AZ passes law saying life beings pre-conception

[Zoom-boing]

Ah come on Jillian.

Face it. Deal with it.

Jillian has never struck me as particularly bright, but this level of retardation is beyond the pale...

What kills me is their tactic of "it's not a baby". My daughter in my belly rocked. Hell's bells I could see my son stretching out his legs in my abdomen. AND my last daughter kicked ass in delivery.

Are these people this stupid?

In order to justify the destruction of a human life via abortion, you first have to take away its humanness. That's how they roll.

 

[Clementine]

what hapopens when you separate a fetus from the palcenta?

It dies.

How can something die that was never alive to begin with?

Why does it need the palcenta to live?

Becuase it requires human blood, human hormones and himan antibodies to live.

Other than a human, what else requires human blood, human hormones, and human antibodies to live?

Nothing. Just humans.

TYherefore...according to basic science......the fetus is a live human.

I have the pro choice position becuase I see the logic and respect what the pro choicers say.

Why are those on the left unable to see the logic and respect what the right sees? Afterall, as I demonstrated in this post...there is absolute scientific logic that backs up the claim of the right.

a tooth. Separate a tooth from a blood supply, it dies.

An embryo is not a human.

You compared a tooth to a fetus in an effort to be right in this debate.

You are a classic example of what I was referring to. A person on the left who refuses to see the logic behind the sentiments of one that thinks differently...and therefore refuses to respect that persons sentiments.

Comparing a tooth to a fetus.

Quite arrogant of you.

"lookie me. I have a way to shoot down what he says".

Go for it. It makes you look silly...but go for it.

FYI...a tooth does not actually die. That is strictly a term to imply the tooth is worthless.

Next time try to enegage in a mature "big boy" debate.

It's an election year and time to attack and play dirty. Of course, they'll take cheap shots whenever they have nothing intelligent to say.

A tooth, like our organs, are body parts and obviously need blood. Of course, none of our organs or teeth ever get to the point where they can remain alive once removed from the body. There is no comparison to a fetus, though liberals prefer to pretend that they are nothing unless someone decides to give birth.

No one is taking away a woman's right to have an abortion, though they are being ridiculous if they insist that fetuses are anything less than human. The fetuses will feel pain at 20 weeks and they can move and are starting to take a familiar shape. Having a late term abortion is just disturbing unless the woman's life is in danger and some of those live for a time once aborted. It is perfectly reasonable for doctor to do ultrasounds to ensure that they are following the law by determining the exact age of the fetus prior to an abortion. Only so many ways that can be done. All the bill is doing is ensuring things are above board, but somehow that's caused a panic among the benighted liberals.

I just find it interesting the way liberals prefer to deny that fetuses are living beings. I can only believe that to do so would be far too disturbing, so it's just easier not to think about. Somehow, they'd feel remorse or at least sadness at each abortion. The way they look at it, as long as they can pretend it's nothing, it's easier to support millions of abortions each year. That's their right, so don't expect they'll have the courage to look at things for what they are. If they can't face the truth and prefer to live in denial, great, but it's mean for them to try to fool others into avoiding the medical facts. Many women will come to realize things years later and some have experienced depression long after the abortion.

If a woman wants an abortion and can live with the decision, fine. They just need to realize that they cannot force doctors to do them. Amazing that some gripe about not enough abortion clinics. Is this really a crisis? Shame that these unwanted pregnancies cannot be prevented. Perhaps someday, someone will come up with something.

I shouldn't be surprised at all the spin in this thread and the outright lies about the AZ bill. It's time to scare women and try to garner some support for the left. This is always one of their favorite tactics.

 

[Uncensored2008]

All I see is once again you being the dishonest one.

Are you pregnant with a tooth?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

the allegedly 'small government GOP'er Jan Brewer has signed into law saying, essentially, life begins two weeks before conception.

so now, every time you ovulate...congrats you're a mom.

nutters...

AllGov - News - Arizona Law Declares Life Begins before Conception: Update

the statute...one of the most disgusting i've ever read.

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/50leg/2r/adopted/s.2036jud.pdf

holy cow..you people call yourselves compassionate human beings
but you all sure didn't mind when Government stepped in to make ABORTIONS legal

Now here’s a glaringly ignorant statement, although not surprising coming from a conservative.

Government didn’t ‘step in’ to ‘make abortion legal.’

The Constitution compelled government to butt out of citizens’ private affairs, the rule of law prohibited government from violating the fundamental right to privacy and individual liberty.

 

[koshergrl]

Actually, government DID step in, via judicial legislation, to force legalized killing upon the people...who didn't want it.

Another example of the left inserting itself into our lives where we don't want them, and they don't belong.

 

[koshergrl]

No, they expanded government to force abortion upon a populace that viewed it as murder.

Then they re-educated them via "sex education" that they also did not want.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Murder is a moral issue.
Does that mean we should be *free* to commit it?

Because that is the argument of the pro-abortion movement. It's okay to kill others if they are a certain age. It's okay to kill others if they are helpless and in your care. It's okay to kill others if in doing so, you liberate yourself from responsibility.

Murder is a legal issue; and abortion is not ‘murder.’

If one wishes to refrain from abortion or counsel others to do so on moral grounds he’s free to act accordingly; he is not free, however, to compel others to act likewise by attempting to codify subjective moral beliefs in to secular law.

Laws such as this are aimed at abortion providers, rather than those seeking an abortion. The effort is to create a regulatory minefield to discourage clinics from opening, attempting to stay open, or providing abortion services.

I just wonder if it has escaped anyone's notice in our legislature how close California or Mexico is to us ? It would seem that these sorts of bills are just a huge waste of time and resources that the state does not have, becaue you can be sure that they will find themselves in a court battle over them.

That’s exactly what they want – this type of legislation is specifically designed to provoke a lawsuit for purely partisan reasons; it becomes fodder for stump speeches.

 

[koshergrl]

It was murder when Lacey Peterson's husband was convicted of murdering their baby....

 

[hortysir]

The law seems a bit absurd to me but I have to admit in my "head" life seems to begin every time I see sexy curves with little to nothing covering them. Or occasionally not so sexy if I've had a few too many to drink.

Not if you think about it..... what they are trying to stop is the morning after pill.

I have no problem with the pill.

Then YOU take it


Makes more sense to take the bullets out of the gun than to wear a bullet-proof vest.

 

[newpolitics]

I personally do not believe in abortion...but I respect those that feel it is invasive to their choices to ban it, so my tolerance for the beliefs of others has me supporting the pro choice side.

However....the question is not really about choice. It is, and has always been, whether or not abortion is murder...whuich stems from "when does life begin."

now...you say "a bunch of cells" is not a human life.....I agree.

However...if that "bunch of cells" is dependant upon a human being to grow...via the umbilical chord/placenta....then maybe it is not just a bunch of cells?

Look at it this way.....what other than a human being requires human antibodies and human blood cells to survive?

So you see, it is not just the religious right that feel that way...many form a science background see a fetus as a human being...from a scientific standpoint.

Unless, of course, you can cite what other than a lviing human requires human antibodies to survive....

All I know, is that a newly conceived egg does not feel pain, therefore, without suffering, the death of that egg can not be said to be immoral. Conscious suffering is what largely defines immorality to me. It is to inflict suffering unnecessarily on a being that does not choose it or does not have the ability to defend against it (e.g., factory farmed animals... why don't we talk about their suffering? Go vegan EARTHLINGS - Make the Connection. | Nation Earth )

I do see a sufficiently formed fetus as a human. I just don't know at what point a human is a human, and hence the crux of the problem. Yet I will universally deny the theist position that life starts at conception, and based on that theism, legislate against it. That is immoral, because you now forcing people to do what they do not want to, when it is their body.

Exactly how do the unborn defend themselves against being aborted??

Humans beget humans. From the moment of conception (oh sorry Jillian, fertilization) it is 100% human. The moment of fertilization is a human being in the earliest stages of its development. It doesn't 'become more human'; it is human from the get go. It becomes 'more developed' but it is always human.

Abortion destroys/ends/terminates the life of another human. Pro-choice supports the choice of a woman to end the life of another human.

Who cares about fertilization. That egg does not feel pain without it having a central nervous system, so it doesn't matter. It is not aware at all of its own existence, being conscious arises from a fully formed nervous system, made up of many cells. A fertilized egg is one cell (or two technically? I don't know), that can not detect itself. That doesn't happen for a few months, so there is a window where aborting is ethical. It is undoubtedly sad to waste a potential human life that is so close to fruition, but it is not unethical. Unethical is, as I said, what we do to our food animals, who are fully formed in their central nervous system... they are not made in God's image, so it doesn't matter. Christianity is so dumb. It produces more immorality than it pretends to put aside.

 

[Intense]

the allegedly 'small government GOP'er Jan Brewer has signed into law saying, essentially, life begins two weeks before conception.

so now, every time you ovulate...congrats you're a mom.

nutters...

AllGov - News - Arizona Law Declares Life Begins before Conception: Update

the statute...one of the most disgusting i've ever read.

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/50leg/2r/adopted/s.2036jud.pdf

Some Times You feel like a nut, sometimes you don't.

 

[newpolitics]

So you take a stance against it because Christians believe murdering innocents is wrong.

Way to showcase your bigotry there, skippy.

Are you stupid? How am I showcasing bigotry. Don't play a victim. You're part of a religion that has subjugated more people than any other in history. You're insult is a pathetic attempt at sounding smart.

I take a stand against Christianity because it is based on zero evidence, yet its proponents pretend to have solid ground when facing issues of science, and in matters concerning public policy. It's a fucking joke. The arrogance involved here is simply astounding. Stick to what you know... fairy tales.

 

[koshergrl]

You're a bigot because you admit your only problem with proposed legislation is the fact it is supported by the religious.

That's bigotry.

 

[Political Junky]

Rick Santorum Aborts Presidential Campaign from Ashley Judd, Michelle Trachtenberg, Katy Mixon, E. Coupe and her Breezy V., michaeltruly, Andy Maxwell, Alex Richanbach, BoTown Sound, and Funny Or Die

 

[AnonymousIV]

Exactly how do the unborn defend themselves against being aborted?? ~ Do you actually believe the unborn, think in terms of life and death? I think their little muscles jerk, and they are gone. It's like "quickening" in reverse. What is going on during the "quickening" stage of a pregnancy.

 

[hortysir]

Exactly how do the unborn defend themselves against being aborted?? ~ Do you actually believe the unborn, think in terms of life and death? I think their little muscles jerk, and they are gone. It's like "quickening" in reverse. What is going on during the "quickening" stage of a pregnancy.

You're a sick fuck, hunh?

 

[Clementine]

You're a bigot because you admit your only problem with proposed legislation is the fact it is supported by the religious.

That's bigotry.

It is. When a religious person has any opinion, they'll be attacked no matter what.

Actually, I thought most religions didn't approve of any abortion, so the left can take a break from their religion bashing on this one.

This bill is just laying the rules for abortions up until the fetus is 20 weeks old. I don't know how the OP's complete misinterpretation of the bill has come around to the left attacking religion. People have a right to believe what they want, but this bill has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with what is medically sound. The thread started with a faulty premise and the left has once again ended with an attack on religion. Not surprising because the only religion the left seems to respect is the most oppressive of them all, Islam, which is the worst when it comes to women's rights (they don't exist).

The AZ bill is simply ensuring that doctors abide by the 20 week rule for abortions, but the left resents that they must do tests in order to accurately determine the gestational age.

 

[AnonymousIV]

Exactly how do the unborn defend themselves against being aborted?? ~ Do you actually believe the unborn, think in terms of life and death? I think their little muscles jerk, and they are gone. It's like "quickening" in reverse. What is going on during the "quickening" stage of a pregnancy.

You're a sick fuck, hunh?

No I'm pro-self, I'm as stingy as you. I act out of self-interest just like you.

 

[devilin111]

Why do people celebrate birthdays, rather than fuckdays?

 

[newpolitics]

You're a bigot because you admit your only problem with proposed legislation is the fact it is supported by the religious.

That's bigotry.

that doesn't make me a bigot. It makes me someone who disagrees with Americans forming public policy around god, which violates the constitution, because there is no evidence that god exists. That's all. It's really no big deal. It's only our constitution.