Zone1 Broad-brush reparations to all blacks is unconstituional

[martybegan]

BS. Asians get a government program that puts them in high paying jobs. Blacks had businesses , whites burned them, bombed them, or ran highways through black communities to end them.

Then those blacks should sue the people that burned them, or the estates of the dead ones.

 

[martybegan]

No, it's not free money. Turn black and find out how "free" this money is. We want the same amount of money whites have been given by the government since 1776.

THAT'S equal protection.

You mean the services we get for the taxes we paid?

 

[martybegan]

People doing research, attending city council meetings and legislative sessions in order to bring about a desired result in society is not "hawking".

Marc, IM2, nor anyone else in our group is required to prove anything to you or anyone else on this board particularly since we know how all you receive information that is contrary to your prejudiced and misguided belief systems.

Calling me lazy was a real big tell regarding your own insecurities and fears - that a Black person could somehow be "better" or "better off" than you, or be considered a "better person", or have something that you don't but covet, etc. That's what's really driving all the angst, the fear that Black people will get something, especially money, that you don't believe should come to us, for all of the stupid and inane reasons you all list, none of which are valid.

My concern is my taxes having to increase 100% to pay for this grifting.

 

[Coyote]

Here is what I found interesting in this thread...and that is what appears to be a double standard in arguement where people support or defend reparations to interred Japanese Americans but not Jim Crowe African Americans.

Claim: There were Blacks who became hugely successful by overcoming Jim Crowe so why should we give reparations?

Ans: There were Japanese-Americans who were became hugely successful, overcoming the tragedy of internment. They still received reparations.

Claim: It's unfair to give reparations to every Black person in America, after all reparations weren’t given to every Japanese American.

Ans: That is why some of us make the argument to limit eligibility to those still alive who lived under Jim Crowe.

Claim: They shouldn't get reparations if they benefitted from a free college education or other government programs.

Ans: This restriction wasn’t put on the Japanese Americans who received reparations. Why a different standard?

Claim: Not all Blacks were affected equally thus they shouldn't get reparations as a group.

Ans: This restriction wasn’t put on the Japanese Americans who received reparations.

Claim: Variations on a theme - why should my taxes pay for this since I didn’t do anything wrong.

Ans: Why didn’t that matter when we gave reparations to the Japanese Americans?

Claim: …but the Japanese Americans were put into camps.

Ans: When the government acts to remove Constitutional rights from a group based only on that groups ethnic/racial/religious/etc. identity, it is wrong and unjust, regardless of which rights are removed.


Claim: they want too much money. Grifters.
Ans: No one called the Japanese Americans grifters. They worked for decades to get reparations. The amount they got was the result of negotiations and discussions, which is overlooked now.

It also seems to me that arguing money first is a red herring. First you need to determine whether a wrong was done that needs to be acknowledged and reparations made. Only then can you argue what form those reparations need to be, imo.

So far, every argument made against reparations here, should be, but was not applied to reparations given to Japanese Americans. I know there is a handful of folks who oppose reparations in both cases and though I disagree, I respect that, it is at least internally consistent.

So why the different standards demanded of each group? I think it points out how deeply entrenched the issue of Black/White race is in this country and how complicated and personal it feels.

I still feel it’s enlightening to argue this from the opposite side (I would argue against with some one else who opposes it, arguing for). It is good for both sides of the debate. I’d be willing if anyone else is.

 

[IM2]

It's 100% grift, and anyone who says otherwise is lying.

Only to people ignorant about the history of US public policy.

 

[IM2]

My concern is my taxes having to increase 100% to pay for this grifting.

There is no grift and my grandparents, parents and I have paid taxes for things that have helped whites that either blacks were excluded from or for things blacks don't get equally today. Your taxes won't be raised for this and since you have the same racist attitude as whiites did in prior generations, you can't say you are being penalized for something you did not do.

 

[Coyote]

There is no grift and my grandparents, parents and I have paid taxes for things that have helped whites thay either blacks were excluded from or for things blacks don't get equally today. Your taxes won't be raised for this and since you have the same racist attitude as whiites did in prior generations, you can't say you are being penalized for something you did not do.

There was no increase in taxes to cover reparations for the JapaneseAmericans either.

 

[IM2]

There was no increase in taxes to cover reparations for the JapaneseAmericans either.

True. It is amazing just how uninformed these guys are about this.

 

[el midgetron]

I think paying only those who experienced Jim Crow is the best case for reparations. The reparations-advocate’s generational damages becomes a completely theoretical exercise.

 

[el midgetron]

I have paid taxes for things that have helped whites that either blacks were excluded from or for things blacks don't get equally today.

How many billions in government funding has been and will be spent on DEI? I am excluded from all of it. I also am excluded for all of the governments “equity advancement” initiatives.

DEI is a billion dollar industry that white people are already paying for.

Pentagon's plan to spend over $100m on diversity training sparks fury

A request for funds for diversity, equity, inclusion and accessibility programs by the Department of Defense met opposition from MAGA Republicans.

www.newsweek.com

FACT SHEET: The Biden-Harris Administration Advances Equity and Opportunity for Black People and Communities Across the Country | The White House

From the first day in office and every day since, the Biden-Harris Administration has taken a historic approach to advancing racial equity, including directing every agency across the whole of the federal government to address the lasting impacts of systemic racism on Black communities. For...

www.whitehouse.gov

 

[el midgetron]

Why is the government funding universities that produce crap like this?



Harvard receives hundreds of millions in federal funding.

30 Colleges With the Most Federal Funding 2024

 

[martybegan]

Only to people ignorant about the history of US public policy.

Nope.

 

[martybegan]

There is no grift and my grandparents, parents and I have paid taxes for things that have helped whites that either blacks were excluded from or for things blacks don't get equally today. Your taxes won't be raised for this and since you have the same racist attitude as whiites did in prior generations, you can't say you are being penalized for something you did not do.

My taxes will have to be raised for it, at the time or later to pay for it.

Not. One. Cent.

 

[JoeB131]

Both @AZrailwhale and I pointed

Yes, we've heard it all before, and frankly it's tiresome, because the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was a specific kind of awful that killed millions.

Slave Trade | United Nations

www.un.org

15 million people were enslaved, 2.4 million died.

You just make stuff up. They literally called it a “scorched earth policy”.

Yes, Kitchner was a bastard. (And amusingly was killed by a German sub in WWI.)

But at the end of the day, the British wanted the Boers to be partners in their empire. Got to keep the Wogs in line.

 

[JoeB131]

China still has slaves to this day.

No, they don't. They have prison labor. So do we.

Except even though they have five times as many people as we have, we still manage to have more people in prison, in the "Land of the Free".

 

[el midgetron]

Yes, we've heard it all before, and frankly it's tiresome, because the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was a specific kind of awful that killed millions.

Bullshit. You are white-washing the reality of 99.99% of the history of slavery. You are like some armchair scholar looking at the news footage of the Vietnam war and declaring it the worst war in the history of mankind.

 

[el midgetron]

No, they don't. They have prison labor. So do we.

Except even though they have five times as many people as we have, we still manage to have more people in prison, in the "Land of the Free".

Slavery is not institutionalized in modern China, however there are still people working in slave-like conditions under illegal circumstances. In 2007 and 2011, disabled men in central China were enslaved to work in kilns.[47]

Slavery in China - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[CrusaderFrank]

No, they don't. They have prison labor. So do we.

Except even though they have five times as many people as we have, we still manage to have more people in prison, in the "Land of the Free".

Your posts make Xi smile! Your social credit score is stellar!

 

[JoeB131]

Bullshit. You are white-washing the reality of 99.99% of the history of slavery. You are like some armchair scholar looking at the news footage of the Vietnam war and declaring it the worst war in the history of mankind.

Except the Tran-Atlantic trade was the worst slavery in history, that was the point. It involved not people just enslaving their neighbors, but wholesale slaughter and relocation of millions of people. Not to mention systematic rape, torture, and brutality aginst a people for hundreds of years.

Slavery is not institutionalized in modern China, however there are still people working in slave-like conditions under illegal circumstances. In 2007 and 2011, disabled men in central China were enslaved to work in kilns.[47]

Point is it isn't slavery, is it? Slavery is one human being owning another, not shitty working conditions.

 

[el midgetron]

Except the Tran-Atlantic trade was the worst slavery in history, that was the point. It involved not people just enslaving their neighbors, but wholesale slaughter and relocation of millions of people. Not to mention systematic rape, torture, and brutality aginst a people for hundreds of years.

Check, check and check. You like most liberals just don’t know history or even what is happening in the world today. Most liberals are so obsessed with white people that they can’t imagine a world beyond Western Civilization. Brutal slave trades that trafficked millions of people have existed in African for thousands of years. You dismiss the experience of millions of people being enslaved by their neighbors, their wholesale slaughter, systematic rape and torture because in liberal land white people invented all that stuff.

…..Arabs would routinely acquire slaves through violent raiding, followed by capturing them and sending them on dangerous forced marches across the Sahara to slave markets where they would be treated as chattel i.e. as personal property that can be bought and sold.[20] …..

……Al-Idrisi would also describe the different methods Muslim merchants would use to enslave blacks, recording that some would "steal the children of the Zanj ……

……while many chiefs would become middlemen in the trafficking, rounding up members of nearby villages to be sold to visiting merchants.[22] ……

…..In 1353, the Berber explorer Ibn Battuta would record accompanying a trade caravan to Morocco which carried 600 black female slaves who were to be used as domestic servants and concubines.

…..Sometimes whole caravans of thousands of people could disappear without a trace.[27]….

…..Eunuchs, who were around seven times more expensive than non-castrated males could be used as harem guards, administrators, tutor, secretaries, commercial agents, and even concubines.[33] Due to strictures within Islamic law, slaves would not usually be castrated within Muslim territory and therefore would be castrated before being sent across the Sahara. ……

…..Conditions within the mining industry were notoriously harsh especially the salt mines of Basra where tens of thousands of black slaves toiled in extremely miserable conditions living on insufficient amounts of food….

….in the late 14th century, a black king of Bornu wrote a letter to the sultan of Egypt complaining of the continual slave raids perpetrated by Arab tribesmen, which were devastating his lands and resulting in the mass enslavement of the black Muslim population of the region…..

……None of the owners were ever without their whips which were in constant use...no slave dares to be ill or unable to walk, but when the poor sufferer dies the master suspects there must have been "something wrong inside" and regrets not having liberally applied the usual remedy of burning the belly with a red hot iron" thus reconciling to themselves their cruel treatment of these unfortunate creatures……

…..The Muslim historian Ahmad ibn Khalid an-Nasiribemoaned the "unlimited enslavement of blacks" in 19th century North Africa "where men traffic them like beasts or worse" and where the majority of slaves were Muslims who should have been exempt from slavery because of their religious status….

…..Slaves are often ransomed to their families and in the meantime until ransoms can be tortured, forced to work, sometimes to death and eventually executed or left to starve if they can't pay for too long. Women are often raped and used as sex slaves and sold to brothels and private Libyan clients…..

…..After receiving unverified CNN video of a November 2017 slave auction in Libya, a human trafficker told Al-Jazeera (a Qatari TV station with interests in Libya) that hundreds of migrants are bought and sold across the country every week.[70] Migrants who have gone through Libyan detention centers have shown signs of many human rights abuses such as severe abuse, including electric shocks, burns, lashes and even skinning, stated the director of health services on the Italian island of Lampedusa to Euronews…..

Trans-Saharan slave trade - Wikipedia.