For First Time ,a U.S. Capitol riot defendant is

[Coyote]

No need to play a race card here. Poverty has never meant immorality or criminality. Regardless of race. It's all the OTHER factors. Like having the motivation to take advantage of education and YES maybe a bit of parental discipline and even a bit of religion.

The poster you responded to virtually told you that. And you interpreted that as somehow "race sensitive". The SUCCESS of a family to COPE with poverty determines the outcome. Not the skin color. And it's measured by all the successful people we know that came out of poverty BECAUSE of the way the family was able to cope.

The race card was not played. This poster has history of uniquely singling out only black people as a whole for things. Secondly, we both know poverty has a wide variety of causes, usually multiple. To just lump all black people into a category of "it's their fault" while simultaneously absolving white people of group fault in poverty ignores the complex nature of povery. My biggest beef here is the tendancy of the right to assign a moral value to being poor and when it is only applied to one race, it sure looks a bit racist.

I live in a state with a lot of poverty. A lot of broken families, children raised by grandparents, ground zero for the opiod epidemic, high unemployment, lack of good jobs, a lot of poor schools. All of those factors can and have applied to black people. But my state is mostly white. No one blames their race for poverty.

 

[Lisa558]

Only because the context was primarily "race riots" -- Duhhh....

I HATE the fact that Xenforo took out the option to carry the WHOLE "sub-threads". We used to be able to get context from the whole "separate convos" that were going on. But we had to "twitterfy" USMB to just carry the "last quote" forward rather than select the LENGTH of the quote chain. It really SUCKS for a discussion board.

Lisa was replying to EvilEyeFleagle who ASSERTED he knew that the poor were responsible for most crimes. OR was attributing that to Lisa or just his imagined version of "what racists would think". Hard to tell when folks speak for others so often on USMB. HE brought up the "poor" connection.

Which is ironic now that we know that the BLM founders have "LOST" about $40Mill in donations, but suddenly have 3 fancy houses and new $6Mill BLM retreat they just bought in a swanky part of L.A. THERE's the "cure" for "black" poverty I guess.

And like I said "high rate of out-of-wedlock" births HAS no racial connection. UNLESS -- it's top of YOUR mind.

Thank you. And the irony here is that liberals have made remarks that go against whites related to the 1/6 riot (a bunch of “old white dudes”), when race had nothing to do with the protest. It again is an example of how frequently libs work in some remark showing hostility toward whites, and that goes by without a blink. But let someone try and excuse blacks for their crimes because they are still poor, and a white person says that’s no excuse because they are poor due to their own decisions, wam! Racist!

 

[Hang on Sloopy]

Precisely. There was nothing in the post that blamed blacks for being poor and excusing whites. That poster races in to change around what conservatives say to make them APPEAR racist, since if she stuck to what they do say, she’d have no argument.

To recap, a liberal was excusing or “explaining” criminal behavior by blacks because, he said, they’re poor. (That right there is racist.) I responded by saying that’s no defense, since they are poor due to their own actions and bad choices.

So the liberal races in with, “oh, so blacks are poor dUE to their own failings, but ’you whites’ are blameless.” Nobody ever said that. Whites who remain poor are poor for the same reasons, but of course percentage wise poverty and its correlated crime rate is less of an issue among whites due to their actions and choices. But for those who remain poor, it’s for the same basic reasons: having babies out of wedlock and failing to complete school.

Well said. The teachings of Thomas Sowell should be taught to all in schools

 

[Lisa558]

The race card was not played. This poster has history of uniquely singling out only black people as a whole for things. Secondly, we both know poverty has a wide variety of causes, usually multiple. To just lump all black people into a category of "it's their fault" while simultaneously absolving white people of group fault in poverty ignores the complex nature of povery. My biggest beef here is the tendancy of the right to assign a moral value to being poor and when it is only applied to one race, it sure looks a bit racist.

I live in a state with a lot of poverty. A lot of broken families, children raised by grandparents, ground zero for the opiod epidemic, high unemployment, lack of good jobs, a lot of poor schools. All of those factors can and have applied to black people. But my state is mostly white. No one blames their race for poverty.

And THIS poster has a pattern of putting words in my mouth to make it seem as if I’m racist. To her, any comment that the cause of poverty among blacks - when a different poster brought UP the poverty among blacks as an excuse for their crime rate - is due to their own decisions, she considers it racist.

And here again, you see another of her lies - her putting words in my mouth. I never said the reasons for poverty apply only to blacks, and not to whites. She accused me of that, naturally, and I expanded to make it clear that whites who are poor are so due to the same reasons. Yet, given her deceit, she ignores - pretends I never said it - and once again lies to say I have applied the reasons for poverty to just one race.

And the reason that blacks, as a group, have higher rates of poverty is because blacks, as a group, have a significantly higher OOW rate.that’s not racist…..that’s a fact. Yet the deceitful poster above, anytime a white doesn't blame racism for blacks’ higher poverty rate, and instead holds them responsible, it’s racist.

THE POSTER IS LYING ABOUT WHAT I SAY TO MAKE IT APPEAR THAT HER ENEMY IS A RACIST. AND SHE LIES REPEATEDLY. This is the only way that leftists can keep the “conservatives are racist” lie going.

NORMAL people - which excludes the deceitful leftists - aren’t falling for your game anymore, and they’ve had enough. You’ll see come November 2022, when we put a stop to the nonsense.

 

[Lisa558]

No one was murdered, over 150 police injured, some severely, 5 people died either directly or indirectly. The Capital was looted and feces smeared on the walls. An attack was made on our seat of democracy by people attempting to overthrow an election and prevent the peaceful transfer of power.

And the black police officer? He was American too.

Pales in comparison to the death and destruction that resulted from the BLM riots. Bit because those much more violent and destructive riots were in defense of a black cause (and one based on a lie, at that), there was all sorts of tolerance for it, ans downplaying of it. The future VP even lobbied for funds to get the rioters who were arrested out of jail.

A few people smearing feces on the walls, disgusting as it is, it not as deserving of punishment and derision as arsonists and murderers, such as amomg the BLM crowd.

 

[Lisa558]

It is a very nasty, shameful, unforgiveable thing to make up lies about what someone says in the attempt to make them appear racist.

THOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS.

 

[Grumblenuts]

And THIS poster has a pattern of putting words in my mouth to make it seem as if I’m racist.

No one need stuff any words in your mouth. Just read your own crap, compare it to the definition, and get busy cleaning up your own act.

 

[Lisa558]

No one need stuff any words in your mouth. Just read your own crap, compare it to the definition, and get busy cleaning up your own act.

Nope. Lib’s ARE putting words in my mouth. Nothing I’ve said is racist. You hypocrites are angry because I’m not going along with the anti-white racism cropping up everywhere, so as to deflect from that, you use the nasty tactic perfected by the Clintons: the politics of character destruction.

That‘s also an Alinsky tactic: when you can’t argue the point, attack the messenger.

Normal people aren’t falling for your shameful tactics. I in fact am ashamed that people like you are citizens of America.

 

[Osiris-ODS]

May you should try that schpeil on the 150 some police who were injured by your violent criminals peaceful "patriots".

Geez...if you didn't have a double standard you'd have no standards at all.

I think I've just about had my fill of whackos for the night.

I really don't understand how they let you be a mod. You constantly use aggressive demeaning language towards posters on this site. I wish I could put you on ignore but of course that's not allowed. You are my biggest gripe about this site.

 

[Lisa558]

I really don't understand how they let you be a mod. You constantly use aggressive demeaning language towards posters on this site. I wish I could put you on ignore but of course that's not allowed. You are my biggest gripe about this site.

Thank you. I too have a problem when a very biased moderator is allowed to attack innocent posters so venomously, and lie about what they say, simoly because they don’t subscribe to the false narrative being put forth by leftists.

 

[mudwhistle]

In case you missed it, we aren't the ones calling the Floyd rioters "peaceful patriots" ...we call rioters rioters and peaceful protesters are those who did not participate in riots. Why are you righris6s incapable of saying that those who broke into the capital. assaulted and injured police. stole and vandalized property and smeared feces on the walls are no different than those who rioted in Floyds name? Is it because they have an R affiliation?

No...that's not the situation here. Biden, Pelosi, and other Democrats claim that Jan 6th was worse than 911 or Pearl Harbor.
Do you really believe that? Their only evidence is doctored videos of so-called Trump supporters fighting with a bunch of jack-booted thugs on the Capital steps. But what caused that to start in the first place. Were the Trump supporters attacked and simply trying defend themselves? Witnesses say that is the case. Never mind all of the ANTIFA instigators that the Democrats hauled in vans into the area and ushered into the Capital when the cameras were off.

Democrats and some Republican Deep Staters used the CIA and a bunch of radicals to stage a false-flag operation, so they could do a preemptive strike against any future protests. (They've done this in other countries...why not in the USA?)

This led into the claims by Democrats that #MAGA hats were the a sign of terrorism/racism......and that anyone wearing one needs to be arrested or at least considered a threat. Then the AG issues a statement that parents are to be considered Domestic Terrorists because they don't want teachers to show their 6 year olds how to jerk-off.
Seems everywhere you look we see lying pedophiles being put in charge of your children and our government.
Any rational person can tell they're lying, but that doesn't seem to matter to Democrat voters....because they demonized the Orange Man so much even Marxist Pedophiles are more warm and fuzzy to them.

Matter of fact.....lying is a primary weapon the left uses to get what they want. At least that's what Obama has been caught saying. If he couldn't lie....he wouldn't be able to give a speech.
What kind of public-servant has to lie about everything to get things they want?
Answer: A crooked politician....I.E. a Communist/Marxist. (See Bernie Sanders)

Joe Biden is The Doomsday Scenario We Were Warned About

I have a new name for the current occupant of the White House: Doomsday Joe. We have heard “Creepy Joe,” “Ol’ Joe,” “Sleepy Joe,” and “Stumblin’ Joe,” but now let’s add “Doomsday...

www.americanthinker.com

 

[flacaltenn]

The race card was not played. This poster has history of uniquely singling out only black people as a whole for things. Secondly, we both know poverty has a wide variety of causes, usually multiple. To just lump all black people into a category of "it's their fault" while simultaneously absolving white people of group fault in poverty ignores the complex nature of povery. My biggest beef here is the tendancy of the right to assign a moral value to being poor and when it is only applied to one race, it sure looks a bit racist.

I usually depend on the words people use, not some personal interpretation of "what is racist". You and I are saying the same things about poverty. But it's not fair to dismiss facts/statistics about the disparate effects of poverty on different sections of the population. And facts/statistics are not racist.

The question of BLAMING is a lot different from UNDERSTANDING the root causes of stuff. And it's actually a harder case to make. For instance, poverty is maybe not the primary predictor of where opioids are gonna devastate people. This is systemic NOW in all classes and locations. And LIKELY the problem has gotten MUCH worse with enough Fentanyl crossing the border recently to actually KILL maybe 25% of the ENTIRE US POPULATION. Over 100,000 deaths this year alone - so FAR..

To jump on folks that dare to TRY and understand WHY there was a lot of "black" looting/pillaging last summer and convince yourself anyone is racist for discussing it -- is too easy.

And we're here to discuss INCARCERATIONS for at least the "pillaging" part -- not EVEN the LOOTING part of the parallels to Jan 6th. There is simply NO PARALLEL to the damage done or the violence between the 2 events.

 

[Grumblenuts]

And we're here to discuss INCARCERATIONS for at least the "pillaging" part -- not EVEN the LOOTING part of the parallels to Jan 6th. There is simply NO PARALLEL to the damage done or the violence between the 2 events.

No "we're" not. That's just deliberately engaging in fallacious whataboutery instead of seriously addressing the actual topic. Projection. Distraction. Ad hominem. The pot calling the kettle black.

The Childish Response​

"Of all human instincts, not even the urge to say 'I told you so' is stronger than the response called tu quoque: 'Look who's talking.' To judge from children, it is innate ('Cathy says you took her chocolate,' 'Yes but she stole my doll'), and we don't grow out of it . . .

 

[flacaltenn]

No "we're" not. That's just deliberately engaging in fallacious whataboutery instead of seriously addressing the actual topic. Projection. Distraction. Ad hominem. The pot calling the kettle black.

The Childish Response​

Not according to the title and Opost. Reads just the way I thought it did. The whataboutery is allowed if it's a direct comparison to the INCARCERATION of the Jan 6th folks. So the summer Covid riots are "on topic". The excursion into what's racist began while I was living life.

Since "EVERYTHING is racist" now, that tends to leak into to ANYTHING where the partisan warriors start dealing the racist cards. In fact, it's the card that gonna SAVE the Dem party in the next elections. LOL....

 

[beautress]

Reuters reports " In a case that could embolden some of the hundreds
of other defendants facing minor misdemeanor charges to go to
trial rather than seeking plea deals."

There's the flip side of the coin that changes the scenario the alleged "rioters" who were actually peaceful protesters against the lies told by the press and certain politicians who needed the new false witness approach to keep Donald Trump down and disabled from going after precinct chairmen and chairwomen changing the American people's vote with false votes received at 3am the morning after the election that were counted anyways, and all of them were written by the same hand, and all of them were for Joe Biden. *yawn*

Here's that flip side of the decision:

Martin, whose bench trial started Tuesday, testified that a police officer waved him into the building after the riot erupted. A prosecutor dismissed that testimony as “nonsense.”​

​

The judge, however, said video shows two police officers standing near the Rotunda doors and allowing people to enter as Martin approached. One of the officers appeared to lean back before Martin placed a hand on the officer’s shoulder as a possible sign of gratitude, the judge said.​

​

Judge issues first acquittal to Jan. 6 riot defendant

WASHINGTON — A federal judge on Wednesday acquitted a New Mexico man of misdemeanor charges that he illegally entered the U.S. Capitol and engaged in disorderly conduct after he walked into the bui…

thehill.com

 

[Grumblenuts]

Not according to the title and Opost. Reads just the way I thought it did. The whataboutery is allowed if it's a direct comparison to the INCARCERATION of the Jan 6th folks.

I presume you mean the thread title and opening post. Please clarify if otherwise. That reads:

For First Time ,a U.S. Capitol riot defendant is​

-----
Acquitted.As reported by Reuters a mere 3 hrs ago.
Thank Heaven and also Donald Trump.It was done via a bench trial
not a Jury Trial by a U.S. District Judge appointed by Trump.
How's them Potatoes.

A false claim, as the unlinked source itself made plain. Not the first to be acquitted, though apparently the first to be entirely acquitted of all charges after being heard by a judge without a jury trial.

The OP clearly expresses approval of that outcome, but oddly credits "Heaven" and "Donald Trump" rather than the judge directly. The former ("Heaven"), of course, being a spurious attribution utterly devoid of supportable evidence.

Also, notice how "INCARCERATION" is mentioned exactly nowhere. Not in the title. Not in the OP. Nor even in the story. A complete non sequitur. What HAVE you been smoking?

 

[Grumblenuts]

It's up at Reuters by Jan Wolfe. - 3 hrs. ago.
No I'm not gonna hold yer hand.

^Lazy!:

For first time, a U.S. Capitol riot defendant is acquitted

A federal judge on Wednesday issued the first acquittal in a criminal trial stemming from the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol, saying prosecutors failed to prove their case against a New Mexico man facing misdemeanor charges.

www.reuters.com

 

[Grumblenuts]

The excursion into what's racist began while I was living life.

Were you just speaking for yourself here? I sure hope so.

Do you believe the definition of racism has changed significantly in your lifetime? I don't. I've never had any shortage of racist neighbors, family, and acquaintances. Never noticed them spouting anything significantly different from what gets spewed around here.

 

[Coyote]

Money can NOT help MOST of the Jan 6th political prisoners being held -- NOT in a typical US legal system, but in the District of Columbia -- in solitary -- in a jail that MOST ADMIT, should be condemned. Most court systems in the US operate under general civil law, where D.As and defense attorneys make all the decisions. But in D.C. --- the Congress which actually RUNS the district, has the muscle to bend the system.

About 40% of the 100 or so arrested for Jan 6th are held WITHOUT BAIL and limited access to ANYONE/ANYTHING outside the prison. So any outside money is of NO USE...

There's a list of about 90 of cases and each status here at tthe DOJ site ---

Capitol Breach Cases

www.justice.gov

There's about 20% of cases already decided. MOST ending a 3 to 6 month hell of confinement with nothing but probation and public service. THEIR CHARGES are virtually indistinguishable from the cases that REMAIN in solitary/no bail. From what I read in that link, your level of torture depends SOLELY ON whether the Fed govt hates the people you associate with.

IF THAT CRITERIA WERE USED for the "summer rioters" -- most Anti-Fa/BLM activists would STILL BE ROTTING IN PRISON TODAY for worse offenses. And efforts to "fund them" would be similarly pointless.

Jan 6 protesters/trespassers/rioters held in solitary, no bail, some without charges

People at the Capitol, not necessarily in the Capitol, on January 6th are in restrictive housing, aka solitary. Elizabeth Warren (MA) and Dick Durbin (IL) spoke up against the harsh treatment of people taken into custody for the Jan. 6 Capitol “riot.” Christian Gold Company Defies Industry’s...

www.independentsentinel.com

People at the Capitol, not necessarily in the Capitol, on January 6th are in restrictive housing, aka solitary.

Elizabeth Warren (MA) and Dick Durbin (IL) spoke up against the harsh treatment of people taken into custody for the Jan. 6 Capitol “riot.” [[Note DEMOCRATS - FCT]]

MASS SOLITARY
According to the Tennessee Star, the jail where some rioters /trespassers are kept, houses 1,500 inmates. They are confined to their jail cells 22 hours per day, an increase of one hour over what it was last month. They are prohibited from going outside.

Some of them are let out for recreation at 2 am due to COV. A Washington Post report described the jail’s COVID-19 order as “mass solitary confinement.” That got Democrats concerned because it hurts their argument for making DC a state.

A lawyer for Jan. 6 defendants told Politico that lawmakers should contact him if they were concerned about the inmates’ treatment. Marty Tankleff, himself exonerated after decades in prison for a wrongful murder conviction, told Just the News no one has contacted him nearly three weeks later.

His clients include Ryan Samsel, who alleges a prison guard beat him so badly he suffered permanent eye damage, and Edward Jacob Lang, an observant Jew who claims guards disparaged him as a “false prophet” as he prayed for other inmates.

40

I usually depend on the words people use, not some personal interpretation of "what is racist". You and I are saying the same things about poverty. But it's not fair to dismiss facts/statistics about the disparate effects of poverty on different sections of the population. And facts/statistics are not racist.

The question of BLAMING is a lot different from UNDERSTANDING the root causes of stuff. And it's actually a harder case to make. For instance, poverty is maybe not the primary predictor of where opioids are gonna devastate people. This is systemic NOW in all classes and locations. And LIKELY the problem has gotten MUCH worse with enough Fentanyl crossing the border recently to actually KILL maybe 25% of the ENTIRE US POPULATION. Over 100,000 deaths this year alone - so FAR..

To jump on folks that dare to TRY and understand WHY there was a lot of "black" looting/pillaging last summer and convince yourself anyone is racist for discussing it -- is too easy.

And we're here to discuss INCARCERATIONS for at least the "pillaging" part -- not EVEN the LOOTING part of the parallels to Jan 6th. There is simply NO PARALLEL to the damage done or the violence between the 2 events.

There is no "trying to understand" the causes of poverty in that. Not at all. Not when you hear "it's their own fault".

Please explain how a judgement like that has even a scant resemblence to "trying to understand".

As far as parallels, there is simply NO PARALLEL to damage caused by an attack on our nations capital, in a violent attempt to overthrow an election and subvert the peaceful transfer of power! NONE.

I've had enough of the but but but what about the Floyd riots. There is no comparison in terms of the damage done to OUR COUNTRY.


P.S. not trying to be nasty here, but when you see someone categorize an ENTIRE ethnic or racial group as somehow responsible, as a group for their poverty, ...doesn't that strike you, who pointed out that poverty has many factors affecting it...as a bit simplistic if not racist? Is that any different than blaming whitey?

 

[Coyote]

I really don't understand how they let you be a mod. You constantly use aggressive demeaning language towards posters on this site. I wish I could put you on ignore but of course that's not allowed. You are my biggest gripe about this site.

Sorry you feel that way but as mod, like all the mods here, I am allowed to post as a member. If it upsets that I use "demeaning language" maybe you should consider the language what I am responding to. Sadly for both of us. I can not ignore you either.