Debate these beliefs...

[KGB]

I found these on-line....see how many you support & find out where you stand....I'll then tell you what party this represents. But before I do, I want to gauge how well versed this board really is.

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.
3. A strong military is essential.
4. Special interests must be eliminated.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.
13. Intrusive government must be stopped.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

 

[deltex1]

I found these on-line....see how many you support & find out where you stand....I'll then tell you what party this represents. But before I do, I want to gauge how well versed this board really is.

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.
3. A strong military is essential.
4. Special interests must be eliminated.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.
13. Intrusive government must be stopped.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

Agree with most...but right now I am listening to Pelosi talk about immigration...and I have to go and vomit.

 

[KGB]

Agree with most...but right now I am listening to Pelosi talk about immigration...and I have to go and vomit.

your reaction is quite understandable.... This is a strawman poll. I am doing this experiment for a reason....

 

[Pennywise]

Looks all good, but a little too broad in some points. Special Interests meaning lobbyists? Not sure exactly where that one is going.

 

[KGB]

Looks all good, but a little too broad in some points. Special Interests meaning lobbyists? Not sure exactly where that one is going.

you'll be surprised at the end of this.

 

[Pennywise]

Looks all good, but a little too broad in some points. Special Interests meaning lobbyists? Not sure exactly where that one is going.

you'll be surprised at the end of this.

Only if the points are being purposely altered. It's likely some group like the American Nazi Party or some such thing and if it is, it does not diminish the validity of the tenets.

 

[KGB]

Looks all good, but a little too broad in some points. Special Interests meaning lobbyists? Not sure exactly where that one is going.

you'll be surprised at the end of this.

Only if the points are being purposely altered. It's likely some group like the American Nazi Party or some such thing and if it is, it does not diminish the validity of the tenets.

I didn't alter anything, I copied it verbatim. I want to see how politically aware people are. I suspect not very.

 

[Pennywise]

you'll be surprised at the end of this.

Only if the points are being purposely altered. It's likely some group like the American Nazi Party or some such thing and if it is, it does not diminish the validity of the tenets.

I didn't alter anything, I copied it verbatim. I want to see how politically aware people are. I suspect not very.

Is it from JFK? FDR?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I found these on-line....see how many you support & find out where you stand....I'll then tell you what party this represents. But before I do, I want to gauge how well versed this board really is.

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.
3. A strong military is essential.
4. Special interests must be eliminated.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.
13. Intrusive government must be stopped.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

One can’t ‘debate’ meaningless talking points, vacuous bumper sticker slogans, and out of context one-liners.

For example:

Undocumented immigrants become ‘illegal’ only after adjudicated as such, and only as a consequence of due process in the context of the rule of law. See: Plyler v. Doe (1982).

The right to own a firearm is inalienable but not absolute; the rights enshrined in the Second Amendment, as is the case with all other rights, are subject to reasonable restrictions by government. See: DC V Heller (2008).

What constitutes a ‘special interest,’ and how can they be ‘eliminated’ without violating the First Amendment. See, e.g., Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission (2010).

What constitutes an ‘average citizen,’ ‘intrusive government,’ or ‘traditional family values'? ‘Intrusive government’ can clearly be a given state seeking to violate the privacy rights of women by ‘banning’ abortion. See: Planned Parenthood v. Casey (1992).

Obviously the OP has failed to think any of this through, as this is all meaningless, ignorant gibberish.

 

[JakeStarkey]

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally. and they are home
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable. no doubt
3. A strong military is essential. can still get the job done easily with a 30% cut over ten years
4. Special interests must be eliminated. revoke Citizens United and invoke public campaign financing
5. Gun ownership is sacred. Jesus was packing?
6. Government must be downsized. As long as it meets its need to serve the country and citizens
7. The national budget must be balanced. With a caveat that Congress when necessary can unbalance it
8. Deficit spending must end. You need to take economics, several times, perhaps
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal. No
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must. On real people, not pretend people
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory. See above #10
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens. Indeed
13. Intrusive government must be stopped. Indeed
14. English as our core language is required. It is our core language
15. Traditional family values are encouraged. Within constitutional limits

 

[hazlnut]

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
"Give me your tired, your poor/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free" -- Illegal means illegal, so yes. However, keeping with our core values and historical traditions, we treat those who come here looking for a better life with dignity and compassion -- our immigration laws need to do a better job of addressing all the complexed and varied issues


2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.

Yes. Keep in mind what you're talking about is contrary to the free market. If Apple can find people willing to assemble iPhones for pennies on the dollar, then that is the best wage cost available on the market. And Ayn Rand would have a big problem with subsidies or tax breaks to small businesses who hire domestically. Small businesses and big businesses are free to set up shop and hire whomever they want -- you're talking about manipulating market forces to get more Americans employed. BTW -- re: 1 and 2 -- I'd like to point out there are low wage DOMESTIC jobs picking grapes and nuts in the California central valley and butchering cows in Texas -- jus' sayin'. And speaking of market forces, who hires the most expensive landscapers who work slow and complain? No one.

3. A strong military is essential.

Yes. Keep in mind that since the next 8 biggest Navies in the world can fit inside ours, that all Military Spending at this point is Keynesian.

So, you must be pro-Keynsian economic policy. -- Otherwise you would support shutting down surplus bases and discharging every solider doing redundant jobs.


4. Special interests must be eliminated.

Yes. Start with the Tea Party -- as a corporate funded Astroturf organization, I don't like seeing my fellow Americans being used as pawns of the Koch Bros. As ignorant and misguided as they might be, I still love them and don't like seeing this abuse.

Everybody supports eliminating the other guy's interests.


5. Gun ownership is sacred.

Whatever floats your boat.

I'll quote the Conservative Supreme Court Justice Scalia from DC vs Heller: "Like most rights, the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose: For example, concealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. Miller’s holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those “in common use at the time” finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons."

6. Government must be downsized.

Yes. But since every agency will protect their own self-interests, good luck with that.

Entire industries have sprung up around our never-ending election cycle. From all the lawyers that set up PACs and the professional media advisors, to the companies that manufacture the buttons and bumper stickers. And don't forget the pundits that get paid for every 8 minute segment of television during which they point out the obvious. If we were to move to a UK election cycle model, all those people would be out of work.

7. The national budget must be balanced.

Yes. Cut defense. Cut tax subsidies to oil, energy, and natural gas -- and any industry showing million - billion dollar quarterly profits.

Raise taxes on the wealthy and super wealth.

Write laws that penalize moving money off-shore. No trust fund kid or Paris Hilton should have access to money off shore.

HERE'S THE RULE: If the wealth was generated on the backs of the U.S. Economy -- IT STAYS HERE!! I'm talking to you, MITT.

8. Deficit spending must end.

Sure. As long as we pay our bills and keep the lights on.


9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.

Well...Not yet.


But you can write laws to make it illegal to bail out an industry.

However, keep in mind the economists formula re: massive unemployment -- If you put a million people out of work (Detroit + suppliers + support industries) you will start a depression -- like a rock in a pond, the waves of failure will spread across the country. You have to accept that everything is tied to everything else which is tied to government.

10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.

Sure, for the middle and lower classes. But since Reagan, cutting taxes on the wealthy has created a trickling up effect -- WEALTH HAS MOVED UPWARDS OVER THE LAST FOUR DECADES.

If/when the majority of the wealth becomes concentrated at the top, like one player controlling all the chips in a poker game -- the game ends when the other players can no longer borrow from him.

11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.

Hold on to your conservative pinhead hats. -- CORPORATIONS DON'T PAY FEDERAL INCOME TAX -- with all the subsidies and tax breaks -- the big ones end up owing nothing.

If you want to do business in the U.S. and abroad, enjoy the protection of the U.S. Military, U.S. Dollar, rely on U.S. infrastructure, and U.S. Consumers to buy your stuff...

You gotta pay to play. Taxes should be fair and incentivize desired behavior. Right now they incentivize lobbying and looking for sneaky ways around the newest laws, like incorporating on some Island in the Bahamas. If you're not incorporated and in one of the 50 U.S. states, you don't do business here.

12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.

They are.

Are you saying you want your "free speech" to be as valued as the Koch Bro$ Free $Peech?? That's a different issue.

13. Intrusive government must be stopped.

Sure. Too much regulation is as harmful as too little. A pragmatic balance is needed.

Our government really isn't that intrusive -- relatively speaking. People in the U.S. take too many daily freedoms for granted.


14. English as our core language is required.

Required, for what? To talk to you? Who gives a fuck!!

American is a melting pot of cultures, languages, and traditions. Come join the party!!

If you want a high paying job then learn English. If you're happy to work as a landscaper, dishwasher, domestic, who cares as long as you can get by and communicate with your boss.



15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

Two gay men can be better parents to an adopted child than a Christian couple with their own children. WHY? The two gay men can better teach tolerance and emotional maturity, character and integrity. The Christian parents rely on Jewish fairy tales to teach intolerance.

 

[KGB]

I found these on-line....see how many you support & find out where you stand....I'll then tell you what party this represents. But before I do, I want to gauge how well versed this board really is.

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.
3. A strong military is essential.
4. Special interests must be eliminated.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.
13. Intrusive government must be stopped.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

One can’t ‘debate’ meaningless talking points, vacuous bumper sticker slogans, and out of context one-liners.

For example:

Undocumented immigrants become ‘illegal’ only after adjudicated as such, and only as a consequence of due process in the context of the rule of law. See: Plyler v. Doe (1982).

The right to own a firearm is inalienable but not absolute; the rights enshrined in the Second Amendment, as is the case with all other rights, are subject to reasonable restrictions by government. See: DC V Heller (2008).

What constitutes a ‘special interest,’ and how can they be ‘eliminated’ without violating the First Amendment. See, e.g., Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission (2010).

What constitutes an ‘average citizen,’ ‘intrusive government,’ or ‘traditional family values'? ‘Intrusive government’ can clearly be a given state seeking to violate the privacy rights of women by ‘banning’ abortion. See: Planned Parenthood v. Casey (1992).

Obviously the OP has failed to think any of this through, as this is all meaningless, ignorant gibberish.

actually it isn't gibberish, nor it is taken out of context. These are core beliefs of a party in this country & no one yet has recognized it. I'll give this another hour & then state which party it is.

Incidentally, an "undocumented immigrant" is by definition illegal since they have already broken Title 8 of the Code of Federal Regulations. They did that when they illegally crossed the US border. That act alone is a crime. Otherwise, there would be no need for all this rhetoric about a "path to citizenship" or "amnesty".

 

[daveman]

I found these on-line....see how many you support & find out where you stand....I'll then tell you what party this represents. But before I do, I want to gauge how well versed this board really is.

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
2. Pro-domestic employment is indispensable.
3. A strong military is essential.
4. Special interests must be eliminated.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
12. Political offices must be available to average citizens.
13. Intrusive government must be stopped.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

One can’t ‘debate’ meaningless talking points, vacuous bumper sticker slogans, and out of context one-liners.

For example:

Hope. Change. Tax the rich. No war for oil. Free Bradley Manning. Reality has a liberal bias.

 

[KGB]

3. A strong military is essential.

Yes. Keep in mind that since the next 8 biggest Navies in the world can fit inside ours, that all Military Spending at this point is Keynesian.

So, you must be pro-Keynsian economic policy. -- Otherwise you would support shutting down surplus bases and discharging every solider doing redundant jobs.

7. The national budget must be balanced.

Yes. Cut defense. Cut tax subsidies to oil, energy, and natural gas -- and any industry showing million - billion dollar quarterly profits.

Since defense is close & dear to my heart, I'll retort accordingly. The DoD has been cut pretty dramatically. Sequestration on top of already mandated cuts have already taken care of that. The problem the DoD (& bigger government) runs into is the Federal Acquisition Regulation. This is where a lot of the wasteful spending occurs. If you give a person in uniform a mission, they'll generally find ways of getting it done regardless of the amount of resources. We are trained that way. That being said, if you give the DoD a better model on how to buy things & take out the politically driven acquisitions, then we are in business. The FAR is the highest obstacle towards any meaningful reform. The mandates dictated by it ensure that we will always overpay. This is why it takes 20 years to field a new weapon system only to find it obsolete upon introduction into the force.

So the key isn't cutting defense, the key is reforming acquisition. The key also is taking politics out of mission needs. The Abrams is a classic example of this. In addition, the services would gladly cut infrastructure, but it still requires congressional approval. Every time there is a BRAC, there is a pack of lobbyists lining up behind chanting "not my base".

 

[KGB]

well, I think I've given this enough time. The experiment was a success since it demonstratively proved that none of you has a clue when it comes to politics. Then again, neither does the media who propagates innuendo without much fact. The party in question is actually the Tea Party taken direct from their site. None of you recognized it....sad...

About Us - Tea Party

So far all the bluster on both sides, no one could identify any of the main points of the much aligned Tea Party when presented to them....

 

[daveman]

3. A strong military is essential.

Yes. Keep in mind that since the next 8 biggest Navies in the world can fit inside ours, that all Military Spending at this point is Keynesian.

So, you must be pro-Keynsian economic policy. -- Otherwise you would support shutting down surplus bases and discharging every solider doing redundant jobs.

7. The national budget must be balanced.

Yes. Cut defense. Cut tax subsidies to oil, energy, and natural gas -- and any industry showing million - billion dollar quarterly profits.

Since defense is close & dear to my heart, I'll retort accordingly. The DoD has been cut pretty dramatically. Sequestration on top of already mandated cuts have already taken care of that. The problem the DoD (& bigger government) runs into is the Federal Acquisition Regulation. This is where a lot of the wasteful spending occurs. If you give a person in uniform a mission, they'll generally find ways of getting it done regardless of the amount of resources. We are trained that way. That being said, if you give the DoD a better model on how to buy things & take out the politically driven acquisitions, then we are in business. The FAR is the highest obstacle towards any meaningful reform. The mandates dictated by it ensure that we will always overpay. This is why it takes 20 years to field a new weapon system only to find it obsolete upon introduction into the force.

So the key isn't cutting defense, the key is reforming acquisition. The key also is taking politics out of mission needs. The Abrams is a classic example of this. In addition, the services would gladly cut infrastructure, but it still requires congressional approval. Every time there is a BRAC, there is a pack of lobbyists lining up behind chanting "not my base".

But it's so much easier to screech "Cut defense!!"

Right, hazlnut?

 

[daveman]

well, I think I've given this enough time. The experiment was a success since it demonstratively proved that none of you has a clue when it comes to politics. Then again, neither does the media who propagates innuendo without much fact. The party in question is actually the Tea Party taken direct from their site. None of you recognized it....sad...

About Us - Tea Party

So far all the bluster on both sides, no one could identify any of the main points of the much aligned Tea Party when presented to them....

I thought it sounded familiar, then Googled it. Sure enough, I was right. But since I "cheated", I didn't post.

They're ideas guaranteed to build a better America. So naturally, the left hates them.