Can someone explain what has happened to the GOP?

[Rustic]

The GOP has been neutered long ago by career politicians, known as Rinos today....

But Trump is the ultimate Northeast RINO.....he's who you all have pushed out of congress....the social moderate, isn't he???

Trump is literally a RINO....yet points to other candidates and screams.....You are not a real Republican

Socialist/career politician/Rino all the same thing... The d or r does not matter anymore at this point.
The federal government ceased to be the people's decades ago...

 

[Rustic]

When Boehner and McConnell caved on Cut, Cap, and Balance, thats when I began losing faith in the Republican Party. They weren't at all fighting for their constituents. When the going got tough, they just seemingly shrugged their shoulders and moved on. Beyond weak.

What should they have done?

They should have put single term limits on all elected federal politicians from the start.

 

[Rustic]

And maybe explain it without the standard hyperbole and partisan BS. Just some honest, solid analysis. Or maybe provide a link to a piece that someone has written that calmly and reasonably explains it.

I think this "Fox News is the enemy" thing is the final straw with me. I'm now completely lost, and I feel like Sandra Bullock in Gravity, floating away from reality with no way to get back.

To wit:

• The aforementioned darling news network is, overnight, the target of at least as much derision as MSNBC
  
• A bombastic New Yorker who is clearly not a conservative is running away with the nomination
• That same candidate can literally say the most ridiculous things and it only makes his support stronger
  
• Suddenly, nationalism & populism clearly have more energy in the party than "conservative values"
• A nihilistic, "I don't care, just blow the whole thing up" attitude seems to completely permeate the party
  
• The slightest nod toward legislative cooperation is simply no longer allowed in public discourse
• The Establishment, whatever that is, appears to be more hated than any Democrat

It's like half the party has just snapped.

Exactly what is the goal here? And does anyone care if this inter-party schism is healed?
.

I've told you for a long time there is no such thing as a RINO only people that republicans disagree with at the time. They are a knee jerk party who puts more into tough talking and show than substance. I think Bush played it that way great....except people started to believe the show.

Now we have Trump, a literal rich kid who simply says hes a (Maverick, Outsidered, Rebel) Anti Establishment enough with a straight face and all he has to do to strengthen himself is to blame an enemy to create support. Insert Press and Media here. Now maybe my explanation isnt considered calm or you will call it partisan to move on and ignore it....Ironically its the same thing that is happening now. You've been taught that everyone is wrong or partisan or hates your face instead of them might actually having a point.

So now the republicans are being yelled down by their own. It was inevitable. Its like Frankenstein's monster

Ain't it great what is happening to the GOP and its career politicians??

Nothing has happened. But it's interesting that the Rebel label seems to work on you guys every election cycle when Trump is anything BUT...but he says he is a whole bunch so it takes hold

The sooner the GOP establishment is burned to the ground the better... Poach more Rinos

Better vote for Cruz then, since Trump said he'd cut deals with Nancy Pelosi, i.e. he's a RINO.

I might not vote at all... I might write in Mickey Mouse he would be more qualified than any career politician.

 

[Uncensored2008]

And maybe explain it without the standard hyperbole and partisan BS. Just some honest, solid analysis. Or maybe provide a link to a piece that someone has written that calmly and reasonably explains it.

I think this "Fox News is the enemy" thing is the final straw with me. I'm now completely lost, and I feel like Sandra Bullock in Gravity, floating away from reality with no way to get back.

To wit:

• The aforementioned darling news network is, overnight, the target of at least as much derision as MSNBC
  
• A bombastic New Yorker who is clearly not a conservative is running away with the nomination
• That same candidate can literally say the most ridiculous things and it only makes his support stronger
  
• Suddenly, nationalism & populism clearly have more energy in the party than "conservative values"
• A nihilistic, "I don't care, just blow the whole thing up" attitude seems to completely permeate the party
  
• The slightest nod toward legislative cooperation is simply no longer allowed in public discourse
• The Establishment, whatever that is, appears to be more hated than any Democrat

It's like half the party has just snapped.

Exactly what is the goal here? And does anyone care if this inter-party schism is healed?
.

Obama happened.

This is just the pendulum swinging back and going just as far from center in the other direction.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I've notice that most of the parts of the country that haven't yet recovered are run by GOP governors (or in the case of now poorest state in the Union, Louisiana--up until very recently). So they feel betrayed by their own party. And of course by the Democrats as well, since they nominated a black man.

HACK ALERT!

This is a level 1 hack alert. Remain calm and back away from the inanity being spewed by the mindless hack, for your own safety.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Populism is dangerous.

It offers simple solutions to complex problems, and relies on demagoguery and scapegoating of others. It speaks to people in a very dark place.

Some of the worst governments anywhere have been populist or had roots in populism - Chavez, Peron, Mugabe, Hitler to name a few.

Obama, Sanders.

Trump is the mirror image of Obama, he is the opposite, but that doesn't mean he is any better.

 

[SmokeALib]

When Boehner and McConnell caved on Cut, Cap, and Balance, thats when I began losing faith in the Republican Party. They weren't at all fighting for their constituents. When the going got tough, they just seemingly shrugged their shoulders and moved on. Beyond weak.

What should they have done?

They should have shut down the damn government until some meaningful spending cuts were put in place.

 

[miketx]

That Trump said he'd ban American Muslims from entering the country, then walked back from it, shows that he is not thinking this through and reacting emotionally.

Why lie? I heard the statement Trump made when he made it. He said "Until". Why don't you and the rest of the libtards put your heads together and get your lies straight?

 

[Zander]

Here is what has happened to the GOP. The GOP leadership has FAILED. . They talk a good game come election time, but when it is time to ACT, they are spineless cowards. They do not have the intestinal fortitude needed to get the job done. Talk is cheap. For instance:

We have a border security issue. Should we continue to allow illegals to crash our gates at will? The GOP has been promising border security for 30 years. We have more illegals now than ever. FAIL

We are being ass-raped by bad trade deals. Should we just continue along, losing our jobs and manufacturing base? The GOP answer is to pass yet another lousy trade deal. FAIL

Our vets are treated like shit and the VA is a fucking joke. . Should we continue to pay millions in bonuses to an incompetent VA while an average of 22 vets commit suicide every day? The GOP has done nothing to fix the VA in over 30 years. FAIL

We are $19 trillion in debt. Should we just continue to increase spending every year and hope nobody notices? The GOP response is to pass the largest spending bill in US history. FAIL

Our tax code is a clusterfuck that is so complicated even the IRS doesn't understand it! The GOP has been promising "tax reform" for 30 years. What have they done? Nada. Squat. Zilch. FAIL​

If you think we should continue doing the same shit we've been doing (more FAIL), you should vote for an establishment GOP candidate.

 

[miketx]

What is clear is that the libtards lie repeatedly. In the face of that, let's just go ahead and have a civil war, because debating these lying sons of whores is a waste of time.

 

[SwimExpert]

And maybe explain it without the standard hyperbole and partisan BS. Just some honest, solid analysis. Or maybe provide a link to a piece that someone has written that calmly and reasonably explains it.

I think this "Fox News is the enemy" thing is the final straw with me. I'm now completely lost, and I feel like Sandra Bullock in Gravity, floating away from reality with no way to get back.

To wit:

• The aforementioned darling news network is, overnight, the target of at least as much derision as MSNBC
  
• A bombastic New Yorker who is clearly not a conservative is running away with the nomination
• That same candidate can literally say the most ridiculous things and it only makes his support stronger
  
• Suddenly, nationalism & populism clearly have more energy in the party than "conservative values"
• A nihilistic, "I don't care, just blow the whole thing up" attitude seems to completely permeate the party
  
• The slightest nod toward legislative cooperation is simply no longer allowed in public discourse
• The Establishment, whatever that is, appears to be more hated than any Democrat

It's like half the party has just snapped.

Exactly what is the goal here? And does anyone care if this inter-party schism is healed?
.

In a nutshell....no. I cannot explain what has happened. I can't explain it because it's not something that happened recently. It's been happening for years. Decades, really. It's been one hell of a slow cooker maturation process.

In order to even begin trying to understand it, you have to get your head around some fundamental truths that most people tend to either neglect or never realize.

1 - Politics is much more generational than it is partisan.
2 - Grassroots inevitably degrades to massroots.
3 - A two party system will always a facade, hiding many coalitions along a single axis.

Understanding those things, then going back and reliving the past 30 years, the current state of the GOP makes perfect sense.

 

[rightwinger]

When Boehner and McConnell caved on Cut, Cap, and Balance, thats when I began losing faith in the Republican Party. They weren't at all fighting for their constituents. When the going got tough, they just seemingly shrugged their shoulders and moved on. Beyond weak.

What should they have done?

They should have shut down the damn government until some meaningful spending cuts were put in place.

The stupid response I expected

 

[SmokeALib]

When Boehner and McConnell caved on Cut, Cap, and Balance, thats when I began losing faith in the Republican Party. They weren't at all fighting for their constituents. When the going got tough, they just seemingly shrugged their shoulders and moved on. Beyond weak.

What should they have done?

They should have shut down the damn government until some meaningful spending cuts were put in place.

The stupid response I expected

You should always expect stupid responses. Easier for you to understand.

 

[Katzndogz]

The answer lies with the leaders of the GOP. They can be heard discussing the matter daily on am radio stations nationwide. The goal of the GOP has been to get ratings rather than votes. With that in mind....exciting the base is more productive than expanding the base.

That's true. Exciting the base is always going to be more productive than expanding the base. Excited voters are motivated to vote. A large but apathetic voter base will lose.

 

[Toro]

Populism is dangerous.

It offers simple solutions to complex problems, and relies on demagoguery and scapegoating of others. It speaks to people in a very dark place.

Some of the worst governments anywhere have been populist or had roots in populism - Chavez, Peron, Mugabe, Hitler to name a few.

Simple answers are sometimes called for.

And we are not scapegoating others. NOr are we operating from a "dark place".

It is when your leading candidate calls Mexican immigrants rapists and proposes banning all Muslims.

That's really bad.

There are much, much better ways to articulate opposition to immigration and terrorism than that.

Because of this and this alone, I will never support Trump.

There is a problem with crime and Third World Immigration. Being honest about that is not demagoguery or scapegoating others.

There is a problem with Muslims becoming radicalized and we don't know how to filter for that. A "temporary" ban is a reasonable response to that. That is not demagoguery or scapegoating others.

If there are "better ways" to articulate opposition to immigrant criminals and terrorism, no one has picked up that ball and ran with it.

Trump has. He is the best option for those issues available at this time.

It is not true that most Mexican immigrants are rapists, drug mules, etc.

Nor is it true that all Muslims are terrorists.

That's demagoguery and scapegoating groups of people.

That is divisive and dangerous.

That Trump said he'd ban American Muslims from entering the country, then walked back from it, shows that he is not thinking this through and reacting emotionally.

The country needs a cool, level-headed President, not one that reacts without thinking.

THat fact that a majority of Mexican immigrants are NOT rapists or drug mules does not reduce the number of those that ARE, or address the harm they do to Americans.

The fact that the majority of musilms are NOT terrorist does not reduce the danger from those that are.

These are real problems and it is NOT demagoguery not scapegoating to address them.

THis country needs a president that is not afraid to address crime by illegal immigrants and muslim terrorism because it is Politically INcorrect to do so.

There's a big difference between identifying problems within groups and entire groups that are problems.

Blaming entire groups IS scapegoating and demagoguery.

That's what Trump is doing.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The answer lies with the leaders of the GOP. They can be heard discussing the matter daily on am radio stations nationwide. The goal of the GOP has been to get ratings rather than votes. With that in mind....exciting the base is more productive than expanding the base.

That's true. Exciting the base is always going to be more productive than expanding the base. Excited voters are motivated to vote. A large but apathetic voter base will lose.

Look at that. You grasp a fact and you didn't have to say something nasty to go with it. The problem with this plan is that the GOP base is shrinking and not enough of the base can seem to get excited about the same thing.

The funny part is that you agree with the plan.

 

[Correll]

Simple answers are sometimes called for.

And we are not scapegoating others. NOr are we operating from a "dark place".

It is when your leading candidate calls Mexican immigrants rapists and proposes banning all Muslims.

That's really bad.

There are much, much better ways to articulate opposition to immigration and terrorism than that.

Because of this and this alone, I will never support Trump.

There is a problem with crime and Third World Immigration. Being honest about that is not demagoguery or scapegoating others.

There is a problem with Muslims becoming radicalized and we don't know how to filter for that. A "temporary" ban is a reasonable response to that. That is not demagoguery or scapegoating others.

If there are "better ways" to articulate opposition to immigrant criminals and terrorism, no one has picked up that ball and ran with it.

Trump has. He is the best option for those issues available at this time.

It is not true that most Mexican immigrants are rapists, drug mules, etc.

Nor is it true that all Muslims are terrorists.

That's demagoguery and scapegoating groups of people.

That is divisive and dangerous.

That Trump said he'd ban American Muslims from entering the country, then walked back from it, shows that he is not thinking this through and reacting emotionally.

The country needs a cool, level-headed President, not one that reacts without thinking.

THat fact that a majority of Mexican immigrants are NOT rapists or drug mules does not reduce the number of those that ARE, or address the harm they do to Americans.

The fact that the majority of musilms are NOT terrorist does not reduce the danger from those that are.

These are real problems and it is NOT demagoguery not scapegoating to address them.

THis country needs a president that is not afraid to address crime by illegal immigrants and muslim terrorism because it is Politically INcorrect to do so.

There's a big difference between identifying problems within groups and entire groups that are problems.

Blaming entire groups IS scapegoating and demagoguery.

That's what Trump is doing.

In both cases (criminal illegal and muslim terrrorists) Trump clearly indicated that he was discussing PORTIONS of the groups, not the behavior of ALL of the group.

And that is the reality of the situation.

Allowing the entire group of illegals to remain allows all the criminals and rapists and drug dealers and gang members to remain.

Allowing all the Muslims in will allow in those individual muslims who may be now or may become terrorists in, where they can commit acts of terrorism.

And that is the reality of the situation.

Dicussing the truth is not demagoguery or scapegoating people.

 

[SmokeALib]

The answer lies with the leaders of the GOP. They can be heard discussing the matter daily on am radio stations nationwide. The goal of the GOP has been to get ratings rather than votes. With that in mind....exciting the base is more productive than expanding the base.

That's true. Exciting the base is always going to be more productive than expanding the base. Excited voters are motivated to vote. A large but apathetic voter base will lose.

Look at that. You grasp a fact and you didn't have to say something nasty to go with it. The problem with this plan is that the GOP base is shrinking and not enough of the base can seem to get excited about the same thing.

The funny part is that you agree with the plan.

After the clown show The Blamer has brought forth, you will see the GOP base increase. Even Libs aren't that braindead.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The answer lies with the leaders of the GOP. They can be heard discussing the matter daily on am radio stations nationwide. The goal of the GOP has been to get ratings rather than votes. With that in mind....exciting the base is more productive than expanding the base.

That's true. Exciting the base is always going to be more productive than expanding the base. Excited voters are motivated to vote. A large but apathetic voter base will lose.

Look at that. You grasp a fact and you didn't have to say something nasty to go with it. The problem with this plan is that the GOP base is shrinking and not enough of the base can seem to get excited about the same thing.

The funny part is that you agree with the plan.

After the clown show The Blamer has brought forth, you will see the GOP base increase. Even Libs aren't that braindead.

Look everyone! A new toy! It's not the newest model though. Bummer.

 

[Kondor3]

...No. They are not similar. Not in any way.

And there is where I believe you to be profoundly wrong.

It is true, that they are not similar in their positions on various issues.

But it is also true that they both rely upon Popular Rebellion against their respective Established Party Leadership, in order to grow and sustain their support bases.

We are looking at a shockingly sudden and profound Populist movement on BOTH sides of the aisle; with The People themselves attempting to shove their leadership aside.

THERE is the similarity.

Not in the party platform nor the mechanics by which they might accomplish an agenda, but in the Rebellious nature of their initial and most loyal support base.

That similarity is as obvious as obvious can be.