Battle of Bakhmud won by Russia

[JohnDB]

Exactly! ^^

Same exact soldiers in both "nazi" pictures. (Except fewer because some died in the fighting)

If you can't come up with more people than this....then it's no different than the Nazi groups in America. Too few and despised to be a serious percentage of the population.

 

[para bellum]

Exactly! ^^

Oh yeah, that's about as real as the $20 Rolex I bought in Tijuana.

Very realistic.

 

[para bellum]

I did a google image search on that last one. It was one of a group of pictures that were published back in 2015 on VKontatke, by someone called "The Militia of Novorossia".

I guess recycling old propaganda makes it new again...

 

[para bellum]

Prigozhin talks to peg-leg Pegov about the demise of Wagner due to the ammunition shortage.

Pegov looks totally strung out on opiates.

Rough AI translation.

 

[José]

Originally posted by JohnDB
Forced migration of Russians to Uke territory and forced Siberian immigration of Ukranians.

Originally posted by para bellum
Depopulation and changing the demographics of a place is one of the definitions of genocide.

First of all let's remember that restrition of movement is the norm in any armed conflict.

Having said that, in order to qualify as genocide the number of forced relocations of Ukrainians to Russia and Russians to Ukraine would have to be in the order of hundreds of thousands, at the very least.

Where are all those ukrainians being held in Russia against their will? Not even a totalitarian state like North Korea would be able to completely hide so many people from view for so long in the age of cell phones let alone a mere autocracy like Russia.

Nobody can't find a single Ukrainian family forced to live in Russia, let alone hundreds of thousands, because the whole story is total garbage, that's why...

And just for the sake of the argument... Even if the story were true it would still not qualify as genocide. Ukrainians and Russians are all east slavs, two extremelly close ethnic groups. The idea that mass immigration of Russians to Ukraine, forced or not, would represent any kind of genocide is as absurd as the idea that mass immigration of anglo canadians to the US would lead to the genocide of anglo americans.

If you want to see a real genocide in action look no further than the millions of non-white immigrants who arrive in America every decade and the massive indoctrination campaign of the american youth with pro miscegenation propaganda.

You and JohnDB accuse Russia of an imaginary genocide that only exists inside your heads and sweep under the carpet, ignore, justify and rationalize the real genocide that's happening in front of you, in your country and targeting your own ethnic group.

 

[gipper]

How many Ukrainians are left in Ukraine? I’ve read estimates that half the population has left the country since this dumb PROVOKED war began.

 

[para bellum]

...this dumb PROVOKED war

Here we go again, Russia is really the VICTIM.

So pathetic. No one was threatening Russia. EVERYONE, and I mean EVERYONE, was telling Putin "DO NOT INVADE UKRAINE".

Putin was all "Who, me?"

His own army didn't even know they were going to war.

Poor, poor Russia, we should feel sorry for them.

 

[gipper]

Here we go again, Russia is really the VICTIM.

So pathetic. No one was threatening Russia. EVERYONE, and I mean EVERYONE, was telling Putin "DO NOT INVADE UKRAINE".

Putin was all "Who, me?"

His own army didn't even know they were going to war.

Poor, poor Russia, we should feel sorry for them.

Lies from the MIC.

The expansion of NATO was clear and obvious provocation to Russia. Numerous foreign policy experts warned against this in the 1990s.

Have you learned nothing from the past 30 years? Our government and media lie repeatedly yet you chose to still believe them. Why?

 

[para bellum]

Lies from the MIC.

Sure, everything that does not conform to your worldview is "lies from the MIC".

The expansion of NATO was clear and obvious provocation to Russia. Numerous foreign policy experts warned against this in the 1990s.

Have you learned nothing from the past 30 years? Our government and media lie repeatedly yet you chose to still believe them. Why?

Russia has not been consistent even in this.

Putin, on the joining of the Balts in 2001:

"Not only I am not opposed to it, I actually don't think it makes any sense. If we were to deal with increasing its national security, NATO enlargement does not make sense. We of course are not in a position to tell people what to do. We cannot forbid people to make certain choices if they want to increase the security of their nations in a particular way. But I don't think that enlarging or enhancing NATO mechanically makes any sense."

On Ukraine in 2002:

“I am absolutely convinced that Ukraine will not shy away from the processes of expanding interaction with NATO and the Western allies as a whole. Ukraine has its own relations with NATO; there is the Ukraine-NATO Council. At the end of the day, the decision is to be taken by NATO and Ukraine. It is a matter for those two partners.”

At the 2010 NATO summit in Lisbon, Medvedev said "the period of distance in our relations and claims against each other is over now. We view the future with optimism and will work on developing relations between Russia and NATO in all areas … [as they progress toward] a full-fledged partnership.”

No mention of NATO expansion...

NATO had been in a 30 year disarmament before Putin invaded Ukraine. The "provocation" argument is bullshit. If Putin were truly afraid of NATO he wouldn't have hollowed out his army with corruption, or made Belarus so weak.

Putin's real fear is the expansion of democracy on his borders. He doesn't like the notion that those former SSR's can decide their own leaders and futures.

 

[para bellum]

You and JohnDB accuse Russia of an imaginary genocide that only exists inside your heads and sweep under the carpet, ignore, justify and rationalize the real genocide that's happening in front of you, in your country and targeting your own ethnic group.

No Jose, you are mischaracterizing immigration and ignoring Russian policy wrt Ukraine. Immigration in the US is not coerced, and there is no relocation of populations in the US to achieve demographic results.

Russia on the other hand...

"Russian President Vladimir Putin signed a decree on April 27 codifying conditions for the further large-scale deportation to Russia of residents of occupied areas of Ukraine.

Putin signed a decree entitled “On the Peculiarities of the Legal Status of Certain Categories of Foreign Citizens and Stateless Persons in the Russian Federation” that defines those who are living in Russian-occupied territories who have declared their desire to retain their current citizenship and refuse to accept Russian passports as “foreign citizens and stateless persons currently residing in the Russian Federation.”

The decree holds that such individuals may continue to reside in occupied territories until July 1, 2024, suggesting that these individuals may be subject to deportation following this date. This decree codifies coercive methods to encourage residents of occupied areas to receive Russian passports and also sets conditions for the deportation of Ukrainians who do not agree to become Russian citizens.

Russian authorities are also continuing other efforts to deport Ukrainians, particularly children, to Russia under various schemes.

ISW continues to assess that all lines of effort aimed at deporting Ukrainians to Russia may constitute a violation of the Geneva Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, as well as a potential deliberate ethnic cleansing campaign."

https://www.understandingwar.org/sites/default/files/NEW%20AO%20APR%2028%20Russian%20Offensive%20Campaign%20Assessment%20PDF.pdf

 

[gipper]

Sure, everything that does not conform to your worldview is "lies from the MIC".

Russia has not been consistent even in this.

Putin, on the joining of the Balts in 2001:

"Not only I am not opposed to it, I actually don't think it makes any sense. If we were to deal with increasing its national security, NATO enlargement does not make sense. We of course are not in a position to tell people what to do. We cannot forbid people to make certain choices if they want to increase the security of their nations in a particular way. But I don't think that enlarging or enhancing NATO mechanically makes any sense."

On Ukraine in 2002:

“I am absolutely convinced that Ukraine will not shy away from the processes of expanding interaction with NATO and the Western allies as a whole. Ukraine has its own relations with NATO; there is the Ukraine-NATO Council. At the end of the day, the decision is to be taken by NATO and Ukraine. It is a matter for those two partners.”

At the 2010 NATO summit in Lisbon, Medvedev said "the period of distance in our relations and claims against each other is over now. We view the future with optimism and will work on developing relations between Russia and NATO in all areas … [as they progress toward] a full-fledged partnership.”

No mention of NATO expansion...

NATO had been in a 30 year disarmament before Putin invaded Ukraine. The "provocation" argument is bullshit. If Putin were truly afraid of NATO he wouldn't have hollowed out his army with corruption, or made Belarus so weak.

Putin's real fear is the expansion of democracy on his borders. He doesn't like the notion that those former SSR's can decide their own leaders and futures.

Everything you’ve stated is nothing but propaganda. You must consume prodigious amounts of state run media.

You!

 

[para bellum]

Everything you’ve stated is nothing but propaganda. You must consume prodigious amounts of state run media.

Putin's own words about NATO expansion are western propaganda?

And your only reply is an anti-US propaganda meme?

Pretty feeble.

 

[gipper]

Putin's own words about NATO expansion are western propaganda?

And your only reply is an anti-US propaganda meme?

Pretty feeble.

Truth my son.

Truth in your world is lies and lies are truth. This is what happens when you believe state run media.

 

[gipper]

Putin's own words about NATO expansion are western propaganda?

And your only reply is an anti-US propaganda meme?

Pretty feeble.

You’re completely controlled.

 

[gipper]

Putin's own words about NATO expansion are western propaganda?

And your only reply is an anti-US propaganda meme?

Pretty feeble.

Think for once…

 

[JohnDB]

First of all let's remember that restrition of movement is the norm in any armed conflict.

Having said that, in order to qualify as genocide the number of forced relocations of Ukrainians to Russia and Russians to Ukraine would have to be in the order of hundreds of thousands, at the very least.

Where are all those ukrainians being held in Russia against their will? Not even a totalitarian state like North Korea would be able to completely hide so many people from view for so long in the age of cell phones let alone a mere autocracy like Russia.

Nobody can't find a single Ukrainian family forced to live in Russia, let alone hundreds of thousands, because the whole story is total garbage, that's why...

And just for the sake of the argument... Even if the story were true it would still not qualify as genocide. Ukrainians and Russians are all east slavs, two extremelly close ethnic groups. The idea that mass immigration of Russians to Ukraine, forced or not, would represent any kind of genocide is as absurd as the idea that mass immigration of anglo canadians to the US would lead to the genocide of anglo americans.

If you want to see a real genocide in action look no further than the millions of non-white immigrants who arrive in America every decade and the massive indoctrination campaign of the american youth with pro miscegenation propaganda.

You and JohnDB accuse Russia of an imaginary genocide that only exists inside your heads and sweep under the carpet, ignore, justify and rationalize the real genocide that's happening in front of you, in your country and targeting your own ethnic group.

Nope....READ what I posted more carefully. Russia is deporting Ukrainians out of their homes forcibly to Russia....especially children and especially those who do not want Russian passports or citizenship. Then they are importing other "Russian " citizens to Ukraine to help "Russify" the areas.

 

[para bellum]

You’re completely controlled.

You're a moron and a Kremlin stooge. Witting or unwitting, it matters not.

If you knew anything about me, you'd know I've spent about the last 20 years trying to convince people that the so called "Russia threat" is a fraud, simply because a country with the economy of an Italy cannot ever be a superpower.

All your pathetic memes and talking head videos and associated Kremlin talking points have no impact on me. These are all old and stale and only serve to illustrate that you lack the capacity for independent thought.

Putin's war, 100% his decision. Fact.

He's not fighting NATO, he's not fighting the US. He's fighting Ukraine, and it's a fight that he picked.

Every country that helps Ukrainians defend their nation is on the right side of history.

 

[gipper]

Putin's own words about NATO expansion are western propaganda?

And your only reply is an anti-US propaganda meme?

Pretty feeble.

 

[gipper]

You're a moron and a Kremlin stooge. Witting or unwitting, it matters not.

If you knew anything about me, you'd know I've spent about the last 20 years trying to convince people that the so called "Russia threat" is a fraud, simply because a country with the economy of an Italy cannot ever be a superpower.

All your pathetic memes and talking head videos and associated Kremlin talking points have no impact on me. These are all old and stale and only serve to illustrate that you lack the capacity for independent thought.

Putin's war, 100% his decision. Fact.

He's not fighting NATO, he's not fighting the US. He's fighting Ukraine, and it's a fight that he picked.

Every country that helps Ukrainians defend their nation is on the right side of history.

Almost all the Ukrainians who survive this war will probably come to hate the US government bitterly for the rest of their lives. Why? For getting hundreds of thousands of their young men killed for nothing.

 

[para bellum]

View attachment 780852

This is a perfect illustration of what I said prev. For you this is all about US domestic political issues.

There is not one single name on that list who I would listen to, or who has helped me form an opinion on anything. By your own admission, these are the people upon which you formed your opinion vis-a-vis Ukraine.

You are exactly like the left-wingers you hate so much. There is not a shred of difference between your behavior and theirs.

You have no problem with the killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent Ukrainians, so long as it delivers a "defeat" to BIDEN.

And you're good with the destruction of the Bretton-Woods post-WW2 rules based system, and the UN and NATO, and everything else, because you think you will be able to say "I told you so"- no matter the harm that is done.

You are a mental juvenile, no matter what your chronological age may suggest.

Your ilk sickens me. I genuinely hope you are a paid Kremlin troll, because a real American should hang his head in shame for the things you say.