do not.

 

[Harry Dresden]

So...when was our last mass shooting?
In fact, when was America's last mass shooting? Last week, wasn't it?

Gun crime and freedom is NOT measured in isolated incidents like mass shootings....but then, you knew that. Or you should have known that.

Good morning to you.

Stop saying we have lost our freedom, because we haven't. Like I said, we are not paranoid fucks like you lot. We are happy to have given up our guns because we have prevented another massacre. Unlike you lot. You keep going on like you have been, in a 100 years, Americans will be extinct.

you never answered my question Noomi.....why doesnt your Govt trust law abiding Aussies to own a gun or two?.....what are they afraid of?....

 

[Harry Dresden]

[

they had the stats compiled by the FBI and local police.....the people on the panel were Chiefs of Police and DA's from various cities.....there was like 10 of them....it was on Gun Violence in California ......ill go by what they say Joe....you cant tell me that shootings by Gangs weekly in the Country dont add up to some pretty good numbers.....gun violence by Gangs adds a lot to the numbers....

"In any given year from 2002 to 2009, from 1,000 to 1,300 gang-related homicides are documented and reported in the largest cities in the NYGS."

We have 15,000 homicides a year (11,000 of them with guns). Gang violence makes up less than 10% of them.

How many gang related deaths occur within the US each year

Joe learn to read.....i have been saying GUN VIOLENCE .....that not only includes deaths it includes people who were shot but did not die or just gangs shooting at each other.....the panel i was listening too also said there are many shootings that they cant outright classify as "gang related"......but they know it was gang motivated or related......you say i am just echoing what the Pro gunners say......well it seems you are just echoing what the Anti gunners say.....but all in all what i have been saying still stands.....NO ONE it seems wants to deal with the REAL gun nuts in this society.....GANGS and the criminal element out there.....

 

[JoeB131]

[

Joe learn to read.....i have been saying GUN VIOLENCE .....that not only includes deaths it includes people who were shot but did not die or just gangs shooting at each other.....the panel i was listening too also said there are many shootings that they cant outright classify as "gang related"......but they know it was gang motivated or related......you say i am just echoing what the Pro gunners say......well it seems you are just echoing what the Anti gunners say.....but all in all what i have been saying still stands.....NO ONE it seems wants to deal with the REAL gun nuts in this society.....GANGS and the criminal element out there.....

Guy, the thing is, we lock up 2 million people.

The UK locks up 78,000.
Germany locks up 78,000
Japan locks up 69,000

It seems that the notion that, "We just need to lock up them Gangbangers" and all will be well is a fallacy. We lock up a shitload of people. We have 2 million in prison and another 7 million on parole or probation.

If guns and prisons make us safer, why are we so scared?

 

[FA_Q2]

Again- most gun deaths are suicides, accidents and domestic arguments.

The gang-bangers aren't that big of a problem, they are just how the NRA and gun manufacturers scare people into buying their products.

oh they arent?.....ok Joe.....on a program here about gun violence in California it was stated that if you remove shooting incidences by the gangs in this State Californias gun violence stats drop 60-70%.....and it was agreed on by both sides of the people on the show....so yea they dont make a difference Joe.....

A lot of erroneous stuff is said on "programs". I'll go with the crime statistics.

Most gun deaths are suicides, domestic violence or accidents.

You don’t go with any statistics as you have none. No one really cares about ‘gun deaths’ just deaths and I guarantee that most people do not die as a matter of suicide. Gangs are the number one instigator of crimes:

NGIC analysis indicates that gang members are responsible for an average of 48 percent of violent crime in most jurisdictions and much higher in others. Some jurisdictions in Arizona, California, Colorado, Illinois, Massachusetts, Oklahoma, and Texas report that gangs are responsible for at least 90 percent of crime. A comparison of FBI Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) 2009 violent crime data and 2010 NGIC gang data illustrates that regions experiencing the most violent crime—including southern California, Texas, and Florida—also have a substantial gang presence (see Figure 1 and Map 1)

FBI ? 2011 National Gang Threat Assessment

 

[JoeB131]

Okay, we weren't talking about "violent crime", guy.

Quit trying to m ove the goalposts.

We were talking about GUN DEATHS.

We had 31,000 gun deaths a year, 11,000 of those homicides. According to the FBI, gang activity, which is pretty broadly defined, such as even being in a gang, only accounts for 1000-1300 of those a year.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Okay, we weren't talking about "violent crime", guy.

Quit trying to m ove the goalposts.

We were talking about GUN DEATHS.

We had 31,000 gun deaths a year, 11,000 of those homicides. According to the FBI, gang activity, which is pretty broadly defined, such as even being in a gang, only accounts for 1000-1300 of those a year.

Since you have great faith in FBI and Department of Justice reports, what do youthink of their results showing that:

550 rapes and 1200 murders are prevented each DAY by civilian firearms, and over 3,000,000 crimes total are prevented each year by simply revealing a defensive firearm (doesn't even need to be shot).

In fact, how many times do you need to be told and shown these facts? Do you Alzheimer's disease, or are you deliberating lying?

Department of Justice Statistics:

You are far more likely to survive
a violent assault if you defend yourself with a gun.

Resisting with a gun 6%
Did nothing at all 25%
Resisted with a knife 40%
Non-violent resistance 45%

U.S. Department of Justice, Law Enforcement Assistance Administration, Rape Victimization in 26 American Cities, 1979 60
Department of Justice's National Crime Victimization Survey 61
U.S. Department of Justice 62
U.S. Department of Justice 63
British Home Office – no a pro-gun organization by any mean

From these same studies.

Of the 2,500,000 annual self-defense cases using guns, more than 7.7% are by women
defending themselves against sexual abuse.
Fact:
When a woman was armed with a gun or knife, only 3% of the attempted rapes are
successful, compared to 32% when unarmed.

Fact:
The probability of serious injury from an attack is 2.5 times greater for women offering no
resistance than for women resisting with a gun. Men also benefit from using a gun, but the
benefits are smaller: offering no resistance is 1.4 times more likely to result in serious injury than
resisting with a gun.

Fact:
27% of women keep a gun in the house.

Fact:
37.6 million women either own or have rapid access to guns.

Fact:
In 1966 the city of Orlando responded to a wave of sexual assaults by offering firearms
training classes to women. The number of rapes dropped by nearly 90%.

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/Digitization/55878NCJRS.pdf

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Okay, we weren't talking about "violent crime", guy.

Quit trying to m ove the goalposts.

We were talking about GUN DEATHS.

We had 31,000 gun deaths a year, 11,000 of those homicides. According to the FBI, gang activity, which is pretty broadly defined, such as even being in a gang, only accounts for 1000-1300 of those a year.

Since you have great faith in FBI and Department of Justice reports, what do youthink of their results showing that:

550 rapes and 1200 murders are prevented each DAY by civilian firearms, and over 3,000,000 crimes total are prevented each year by simply revealing a defensive firearm (doesn't even need to be shot).

In fact, how many times do you need to be told and shown these facts? Do you Alzheimer's disease, or are you deliberating lying?

Department of Justice Statistics:

You are far more likely to survive
a violent assault if you defend yourself with a gun.

Resisting with a gun 6%
Did nothing at all 25%
Resisted with a knife 40%
Non-violent resistance 45%



From these same studies.

Of the 2,500,000 annual self-defense cases using guns, more than 7.7% are by women
defending themselves against sexual abuse.
Fact:
When a woman was armed with a gun or knife, only 3% of the attempted rapes are
successful, compared to 32% when unarmed.

Fact:
The probability of serious injury from an attack is 2.5 times greater for women offering no
resistance than for women resisting with a gun. Men also benefit from using a gun, but the
benefits are smaller: offering no resistance is 1.4 times more likely to result in serious injury than
resisting with a gun.

Fact:
27% of women keep a gun in the house.

Fact:
37.6 million women either own or have rapid access to guns.

Fact:
In 1966 the city of Orlando responded to a wave of sexual assaults by offering firearms
training classes to women. The number of rapes dropped by nearly 90%.

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/Digitization/55878NCJRS.pdf

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/283515-three-things-gun-grabbers-run-from.html