Everyone is dancing around the truth in the Sandra Bland arrest. What happened is obvious.

[Hutch Starskey]

Cops also pick on white trash burnout guys who are rude. Moral of the story is be as respectful and nervous in front of a cop as you are a judge.

Exactly. Everyone of these "bad cop" situations have the perp not following directions. I've been stopped for speeding and always begin with "Good afternoon, Officer." I got out of some tickets and others I just thanked them and went on my way. One difference I would do now, is tell him I realize he was tough job ... especially now.

If Sandra Bland had a personality that didn't lend her to jail time, she should have acted just as I do. It's nice to go home.

Maybe that's a problem with cops and not the people who are not surprisingly pissed off?

 

[Oldstyle]

[...] I've been pulled over by the police many times in just the same way. They talk to you, ask you where it is you're going, check your info, then they issue you a warning and you're on your way.

[...]

So you get pulled over for failing to signal a lane change and the cop wants to know "where it is you're going," and you're okay with that?

I won't criticize you if you are willing to tell the cop where you're going, or where you've been, or why, or whatever intrusive assault on your privacy he chooses to impose, because you'd prefer to get a warning instead of a summons. In the proper mood I might be inclined to do the same. But wouldn't you prefer that the cop is not equipped with the power of judging whether you get a warning or a summons based on his personal disposition toward you?

Warnings in the example of minor traffic infractions are typically issued to individuals who have clean driving records -- which should be the only criterion for determining who gets a warning rather than a summons. It should not be up to the cop. Because cops are cops -- not judges. And a basic psychological principle in delegating authority, such as police authority, is recipients are likely to autonomously expand to the next higher level if not diligently supervised.

If a cop is allowed to tell a driver he pulls over for a minor traffic infraction to put his/her cigarette out, he soon will be asking where they are going, or where they've been, and with who, or whatever else might occur to him when in fact it is none of his business.

If a cop pulls you over for failing to signal a turn, unless there is some evidence of something illegal he has no right to assert his authority beyond that necessary to facilitate his immediate purpose, which is issuing a warning or a summons for the infraction he observed.

This is so because America is not a police state.

Yet.

With all due respect, Mike...the police officer DOES have the discretion to decide whether you get a warning or a ticket. You've broken a law and that police officer is the on site representative of our legal system who you are dealing with. You can do everything in your power to make that officer decide in your favor and give you a warning...or you can bust his chops and probably get a ticket or worse. My question for you is a simple one...why would you antagonize the person who has that discretion? It's just plain stupid.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

When a cop wants you out of the car he doesn't need a lighted cigarette flicked into his face.

Wow, the cop even said he was going to give her a warning. He asked why she was irritated, she answered politely mind you, she did not cus she said she had tried to get out of his way when he sped up on her. He then said are you done? She said yes you asked why I was irritated and I told you. Then he said do you mind putting out the cigarrette please. He asked her it was not an order and he asked her to do that to provoke her. He knew she was stressed and wanted to get a reaction, she replied why? Then The cop got nasty. The cop did it intentionally and even lied to another officer about her demeanor after the bs arrest. He said she was out of control and all I wanted to do was give her a warning. How can anyone defend this pos cop? Cops do this type of stuff all the time to get a reaction and get an arrest and to provoke so they have something to do. Typical in every police station across the nation. This is police training 101.

I had no idea you could read minds.

"He asked her it was not an order and he asked her to do that to provoke her."

Have you been through police training?

"This is police training 101."

Apparently you have never been approached or pulled over by police. She did nothing unusual or anything I would not have said when I was younger. Now I give them what is required when it is required and say nothing else. They do not like that and it always turns into " let's talk man to man" or "I am just trying to have a conversation with you" They want you to talk. This cop had only been on the beat for one year, he was trying to make a name for himself with the department, his lies about miss bland proove that when he is talking on the recording latter on. Looking at how he was positioned and his reaction to her when she questioned why she was being arrested and notice he did not answer which he was legally obligated to do.

He did ask her to put out the cigarette and he said please. Not a command. So you believe what this cop did was right? That he wasnt provoking her? that she was rude? And he wasn't rude by saying are you done? GTFO of here. You are very gullible and if this is the sort of police officer you like then you need to get with this guy and the McKinley summersault cop and have a pity party!

No the cop should lose his job and the city will probably settle a lawsuit with the family. We're just saying black people don't know how to talk to police officers. You don't screw with cops. Yes sir no sir.

.

And police don't know how to avoid a lawsuit. Hmm... I wonder what should change for the taxpayers.

 

[Oldstyle]

I'm baffled by this concept that the police should be held to a higher standard than the rest of us.

Try this out, Hutch...go to the Registry of Motor Vehicles and treat that person behind the counter like they're something you just scraped off the bottom of your shoe and see what happens. I guarantee that whatever you brought with you to get that new license or register that new vehicle isn't going to satisfy Registry "requirements".

Anyone who deals with people in the real world regularly knows that being cordial gets you better results than being an asshole.

Look I'm not advocating people be assholes. I get it. I'm always cordial and have never had a bad experience. That's not to say that the police in any way have the right to fuck me because I was a smartass. It baffles me why you would be ok with that.

It's not that I'm either OK or not OK with it, Hutch...I simply grasp that it's reality and deal with that reality in the most logical way I can. That goes for not just for your interactions with the police, by the way but for your interactions with just about everyone. That person at the Registry of Motor Vehicles that you got snippy with has no right to deny you a new license because you don't have the "required" ID's but you know as well as I do that they will do exactly that! So you have a choice...play nice with the asshole behind the counter...or have them cause inconvenience in your life.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

Proper police procedure. A lit tobacco product is not only a distraction, but can be used as a weapon.
If the cop tells you to put out the thing, don't be a prick. Put it out.

Yes, we all know about the highly feared but seldom seen black butt flicking ninja assassins.
Are cops really that pussy?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Yes and her autopsy report came out that she had a large amount of THC in her system.

So what?

Detectable traces of marijuana remain constant for up to thirty days. If she was under the influence of marijuana at the time of occurrence she would have been sedated, not argumentative or belligerent. So that autopsy finding is not irrelevant to the circumstances.

It wasn't a trace, it was a large amount.
She got it while she was in her cell.
If she is doing it in jail then she also did it all the time.

And that say more about the jail and the department than her. Corruption seems apparent.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

She didnt get arrested for a traffic violation. But you knew that.

No, she got arrested for not respecting the White Man.

Than why did you say she got arrested for a traffic violation?
No need to answer...we know why.

Because try as you might to spin this, there's really no excuse for what this cop did.

None at all.

And the only reason why THIS bogus arrest is getting attention is because the girl killed herself or someone else killed her in jail.

What a dumbass..
No body killed her,and had she just acted civilized she wouldnt have been arrested in the first place.
Stop defending people who behave badly.

Including the officer!

She's the one who went apeshit.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

When a cop wants you out of the car he doesn't need a lighted cigarette flicked into his face.

That's why his next request was going to be for her to bite off all nails.

Why do so many go off on a la la land remark that would never happen?

Well no one knew until this happened not putting out your cigarette in your own car was something you can be arrested for. Nail removal is reasonable..after all don't want to risk the officer maybe getting hurt by a cigarette or nails.

I don't thik the vest is rated to stop either.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

Proper police procedure. A lit tobacco product is not only a distraction, but can be used as a weapon.
If the cop tells you to put out the thing, don't be a prick. Put it out.

Yes, we all know about the highly feared but seldom seen black butt flicking ninja assassins.
Are cops really that pussy?

I promise you,I flick a lit cigarette in your face I have a free shot at you or a chance to escape.
They're not being assholes telling you to put out your cigarette,it's for their own safety.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

I'm baffled by this concept that the police should be held to a higher standard than the rest of us.

Try this out, Hutch...go to the Registry of Motor Vehicles and treat that person behind the counter like they're something you just scraped off the bottom of your shoe and see what happens. I guarantee that whatever you brought with you to get that new license or register that new vehicle isn't going to satisfy Registry "requirements".

Anyone who deals with people in the real world regularly knows that being cordial gets you better results than being an asshole.

Look I'm not advocating people be assholes. I get it. I'm always cordial and have never had a bad experience. That's not to say that the police in any way have the right to fuck me because I was a smartass. It baffles me why you would be ok with that.

It's not that I'm either OK or not OK with it, Hutch...I simply grasp that it's reality and deal with that reality in the most logical way I can. That goes for not just for your interactions with the police, by the way but for your interactions with just about everyone. That person at the Registry of Motor Vehicles that you got snippy with has no right to deny you a new license because you don't have the "required" ID's but you know as well as I do that they will do exactly that! So you have a choice...play nice with the asshole behind the counter...or have them cause inconvenience in your life.

Not really the same thing dude.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

No, she got arrested for not respecting the White Man.

Than why did you say she got arrested for a traffic violation?
No need to answer...we know why.

Because try as you might to spin this, there's really no excuse for what this cop did.

None at all.

And the only reason why THIS bogus arrest is getting attention is because the girl killed herself or someone else killed her in jail.

What a dumbass..
No body killed her,and had she just acted civilized she wouldnt have been arrested in the first place.
Stop defending people who behave badly.

Including the officer!

She's the one who went apeshit.

What is apeshit? Being pissed because a cop who said he was giving you a warning threatened to " light you up" ?

Who went apeshit again?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

When a cop wants you out of the car he doesn't need a lighted cigarette flicked into his face.

That's why his next request was going to be for her to bite off all nails.

Why do so many go off on a la la land remark that would never happen?

Well no one knew until this happened not putting out your cigarette in your own car was something you can be arrested for. Nail removal is reasonable..after all don't want to risk the officer maybe getting hurt by a cigarette or nails.

She didn't get arrested for not putting out her cigarette.

What was she arrested for?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What do you tell your children. Do tell them screw the police you know your rights or do you tell them to be polite?

What I tell my kids and how I react to this are two entirely different things. It's my hope we can change this so I don't have to tell my kids that.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

[...] I've been pulled over by the police many times in just the same way. They talk to you, ask you where it is you're going, check your info, then they issue you a warning and you're on your way.

[...]

So you get pulled over for failing to signal a lane change and the cop wants to know "where it is you're going," and you're okay with that?

I won't criticize you if you are willing to tell the cop where you're going, or where you've been, or why, or whatever intrusive assault on your privacy he chooses to impose, because you'd prefer to get a warning instead of a summons. In the proper mood I might be inclined to do the same. But wouldn't you prefer that the cop is not equipped with the power of judging whether you get a warning or a summons based on his personal disposition toward you?

Warnings in the example of minor traffic infractions are typically issued to individuals who have clean driving records -- which should be the only criterion for determining who gets a warning rather than a summons. It should not be up to the cop. Because cops are cops -- not judges. And a basic psychological principle in delegating authority, such as police authority, is recipients are likely to autonomously expand to the next higher level if not diligently supervised.

If a cop is allowed to tell a driver he pulls over for a minor traffic infraction to put his/her cigarette out, he soon will be asking where they are going, or where they've been, and with who, or whatever else might occur to him when in fact it is none of his business.

If a cop pulls you over for failing to signal a turn, unless there is some evidence of something illegal he has no right to assert his authority beyond that necessary to facilitate his immediate purpose, which is issuing a warning or a summons for the infraction he observed.

This is so because America is not a police state.

Yet.

With all due respect, Mike...the police officer DOES have the discretion to decide whether you get a warning or a ticket. You've broken a law and that police officer is the on site representative of our legal system who you are dealing with. You can do everything in your power to make that officer decide in your favor and give you a warning...or you can bust his chops and probably get a ticket or worse. My question for you is a simple one...why would you antagonize the person who has that discretion? It's just plain stupid.

See, here's the rub. There is no legal standard that allows for attitude. Either ticket me or walk the fuck away. That's the two choices available if the officer has no other probable cause. He certainly shouldn't continue to escalate the situation until he feels he has one.

 

[Harry Dresden]

You have an articulate and good looking black woman who probably came from up north some where and you have a very red neck white officer with that hickey kind of country accent. He's probably spent his entire life within 10 miles of where that incident took place. I bet he has a half dozen confederate T shirts.

For some reason, and you can see it here on the USMB, conservatives and right wingers believe you should just give up every right you have and instantly jump at what a police officer says, no matter the circumstances, or you get what you deserve. Especially if you are black, Hispanic, gay or some other minority. It's an example of the ultimate police state.

So he stops her for not using her turn signal. Of course she should use her turn signal, that's what it's there for. He should have just given her a ticket or a warning. And if it was some other white with that hickey accent, you know he would have only given a verbal warning if he had bothered to stop them.

And I'll tell you something else. I have relatives in the deep south that I spent some vacations and a couple of summers with growing up. I speak perfect "Yawl (or as some USMB members insist, "ya'll"), and I have been stopped because my license is from out of state and I just start talking Yawl and they suddenly talk very nice and have never given me a ticket.

Clearly that officer provoked her and escalated the situation with "put out your cigarette" and "step out of the car" and arresting her. It wasn't that he wanted her respect. He wanted her to cower and shuffle and she wasn't having it. So in his tiny and racist little mind, he was teaching her a lesson and it was within his right to teach her that lesson no matter what the actual law said because of who he was, the uniform he was wearing and who she was. In that part of the country, it's the "natural order" of things.

Wow for once I disagree with you. Actually I agree about the cops but also have an issue with the disrespect blacks feel they should be allowed to give to cops.

I don't talk like that to cops and if I did I would expect trouble.

Do black people think white people get away with disrespecting cops? Because we don't.

for once?.....so you agree with dean that all republicans are like he says they are?...

If you mean stupid kaka poo poo yes.

well that answered that....avoid answering, just like the guy....

I don't know what your asking harry.

sure you do....you said you always agree with dean except here.....so you know what dean says ALL Republicans believe,which is bullshit...when dean says ALL Republicans hate minorities,even though thousands of them have lived out here amongst them for decades and have even married them...so do you agree with him?...do you believe all Republicans hate gays,the poor,dont want people to have health ins,dont like science and education...this is what this unfortunate stroonge believes....so do you agree with him?....because by saying what you said above...you do...he said i was a racist in another thread last week,when i asked him to do what he claims he does better than anyone here,prove it....the guy just could not do it,so he started playing his little games that he always plays..."i dont know what you are talking about"....thats what im talking about bobo....

 

[Hutch Starskey]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

Proper police procedure. A lit tobacco product is not only a distraction, but can be used as a weapon.
If the cop tells you to put out the thing, don't be a prick. Put it out.

Yes, we all know about the highly feared but seldom seen black butt flicking ninja assassins.
Are cops really that pussy?

I promise you,I flick a lit cigarette in your face I have a free shot at you or a chance to escape.
They're not being assholes telling you to put out your cigarette,it's for their own safety.

Mmhmm. That 1.5 second head start is a game changer. I suppose that woman could have flicked, slipped out of the car and disarmed then subdued the officer before the butt hit the ground.
You're right. The officer had no choice.

 

[Papageorgio]

I'm baffled by this concept that the police should be held to a higher standard than the rest of us.

Try this out, Hutch...go to the Registry of Motor Vehicles and treat that person behind the counter like they're something you just scraped off the bottom of your shoe and see what happens. I guarantee that whatever you brought with you to get that new license or register that new vehicle isn't going to satisfy Registry "requirements".

Anyone who deals with people in the real world regularly knows that being cordial gets you better results than being an asshole.

Look fool. I'm a veteran. I've acted under rules of engagement. Those are orders that carry great responsibility as well as great consequence. Violate them and you had better have a rock solid excuse or that's your ass. That should be the standard for cops.They hold the public trust.Without that, nothing works. If I was able to meet that standard without exception at 19 or 20 years old than what excuse does a 15 or 20 year veteran of Shitstain PD have?

Great superior attitude there bub, I hope they don't treat you the way you feel about them, asshole.

That's my hope as well.

We all picked up you are a sanctimonious, liberal asshole rather quickly, I am sure the police will figure you out as well.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Than why did you say she got arrested for a traffic violation?
No need to answer...we know why.

Because try as you might to spin this, there's really no excuse for what this cop did.

None at all.

And the only reason why THIS bogus arrest is getting attention is because the girl killed herself or someone else killed her in jail.

What a dumbass..
No body killed her,and had she just acted civilized she wouldnt have been arrested in the first place.
Stop defending people who behave badly.

Including the officer!

She's the one who went apeshit.

What is apeshit? Being pissed because a cop who said he was giving you a warning threatened to " light you up" ?

Who went apeshit again?

Obviously the self riotous black women.
White people get pulled over for the same bullshit reasons...yet we dont feel the need to act like a dumbass.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

[...] I've been pulled over by the police many times in just the same way. They talk to you, ask you where it is you're going, check your info, then they issue you a warning and you're on your way.

[...]

So you get pulled over for failing to signal a lane change and the cop wants to know "where it is you're going," and you're okay with that?

I won't criticize you if you are willing to tell the cop where you're going, or where you've been, or why, or whatever intrusive assault on your privacy he chooses to impose, because you'd prefer to get a warning instead of a summons. In the proper mood I might be inclined to do the same. But wouldn't you prefer that the cop is not equipped with the power of judging whether you get a warning or a summons based on his personal disposition toward you?

Warnings in the example of minor traffic infractions are typically issued to individuals who have clean driving records -- which should be the only criterion for determining who gets a warning rather than a summons. It should not be up to the cop. Because cops are cops -- not judges. And a basic psychological principle in delegating authority, such as police authority, is recipients are likely to autonomously expand to the next higher level if not diligently supervised.

If a cop is allowed to tell a driver he pulls over for a minor traffic infraction to put his/her cigarette out, he soon will be asking where they are going, or where they've been, and with who, or whatever else might occur to him when in fact it is none of his business.

If a cop pulls you over for failing to signal a turn, unless there is some evidence of something illegal he has no right to assert his authority beyond that necessary to facilitate his immediate purpose, which is issuing a warning or a summons for the infraction he observed.

This is so because America is not a police state.

Yet.

With all due respect, Mike...the police officer DOES have the discretion to decide whether you get a warning or a ticket. You've broken a law and that police officer is the on site representative of our legal system who you are dealing with. You can do everything in your power to make that officer decide in your favor and give you a warning...or you can bust his chops and probably get a ticket or worse. My question for you is a simple one...why would you antagonize the person who has that discretion? It's just plain stupid.

See, here's the rub. There is no legal standard that allows for attitude. Either ticket me or walk the fuck away. That's the two choices available if the officer has no other probable cause. He certainly shouldn't continue to escalate the situation until he feels he has one.

One what?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

What rule says one cannot smoke in one's own vehicle?

Proper police procedure. A lit tobacco product is not only a distraction, but can be used as a weapon.
If the cop tells you to put out the thing, don't be a prick. Put it out.

Yes, we all know about the highly feared but seldom seen black butt flicking ninja assassins.
Are cops really that pussy?

I promise you,I flick a lit cigarette in your face I have a free shot at you or a chance to escape.
They're not being assholes telling you to put out your cigarette,it's for their own safety.

Mmhmm. That 1.5 second head start is a game changer. I suppose that woman could have flicked, slipped out of the car and disarmed then subdued the officer before the butt hit the ground.
You're right. The officer had no choice.

Oh shut the fuck up...cops dont use a racial bar graph when deciding on who should put their cigarette out.
They've told me the same damn thing and I wasnt acting like a fucken moron.