Colorado puts 25% tax on marijuana

[KevinWestern]

Yeah, I do. And it is moot because IT IS NO LONGER ILLEGAL TO GROW. Meaning all those people that were probably within a stone throw from you, will make access to the product much easier. And again, you're making it out as though dispensaries will pop up on every corner. Not so. There will be only so many allowed per county, per city, etc.... You may, under the guise of living in Colorado, still have to drive somewhere to obtain it. You're essentially pushing a case that very few will have the benfit from under the current law. Furthermore, as I've tried to convey, social setting businesses are going to get hosed by these taxes. Making their affordability and desirability greatly diminshed.

it's not like the nearest bodaga is going to have a 20 variety outlet of cannibus to choose from. it's not being treated like alcohol where the grovcer will have it on hand.

If it’s 8pm and you want a joint, it’s always going to be easier to walk into a public store (no apt.) and purchase what you need vs calling a friend, hoping he picks up, travelling to his house, having to talk to him for 45 minuntes, etc. I think you’re underestimating the price people are willing to pay for convenience.

We might just need to agree to disagree, but I don’t think a 25% tax (which I believe is being proposed in Colorado) is going to be much of a barrier, and I think that overall (over time) the price of legal marijuana will be far lower than the price of black market marijuana.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

And since i've spent so much time in thsi thread, I felt I should educate myself a bit better regarding the new law and how CO is working it.

http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellit...goBlobs&blobwhere=1251883847085&ssbinary=true

Some cliff notes:

For the first nine months of 2014, a retail marijuana business can only sell marijuana that it has grown in its commonly-owned cultivation facility, with some exceptions. A recreational pot dispensary can purchase up to 30 percent of its total inventory and can also sell an additional 30 percent of its total inventory to other marijuana dispensaries.

All retail marijuana shops must use the Marijuana Inventory Tracking Solution (MITS) to ensure its inventories are identified and tracked from the point they are transferred from a cultivation or manufacturing facility through the point of sale.

All edible marijuana products may include no more than a total of 100 milligrams of active THC, the chemical in marijuana which causes the "high" sensation.

Retail marijuana dispensaries must prohibit the consumption of marijuana or marijuana products on the premises.

Marijuana must be placed in special child-resistant packages, designed to be significantly difficult for children under five years of age to open, before it is removed from the dispensary. The packaging must also be opaque "so that the product cannot be seen from the outside of the packaging" and labeled properly.

Retail marijuana shops cannot advertise where minors are likely to see the ads on television, radio or newspapers unless "no more than 30 percent of the audience" is "reasonably expected to be under the age of 21."

The retail marijuana rules do not limit the ability for local law enforcement to investigate unlawful activity in relation to the marijuana shop.

Colorado adults, 21 and over, will be limited to purchasing up to an ounce of marijuana for recreational use from specialty licensed retail shops that can also sell pot-related items such as pipes and accessories. Coloradans can also grow up to six plants -- with only three flowering at a given time -- in their home for personal use.

Adults can possess up to an ounce of marijuana legally.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Yeah, I do. And it is moot because IT IS NO LONGER ILLEGAL TO GROW. Meaning all those people that were probably within a stone throw from you, will make access to the product much easier. And again, you're making it out as though dispensaries will pop up on every corner. Not so. There will be only so many allowed per county, per city, etc.... You may, under the guise of living in Colorado, still have to drive somewhere to obtain it. You're essentially pushing a case that very few will have the benfit from under the current law. Furthermore, as I've tried to convey, social setting businesses are going to get hosed by these taxes. Making their affordability and desirability greatly diminshed.

it's not like the nearest bodaga is going to have a 20 variety outlet of cannibus to choose from. it's not being treated like alcohol where the grovcer will have it on hand.

If it’s 8pm and you want a joint, it’s always going to be easier to walk into a public store (no apt.) and purchase what you need vs calling a friend, hoping he picks up, travelling to his house, having to talk to him for 45 minuntes, etc. I think you’re underestimating the price people are willing to pay for convenience.

We might just need to agree to disagree, but I don’t think a 25% tax (which I believe is being proposed in Colorado) is going to be much of a barrier, and I think that overall (over time) the price of legal marijuana will be far lower than the price of black market marijuana.

Yes, and you completely ignored the fact that you may not have a dispensary any where near you. You might have to travel more than an hour (who knows) to obtain the product. Meanwhile, people will be growing it and handing off or trading it in local setting where dispensaries are shut out or too far away.

Again, its not beer, liquor or cigs. Only licensed, specific despensaries will have these products. It's being tightly regulated. Therefore the home based operations will thrive. Cartels will not go away, but will reduce pricing and the state will not see the projected revenues that they hoped for by making it so difficult for the legal world to do what the black market has been doing successfully for decades.

 

[Moonglow]

And since i've spent so much time in thsi thread, I felt I should educate myself a bit better regarding the new law and how CO is working it.

http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellit...goBlobs&blobwhere=1251883847085&ssbinary=true

Some cliff notes:

For the first nine months of 2014, a retail marijuana business can only sell marijuana that it has grown in its commonly-owned cultivation facility, with some exceptions. A recreational pot dispensary can purchase up to 30 percent of its total inventory and can also sell an additional 30 percent of its total inventory to other marijuana dispensaries.

All retail marijuana shops must use the Marijuana Inventory Tracking Solution (MITS) to ensure its inventories are identified and tracked from the point they are transferred from a cultivation or manufacturing facility through the point of sale.

All edible marijuana products may include no more than a total of 100 milligrams of active THC, the chemical in marijuana which causes the "high" sensation.

Retail marijuana dispensaries must prohibit the consumption of marijuana or marijuana products on the premises.

Marijuana must be placed in special child-resistant packages, designed to be significantly difficult for children under five years of age to open, before it is removed from the dispensary. The packaging must also be opaque "so that the product cannot be seen from the outside of the packaging" and labeled properly.

Retail marijuana shops cannot advertise where minors are likely to see the ads on television, radio or newspapers unless "no more than 30 percent of the audience" is "reasonably expected to be under the age of 21."

The retail marijuana rules do not limit the ability for local law enforcement to investigate unlawful activity in relation to the marijuana shop.

Colorado adults, 21 and over, will be limited to purchasing up to an ounce of marijuana for recreational use from specialty licensed retail shops that can also sell pot-related items such as pipes and accessories. Coloradans can also grow up to six plants -- with only three flowering at a given time -- in their home for personal use.

Adults can possess up to an ounce of marijuana legally.

I need to move to Colorado.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

One of the biggest flaws I see right away is that it states coloradans can possess up to one ounce of the dank, and can grow up to six plants with three flowering at any given time.

yeah, ok. Well, thats gonna be a problem. I know people that can cultivate and harvest over a pound per plant. Which means...can anyone guess what that means?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

They will simply reduce their prices to beat legal competition. In most cases, its a moot point because of the 12% of the population who participates in cannibus, 100% can grow their own.

Again, 100% of people can brew their own beer with some simple kitchen equipment and minimal effort.

Why do we see so many people purchasing beer at stores/bars with insane taxes and markups? I can brew 5 gallons of beer at literally 1/5 the cost of what a bar would sell it to me at, and maybe 1/2 of what a store would sell.

Why won't you address this very relevant precedent?!

I drink beer often. I even have the glass carboy and some other stuff. I have never bothered to brew beer.
First, it requires more equipment, like bottles. Then the time to do it. Then I can get more variety out of buying different types of beer. Then the uncertainty how my product will turn out.
There is none of this with dope.
OTOH, people do roll their own cigarrrettes and localities have been restricting roll shops where they basically rent rolling machines. So there is tax avoidance in the production of cigs, as well as the sale in very high tax states.

This is so staggeringly wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

Growing good weed is NOT easy. It requires hundreds of dollars worth of equipment and supplies, and will take 4-5 months to harvest.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

It's far more about the strain and making sure you stick to the proper regime than anything else. Now, curing it is also a technique that requires some skill.

 

[KevinWestern]

Again, 100% of people can brew their own beer with some simple kitchen equipment and minimal effort.

Why do we see so many people purchasing beer at stores/bars with insane taxes and markups? I can brew 5 gallons of beer at literally 1/5 the cost of what a bar would sell it to me at, and maybe 1/2 of what a store would sell.

Why won't you address this very relevant precedent?!

I drink beer often. I even have the glass carboy and some other stuff. I have never bothered to brew beer.
First, it requires more equipment, like bottles. Then the time to do it. Then I can get more variety out of buying different types of beer. Then the uncertainty how my product will turn out.
There is none of this with dope.
OTOH, people do roll their own cigarrrettes and localities have been restricting roll shops where they basically rent rolling machines. So there is tax avoidance in the production of cigs, as well as the sale in very high tax states.

This is so staggeringly wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

Growing good weed is NOT easy. It requires hundreds of dollars worth of equipment and supplies, and will take 4-5 months to harvest.

That's kind of what I was thinking. I don't think you can just get a pot with some soil, some seeds and you're set to go, lol.

Beer on the other hand is relatively easy to make. Bottles? Lol, these are dirt cheap and literally everywhere. You can simply save some bottles after you drink store bought beer. Besides that all you need is (real basic brew):

Equipment:
1.) SS lettle (6 gal) + Stove
2.) Thermometer
3.) Five gallon plastic bucket with lid + airlock hole (easily purchased online)

Bet the whole gettup costs about $70, with most of the price going into the stainless steel kettle.

Brewing takes about 1 hr to boil, let it cool, and put in the bucket and pitch your yeast. Wait 2.5 weeks, bottle w/sugar, wait 2 weeks and you're good.

Guess it's about a month long process that only requires you to actively engage during the brew and bottling sections (vs actively having to water plants, etc).

 

[hangover]

Again, 100% of people can brew their own beer with some simple kitchen equipment and minimal effort.

Why do we see so many people purchasing beer at stores/bars with insane taxes and markups? I can brew 5 gallons of beer at literally 1/5 the cost of what a bar would sell it to me at, and maybe 1/2 of what a store would sell.

Why won't you address this very relevant precedent?!

I drink beer often. I even have the glass carboy and some other stuff. I have never bothered to brew beer.
First, it requires more equipment, like bottles. Then the time to do it. Then I can get more variety out of buying different types of beer. Then the uncertainty how my product will turn out.
There is none of this with dope.
OTOH, people do roll their own cigarrrettes and localities have been restricting roll shops where they basically rent rolling machines. So there is tax avoidance in the production of cigs, as well as the sale in very high tax states.

This is so staggeringly wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

Growing good weed is NOT easy. It requires hundreds of dollars worth of equipment and supplies, and will take 4-5 months to harvest.

#1 I used to brew five gallons of beer per week. It takes 30 days to lager. Just have lots of 20 ounce bottles. The beer I made was better than what you can buy at the store, but I gained a lot of weight.

#2 It's not hard to grow, and after the initial investment of lights, the fertilizer(batwana) and CO2 isn't much cost. You can grow 5 lbs. of high quality bud every 8 weeks in a basement.

 

[KevinWestern]

It's far more about the strain and making sure you stick to the proper regime than anything else. Now, curing it is also a technique that requires some skill.

Correct me if you think I'm wrong, but guessing brewing beer is a much easier process, especially given that you really need to only dedicate a few hours for the brewing, and maybe 30 min for the bottling/kegging a few weeks later.

90% of the process is just letting the beer sit - no attention needed.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

It's far more about the strain and making sure you stick to the proper regime than anything else. Now, curing it is also a technique that requires some skill.

Correct me if you think I'm wrong, but guessing brewing beer is a much easier process, especially given that you really need to only dedicate a few hours for the brewing, and maybe 30 min for the bottling/kegging a few weeks later.

90% of the process is just letting the beer sit - no attention needed.

90% of the process is making sure all of your equipment is completely sterilized. Or you will contaminate your batch and you've wasted your effort.

Growing M vs. brewing beer is apples to oranges to compare. And even furthermore so in this discussion because when beer entered the converssation it did so under the false pretense that since people do not generally brew their own, then people will not grow their own M either. The problem is, I can access beer at a convenience store, M, I can not.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

#2 It's not hard to grow, and after the initial investment of lights, the fertilizer(batwana) and CO2 isn't much cost. You can grow 5 lbs. of high quality bud every 8 weeks in a basement.

None of the former is contingent on the latter. The strain will dictate what you end up with far more than anything else. And you dont need all that fancy equipment to have a revolving, high quality harvest.

 

[KevinWestern]

90% of the process is making sure all of your equipment is completely sterilized. Ort you will contaminate your bactha and you've wasted your effort.

I would correct you and say that 90% of the brewing process is making sure your stuff is sterilized. This is included in that 3-4 hour brewing time. After that (once alcohol begins to form), sterilization isn't quite as important (but still important to a degree).

If you look at the 4-5 weeks it takes to make beer, 90% of the time it is just sitting somewhere fermenting. No action needed. That's what I meant by my statement.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

90% of the process is making sure all of your equipment is completely sterilized. Ort you will contaminate your bactha and you've wasted your effort.

I would correct you and say that 90% of the brewing process is making sure your stuff is sterilized. This is included in that 3-4 hour brewing time. After that (once alcohol begins to form), sterilization isn't quite as important (but still important to a degree).

If you look at the 4-5 weeks it takes to make beer, 90% of the time it is just sitting somewhere fermenting. No action needed. That's what I meant by my statement.

You will get zero disagreement from me that brewing beer is easier than growing.

 

[eflatminor]

Again, 100% of people can brew their own beer with some simple kitchen equipment and minimal effort.

Why do we see so many people purchasing beer at stores/bars with insane taxes and markups? I can brew 5 gallons of beer at literally 1/5 the cost of what a bar would sell it to me at, and maybe 1/2 of what a store would sell.

Why won't you address this very relevant precedent?!

I drink beer often. I even have the glass carboy and some other stuff. I have never bothered to brew beer.
First, it requires more equipment, like bottles. Then the time to do it. Then I can get more variety out of buying different types of beer. Then the uncertainty how my product will turn out.
There is none of this with dope.
OTOH, people do roll their own cigarrrettes and localities have been restricting roll shops where they basically rent rolling machines. So there is tax avoidance in the production of cigs, as well as the sale in very high tax states.

This is so staggeringly wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

Growing good weed is NOT easy. It requires hundreds of dollars worth of equipment and supplies, and will take 4-5 months to harvest.

Actually, one needs only a few seeds, sunshine, mother earth and water to grow cannabis. It's the second fastest growing plant on the planet and incredibly easy to grow. Hell, there's a low THC strain that grows in ditches throughout the Midwest. Grows like a weed...

If you have the right equipment, you can take many strains to flower in about 5 weeks...so you're wrong there too.

You were saying something about 'staggering'???

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I drink beer often. I even have the glass carboy and some other stuff. I have never bothered to brew beer.
First, it requires more equipment, like bottles. Then the time to do it. Then I can get more variety out of buying different types of beer. Then the uncertainty how my product will turn out.
There is none of this with dope.
OTOH, people do roll their own cigarrrettes and localities have been restricting roll shops where they basically rent rolling machines. So there is tax avoidance in the production of cigs, as well as the sale in very high tax states.

This is so staggeringly wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

Growing good weed is NOT easy. It requires hundreds of dollars worth of equipment and supplies, and will take 4-5 months to harvest.

Actually, one needs only a few seeds, sunshine, mother earth and water to grow cannabis. It's the second fastest growing plant on the planet and incredibly easy to grow. Hell, there's a low THC strain that grows in ditches throughout the Midwest. Grows like a weed...

It's easy to grow shitty weed. It's hard to grow good weed.

If you have the right equipment, you can take many strains to flower in about 5 weeks...so you're wrong there too.

You were saying something about 'staggering'???

Wait.. I thought you just said you didn't need any "equipment" other than soil, water and sun.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Sativas have a longer growing cycle than indicas. I dont know much more about this subject though.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Sativas have a longer growing cycle than indicas. I dont know much more about this subject though.

Each strain will have it's own quirks, but that's a general rule of thumb.

I don't know that much about it either, but I looked into growing in my closet a while ago, and decided it wasn't worth the effort and investment.

 

[Sallow]

Wait and see how it actually turns out. If such a tax turns people from the legal outlets to the old reliable street corner dealer, it won't be such a good idea.

Why would they go back and pay more. It is cheaper and more accessible the legal way.

How do you think drug dealers are going to deal with legal competition?

The same way bootleggers dealt with theirs..

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Agiain, and then I'm not going to bother with this anymore. There is a very limited spectrum of dispensaries that will be allowed in CO. It's not going to be that you can walk into a gas station and graba sixer and two twenty twin twins.

The black market and local coalitions aren't going any where. in fact, they will thrive with the state of the current law on the subject.