Creationists

[Lonestar_logic]

what you believe has no bering on reality,,,

Hey moron it's spelled "bearing".

My beliefs are just as valid as yours.

oops a typo on my part..
as beliefs they are valid but not as evidence...you guys are unable or unwilling to see the difference..

No one has tried to make that distinction. But go ahead and create a strawman.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

no you haven't ,you either had an hallucination of some kind either brought on by stress from the revival meeting you were attending and worked yourself up to it.

You do know that what your doing is fulfulling biblical prophecy.

So keep it up!

right.....more paranoid shit ..no biblical prophecy has ever come to pass..

Sure it has and there is plenty of evidence that proves it. Here a just a few of the most recent ones.

 

[UltimateReality]

It is a legitimate question.

Now please answer it.

I take your non-answer as a concession.

I can only take your inability to post a legitimate question as an admission regarding the failure of your argument.

Your lack of study and knowledge regarding science is not made less bankrupt by failed attempts at defending a sectarian religious viewpoint.

Manipulitive post aimed at baiting the other poster into an educational credentials discussion. Please try to keep your posts on topic. Thanks.

 

[Hollie]

When did evolution begin?

According to the Christian creationists in this thread - never. They believe in a worldwide conspiracy involving all of the accredited universities, the vast majority of scientists and all of those yet un-named conspirators who planted the fossil evidence under cover of darkness.

So.... what did the carnivorous animals eat when Noah docked his Ark?

It's hard to believe a simple question such as that stumped you. But...it did.

To answer your question. Many carnivorous animals can manage on a vegetarian diet including lions and tigers.

That's interesting. So, can you confirm for us that Noah brought provisions to sustain carnivorous animals for many months after the flood? Was there competition for food between the more modern carnivores and dinosaurs? I'd be curious to know if the carnivorous dinosaurs could similarly survive on a vegetarian diet as you claim to know lions and tigers could do.

 

[UltimateReality]

yeah.... but did you graduate and what degree do you have...?

You and Hollie tell me where you went to college and I will gladly answer your question.

hey slapdick you already did (Mechanical Engineering at the University of Arizona)

I've posted my educational background several times...no needed to post it again.

Mechanical Engineering at the University of Arizona (7 words)

I've posted my educational background several times...no needed to post it again. (13 words)

Wouldn't it have been easier just to post it again?

 

[Hollie]

I take your non-answer as a concession.

I can only take your inability to post a legitimate question as an admission regarding the failure of your argument.

Your lack of study and knowledge regarding science is not made less bankrupt by failed attempts at defending a sectarian religious viewpoint.

Manipulitive post aimed at baiting the other poster into an educational credentials discussion. Please try to keep your posts on topic. Thanks.

You poor, dear.

Can you entertain us with your relentless stalking and posting of gargantuan fonts?

Try to follow the discussion and entertain us with more bible thumping.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

According to the Christian creationists in this thread - never. They believe in a worldwide conspiracy involving all of the accredited universities, the vast majority of scientists and all of those yet un-named conspirators who planted the fossil evidence under cover of darkness.

So.... what did the carnivorous animals eat when Noah docked his Ark?

It's hard to believe a simple question such as that stumped you. But...it did.

To answer your question. Many carnivorous animals can manage on a vegetarian diet including lions and tigers.

That's interesting. So, can you confirm for us that Noah brought provisions to sustain carnivorous animals for many months after the flood? Was there competition for food between the more modern carnivores and dinosaurs? I'd be curious to know if the carnivorous dinosaurs could similarly survive on a vegetarian diet as you claim to know lions and tigers could do.

I can no more confirm the events on the Ark as you can confirm the beginning of evolution. But I do know that many canivores can manage on a vegetarian diet. I'll concede that they cannot maintain such a diet for a great length of time.

But the Ark had many animals that could multiply in a matter of days. For instance a rabbits gestation period is 28 to 30 days. The Opposum 12 to 13 days.

The dinosaur bit is just more pettifogging on your part.

 

[Hollie]

You and Hollie tell me where you went to college and I will gladly answer your question.

hey slapdick you already did (Mechanical Engineering at the University of Arizona)

I've posted my educational background several times...no needed to post it again.

Mechanical Engineering at the University of Arizona (7 words)

I've posted my educational background several times...no needed to post it again. (13 words)

Wouldn't it have been easier just to post it again?

Be honest, dear. You actually attended the class of Friday afternoon, graduating from the Jimmy Swaggert school of "Pants Down Around the Ankles, right?

 

[Hollie]

It's hard to believe a simple question such as that stumped you. But...it did.

To answer your question. Many carnivorous animals can manage on a vegetarian diet including lions and tigers.

That's interesting. So, can you confirm for us that Noah brought provisions to sustain carnivorous animals for many months after the flood? Was there competition for food between the more modern carnivores and dinosaurs? I'd be curious to know if the carnivorous dinosaurs could similarly survive on a vegetarian diet as you claim to know lions and tigers could do.

I can no more confirm the events on the Ark as you can confirm the beginning of evolution. But I do know that many canivores can manage on a vegetarian diet. I'll concede that they cannot maintain such a diet for a great length of time.

But the Ark had many animals that could multiply in a matter of days. For instance a rabbits gestation period is 28 to 30 days. The Opposum 12 to 13 days.

The dinosaur bit is just more pettifogging on your part.

You don't know your creationist history. Ken Ham's museum clearly depicts humans frollicking with dinosaurs. Could that have been before Noah's cruise?

 

[daws101]

I've witnessed proof.

Really?! What proof was this?!!!

I've witnessed lives that were changed immediatly after accepting Jesus as their Savior. Mine included. I would not be where I'm at now if not for the grace of God.

how did I know you'd say that...people changing their behavior is no proof that Jesus had any thing to do with it.

it has far more to do with with early indoctrination to a belief system and the individual personality of the "acceptor".
studies have shown that nearly all "the saved" are undereducated and highly sugestable.
there are also the conditions called suspension of disbelief and crowd psychology

 

[Lonestar_logic]

That's interesting. So, can you confirm for us that Noah brought provisions to sustain carnivorous animals for many months after the flood? Was there competition for food between the more modern carnivores and dinosaurs? I'd be curious to know if the carnivorous dinosaurs could similarly survive on a vegetarian diet as you claim to know lions and tigers could do.

I can no more confirm the events on the Ark as you can confirm the beginning of evolution. But I do know that many canivores can manage on a vegetarian diet. I'll concede that they cannot maintain such a diet for a great length of time.

But the Ark had many animals that could multiply in a matter of days. For instance a rabbits gestation period is 28 to 30 days. The Opposum 12 to 13 days.

The dinosaur bit is just more pettifogging on your part.

You don't know your creationist history. Ken Ham's museum clearly depicts humans frollicking with dinosaurs. Could that have been before Noah's cruise?

The Bible speaks of dinosaurs but it doesn't go into great lengths as to what their diet consisted of or how the competition for food was.

Try Reading the book of Enoch, it has a lot about the dinosaurs in it.

I have no idea who Ken Hamm is, nor do I care.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Really?! What proof was this?!!!

I've witnessed lives that were changed immediatly after accepting Jesus as their Savior. Mine included. I would not be where I'm at now if not for the grace of God.

how did I know you'd say that...people changing their behavior is no proof that Jesus had any thing to do with it.

it has far more to do with with early indoctrination to a belief system and the individual personality of the "acceptor".
studies have shown that nearly all "the saved" are undereducated and highly sugestable.
there are also the conditions called suspension of disbelief and crowd psychology

Link to those studies please.

 

[Hollie]

Really?! What proof was this?!!!

I've witnessed lives that were changed immediatly after accepting Jesus as their Savior. Mine included. I would not be where I'm at now if not for the grace of God.

how did I know you'd say that...people changing their behavior is no proof that Jesus had any thing to do with it.

it has far more to do with with early indoctrination to a belief system and the individual personality of the "acceptor".
studies have shown that nearly all "the saved" are undereducated and highly sugestable.
there are also the conditions called suspension of disbelief and crowd psychology

People have changed their lives after accepting David Koresh as a prophet. Charismatic figures like Jim Jones can persuade the gullible to end their lives. People sacrificed animals to appease your gawds.

There are always rubes ripe to be fleeced.

 

[Hollie]

I can no more confirm the events on the Ark as you can confirm the beginning of evolution. But I do know that many canivores can manage on a vegetarian diet. I'll concede that they cannot maintain such a diet for a great length of time.

But the Ark had many animals that could multiply in a matter of days. For instance a rabbits gestation period is 28 to 30 days. The Opposum 12 to 13 days.

The dinosaur bit is just more pettifogging on your part.

You don't know your creationist history. Ken Ham's museum clearly depicts humans frollicking with dinosaurs. Could that have been before Noah's cruise?

The Bible speaks of dinosaurs but it doesn't go into great lengths as to what their diet consisted of or how the competition for food was.

Try Reading the book of Enoch, it has a lot about the dinosaurs in it.

I have no idea who Ken Hamm is, nor do I care.

Why do you think such little detail is devoted to the gawds wiping humanity from the planet? That seems like an important detail.

Any thoughts as to why the gawds would litter the planet with fosill relics that depict an ancient earth when the planet is only 6,000 years old?

Have the gawds played a cruel joke on you?

 

[daws101]

I've witnessed lives that were changed immediatly after accepting Jesus as their Savior. Mine included. I would not be where I'm at now if not for the grace of God.

Just plain old self-delusion.

Don't judge until you've walked a mile in my shoes.

no need, your story is no different from any other of the saved.
it most likely goes like this...you were raised in some branch of fundamentalism and some how lost faith , someone died or you got addicted or got someone pregnant etc..

OR you were raised in a family that had a faith but didn't attend church a lot and some or all of the previously mentioned stuff happened.
then you hit bottom or fucked up hard and went looking for answers.
no matter how you answer, I know I'm fairly close to the truth.

 

[daws101]

What if the self-delusion is yours ?

How can a 2000 year old dead guy that might not even have existed save you today? That makes no sense.

But yet the God that spat stars out of his mouth humbled himself and became human. And not a human born to royalty, but born to the poorest and most humble family, so much so that he was born in a stable and laid in a feeding trough. You may have heard of this story. It is actually a national holiday and it's called Christmas.

another biblical fiction .
christmas is a usurped holiday : The History of Christmas and Its Pagan Origins
Christmas from a Non-Christian Perspective
Jennifer Claerr, Yahoo! Contributor Network
Nov 10, 2007 "Share your voice on Yahoo! websites. Start Here."
.More:Christmas.Christmas Cakes.tweet27PrintFlagCloseMany people suffer from the misconception that Christmas is a Christian holiday. The earliest history of Christmas is composed of "pagan" (non-Christian) fertility rites and practices which predate Jesus by centuries. The truth is, in short, the real history of Christmas has nothing to do with Christianity. Many of the traditions which we hold dear, such as decorating Christmas trees, singing Christmas carols, and giving Christmas gifts, are rooted in the traditions of non-Christian religions.
We do not observe Christmas on December 25th because it was the date in history when Jesus was born. Nobody knows exactly what that date was, but references in the Bible show it most likely did not take place in winter. Rather it is because this was the date that the Romans historically celebrated the winter solstice. This celebration was about dies natalis solis invicti: the day of the birth of the unconquerable sun, which took place on December 22nd. The winter solstice held the promise of the return of springtime and earthly renewal. In Roman history, this was the time of Saturnalia, honoring the God of Agriculture, for the week before the solstice, and Juvenalia, a feast in honor of the children of Rome, around the same time. On the 25th of the month they celebrated the birth of the sun-god Mithra. Masters and servants traded places temporarily, and everybody had a rollicking good time. It was during Saturnalia that the tradition of exchanging gifts was established. They gave one another Stenae or fruits which were intended to bring good luck. The Romans placed an enormous amount of pressure on the early Christians to rejoice along with them, and around the time of the fourth century, they began to celebrate Christmas around the same time. It was inevitable that Christians should make a connection between the rebirth of the sun and the birth of the Son.

In the Middle Ages, Christmas was a raucous, drunken celebration which resembled a carnival. Poor people would go on a Christmas"trick or treat" around the richer neighborhoods, causing them misery if they didn't get what they wanted.

Many other pagan traditions have been incorporated into Christmas. Yule was celebrated by the Norse in Scandanavia around the time of the winter solstice by bringing in large logs for the fire, in recognition of the eventual return of the sun. It could take as much as twelve days for the log to burn down. Meanwhile, the Norse would feast. The holiday usually lasted through January.

The Germans did not so much celebrate as honor the winter solstice. They believed that their god, Oden, flew through the sky at night passing judgment on his people. Generally, they would stay indoors during this season. When the Germanic people were converted to Christianity, their winter festival was naturally adopted as a celebration of the birth of Christ.

To the pagans, evergreens served as a symbol of winter's inability to stop the cycle of renewal. They were important fertility symbols which were highly revered by many cultures, including the Germans and the Celts. They helped to soothe the pagans' fears that the sun would never return, and that winter would reign eternal.

Contrary to popular belief, the tradition of cutting down a Christmas tree, bringing it into the home and decorating it is not pagan in origin, and did not appear until centuries after Christ's broth. The Romans decorated their homes and temples with evergreen clippings, but allowed the trees to remain intact, often decorating live trees with religious icons. The Druids tied fruit to the branches of live trees, and baked cakes in the shape of fish, birds and other animals, to offer to their god, Woden. We also inherited the tradition of kissing under the mistletoe from the Druids. The Christmas tree tradition we currently practice had its origins in 16th century Western Germany. "Paradise trees" were cut down to commemorate the Feast of Adam and Eve, which took place on Christmas eve every year.

Many Christians were opposed to the merrymaking and pagan origins of the Christmas festivities, especially the more solemn Christians such as the Puritans. In England in 1645, Christmas was actually canceled. In Boston between 1659 and 1681 Christmas was outlawed, and merrymakers incurred fines for their mirth.

Early carols were sung in a circle dance by European Celts in medieval times, as a part of their fertility rituals, and were later adopted as a way to celebrate Christmas. As a result they became unpopular among Christian authority. Over the ages multiple attempts have been made to ban Christmas carols. Christmas carols enjoyed a revival when St. Francis of Assisi began to favor a more joyous celebration of the Christmas season. Another pagan custom called wassailing, or singing from door to door, also became very popular among Christmas celebrants.

Many people mistakenly state that "Jesus is the reason for the season." They do so, because they believe people have lost sight of the true meaning of Christmas. It simply isn't true. Christmas can be celebrated as completely secular because ultimately it is not a Christian holiday. Christmas goes beyond religious and cultural differences, and addresses something universal in all of us. For this reason it has become popular in non-Christian countries such as Japan. The truth is that Christian and pagan traditions have a great deal in common. The real need behind all of these traditions was to find a source of joy, happiness, hope, goodwill and generosity. There was a need to find ways to cope with our fears about the darkness and cold of wintertime, and to celebrate the return of the sun and the longer days of spring.

In fact, Christianity and pre-Christian pagan religion have a great deal in common. Various pagan religions shared the Christian practice of worshiping a god-man who could offer salvation in the form of heaven or condemnation in the form of hell. The concept that a son of God could be born of a mortal woman is seen in many different religions spanning the globe. These concepts are universal, except to those who are extremely divisive and have a tendency to pick nits.

The pagans were smart people who had quite a few good ideas. They respected the earth, and we have benefited greatly from their practices. There is no reason for Christians to fear "pagan" universal and earth-centered traditions. At Christmas, rather than fretting that non-Christians have forgotten about Jesus we should focus on the deeper purpose of the holiday. The main problem is that Christmas has become far too commercial and this has gotten us away from the pagan tradition of connecting with the earth. Instead, we spend the whole holiday trashing the planet with excessive buying, and cutting down millions of Christmas trees which must then be discarded less than a month later. Environmental destruction and consumerism has passed for merrymaking for many years now, but it's an empty tradition. Celebrating the fertility of the earth is better by far. There is a strong need for a return to the family- and society-centered traditions which were established in Roman times and reestablished in the 19th century. Washington Irving's writings helped Americans to establish Christmas as a time of giving to those who are most in need, and bridging the gap between the rich and the poor. These traditions had their roots in the practices of the real St. Nicholas, who lived in Myra in the fourth century A.D. He was born rich and inherited a great deal of money on the death of his parents, all of which he gave away. St. Nicholas is said to have thrown bags of gold into the windows of dowerless girls to save them from lives of prostitution or slavery. He was also well know for his love and protection of children. St. Nicholas is the figure behind our modern day Santa Claus myth of a generous man who delivered hand-made toys to children all over the world.

So rather than viewing Christmas as a time to break the bank, we can take advantage of it as a time to help the less fortunate. Many people ask that their friends and loved ones give to charity rather than buy them a gift. This sort of gift giving is popular among yogis who see Christmas as a way to extend their practice.

Fortunately there are many ways to reconnect with the original purpose and meaning of Christmas. Small traditions, such as placing apples or cookies on the tree, or decorating a live tree instead of a cut one, are a good way to get in touch with the way that our ancestors celebrated Christmas. Respecting the planet and understanding its powers and its limitations are important. The pagans were aware of the changing seasons and found earth-centered and social ways to cope with them. They were aware and appreciative of the sun. They exchanged gifts, but their gift exchange was not commercialized. Instead the focus was on bringing good fortune. Giving gifts of fruit has been a common practice throughout history, and is still popular today.

The Christmas holiday season is about unity, not divisiveness. At the holiday season we should forget about our religious differences, abandon commercialism and think about what is best for the planet and for humanity.

The History of Christmas and Its Pagan Origins - Yahoo! Voices - voices.yahoo.com

 

[Lonestar_logic]

You don't know your creationist history. Ken Ham's museum clearly depicts humans frollicking with dinosaurs. Could that have been before Noah's cruise?

The Bible speaks of dinosaurs but it doesn't go into great lengths as to what their diet consisted of or how the competition for food was.

Try Reading the book of Enoch, it has a lot about the dinosaurs in it.

I have no idea who Ken Hamm is, nor do I care.

Why do you think such little detail is devoted to the gawds wiping humanity from the planet? That seems like an important detail.

Any thoughts as to why the gawds would litter the planet with fosill relics that depict an ancient earth when the planet is only 6,000 years old?

Have the gawds played a cruel joke on you?

What are gawds? Humanity hasn't been wiped from the planet.

6,000 years old is a number you keep bringing up. Not me.

It's clear that you cannot have an honest debate. You have done nothing but pettifog, insult and ridicule that which you don't believe nor know anything about.

You cannot even muster a defensible argument to support your position without cut and pasting.

I'll take your inability to discuss manners in a rational manner as a concession.

Class dismissed.

 

[daws101]

What if the self-delusion is yours ?

How can a 2000 year old dead guy that might not even have existed save you today? That makes no sense.

I believe we are living the final act to which you will get your answer.

what you believe is not relevant..it's also a non answer.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Just plain old self-delusion.

Don't judge until you've walked a mile in my shoes.

no need, your story is no different from any other of the saved.
it most likely goes like this...you were raised in some branch of fundamentalism and some how lost faith , someone died or you got addicted or got someone pregnant etc..

OR you were raised in a family that had a faith but didn't attend church a lot and some or all of the previously mentioned stuff happened.
then you hit bottom or fucked up hard and went looking for answers.
no matter how you answer, I know I'm fairly close to the truth.

You don't know the first thing about my life. So please don't flatter yourself.

And your assumptions were not even close to the truth.

 

[daws101]

No matter how hard they work at trying to build the puzzle there will always be missing pieces showing this theory to be fabricated from vivid minds.

You're in denial as the entirety of science. The history of knowledge has been to reduce the fear and superstition that defines the worldview you espouse. Living in fear and ignorance is a sad existence. Living in denial of the natural world in favor of comforting myths of a father figure who is watching over you is attempting to escape from reality.

There is no escaping reality we are surrounded by it.

you are right, too bad it's not your reality,as much as you wish it to be.