Birth Control Mandate: Is this taking the Religous Liberty Exception too far?

[BlackSand]

What's to prevent anyone from saying "I object" -- without formally proclaiming a religious exemption?

Is this a serious burden?

This is what you posted in the OP ... Make up your mind.

Why? Because their employees need that form in order to get birth control directly from their insurers (which they need to do because their employers—these Catholic non-profits—are exempt, as they want to be)."

Or keep throwing out parts of the OP to meet your moving goal posts.

 

[paperview]

Again: This

is the form.

CERTIFICATION

(To be used for plan years beginning on or after January 1, 2014)
This form is to be used to certify that the health coverage established or maintained or arranged by the organization listed below qualifies for an accommodation with respect to the federal requirement to cover certain contraceptive services without cost sharing, pursuant to 26 CFR 54.9815-2713A, 29 CFR 2590.715-2713A, and 45 CFR 147.131.

Please fill out this form completely. This form must be completed by each eligible organization by the first day of the first plan year beginning on or after January 1, 2014, with respect to which the accommodation is to apply, and be made available for examination upon request. This form must be maintained on file for at least 6 years following the end of the last applicable plan year.


Name of the organization
Name and title of the individual who is authorized to make, and makes, this certification on behalf of the organization
Mailing and email addresses and phone number for the individual listed above
I certify that, on account of religious objections, the organization opposes providing coverage for some or all of any contraceptive services that would otherwise be required to be covered; the organization is organized and operates as a nonprofit entity; and the organization holds itself out as a religious organization.

Note: An organization that offers coverage through the same group health plan as a religious employer (as defined in 45 CFR 147.131(a)) and/or an eligible organization (as defined in 26 CFR 54.9815-2713A(a); 29 CFR 2590.715-2713A(a); 45 CFR 147.131(b)), and that is part of the same controlled group of corporations as, or under common control with, such employer and/or organization (each within the meaning of section 52(a) or (b) of the Internal Revenue Code), may certify that it holds itself out as a religious organization.

I declare that I have made this certification, and that, to the best of my knowledge and belief, it is true and correct. I also declare that this certification is complete.


______________________________________

Signature of the individual listed above


______________________________________

Date
The organization or its plan must provide a copy of this certification to the plan’s health insurance issuer(s) (for insured health plans) or third party administrator(s) (for self-insured health plans) in order for the plan to be accommodated with respect to the contraceptive coverage requirement.

Notice to Third Party Administrators of Self-Insured Health Plans

In the case of a group health plan that provides benefits on a self-insured basis, the provision of this certification to a plan’s third party administrator that will process claims for contraceptive coverage required under 26 CFR 54.9815-2713(a)(1)(iv) or 29 CFR 2590.715-2713(a)(1)(iv) constitutes notice to the third party administrator that:

(1) The eligible organization will not act as the plan administrator or claims administrator with respect to claims for contraceptive services, or contribute to the funding of contraceptive services; and

(2) Obligations of the third party administrator are set forth in 26 CFR 54.9815-2713A, 29 CFR 2510.3-16, and 29 CFR 2590.715-2713A.

This certification is an instrument under which the plan is operated. _____________________

http://cms.gov/CCIIO/Resources/Form...es/Downloads/cms-10459-certificationdocx.docx

 

[dblack]

The orgs need to certify they are exempt.

It is their burden, as light as it is, not the government to investigate if they are. Saves time and taxpayers' dollars.

It's self incrimination, a violation of the fifth amendment. By certifying they are exempt, these organizations are nominating themselves for said investigation. That may save tax payers money, but it's wrong. It's more of the "guilty-until-proven-innocent" mindset that seems to be gaining a foothold across the board in government these days.

 

[paperview]

What's to prevent anyone from saying "I object" -- without formally proclaiming a religious exemption?

Is this a serious burden?

This is what you posted in the OP ... Make up your mind.

Why? Because their employees need that form in order to get birth control directly from their insurers (which they need to do because their employers—these Catholic non-profits—are exempt, as they want to be)."

Or keep throwing out parts of the OP to meet your moving goal posts.

If you read the link I placed there:

Justice Sotomayor grants temporary injunction to Catholic groups who say filling out an Obamacare form about contraception violates their religious freedom.

you'd see the insurers in this case DO NOT have to provide BC Coverage. They too are exempt.

 

[BlackSand]

What's to prevent anyone from saying "I object" -- without formally proclaiming a religious exemption?

Is this a serious burden?

This is what you posted in the OP ... Make up your mind.

Why? Because their employees need that form in order to get birth control directly from their insurers (which they need to do because their employers—these Catholic non-profits—are exempt, as they want to be)."

Or keep throwing out parts of the OP to meet your moving goal posts.

If you read the link I placed there:

Justice Sotomayor grants temporary injunction to Catholic groups who say filling out an Obamacare form about contraception violates their religious freedom.

you'd see the insurers in this case DO NOT have to provide BC Coverage. They too are exempt.

Then why do they need to fill out the form ... If the form isn't going to make a difference?

.

 

[paperview]

The orgs need to certify they are exempt.

It is their burden, as light as it is, not the government to investigate if they are. Saves time and taxpayers' dollars.

It's self incrimination, a violation of the fifth amendment. By certifying they are exempt, these organizations are nominating themselves for said investigation. That may save tax payers money, but it's wrong. It's more of the "guilty-until-proven-innocent" mindset that seems to be gaining a foothold across the board in government these days.

Bull. Even the Sisters themselves didn't make that case.

They said it amounted to a "permission slip" -- when it did no such thing.

 

[paperview]

This is what you posted in the OP ... Make up your mind.



Or keep throwing out parts of the OP to meet your moving goal posts.

If you read the link I placed there:

Justice Sotomayor grants temporary injunction to Catholic groups who say filling out an Obamacare form about contraception violates their religious freedom.

you'd see the insurers in this case DO NOT have to provide BC Coverage. They too are exempt.

Then why do they need to fill out the form ... If the form isn't going to make a difference?

.

To claim the exemption.

This is getting ridiculous.

 

[koshergrl]

The orgs need to certify they are exempt.

It is their burden, as light as it is, not the government to investigate if they are. Saves time and taxpayers' dollars.

It's self incrimination, a violation of the fifth amendment. By certifying they are exempt, these organizations are nominating themselves for said investigation. That may save tax payers money, but it's wrong. It's more of the "guilty-until-proven-innocent" mindset that seems to be gaining a foothold across the board in government these days.

Too complex and factual for fake, I'm afraid.

 

[dblack]

The orgs need to certify they are exempt.

It is their burden, as light as it is, not the government to investigate if they are. Saves time and taxpayers' dollars.

It's self incrimination, a violation of the fifth amendment. By certifying they are exempt, these organizations are nominating themselves for said investigation. That may save tax payers money, but it's wrong. It's more of the "guilty-until-proven-innocent" mindset that seems to be gaining a foothold across the board in government these days.

Bull. Even the Sisters themselves didn't make that case.

They said it amounted to a "permission slip" -- when it did no such thing.

The Sisters should have given it more thought.

 

[Vox]

Why are you talking to yourself, liar?

Koshergrl is quite well versed in these matters, as a matter of fact.

and as afar as I remember there is no disagreement on the issue between Koshergirl and me

 

[Vox]

They object to being mandated. ACA is the law of the land.

These religious orgs simply need to file a one page form to say they are exempt.

They are then exempt. Are people trying to make the case this 2 minute signature they need to apply to a form results in an undue burden?

No, they simply should be exempt apriori from the mandate and should not be obliged to sign any papers.

signing ANY papers makes you liable.

so - NO.

 

[paperview]

They object to being mandated. ACA is the law of the land.

These religious orgs simply need to file a one page form to say they are exempt.

They are then exempt. Are people trying to make the case this 2 minute signature they need to apply to a form results in an undue burden?

No, they simply should be exempt apriori from the mandate and should not be obliged to sign any papers.

signing ANY papers makes you liable.

so - NO.

That's ridiculous.

 

[Vox]

They object to being mandated. ACA is the law of the land.

These religious orgs simply need to file a one page form to say they are exempt.

They are then exempt. Are people trying to make the case this 2 minute signature they need to apply to a form results in an undue burden?

No, they simply should be exempt apriori from the mandate and should not be obliged to sign any papers.

signing ANY papers makes you liable.

so - NO.

That's ridiculous.

to you, not to anybody with an understanding that succumbing to the idiocy of guilty until proven otherwise is not going to fly.

 

[Stephanie]

Wow, with the libs today, we have no Freedoms from THEM

 

[Luddly Neddite]

This has never been about religious liberty or objections to birth control on religious grounds.

If it had anything to do with religious objections to birth control, all of the Hobby Lobby wives would be pregnant.

Its a scam to screw over women. Period.

If these assholes want to cut women's pay in this way, they need to give the cash instead because THAT is what health insurance is - pay. Any of you who get insurance as a benefit know its in lieu of money in your pay check. If employers want to cut women's benefits, they should pay it in another way - cash.

If it were men's benefits that were being cut, this would not last more than five minutes.

 

[BlackSand]

If you read the link I placed there:

Justice Sotomayor grants temporary injunction to Catholic groups who say filling out an Obamacare form about contraception violates their religious freedom.

you'd see the insurers in this case DO NOT have to provide BC Coverage. They too are exempt.

Then why do they need to fill out the form ... If the form isn't going to make a difference?

.

To claim the exemption.

This is getting ridiculous.

It is ridiculous ... What does claiming the exemption do?
In the OP you mentioned that claiming the exemption and supplying the form allowed employees to get birth control covered by the insurers provided by the Catholic Organizations.

I guess that part of the OP was wrong and you have abandoned it ... The only part that talked about "why" the exemption was necessary.

.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

And, of course, no catholics use birth control.

Fucking hypocrites will do whatever they can to screw over women.

 

[dblack]

Maybe instead of filling out the forms, they could just wear some kind of patch or something.

 

[paperview]

What stops anyone from just saying they are exempt from taxes?

All they need to do is say "hey, too bad -- Ima church.

Suck eggs, gov."

Duddn't work that way.

 

[Vox]

birth control is NOT a healthcare issue and should not be covered by ANYBODY.

Period.

you need birth control? you BUY it in Walmart.
Or CVS