Ed Snowden is a traitor

According to FISA court rulings, for one.

Which one?

The NSA use of blanket survililence (use of section 215 of FISA) is "outside the spirit of the law" and "in violation of the fourth amendment".

Snowden exposed government agency crimes, adn is therefore

Which court convicted anyone of a crime in this matter?


Which court did that?


Only a Statist with little regard for the law
Which laws? Only the ones you like?

, or American liberty would attempt to blame Snowden for exposing government crimes.

Government crimes according to who?

Your circular logic isn't very impressive. I've already answered. You can look it up yourself which FISA court ruling established the NSA as "in violation of the fourth amendment". It's in just about every news column worth its weight regarding the NSA criminal conduct.
 
Throw the 4th amendment out. Too many words and too few people who know how to read.

The 4th:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Fucking tragic but this seems to be the way things are going.


I can read the 4th amendment fine.

I am having trouble reading part of the Constitution though. I can't even find it, actually, maybe you can help me? Since you're a Constitutional scholar and all, it should be easy for you! I'm looking for the part that says Ed Snowden is the one who decides if the government violated the 4th amendment. Can you please show me that part? Thanks for the help!
 
Throw the 4th amendment out. Too many words and too few people who know how to read.

The 4th:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Fucking tragic but this seems to be the way things are going.


I can read the 4th amendment fine.

I am having trouble reading part of the Constitution though. I can't even find it, actually, maybe you can help me? Since you're a Constitutional scholar and all, it should be easy for you! I'm looking for the part that says Ed Snowden is the one who decides if the government violated the 4th amendment. Can you please show me that part? Thanks for the help!

The FISA court already decided that the NSA was in violation of the fourth amendment.
 
Throw the 4th amendment out. Too many words and too few people who know how to read.

The 4th:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Fucking tragic but this seems to be the way things are going.


I can read the 4th amendment fine.

I am having trouble reading part of the Constitution though. I can't even find it, actually, maybe you can help me? Since you're a Constitutional scholar and all, it should be easy for you! I'm looking for the part that says Ed Snowden is the one who decides if the government violated the 4th amendment. Can you please show me that part? Thanks for the help!

The FISA court already decided that the NSA was in violation of the fourth amendment.

And the name of that ruling is.... ?
 
Throw the 4th amendment out. Too many words and too few people who know how to read.

The 4th:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Fucking tragic but this seems to be the way things are going.


I can read the 4th amendment fine.

I am having trouble reading part of the Constitution though. I can't even find it, actually, maybe you can help me? Since you're a Constitutional scholar and all, it should be easy for you! I'm looking for the part that says Ed Snowden is the one who decides if the government violated the 4th amendment. Can you please show me that part? Thanks for the help!

How about the Washington Post reporting on an internal audit by the NSA’s Signals Intelligence Directorate. In fact the NSA admits to thousands of privacy violations - here is their own document:
NSA report on privacy violations in the first quarter of 2012 - The Washington Post

From a different Washington Post article:

"The May 2012 audit, intended for the agency’s top leaders, counts only incidents at the NSA’s Fort Meade headquarters and other *facilities in the Washington area. Three government officials, speak*ing on the condition of anonymity to discuss classified matters, said the number would be substantially higher if it included other NSA operating units and regional collection centers."

"In October 2011, months after the program got underway, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court ruled that the collection effort was unconstitutional. The court said that the methods used were “deficient on statutory and constitutional grounds,” according to a top-secret summary of the opinion, and it ordered the NSA to comply with standard privacy protections or stop the program."

"James R. Clapper Jr., the director of national intelligence, has acknowledged that the court found the NSA in breach of the Fourth Amendment, which prohibits unreasonable searches and seizures, but the Obama administration has fought a Freedom of Information lawsuit that seeks the opinion."

NSA broke privacy rules thousands of times per year, audit finds - The Washington Post

I'm looking forward to your response.
 
Throw the 4th amendment out. Too many words and too few people who know how to read.

The 4th:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

Fucking tragic but this seems to be the way things are going.


I can read the 4th amendment fine.

I am having trouble reading part of the Constitution though. I can't even find it, actually, maybe you can help me? Since you're a Constitutional scholar and all, it should be easy for you! I'm looking for the part that says Ed Snowden is the one who decides if the government violated the 4th amendment. Can you please show me that part? Thanks for the help!

How about the Washington Post reporting on an internal audit by the NSA’s Signals Intelligence Directorate. In fact the NSA admits to thousands of privacy violations - here is their own document:
NSA report on privacy violations in the first quarter of 2012 - The Washington Post

From a different Washington Post article:

"The May 2012 audit, intended for the agency’s top leaders, counts only incidents at the NSA’s Fort Meade headquarters and other *facilities in the Washington area. Three government officials, speak*ing on the condition of anonymity to discuss classified matters, said the number would be substantially higher if it included other NSA operating units and regional collection centers."

"In October 2011, months after the program got underway, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court ruled that the collection effort was unconstitutional. The court said that the methods used were “deficient on statutory and constitutional grounds,” according to a top-secret summary of the opinion, and it ordered the NSA to comply with standard privacy protections or stop the program."

"James R. Clapper Jr., the director of national intelligence, has acknowledged that the court found the NSA in breach of the Fourth Amendment, which prohibits unreasonable searches and seizures, but the Obama administration has fought a Freedom of Information lawsuit that seeks the opinion."

NSA broke privacy rules thousands of times per year, audit finds - The Washington Post

I'm looking forward to your response.


I'm looking forward to you actually looking at the internal audit:
NSA report on privacy violations in the first quarter of 2012 - The Washington Post

Try searching for the terms "4th" or "fourth" or "privacy" or "constitution" or "constitutional"
in that audit. Then come back and tell me how likely it actually is that the audit in question says the NSA violated the 4th amendment.
 
Jesus, you're a dumbfuck, aren'tcha?

Here, child. let me help you out, son. You obviosuly have problems with reading and searching:

NSA Surveillance Violated Constitution, Secret FISA Court Found | Cato @ Liberty

https://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2012_rpt/faa-extend.html

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court Opinion

I hope you can actually read.

“On at least one occasion,” the intelligence shop has approved Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) to say, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court found that “minimization procedures” used by the government while it was collecting intelligence were “unreasonable under the Fourth Amendment.” Minimization refers to how long the government may retain the surveillance data it collects. The Fourth Amendment to the Constitution is supposed to guarantee our rights against unreasonable searches.

I'm sorry, we're talking about two different Ed Snowdens. The one I'm talking about did a lot more than release information that the NSA was holding collected information too long.

If the NSA violates the 4th amendment ever - even once - that means anyone who has taken an oath to protect secrets is free to release any and all secrets they choose to the public?

BTW - can you show us where the 4th amendment says how long the NSA may keep collected data?
 
How can he be a traitor for exposing "secrets" when Obama claims those "secrets" are phoney scandals? if they are phoney scandals, then he clearly didn't expose anything real and thus didn't commit any crime.
 
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You may be able to read some of the words, but the meaning is lost on you.

According to you.


Maybe you can help me out here. Tell me which of these is true.

A) The property of the phone company I do business with is my person.
B) The property of the phone company I do business with is my house.
C) The property of the phone company I do business with are my papers.
D) The property of the phone company I do business with are my effects.


?
 
Did Ed Snowden just happen to stumble across information he felt like the public needed to know?

"My position with Booz Allen Hamilton granted me access to lists of machines all over the world the NSA hacked," he told the Post on June 12. "That is why I accepted that position about three months ago."

Doesn't sound like it to me! Sounds like he sought out the job with the intent all along of violating his security agreement and U.S. law. That's how SPIES behave - not whistle blowers.

Snowden sought Booz Allen job to gather evidence on NSA surveillance | South China Morning Post

Spies give secrets to the enemy. He gave that secret to the US people. I guess the US citizens are now the enemy.
 
How can he be a traitor for exposing "secrets" when Obama claims those "secrets" are phoney scandals? if they are phoney scandals, then he clearly didn't expose anything real and thus didn't commit any crime.

That's a good one :clap2:
 
How can he be a traitor for exposing "secrets" when Obama claims those "secrets" are phoney scandals? if they are phoney scandals, then he clearly didn't expose anything real and thus didn't commit any crime.

That's a good one :clap2:

Ive asked it several times. but I havent seen a response yet. Course, I havent been on the board as much either so it might have been responded to.
 
Jesus, you're a dumbfuck, aren'tcha?

Here, child. let me help you out, son. You obviosuly have problems with reading and searching:

NSA Surveillance Violated Constitution, Secret FISA Court Found | Cato @ Liberty

https://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2012_rpt/faa-extend.html

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court Opinion

I hope you can actually read.

“On at least one occasion,” the intelligence shop has approved Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) to say, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court found that “minimization procedures” used by the government while it was collecting intelligence were “unreasonable under the Fourth Amendment.” Minimization refers to how long the government may retain the surveillance data it collects. The Fourth Amendment to the Constitution is supposed to guarantee our rights against unreasonable searches.

I'm sorry, we're talking about two different Ed Snowdens. The one I'm talking about did a lot more than release information that the NSA was holding collected information too long.

If the NSA violates the 4th amendment ever - even once - that means anyone who has taken an oath to protect secrets is free to release any and all secrets they choose to the public?

BTW - can you show us where the 4th amendment says how long the NSA may keep collected data?

Right. He exposed criminal conduct of the NSA. He was under no obligation to maintain secrecy regarding criminal activity. In fact, just teh opposite.

Well, the NSA DID violate the fourth A. So exposing their criminal activity exonerates Snowden from any liability. In the same fashion a state agent would participate in criminal activity to expose bigger crimes.

BTW - moving the goal posts doesn't make you look any smarter, Junior.
 
How can he be a traitor for exposing "secrets" when Obama claims those "secrets" are phoney scandals? if they are phoney scandals, then he clearly didn't expose anything real and thus didn't commit any crime.

Because he took and oath not to reveal what he revealed. duh.

But the President has said that it's a phoney scandal. Meaning it's untrue. You can't be prosecuted for revealing secrets that aren't real.

If say the government hires me and makes it illegal to expose the secret that grass is really red and that the government paints it every night to make it look green, and then I say the grass is purple have I exposed a secret that I promised not to expose?

Now either Snowden is exposing secrets and Obama is lying to the people. Or Obama is telling the truth and Snowden can't possibly be found guilty of exposing something that doesn't exist.
 
Did Ed Snowden just happen to stumble across information he felt like the public needed to know?

"My position with Booz Allen Hamilton granted me access to lists of machines all over the world the NSA hacked," he told the Post on June 12. "That is why I accepted that position about three months ago."

Doesn't sound like it to me! Sounds like he sought out the job with the intent all along of violating his security agreement and U.S. law. That's how SPIES behave - not whistle blowers.

Snowden sought Booz Allen job to gather evidence on NSA surveillance | South China Morning Post

Spies give secrets to the enemy. He gave that secret to the US people. I guess the US citizens are now the enemy.


That's right, because Al Qaeda doesn't know how to use the internet.

Holy fuck you're a moron.
 
Jesus, you're a dumbfuck, aren'tcha?

Here, child. let me help you out, son. You obviosuly have problems with reading and searching:

NSA Surveillance Violated Constitution, Secret FISA Court Found | Cato @ Liberty

https://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2012_rpt/faa-extend.html

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court Opinion

I hope you can actually read.

“On at least one occasion,” the intelligence shop has approved Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) to say, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court found that “minimization procedures” used by the government while it was collecting intelligence were “unreasonable under the Fourth Amendment.” Minimization refers to how long the government may retain the surveillance data it collects. The Fourth Amendment to the Constitution is supposed to guarantee our rights against unreasonable searches.

I'm sorry, we're talking about two different Ed Snowdens. The one I'm talking about did a lot more than release information that the NSA was holding collected information too long.

If the NSA violates the 4th amendment ever - even once - that means anyone who has taken an oath to protect secrets is free to release any and all secrets they choose to the public?

BTW - can you show us where the 4th amendment says how long the NSA may keep collected data?

Right. He exposed criminal conduct of the NSA. He was under no obligation to maintain secrecy regarding criminal activity. In fact, just teh opposite.

Well, the NSA DID violate the fourth A. So exposing their criminal activity exonerates Snowden from any liability. In the same fashion a state agent would participate in criminal activity to expose bigger crimes.

BTW - moving the goal posts doesn't make you look any smarter, Junior.

You keep calling it "criminal activity."


Can you please name the last person who was convicted, as a criminal, for violation of the 4th amendment?
 
That's just the facts. Snowden revealed the information to the american people. Whether or not al qaeda (i thought they were decimated adn on the run????) knows how to use the internet is not SNowden's problem. He didn't give them the information. He gave it o a journalist who did what journalists do.

He exposed the NSA criminal conduct to the american people.
 

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