Christians Aren't Required By Law Now To Go To Hell Forever In Arizona!

[AVG-JOE]

To everyone on the right celebrating this law

Do you support a business refusing to serve the military because their religion opposes war?

go Jehovah Witnesses!

Someone asked me if I wanted to be a Jehovah's Witness, but I told them I didn't see the accident.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zXDo4dL7SU]Ba Dum Tss! - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Silhouette]

Something worth mentioning is everytime some fundy bashes gay people, they're sinning in the process.

"You may surely reuke a sinner, but not bear a sin on their account."
- Lev 19:17

All about 'rebuking sinners' (and not sinning in the process)
Correcting the Sinner is not ?Being Judgmental.? It is an Essential Work of Charity. « Archdiocese of Washington

This brings up a good point. Should Christians have to bear a sin on the account of gays by participating in same sex weddings?

That's all kind of lukewarm Bible stuff that could be interpreted many ways. But here's the passages of Jude 1 & Romans 1 to clarify exactly what type of sin homosexuality is and more particularly the sin of allowing it to spread unchecked without earnestly contending for the common welfare:

JUDE 1

3. Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

4. For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

5. I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not...

..7. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire...

...14. And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15. To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

16. These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

17. But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

18. How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

19. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

20. But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

21. Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

22. And of some have compassion, making a difference:

23. And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

24. Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy..

ROMANS 1

22. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25. Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27. And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29. Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30. Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31. Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32. Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

So getting more specific about the crime of homosexuality and how much it pisses God off... Jude 1 says that God will condemn those who enable homosexuality to the same pit of fire if they do not "earnestly contend" for the "common salvation".

Romans 1 says at the very end there that not only will the gays go down to the pit, but also those who "have pleasure in them that do". ie: if you smile upon this new LGBT fad and support it with your vote, your on-board assistance, your arguments and smooth speech, you're going to the Pit with those already damned.

That's not an ambiguous decree to christians. Nor is it a diet sin, a venial matter. It's the hard core stuff that is one and the same as completely abandoning your faith. That's where it takes a giant leap into 1st Amendment territory..

 

[JakeStarkey]

Reading this entire thread reminds me why we have the 1st and 14th Amendments.

If we let the reactionary Christian or Muslim dominionists take control of the country, inevitably they would bring the stocks, flogging, and the gallows for those who did not live their understanding of scripture.

And what about letting bigoted reactionary atheists take control of the country?

Don't see that happening, now or in the future.

In no way, shape, or form does marriage equality affects anyone's right to private association.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oh please, has forced integration worked? No. There's segregation now. Did forced busing work? No. What forced busing did was pressure white flight leaving blacks in failed cities. Forcing businesses to participate in homosexual activities will result in fewer facilities available to homosexuals forcing them into doing their business only with those willing to do so.

Now there is a fallacious argument.

Any person in this country can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of his race.

What a silly comment by you, katzndogz.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I'd refuse to serve muslims.

Of course you would, and then you would be out of business shortly.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"That's all kind of lukewarm Bible stuff that could be interpreted many ways. But here's the passages of Jude 1 & Romans 1 to clarify exactly what type of sin homosexuality is and more particularly the sin of allowing it to spread unchecked without earnestly contending for the common welfare"

Your interpretation is heretical and the verses have no standing before the court.

 

[Silhouette]

"That's all kind of lukewarm Bible stuff that could be interpreted many ways. But here's the passages of Jude 1 & Romans 1 to clarify exactly what type of sin homosexuality is and more particularly the sin of allowing it to spread unchecked without earnestly contending for the common welfare"

Your interpretation is heretical and the verses have no standing before the court.

Oh look. Jakey is trying to spam the verses from Jude 1 and Romans 1 onto a backpage as quickly as possible. Luckily I have a copy and paste function on my PC.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"That's all kind of lukewarm Bible stuff that could be interpreted many ways. But here's the passages of Jude 1 & Romans 1 to clarify exactly what type of sin homosexuality is and more particularly the sin of allowing it to spread unchecked without earnestly contending for the common welfare"

Your interpretation is heretical and the verses have no standing before the court.

Oh look. Jakey is trying to spam the verses from Jude 1 and Romans 1 onto a backpage as quickly as possible. Luckily I have a copy and paste function on my PC.

Spam means to replicate over and over. That's what you want to be doing, Sil.

One, you speak with no authority about scripture.

Two, scripture have no standing before court.

Three, I bet you will filibabble again with long diatribes that mean nothing in the context of the debate.

 

[Chaussette]

I'd refuse to serve muslims.

Of course you would, and then you would be out of business shortly.

Ya sure, because I'd even be selling shit that muslims want. They'll have to get their camel turds, korans and magic carpets somewhere else.

 

[whitehall]

Three posts about the poor sodomites. The sissies are aroused.

 

[Katzndogz]

Oh please, has forced integration worked? No. There's segregation now. Did forced busing work? No. What forced busing did was pressure white flight leaving blacks in failed cities. Forcing businesses to participate in homosexual activities will result in fewer facilities available to homosexuals forcing them into doing their business only with those willing to do so.

Now there is a fallacious argument.

Any person in this country can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of his race.

What a silly comment by you, katzndogz.

Any gay person can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of their sexual orientation.

What they can't get is that business' participation in homosexual activities. Just like black customers may or may not get home deliveries in all black areas.

 

[Silhouette]

Any gay person can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of their sexual orientation.

What they can't get is that business' participation in homosexual activities. Just like black customers may or may not get home deliveries in all black areas.

For that matter, nobody can tell a person is gay until that person starts pushing it in people's faces, taking it out of the privacy of the bedroom and demanding the public be exhibitionist-hypersexual with them.

Christians don't abide by that. Agreed, since LGBT are behaviors and not a race, nobody would be the wiser if those behaviors were not practiced in public. Obviously a wedding cake or a wedding catering, or a wedding photo session is indicative of a gay relationship and as such christians are not allowed by core edicts of their faith to participate. Even if they wanted to, they cannot without abandoning their faith.

So, there you go. 1st Amendment protection guaranteed.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oh please, has forced integration worked? No. There's segregation now. Did forced busing work? No. What forced busing did was pressure white flight leaving blacks in failed cities. Forcing businesses to participate in homosexual activities will result in fewer facilities available to homosexuals forcing them into doing their business only with those willing to do so.

Now there is a fallacious argument.

Any person in this country can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of his race.

What a silly comment by you, katzndogz.

Any gay person can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of their sexual orientation.

What they can't get is that business' participation in homosexual activities. Just like black customers may or may not get home deliveries in all black areas.

Of course they can: a business engaged in public commerce cannot deny service because of their sexual orientation.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Nah, 1st Amendment protection does not triumph public commerce. It can't trump the 14th.

This is not a matter of private association.

 

[Silhouette]

Nah, 1st Amendment protection does not triumph public commerce. It can't trump the 14th.

This is not a matter of private association.

A secular law requiring christians to abandon a core edict of their faith would be a precedent that dissolves the 1st Amendment. Don't look for it to happen soon. Nor look for any time soon a Decision by the Supreme Court that overturns its recent findings in DOMA that protect a state's right to sovereignty on the question of so-called "gay marriage".

Your wobbly attempts to manipulate the 14th to include the behaviors in the cult of LGBT [only, but not others] are going to come up against some very hard concrete.

 

[Silhouette]

Now there is a fallacious argument.

Any person in this country can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of his race.

What a silly comment by you, katzndogz.

Any gay person can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of their sexual orientation.

What they can't get is that business' participation in homosexual activities. Just like black customers may or may not get home deliveries in all black areas.

Of course they can: a business engaged in public commerce cannot deny service because of their sexual orientation.

Except that sexual orientation is behavioral and not a race. A little difference Jake likes to ignore, or dance around or change the subject so people will "forget". Or spam 5 posts in a row to eat up the 15 per page so the points he wants to "disappear" [because he cannot effectively debate them away] drop off to an old page...

To wit:

Something worth mentioning is everytime some fundy bashes gay people, they're sinning in the process.

"You may surely reuke a sinner, but not bear a sin on their account."
- Lev 19:17

All about 'rebuking sinners' (and not sinning in the process)
Correcting the Sinner is not ?Being Judgmental.? It is an Essential Work of Charity. « Archdiocese of Washington

This brings up a good point. Should Christians have to bear a sin on the account of gays by participating in same sex weddings?

That's all kind of lukewarm Bible stuff that could be interpreted many ways. But here's the passages of Jude 1 & Romans 1 to clarify exactly what type of sin homosexuality is and more particularly the sin of allowing it to spread unchecked without earnestly contending for the common welfare:

JUDE 1

3. Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

4. For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

5. I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not...

..7. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire...

...14. And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15. To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

16. These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

17. But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

18. How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

19. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

20. But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

21. Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

22. And of some have compassion, making a difference:

23. And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

24. Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy..

ROMANS 1

22. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25. Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27. And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29. Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30. Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31. Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32. Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

So getting more specific about the crime of homosexuality and how much it pisses God off... Jude 1 says that God will condemn those who enable homosexuality to the same pit of fire if they do not "earnestly contend" for the "common salvation".

Romans 1 says at the very end there that not only will the gays go down to the pit, but also those who "have pleasure in them that do". ie: if you smile upon this new LGBT fad and support it with your vote, your on-board assistance, your arguments and smooth speech, you're going to the Pit with those already damned.

That's not an ambiguous decree to christians. Nor is it a diet sin, a venial matter. It's the hard core stuff that is one and the same as completely abandoning your faith. That's where it takes a giant leap into 1st Amendment territory..

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oh please, has forced integration worked? No. There's segregation now. Did forced busing work? No. What forced busing did was pressure white flight leaving blacks in failed cities. Forcing businesses to participate in homosexual activities will result in fewer facilities available to homosexuals forcing them into doing their business only with those willing to do so.

Now there is a fallacious argument.

Any person in this country can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of his race.

What a silly comment by you, katzndogz.

Any gay person can walk into any business engaged in public commerce and not be denied because of their sexual orientation.

What they can't get is that business' participation in homosexual activities. Just like black customers may or may not get home deliveries in all black areas.

Your argument is fallacious, because you can't deny public service to customers based on orientation, etc. They want a cake, you make it, they pick it up, and both of your private association privileges are protected.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Nah, 1st Amendment protection does not triumph public commerce. It can't trump the 14th.

This is not a matter of private association.

A secular law requiring christians to abandon a core edict of their faith would be a precedent that dissolves the 1st Amendment. Don't look for it to happen soon. Nor look for any time soon a Decision by the Supreme Court that overturns its recent findings in DOMA that protect a state's right to sovereignty on the question of so-called "gay marriage".

Your wobbly attempts to manipulate the 14th to include the behaviors in the cult of LGBT [only, but not others] are going to come up against some very hard concrete.

Sil, the wobbliness is your argument. If you engage in public commerce, you have no 1st amendment protection.

SCOTUS will rule in favor of marriage equality, Sil, because you have neither fact nor law on your side.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sil loves to engage in filibabble above to pronounce falsely that "Except that sexual orientation is behavioral and not a race. A little difference Jake likes to ignore, or dance around or change the subject so people will "forget". Or spam 5 posts in a row to eat up the 15 per page so the points he wants to "disappear" [because he cannot effectively debate them away] drop off to an old page...".

One, I have every right to counter your silliness, Sil.

Two, I have every right to point out your long-drawn out nothings are filibabble.

It is what is.

 

[JoeB131]

Christians are now required by Arizona Law to go to DisneyLand.

Arizona Lawmakers decided to take this step because unlike Hell, DisneyLand actually EXISTS!!!!!