California politicians say you can't have guns, cops say you are on your own...nice...

[2aguy]

This is what experts in the field believe:
There's scientific consensus on guns -- and the NRA won't like it

I also found widespread confidence that a gun in the home increases the risk that a woman living in the home will be a victim of homicide (72% agree, 11% disagree) and that a gun in the home makes it a more dangerous place to be (64%) rather than a safer place (5%). There is consensus that guns are not used in self-defense far more often than they are used in crime (73% vs. 8%) and that the change to more permissive gun carrying laws has not reduced crime rates (62% vs. 9%). Finally, there is consensus that strong gun laws reduce homicide (71% vs. 12%).

Now none of this means we ban guns, but it shows how lott and kleck are not what the majority believe. Real researchers have debunked their studies.

Yes...and here is how they got their "Consensus" the same way they got it for man made global warming...

CPRC at Fox News: Gun control advocates taking a page out of global warming advocates' handbook - Crime Prevention Research Center

However, instead of actually reviewing the scientific literature on the subject, Professor David Hemenway at Harvard made a survey of cherry-picked authors. Surprisingly, he found the vast majority agreed that we need more gun control.

So let’s look at the details.

He polled authors who had published in the fields of “public health, public policy, sociology, or criminology.” Most notably, half of the authors picked were within Hemenway’s own field of public health and another third were sociologists/criminologists, followed by public policy and a few economists. It dramatically over weighted those in public health. It didn’t matter whether the publications even contained any empirical work or were related to the survey questions.

Authors were asked if they agreed with the statement: “In the United States, guns are used in self-defense far more often than they are used in crime.” Hemenway reports that 73 percent disagreed. However, many respondents may have believed that there still exists a net benefit from gun ownership — just not enough to say that guns are used defensively “far more often.”

It is abundantly clear that it matters who you ask and how the questions are asked. A survey released in February by the Crime Prevention Research Centerconducted by Professor Gary Mauser at Simon Fraser University in Canada found that 88 percent of North American economics researchers agreed with the statement that, in the US, guns were more frequently used for self-defense than for crime. . . .

 

[2aguy]

And here are the first signs of the coming tide...

Overall Crime Rate Increases in Los Angeles for First Time Since 2003

After 12 straight years of declining crime in Los Angeles, the city experienced an uptick in criminal acts in the first part of 2015, the mayor and police chief announced Wednesday.

Violent and property crimes — known as Part I crimes — were up 12.7 percent for the first half of 2015 compared to the same time in 2014. Violent crimes alone were up 20.6 percent.

Wait. How was it declining so long with strict gun control and liberal policies?

They backed of killing each other...since it is obvious that gun control laws don't keep them from getting guns. Criminals decide when they want to kill people...and when they do they decide wether to use guns or not...in every country in the world, Britain, France, the rest of Europe and Japan.....their criminals get guns when they want or need them.

The only people who can't get guns....law abiding people who obey gun control laws....the very people who do not use guns to commit crime, and murder......

When criminals decide to back of killing each other, the murder rate goes down.....it also helps to have enough police.....

Your claims as usual are baseless. Crime went down with strict gun control and liberal policies.

Yeah it's worked so well in Chicago.

Violent crime has gone up since chicago got carry. That doesn't seem to be working.

And of course you pretend that you don't know the reason. The gangs in chicago pick their aldermen, who then protect the gang members and their interests, the Chicago police have stopped making traffic stops....it was actually on the news today, one of the primary reasons...Ferguson and the recent laws suits here in Chicago with the shootings of thugs by police....and then you have new rules created with the ACLU which forces police to fill out 2 pages of paperwork for every traffic stop....

Chicago cops are not taking any chances and they have backed off.....

Concealed carry can only do so much....the police do 90% of the work.....and when they don't, concealed carry becomes even more important....

 

[Brain357]

The number of people with a carry license is still very small.

Considering before Obama not many of mine had a CC, now a good many do and I will soon.

It is certainly growing. It is pretty amazing marketing by the gun companies. Crime is at its lowest in recorded history and they still get people thinking they need a gun. Glad many are made in the US.

I'm not worried, but it would suck if you needed it and it was sitting at home. Doesn't cost anything to carry it.

No but sounds like a pain to me. I'm pretty old and have never needed one, nor do I know anyone who has. And then if you are robbed by someone armed what do you do? There is like a 99% chance he just wants money. Pull your gun and have a shootout and you have a 50% chance of surviving. I don't carry lots of valuable so why carry a gun? I understand some have more of a need, but like 99.9% of people will never need one. Selling something people don't need is again amazing marketing. There are also people in jail who thought they were lawfully defending themselves...

I may never need a socket set in my car, but if it breaks down on the side of the road. I will be glad I have it.

A socket set has no potential negatives.

 

[2aguy]

Nope….crime started the downward trend as states were adopting concealed and open carry laws…it started in the early 90s. And the fact that the crime rate declined as more people carried guns for self defense destroys the entire notion that law abiding citizens, carrying guns for self defense increase the crime rate. Normal, law abiding people, carrying guns are not the crime problem. The criminal sub culture in the United States is the problem, and they do not obey gun control laws.

There has been no significant number of people carrying til the last 5 years. Even now it is a tiny number. To claim it has caused crime to go down is obviously false. There are almost no arrests due to carry. It has however not increased crime.

What are you talking about, Obama has been the best gun salesman ever.

The number of people with a carry license is still very small.

Considering before Obama not many of mine had a CC, now a good many do and I will soon.

It is certainly growing. It is pretty amazing marketing by the gun companies. Crime is at its lowest in recorded history and they still get people thinking they need a gun. Glad many are made in the US.

Do you know how stupid your post is.....how exactly are the gun companies getting people to buy guns?....they don't advertise anywhere......where exactly are they marketing their gun to the general population? Try thinking for once instead of repeating, zombie like the latest talking point of Mayor bloomberg and his anti gun groups......

What has people buying guns is they are not stupid.....they realize that crime happens to people every day....and people who have guns can stop the crime, people who don't, can't.

 

[2aguy]

Considering before Obama not many of mine had a CC, now a good many do and I will soon.

It is certainly growing. It is pretty amazing marketing by the gun companies. Crime is at its lowest in recorded history and they still get people thinking they need a gun. Glad many are made in the US.

I'm not worried, but it would suck if you needed it and it was sitting at home. Doesn't cost anything to carry it.

No but sounds like a pain to me. I'm pretty old and have never needed one, nor do I know anyone who has. And then if you are robbed by someone armed what do you do? There is like a 99% chance he just wants money. Pull your gun and have a shootout and you have a 50% chance of surviving. I don't carry lots of valuable so why carry a gun? I understand some have more of a need, but like 99.9% of people will never need one. Selling something people don't need is again amazing marketing. There are also people in jail who thought they were lawfully defending themselves...

I may never need a socket set in my car, but if it breaks down on the side of the road. I will be glad I have it.

A socket set has no potential negatives.

You are such a child brain......I am amazed you have managed to survive to whatever age you actually are.....

 

[Brain357]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

 

[Brain357]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

 

[2aguy]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

 

[2aguy]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

yep...they disagree.....Kleck is a sociologist who studies crime....Lott is an economist who studies guns and self defense....

 

[2aguy]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

And it is funny that now you site Kleck..the guy you just trashed a few posts ago to trash Lott......you are a child...you should grow up and try to understand the world around you....

 

[2aguy]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

It is also funny.....you got that link from John Lott's own site...where he links to his differences with Kleck.....and doesn't hide from it.....You do realize that the Crime Prevention Research Center..where you got that little piece from is Lott's site..right....?

 

[Brain357]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

Economics is the social science that describes the factors that determine the production, distribution and consumption of goods and services.

 

[jknowgood]

Considering before Obama not many of mine had a CC, now a good many do and I will soon.

It is certainly growing. It is pretty amazing marketing by the gun companies. Crime is at its lowest in recorded history and they still get people thinking they need a gun. Glad many are made in the US.

I'm not worried, but it would suck if you needed it and it was sitting at home. Doesn't cost anything to carry it.

No but sounds like a pain to me. I'm pretty old and have never needed one, nor do I know anyone who has. And then if you are robbed by someone armed what do you do? There is like a 99% chance he just wants money. Pull your gun and have a shootout and you have a 50% chance of surviving. I don't carry lots of valuable so why carry a gun? I understand some have more of a need, but like 99.9% of people will never need one. Selling something people don't need is again amazing marketing. There are also people in jail who thought they were lawfully defending themselves...

I may never need a socket set in my car, but if it breaks down on the side of the road. I will be glad I have it.

A socket set has no potential negatives.

Guns are the same, they don't shoot people. People do, I can tell you I can kill somebody just as quick with a tension bar. Guns are tools, bad people use them as weapons. Good people use them as tools to defeat the bad people. When you realize that, maybe you won't be paranoid.

 

[2aguy]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

Economics is the social science that describes the factors that determine the production, distribution and consumption of goods and services.

And they are experts at numbers and research.....please...try harder.....

 

[Brain357]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

It is also funny.....you got that link from John Lott's own site...where he links to his differences with Kleck.....and doesn't hide from it.....You do realize that the Crime Prevention Research Center..where you got that little piece from is Lott's site..right....?

Yes. That would seem like the only way you won't just deny the obvious. Even kleck knows lott is wrong.

 

[Brain357]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

Economics is the social science that describes the factors that determine the production, distribution and consumption of goods and services.

And they are experts at numbers and research.....please...try harder.....

You were already proven wrong, no need to try.

 

[2aguy]

Even kleck know lott is a joke.

In the new discussion, Gary continues to go out of his way to engage in personal attacks on Lott: “he instead invents a distorted straw man,” “presents a fantasy version,” “Lott’s version of economic theory is one that has been dead for decades,” “One of Lott’s many errors is to blindly assume,” “In his efforts to distort my positions . . . blatant falsehood,” “This is pure invention,” “Lott’s error was in simplistically assuming,” “Lott tells another especially bizarre whopper,” and “The rest of Lott’s comments are filled with misinformation that betrays an extraordinary ignorance of the research literature.”

CPRC's John Lott continued debate with Gary Kleck over his attacks on "More Guns, Less Crime" - Crime Prevention Research Center

It is also funny.....you got that link from John Lott's own site...where he links to his differences with Kleck.....and doesn't hide from it.....You do realize that the Crime Prevention Research Center..where you got that little piece from is Lott's site..right....?

Yes. That would seem like the only way you won't just deny the obvious. Even kleck knows lott is wrong.

Lott and Kleck disagree...as any two people will.....get real brain......

anyone interested can read the actual debate at the link...it is interesting....Lott says that as a sociologist Kleck misses things and vice versa........

 

[2aguy]

And in Conclusion...

Conclusion

The vast majority of researchers who have published refereed articles in economics journals think that gun ownership makes people safer.

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

Economics is the social science that describes the factors that determine the production, distribution and consumption of goods and services.

And they are experts at numbers and research.....please...try harder.....

You were already proven wrong, no need to try.

Wow....mature...about the child like level I expect from you.

 

[Brain357]

It is certainly growing. It is pretty amazing marketing by the gun companies. Crime is at its lowest in recorded history and they still get people thinking they need a gun. Glad many are made in the US.

I'm not worried, but it would suck if you needed it and it was sitting at home. Doesn't cost anything to carry it.

No but sounds like a pain to me. I'm pretty old and have never needed one, nor do I know anyone who has. And then if you are robbed by someone armed what do you do? There is like a 99% chance he just wants money. Pull your gun and have a shootout and you have a 50% chance of surviving. I don't carry lots of valuable so why carry a gun? I understand some have more of a need, but like 99.9% of people will never need one. Selling something people don't need is again amazing marketing. There are also people in jail who thought they were lawfully defending themselves...

I may never need a socket set in my car, but if it breaks down on the side of the road. I will be glad I have it.

A socket set has no potential negatives.

Guns are the same, they don't shoot people. People do, I can tell you I can kill somebody just as quick with a tension bar. Guns are tools, bad people use them as weapons. Good people use them as tools to defeat the bad people. When you realize that, maybe you won't be paranoid.

Not paranoid. Those who think they need a gun are paranoid. You wear a helmet when you drive your car too?

 

[Brain357]

When did ecomomics become the study of crime?

Since forever....

Economics is the social science that describes the factors that determine the production, distribution and consumption of goods and services.

And they are experts at numbers and research.....please...try harder.....

You were already proven wrong, no need to try.

Wow....mature...about the child like level I expect from you.

You are the one who didn't know what economics is.