...but wait! I thought if I liked my plan I could keep my plan?!

[JakeStarkey]

"Healthcare INSURANCE is NOT affordable now unless you make a lot of money or are almost completely destitute" is an opinion at best and a lie most likely.

 

[Redfish]

Says the pajama bottom beta male, blowfish.

"What Obamabots consistently ignore:
1) High premiums [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
2) High deductibles [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
3) High copay [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
4) Familes who had benefits for years but lost their insurance after Obamacare, and are opting out of the system and taking their chances because they see the rip-off for what it is." [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]

The above "abuses" are not substantiated and can't be.

Now if these betas were able to show numerous thousands who pay the fine so they can get plans that are better and cost- saving for them WITHOUT privatizing profit and socializing risk, please give them.

those proofs have been documented many times, even the left wing media has confirmed 1 through 4 above.

as to fixing the mess. there was no mess to fix. no one in the USA was denied medical care before ACA, being uninsured did not equal being untreated, and you even agreed with that in a previous post.

No, they have not, and, no, you won't. Run along. Before ACA health care was not for everybody affordable, accessible, or quality.

who was denied medical care before ACA? Who was turned away when they needed care?

Sure, going to an ER is less convenient, but you are getting it FREE. There is a convenience price for free stuff, get in line and wait for your lump of free cheese. If you want aged swiss cheese, pay for it.

 

[Redfish]

"Healthcare INSURANCE is NOT affordable now unless you make a lot of money or are almost completely destitute" is an opinion at best and a lie most likely.

wrong, its fact.

 

[Freewill]

" While a direct correlation between Obamacare and the rise in healthcare cost is hard to make" is a true statement, thank you.

Then go to the ACA or another plan or pay the fine.

The cheapest plan they had that was reasonable on the premiums went up 8 percent last year. The plan isn't all the great either. High premiums, 821 dollars/month for two. It even includes a 500 co-pay for emergency rooms and that is pretty standard.

Now think about it Jake. In another thread, it was said that people in the middle would have a hard time finding a spare 400 dollars. With the plan we have one trip to the ER is more.

Yeah, the logical way around Obamacare is to have a job where healthcare is paid for. Isn't that exactly what was said before Obamacare?

 

[Freewill]

" While a direct correlation between Obamacare and the rise in healthcare cost is hard to make" is a true statement, thank you.

Then go to the ACA or another plan or pay the fine.

See, even you can't get the simplest of things right. The SCOTUS ruled it was a tax, or did you forget?

So you are telling young people, either pay out the ass or pay Obamatax. What a freakin' option.

 

[NYcarbineer]

If the popular public option had been passed, this wouldn't be a problem.

I guess you have only the democrats to blame for that, right? Or maybe when the SCOTUS was rewriting Obamacare to make it constitutional they should have just added that option.

English please.

 

[NYcarbineer]

" While a direct correlation between Obamacare and the rise in healthcare cost is hard to make" is a true statement, thank you.

Then go to the ACA or another plan or pay the fine.

The cheapest plan they had that was reasonable on the premiums went up 8 percent last year. The plan isn't all the great either. High premiums, 821 dollars/month for two. It even includes a 500 co-pay for emergency rooms and that is pretty standard.

Now think about it Jake. In another thread, it was said that people in the middle would have a hard time finding a spare 400 dollars. With the plan we have one trip to the ER is more.

Yeah, the logical way around Obamacare is to have a job where healthcare is paid for. Isn't that exactly what was said before Obamacare?

And why was it better before?

 

[Skull Pilot]

You are saying bankruptcy is a good thing. It is not. And, yes, many folks go on public assistance when they no longer can pay their medical bills. You are so hard hearted. That is why I give your arguments or your character little respect.

Where did I say bankruptcy was a good thing?

So how many? You implied that a personal bankruptcy means going on public assistance it does not.

And you think I give a flying fuck about respect from an anonymous internet poster?

MAn you really must be pathetic if you're looking for respect on the internet

You once again post silly words and ascribe them to me. I could care less if you respect me, because your feelings are meaningless to me. You have no character.

I demolished your argument on the OP and that is what you are mad about, nothing more.

Demolished that's funny

You have not proven that people who file bankruptcy have to go on federal assistance

The only thing bankruptcy does is allow one to restructure debt

And really you couldn't make me mad if you tried.

ACA will continue in one shape or another under its or another name. I said many people not all go on assistance. Bankruptcy is far more than just restructuring of debt, the consequences being often financially a disaster for families. That you lie about merely reveals a sad side to you.

How many?

And people recover from personal bankruptcies all the time.

 

[Freewill]

If the popular public option had been passed, this wouldn't be a problem.

I guess you have only the democrats to blame for that, right? Or maybe when the SCOTUS was rewriting Obamacare to make it constitutional they should have just added that option.

English please.

I don't think I can dumb it down any further but let me try.

Obamacare was passed by all Democrats in the still of the night.

You are bitching about something that should have been in Obamacare.

Thus, you are bitching about something that the democrats should have done.

I typed slowly, I hope that helped.

 

[Freewill]

" While a direct correlation between Obamacare and the rise in healthcare cost is hard to make" is a true statement, thank you.

Then go to the ACA or another plan or pay the fine.

The cheapest plan they had that was reasonable on the premiums went up 8 percent last year. The plan isn't all the great either. High premiums, 821 dollars/month for two. It even includes a 500 co-pay for emergency rooms and that is pretty standard.

Now think about it Jake. In another thread, it was said that people in the middle would have a hard time finding a spare 400 dollars. With the plan we have one trip to the ER is more.

Yeah, the logical way around Obamacare is to have a job where healthcare is paid for. Isn't that exactly what was said before Obamacare?

And why was it better before?

Why "what" was better?

 

[Freewill]

Top 10 Reasons People Go Bankrupt

According to that site 72 percent who went bankrupt due to medical cost had some form of healthcare insurance.

Someone needs to post what effect Obamacare had on those statistics.

Believe it or not a 6500 out of pocket expense would be enough to force some folks into bankruptcy. Add a high premium and that would be more than enough.

Here is a thread where I tried to get a discussion about actual costs, not many takers.

Obamacare savings

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Says the pajama bottom beta male, blowfish.

"What Obamabots consistently ignore:
1) High premiums [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
2) High deductibles [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
3) High copay [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]
4) Familes who had benefits for years but lost their insurance after Obamacare, and are opting out of the system and taking their chances because they see the rip-off for what it is." [prove it and that they are higher than before for similar programs]

The above "abuses" are not substantiated and can't be.

Now if these betas were able to show numerous thousands who pay the fine so they can get plans that are better and cost- saving for them WITHOUT privatizing profit and socializing risk, please give them.

You are white noise.
"Prove it" - whatever little guy. As redfish sated, even the left acknowledge that ACA has resulted in higher cost with reduced coverage.
No one even argues that anymore.
You can go annoy someone else who falls for the troll line.

 

[Eaglewings]

Guess what people..unless if your killed in a accident somehow...Your going to get sick, and old....And your going to die.

You may not need the medical system yet, but it is a promise you will.

Not too many people are healthy their whole life to 120 and die in their sleep.

The funeral homes are dying for you to get screwed over in death expenses as well.

.

So if government does it, it's free! So cool

I want us to be able to pay our own way, but I want it to be fair unlike how the medical fucks made it before Obamacare.

So many died because they lost their insurance from not being able to work, and then they lost their homes and life savings after a short amount of treatment, and left for dead......Why you ask?

Because the insurance and medical high ups were getting rich off of the backs of the people.

The huge campaign to run down Obamacare is lying just like we see how the big money can lie in politics to keep the corruption going..They want it gone, and the dumb ass corruptions like McConnell are getting paid by the big fucks to make it gone.

Obamacare may have big flaws but it is a start to help those dicked around with preExisting conditions.

It was all hush hush before that , and no one cared..

It is usually hidden, but look at the jackass who bought the life saving drug company and overnight he jacked the prices up over $5000.00 a pill , which were $1.75 a pill...
Why don't we see you complain about that Kaz..?


.

 

[Eaglewings]

Top 10 Reasons People Go Bankrupt

According to that site 72 percent who went bankrupt due to medical cost had some form of healthcare insurance.

Someone needs to post what effect Obamacare had on those statistics.

Believe it or not a 6500 out of pocket expense would be enough to force some folks into bankruptcy. Add a high premium and that would be more than enough.

Here is a thread where I tried to get a discussion about actual costs, not many takers.

Obamacare savings

So Freewill is complaining about a $100.00 price increase.... Call him a Wambullance

My husband has had his own business since he started it in the 1980's, he has a law firm

We have always had a high deductible, and rarely needed to see a doctor until my son became a Type 1 diabetic and I got breast cancer 5 years ago.

This is when your eyes will open ... Because we applied every year for insurance the next , we were going to be denied insurance because of a pre-existing condition..
I had a full years of chemo, surgeries, and doctor visits for that year..without insurance they get you even more, so it would have been $900.000.000 easily.

With Obamacare they cannot deny you because of pre-existing... I am finding out this week if my cancer is back for the 3rd time.

When you pay that extra money every month , consider it like a savings account with protection for all of your life's work... You sound like you may be around my age. your not getting younger and healthier...

I am going to copy paste this into your other thread.
.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I want us to be able to pay our own way, but I want it to be fair unlike how the medical fucks made it before Obamacare.

So many died because they lost their insurance from not being able to work, and then they lost their homes and life savings after a short amount of treatment, and left for dead......Why you ask?

Because the insurance and medical high ups were getting rich off of the backs of the people.

The huge campaign to run down Obamacare is lying just like we see how the big money can lie in politics to keep the corruption going..They want it gone, and the dumb ass corruptions like McConnell are getting paid by the big fucks to make it gone.

Obamacare may have big flaws but it is a start to help those dicked around with preExisting conditions.

It was all hush hush before that , and no one cared..

It is usually hidden, but look at the jackass who bought the life saving drug company and overnight he jacked the prices up over $5000.00 a pill , which were $1.75 a pill...
Why don't we see you complain about that Kaz..?

.

Sorry to be crass, but that is a lot of bullshit.
People have been saying for years that the American healthcare system needs fixing. And a lot of the things you mention were among those needs both sides wanted to address.
Conservative people's main complaints: (not in order)

1) Tort reform to address the more senseless lawsuits, and exorbitant awards - not addressed by ACA
2) Rising premiums - made worse by ACA
3) Open up monopolistic markets with cross-state competition - not addressed by ACA.
4) Rising prescription cost - not addressed by ACA
5) Pre-existing conditions - addressed by ACA
6) Overloaded emergency rooms in hospitals by people who can't pay...made worse by ACA.

There were really only two things that ACA "fixed" - Pre-existing conditions, and extending the age of children on parents plans.
Neither of these things required an overhaul that has far more negatives than positives.
And don't even BEGIN to tell me that ACA provides insurance for the poor - bullshit!...$5000-$7000 deductible with 30% copay is not insurance. That is a donation.

 

[Eaglewings]

Sorry to be crass, but that is a lot of bullshit.
People have been saying for years that the American healthcare system needs fixing. And a lot of the things you mention were among those needs both sides wanted to address.
Conservative people's main complaints: (not in order)

1) Tort reform to address the more senseless lawsuits, and exorbitant awards - not addressed by ACA
2) Rising premiums - made worse by ACA
3) Open up monopolistic markets with cross-state competition - not addressed by ACA.
4) Rising prescription cost - not addressed by ACA
5) Pre-existing conditions - addressed by ACA
6) Overloaded emergency rooms in hospitals by people who can't pay...made worse by ACA.

There were really only two things that ACA "fixed" - Pre-existing conditions, and extending the age of children on parents plans.
Neither of these things required an overhaul that has far more negatives than positives.
And don't even BEGIN to tell me that ACA provides insurance for the poor - bullshit!...$5000-$7000 deductible with 30% copay is not insurance. That is a donation.

Your not being crass..Now remember my husband deals with the insurance companies much more than I do, but I will try to answer the best I can.

1) Tort reform to address the more senseless lawsuits, and exorbitant awards - not addressed by ACA

They have made it harder to sue for senseless lawsuits.. The attorney's won't even look at a case unless if it is a winning case like for instance finding operating tools in a dead persons body or something like that.. My husband is an attorney so I know this..


2) Rising premiums - made worse by ACA

All insurance premiums are going up for everything, at least in the cities. Home, Car all insurance.

But consider the higher cost a insurance that protects your life work.

Before Obamacare people lost everything and still died when their money ran out.

Like I said to FreeWill higher costs are due to the many illegals clogging our emergency rooms.


3) Open up monopolistic markets with cross-state competition - not addressed by ACA.

I don't know enough about this, to be honest. But all of a sudden the republicans care, it was ignored before Obamacare or voted down.

I will also say the same people in congress voting down healthcare are going to be paid $$$$$ until they die and have the best of the best healthcare.
Why are we paying for that shit?

The republicans dumb ass solution is to put $$ into a pool , which in time will be defunded by them and we are basically back getting screwed. And their dumb ass pool will cover nothing except for a doctor telling you that your going to die.

4) Rising prescription cost - not addressed by ACA

It is the fucking congress on the republican is side blocking any prescription cost reform , most everyone in congress is getting paid off by Big Pharma..

Senate Republicans voted against protecting Medicare. Republicans, led by Paul Ryan, have repeatedly proposed ending the Medicare guarantee and replacing it with a voucher program that would not keep up with seniors' costs. This proposal was once again included in the House Republican budget that will now be considered in conference. Sen. Michael Bennet's (D-CO) amendment would have created a point of order against legislation that would privatize Medicare, cut guaranteed benefits, increase out-of-pocket spending on preventive services or prescription drugs, or turn Medicare into a premium support plan (as proposed in the House Republican budget). Instead of standing with our seniors, nearly every Republican Senator voted to block new protections for Medicare.
U.S. Senate: Roll Call Vote
Statement of Purpose: To create a point of order against legislation that would privatize Medicare, cut guaranteed benefits, increase out-of-pocket spending, or turn Medicare into a premium support plan.

Vote #90 - The Senate failed to waive the point of order and adopt the amendment, 46-53. Click here to see how Republicans voted.


WASHINGTON, April 18 — A pillar of the Democratic political program tumbled today when Republicans in the Senate blocked a proposal to allow Medicare to negotiate lower drug prices for millions of older Americans, a practice now forbidden by law.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/18/washington/18cnd-medicare.html?_r=0
- See more at: Key Voting the New Republican Senate: Volume 2 | Democratic Policy & Communications Center


5) Pre-existing conditions - addressed by ACA
6) Overloaded emergency rooms in hospitals by people who can't pay...made worse by ACA.

Emergency rooms are getting slammed by the illegals using it like a doctors office..
This is the core of the problem and why our costs of medical care is so high.

I was just there for a kidney infection a few weeks back..people who look like they were not American clogging the halls with a rash, or a little cough. I had a IV and sicker than a dog, being treated in the hall because they had it so clogged up.

Yes this does need to be addressed the most...



.

 

[kaz]

Guess what people..unless if your killed in a accident somehow...Your going to get sick, and old....And your going to die.

You may not need the medical system yet, but it is a promise you will.

Not too many people are healthy their whole life to 120 and die in their sleep.

The funeral homes are dying for you to get screwed over in death expenses as well.

.

So if government does it, it's free! So cool

I want us to be able to pay our own way, but I want it to be fair unlike how the medical fucks made it before Obamacare.

So many died because they lost their insurance from not being able to work, and then they lost their homes and life savings after a short amount of treatment, and left for dead......Why you ask?

Because the insurance and medical high ups were getting rich off of the backs of the people.

The huge campaign to run down Obamacare is lying just like we see how the big money can lie in politics to keep the corruption going..They want it gone, and the dumb ass corruptions like McConnell are getting paid by the big fucks to make it gone.

Obamacare may have big flaws but it is a start to help those dicked around with preExisting conditions.

It was all hush hush before that , and no one cared..

It is usually hidden, but look at the jackass who bought the life saving drug company and overnight he jacked the prices up over $5000.00 a pill , which were $1.75 a pill...
Why don't we see you complain about that Kaz..?


.

The system was completely fucked before Obamacare, But it was because of governmnet and their stupid rules.

The best run insurance companies before Obamacare made a 4-5% profit on revenue. That's actually pretty low. Now it's lower. What should they have made? How much more could they have possibly paid for in benefits without jacking up prices like they are going up now?

 

[Andylusion]

" While a direct correlation between Obamacare and the rise in healthcare cost is hard to make" is a true statement, thank you.

Then go to the ACA or another plan or pay the fine.

The cheapest plan they had that was reasonable on the premiums went up 8 percent last year. The plan isn't all the great either. High premiums, 821 dollars/month for two. It even includes a 500 co-pay for emergency rooms and that is pretty standard.

Now think about it Jake. In another thread, it was said that people in the middle would have a hard time finding a spare 400 dollars. With the plan we have one trip to the ER is more.

Yeah, the logical way around Obamacare is to have a job where healthcare is paid for. Isn't that exactly what was said before Obamacare?

And why was it better before?

In 2006, I paid for my own private health insurance. The plan was $67 a month.

Today, all those plans are gone, eliminated by Obama Care. The cheapest plan is $250. Of course subsidies drop it down to $80 a month. So it's still more expensive to me, and at the same time, I'm having you the tax payer, pay $170 a month to the insurance company.

So I'm screwed, and you are screwed. Thanks to Obama Care.

 

[kaz]

I want us to be able to pay our own way, but I want it to be fair unlike how the medical fucks made it before Obamacare.

So many died because they lost their insurance from not being able to work, and then they lost their homes and life savings after a short amount of treatment, and left for dead......Why you ask?

Because the insurance and medical high ups were getting rich off of the backs of the people.

The huge campaign to run down Obamacare is lying just like we see how the big money can lie in politics to keep the corruption going..They want it gone, and the dumb ass corruptions like McConnell are getting paid by the big fucks to make it gone.

Obamacare may have big flaws but it is a start to help those dicked around with preExisting conditions.

It was all hush hush before that , and no one cared..

It is usually hidden, but look at the jackass who bought the life saving drug company and overnight he jacked the prices up over $5000.00 a pill , which were $1.75 a pill...
Why don't we see you complain about that Kaz..?

.

Sorry to be crass, but that is a lot of bullshit.
People have been saying for years that the American healthcare system needs fixing. And a lot of the things you mention were among those needs both sides wanted to address.
Conservative people's main complaints: (not in order)

1) Tort reform to address the more senseless lawsuits, and exorbitant awards - not addressed by ACA
2) Rising premiums - made worse by ACA
3) Open up monopolistic markets with cross-state competition - not addressed by ACA.
4) Rising prescription cost - not addressed by ACA
5) Pre-existing conditions - addressed by ACA
6) Overloaded emergency rooms in hospitals by people who can't pay...made worse by ACA.

There were really only two things that ACA "fixed" - Pre-existing conditions, and extending the age of children on parents plans.
Neither of these things required an overhaul that has far more negatives than positives.
And don't even BEGIN to tell me that ACA provides insurance for the poor - bullshit!...$5000-$7000 deductible with 30% copay is not insurance. That is a donation.

What Obamcare didn't fix on those two things is paying for them though

 

[Eaglewings]

Guess what people..unless if your killed in a accident somehow...Your going to get sick, and old....And your going to die.

You may not need the medical system yet, but it is a promise you will.

Not too many people are healthy their whole life to 120 and die in their sleep.

The funeral homes are dying for you to get screwed over in death expenses as well.

.

So if government does it, it's free! So cool

I want us to be able to pay our own way, but I want it to be fair unlike how the medical fucks made it before Obamacare.

So many died because they lost their insurance from not being able to work, and then they lost their homes and life savings after a short amount of treatment, and left for dead......Why you ask?

Because the insurance and medical high ups were getting rich off of the backs of the people.

The huge campaign to run down Obamacare is lying just like we see how the big money can lie in politics to keep the corruption going..They want it gone, and the dumb ass corruptions like McConnell are getting paid by the big fucks to make it gone.

Obamacare may have big flaws but it is a start to help those dicked around with preExisting conditions.

It was all hush hush before that , and no one cared..

It is usually hidden, but look at the jackass who bought the life saving drug company and overnight he jacked the prices up over $5000.00 a pill , which were $1.75 a pill...
Why don't we see you complain about that Kaz..?


.

The system was completely fucked before Obamacare, But it was because of governmnet and their stupid rules.

The best run insurance companies before Obamacare made a 4-5% profit on revenue. That's actually pretty low. Now it's lower. What should they have made? How much more could they have possibly paid for in benefits without jacking up prices like they are going up now?

The Big Pharma and insurance companies are richer than ever... They are the ones behind the lies about Obamacare and people believe it..They need their annual marks ups to pay for their yaughts.

We need a complete overhaul to end the corruption, but that will never happen.

Obamacare may not be perfect , but it is a start to help the people.

Well, there is a wealth in health, the 18 Richest People In Medicine
18 Richest Health Care Billionaires In America: Medical moguls 2014 » CEOWORLD Magazine


.