Carson Says, “It is our faith that gives us freedom.”

[IsaacNewton]

And do you know who kept the knowledge of civilization alive during the dark ages?

The church.

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

 

[Avatar4321]

And do you know who kept the knowledge of civilization alive during the dark ages?

The church.

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

 

[IsaacNewton]

And do you know who kept the knowledge of civilization alive during the dark ages?

The church.

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

And do you know who kept the knowledge of civilization alive during the dark ages?

The church.

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

"common knowledge" ???

Now that's funny.

 

[koshergrl]

Isnt religion and liberty a contradiction to each other?
You slave or go to hell. Or killed..
Does this not make sense to anybody else?

You're free to go to hell if you prefer.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

"common knowledge" ???

Now that's funny.

Among educated people yes, and I'd say among most of the uneducated as well. Sorry, your time is up. Maybe you can dupe someone else.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

"common knowledge" ???

Now that's funny.

Among educated people yes, and I'd say among most of the uneducated as well. Sorry, your time is up. Maybe you can dupe someone else.

Educated people ?? Like you ??

That's even more funny.

 

[Avatar4321]

And do you know who kept the knowledge of civilization alive during the dark ages?

The church.

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

More straw men. I didn't claim anything you just pretended I did. I've just pointed out I'm familiar with the history and your caricature isn't at all accurate.

I'm not rewriting a thing. I've just studied the topic enough to know your summary of facts is pure bs.

 

[Avatar4321]

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

"common knowledge" ???

Now that's funny.

Among educated people yes, and I'd say among most of the uneducated as well. Sorry, your time is up. Maybe you can dupe someone else.

Your viewpoint isn't even common among historians on the subject.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

'Carson Says, “It is our faith that gives us freedom.”'

And faith is often used to 'justify' taking freedom from others.

Indeed, faith is an unstable foundation upon which to build the edifice of freedom, the Framers understood this well, hence the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment – our freedom manifests as a consequence of our being human, not our faith, which can be subjective and capricious, where freedom is safeguarded by the Constitution, its case law, and the rule of law.

And for theists who might snipe that the law can also be 'subjective and capricious,' they only succeed in exhibiting their ignorance of the law, demonstrating the arrogance common to many theists.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I guess you didn't read it, there was no civilization during the dark ages, hence the DARK ages. There wasn't real civilization in the west again until the Crusades when the Templars brought back wagons full of books and writings from the east, who's civilization had been intact during the dark ages and whom had advanced significantly during that time.

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

More straw men. I didn't claim anything you just pretended I did. I've just pointed out I'm familiar with the history and your caricature isn't at all accurate.

I'm not rewriting a thing. I've just studied the topic enough to know your summary of facts is pure bs.

Sorry Newman, rewrite history on your own time. Anyone can research this and any other subject and it just doesn't fit your self-fulfilling projections.

But your mind is closed and I won't waste any more time trying to open it. Enjoy the closet.

 

[Avatar4321]

Sure there was. There were several civilizations during the dark ages. Visigoth Spain followed by the caliphate in Spain. Both civilizations though far different. The holy roman empire under Charlemagne. The Irish were incredibly civilized after st Patrick converted the isle and preserved most of the classics. Irish monks spend several centuries after the fall of Rome reintroducing the classics throughout Europe.

The chaos after romes fall lasted about 100 years and it was mostly the church that rebuilt Europe.

So all historians are incorrect that the Dark Ages lasted until the Crusades, and you have come along to set them all straight.

Alrighty then. LOL

Straw man. Historians dont say that at all. Who do you think taught me? I have a degree in this lol

LOL Ok, you are the authority on Earth. Or at least on message boards and in your mind. Come one man, it is common knowledge, you don't get to rewrite history. Its like playing tennis with someone, you both admit there is a courst, the dimensions of the court, the height of the net, etc..

You don't get to say "the court is whatever I say it is".

Ok, go play.

More straw men. I didn't claim anything you just pretended I did. I've just pointed out I'm familiar with the history and your caricature isn't at all accurate.

I'm not rewriting a thing. I've just studied the topic enough to know your summary of facts is pure bs.

Sorry Newman, rewrite history on your own time. Anyone can research this and any other subject and it just doesn't fit your self-fulfilling projections.

But your mind is closed and I won't waste any more time trying to open it. Enjoy the closet.

I agree that anyone can do the research. And if they did it would reflect what I am telling you.

Take the Irish for instance. Research into the history of the Irish would show how how they became leaders of scholastic during the so called dark ages. How they preserved the classics and knowledge of Europe and began reintroducing it into Mainland Europe in the centuries that followed Rome's fall.

You can also look up the history of Charlemagne and the Holy Roman Empire. Not exactly uncivilized like you were pretending.

Or visigoth Spain or Umayyad Spain.

That's just A apart of western Europe. Eastern Europe remained stable till the 11th century.

If you seriously think that Rome fell and people became uncivilized and stupid for 600- 800 years or so you haven't done enough research. I doubt you could find a single serious historian who would agrees with that hypothesis or who would agree that the Church wasn't the main source of scholarship or didn't keep the knowledge of the classic period during the middle ages.

The problem was a) there were a lot of things running around making dissemination of knowledge slower and b) until the importation of paper and the invention of the printing press widespread education of anyone was difficult.

Of course, I'm presuming you actually care about the subject and want to be accurate.

 

[Votto]

This should drive the Left and atheists wild. How dare a presidential candidate support any religion? What about the so-called “separation of church and state” that doesn't exist anywhere in our constitution?



Read the full story @ Ben Carson Just Called On Every Christian In America To Do THIS, And It Shouldn't Be Ignored and share it with those who believe like you.

"Allah says: “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error. Whoever rejects false worship and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that never breaks. And Allah hears and knows all things.” [Sûrah al-Baqarah: 256]

One of the fundamental truths established by the sacred texts is that no one can be compelled to accept Islam. It is the duty of Muslims to establish the proof of Islam to the people so that truth can be made clear from falsehood. After that, whoever wishes to accept Islam may do so and whoever wishes to continue upon unbelief may do so. No one should be threatened or harmed in any way if he does not wish to accept Islam."

“Let there be no compulsion in religion.” | IslamToday - English

What Islam says, and what Muslims do is admittedly a tad different.

If you create a theocracy, no matter the theocracy, you create sinful men who claim to speak for God. This is why Sharia law and the Islamic religion can never obtain a free society. This is what was wrong with Constantine when he created a Christian theocracy. Constantine was not even a Christian, yet he created a theocracy that led to inquisitions and Crusades.

Luckily, Christ never mandated a theocracy, while Mohammad did with Sharia law. In fact, Christ said that his kingdom was not of this world, leaving theocracies in the dung heap. Christians learned their lesson, by and large, as where Islam can never break free from their chains.

It got me thinking back to the Pop's visit to the US. Here are he remains of a Christian theocracy. Here you have a man who claims to speak for God giving sermons on global warming, forgiving women who have abortions, and the need for the state to redistribute money around the world.

Could anyone picture Jesus preaching like this? The Pope is, and always has been, a political tool.

 

[Taz]

Faith gives people freedom because they aren't afraid of the unknowns of dying, so they work really hard to convince themselves of their preferred fairy tales. It's an ongoing struggle, but it's better than being afraid, I guess.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

'Carson Says, “It is our faith that gives us freedom.”'

And faith is often used to 'justify' taking freedom from others.

Indeed, faith is an unstable foundation upon which to build the edifice of freedom, the Framers understood this well, hence the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment – our freedom manifests as a consequence of our being human, not our faith, which can be subjective and capricious, where freedom is safeguarded by the Constitution, its case law, and the rule of law.

And for theists who might snipe that the law can also be 'subjective and capricious,' they only succeed in exhibiting their ignorance of the law, demonstrating the arrogance common to many theists.

Red Herring.

Would you like some capers ?