Giuliani told to prepare for‭ '‬imminent‭' ‬legal action

[Eric Arthur Blair]

.the evidence of fraud is so massive that this election may be turned

Where is the evidence and why has no one, particularly the courts seen it?

The state of Michigan actually preformed a forensic study of the Dominion vote changing machine
and found it to be wildly inaccurate and incapable of giving a true vote count. Forensic auditors find shocking 68% error rate in one Michigan county’s votes

Of course Michigan has disputed it's own independent study and have sued to suppress it.

So who are you going to believe? Gretchen Whitmer and her partisan flunkies or an independent audit by experts in their field? The corruption runs a mile deep in Michigan and the other three criminal states.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

.the evidence of fraud is so massive that this election may be turned

Where is the evidence and why has no one, particularly the courts seen it?

The state of Michigan actually preformed a forensic study of the Dominion vote changing machine
and found it to be wildly inaccurate and incapable of giving a true vote count. Forensic auditors find shocking 68% error rate in one Michigan county’s votes

Of course Michigan has disputed it's own independent study and have sued to suppress it.

So who are you going to believe? Gretchen Whitmer and her partisan flunkies or an independent auditor by experts in their field? The corruption runs a mile deep in Michigan and the other three criminal states.

I don't know about you, but if I was paying an attorney $20,000 a day and there is evidence enough to at least raise a "genuine issue of material fact" and my attorney failed to bring this is to the attention of the court, then he's not doing his job properly.

Not all cases are winnable but to my understanding your attorney's main job is to plead your case in a manner so that it survives the oppositions attempt to get the case thrown out on summary judgement prior to the merits of the case ever being heard or for that matter the evidence becoming a matter of public record.

I understand what you're saying but it's very hard to believe that there is evidence of massive voter fraud if the alleged "best people" that Trump employs cannot get it in front of a judge or jury to be considered.

On the other hand, while there may have been some cases of voter irregularities, perhaps it was not enough to ultimately change the outcome of the election. The implication when one claims "massive voter fraud" is that the fraud was significant enough that "had it not occurred" the outcome of the election would have been different. If something of this nature had occurred then I don't see how it's possible that it wasn't brought to the attention of the court. Even if the lower court mistakenly or willfully disregarded the claims alleged and evidence referenced, I find it hard to believe that an appellate court would let a blatant violation of the law or legal proceedings stand, but that's exactly what has happened in each one of Trump's cases that attempted to overturn the election results.

So to answer your question, I don't doubt that there may have been irregularities found however I don't believe that it was on the order of magnitude alleged nor that it was significant enough to change the election results.

Trump is just exceedingly bad at math. He doesn't understand that an 85% lead (or even a 100% lead) of only one third of the ballots (in person ballots) is not enough to win an election when two-thirds of the mail-in/absentee ballots hadn't yet been accountable for.

Genuine Issue of Material Fact

A disagreement between opposing parties on facts legally relevant to a claim. The disagreement must be "genuine" in the sense that it must be plausible (e.g., one cannot logically dispute a contract date without also alleging that a copy of a contract with that date inaccurately reflects the agreement). A genuine issue of material fact precludes summary judgment.
Genuine Issue of Material Fact

 

[meaner gene]

The state of Michigan actually preformed a forensic study of the Dominion vote changing machine
and found it to be wildly inaccurate and incapable of giving a true vote count. Forensic auditors find shocking 68% error rate in one Michigan county’s votes

This claim is completely debunked here:

Antrim County results spur 'human error' finding but claims continue

LANSING — Election results in Antrim County continue to spawn court action and high-profile tweeting even as state Republicans upheld the process.

www.record-eagle.com

And explained: The error stemmed from an incomplete software update by Antrim County Clerk Sheryl Guy, a Republican, who has repeatedly acknowledged that actions taken by her staff led to about 2,000 votes for Trump being mistakenly — and temporarily — tallied for Democratic challenger Joe Biden.

The mistake was caught shortly after Guy released full unofficial results at about 4 a.m. on Nov. 4, but it spurred many, and ongoing, attempts to challenge the state’s overall election results in a presidential bid to stay in office.

In addition, the audited results:

A hand recount and audit were announced by Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson soon after, and she was added to the suit on Dec. 14 as a named defendant.


Local volunteer poll auditors were used and results, which found a net gain of 12 votes for President Trump from among about 16,000 votes cast, were announced the same day.

The additional votes for the president show a .08 percent error in the county’s presidential election — not the 68 percent falsely stated in Ramsland’s report.

 

[Eric Arthur Blair]

You don't seem to know much about this matter. It's not Trump lawyers who are serving him badly.
It's the state and federal courts who are shielding Michigan, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin from
the consequences of their fraud and corruption.

And that includes the Roberts Supreme Court. Look at the way he contorted and completely "misread"
(lied) about Supreme Court tradition in these state v state instances and spouted a lot of bullshit about
Texas (and twenty other states) supposedly not having "standing" in a case where every single citizen in
Texas (AND those other states, 73 MILLION voters plus) were disenfranchised.
Imagine a violent home robbery case whee the victim was told he had no standing in the matter.

By the court letting those four states bypass the Constitution and their own legislators, letting people like Michigan's Soros sponsored Sof S Jocelyn Benson set her own election laws for the Biden election.
And I hate to overuse a word like bullshit...but that's what it was. Absolutely illegal and unconstitutional.

You can file briefs and produce evidence until the cows come home...the court is going to find a way to not
even address these matters if that's what they want to do. And that's what they want to do.

Georgia has a special committee who has looked into the evidence of election corruption and it
recommended to the legislature to decertify Georgia's vote for Corrupt Joe Biden. But the rest of the legislator will have to approve that report. Hopefully they will find their backbones somehow.

 

[meaner gene]

It's the state and federal courts who are shielding Michigan, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin from
the consequences of their fraud and corruption.
And that includes the Roberts Supreme Court.

You can file briefs and produce evidence until the cows come home...the court is going to find a way to not
even address these matters if that's what they want to do. And that's what they want to do.

The judges are throwing out the cases, because of lack of evidence. It's as simple as that. Remember, outside the courtroom Trumps lawyers are alleging voter fraud. Inside the courtroom, the lawyers tell the judge, they are NOT alleging voter fraud.

So you are confused by their saying one thing when there is no prohibition against telling complete fabrications, vs what they tell the court under penalty of perjury or sanction.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

You don't seem to know much about this matter. It's not Trump lawyers who are serving him badly.
It's the state and federal courts who are shielding Michigan, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin from
the consequences of their fraud and corruption.
And that includes the Roberts Supreme Court.

You can file briefs and produce evidence until the cows come home...the court is going to find a way to not
even address these matters if that's what they want to do. And that's what they want to do.

Georgia has a special committee who has looked into the evidence of election corruption and it
recommended to the legislature to decertify Georgia's vote for Corrupt Joe Biden. But the rest of the legislator will have to approve that report. Hopefully they will find their backbones somehow.

So in your opinion, every single court with the exception of the one, as well as the U.S. Supreme Court have all conspired to prevent not one of over 50 lawsuits from being allowed to present their evidence of voter fraud? Some of the judges, in their rulings have stated that Rudy didn't even allege voter fraud. So how do you reconcile that?

 

[JimH52]

They have backup paper ballots. Does trump and his crack legal understand that?

Depending on the model, the dominion voting machines print out a ballot with both text showing who was voted for, and a barcode the tabulator can read.

If any votes were switched, or incorrectly recorded the voter should have seen this before submitting his ballot for tabulation. And I haven't heard any reports of ballots printing names that didn't match the barcodes.

The Georgia hand recount proved the two matched.

Let's try to describe what has been happening.

On election night, trump went to bed thinking he was going to win. The day after election, he awoke and found his significant lead had dwindled and, in some cases, was lost. He had been shouting to his followers that mail in votes were evil. Additionally, GOP legislatures in many states, such as Pennsylvania had ruled that mail in ballots be counted after the in person ballots. So, as the mail in ballots, which were predominantly Democratic, began to be counted, trump's lead began to drop, until suddenly he was behind in many swing states.

Of course, the trump response was that he was the victim of voter fraud. He shouted it and preached it. Everyone said, "Okay, you have a right to challenged the count in court." That is what he has been doing, including pressuring Repub officials to break the law and their oath and declare him the winner in swing states that Biden won. He has lost in court over fifty times. He has lost in the USSC twice.

And still he persists, threatening anyone who acknowledges Biden as the winner, and seeking vengeance on anyone who does not believe his lies and false narratives. We should all be afraid for the next couple weeks. This man in imbalanced and is capable of anything as we go forward. He is desperate to stay in power, and is willing to take down the entire country in his efforts.

 

[Eric Arthur Blair]

So in your opinion, every single court with the exception of the one, as well as the U.S. Supreme Court have all conspired to prevent not one of over 50 lawsuits from being allowed to present their evidence of voter fraud? Some of the judges, in their rulings have stated that Rudy didn't even allege voter fraud. So how do you reconcile that?

It was an early strategy of Trump to not allege fraud, a mistake in retrospect, in favor of procedural crimes
(like by passing state legislatures in making pre election law) but that strategy was discarded pretty quickly.
Over fifty lawsuits, as you state, and NOT ONE SINGLE ONE rejected on the merits of the case itself!
These pro Biden courts have found a way, sometimes with no comment at all, to summarily dismiss
Trump cases for anything and everything BUT the issue of election fraud itself.

NO judge has ruled on the matter of election fraud per se. How interesting.

 

[meaner gene]

The problem with Trump lawsuits is, that they are not normal lawsuits, or even expedited lawsuits, which would take months to go to trial, and result in a verdict from a jury, or a bench decision from the judge.

But they don't have months, so instead they are filing a motion asking for an injunction,

Rule 65. Injunctions and Restraining Orders

www.law.cornell.edu

(c) Security. The court may issue a preliminary injunction or a temporary restraining order only if the movant gives security in an amount that the court considers proper to pay the costs and damages sustained by any party found to have been wrongfully enjoined or restrained.

 

[meaner gene]

Let's try to describe what has been happening.

On election night, trump went to bed thinking he was going to win. The day after election, he awoke and found his significant lead had dwindled and, in some cases, was lost. He had been shouting to his followers that mail in votes were evil. Additionally, GOP legislatures in many states, such as Pennsylvania had ruled that mail in ballots be counted after the in person ballots. So, as the mail in ballots, which were predominantly Democratic, began to be counted, trump's lead began to drop, until suddenly he was behind in many swing states.

Of course, the trump response was that he was the victim of voter fraud. He shouted it and preached it. Everyone said, "Okay, you have a right to challenged the count in court." That is what he has been doing, including pressuring Repub officials to break the law and their oath and declare him the winner in swing states that Biden won. He has lost in court over fifty times. He has lost in the USSC twice.

And still he persists, threatening anyone who acknowledges Biden as the winner, and seeking vengeance on anyone who does not believe his lies and false narratives. We should all be afraid for the next couple weeks. This man in imbalanced and is capable of anything as we go forward. He is desperate to stay in power, and is willing to take down the entire country in his efforts.

Exactly. And as the Trump supporters refuse to acknowledge.

 

[Agit8r]

No insanity defense in civil court. His goose is cooked.

 

[meaner gene]

It was an early strategy of Trump to not allege fraud, a mistake in retrospect, in favor of procedural crimes
(like by passing state legislatures in making pre election law) but that strategy was discarded pretty quickly.

The problem with that theory is Trump has been saying the presidential elections have been rigged since 2016.



US election 2016: Trump says election 'rigged at polling ...
www.bbc.com › news › election-us-2016-37673797

Oct 17, 2016 — US Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump has said the election is "absolutely rigged" by the "dishonest media" and "at many polling ...

 

[meaner gene]

US presidential election is rigged, says Donald Trump – video
The Guardian · Guardian News
Oct 18, 2016

https://cdn.theguardian.tv/mainwebsite/2016/10/18/161018TrumpRiggedElectionUpdate_desk.mp4

 

[Eric Arthur Blair]

The problem with that theory is Trump has been saying the presidential elections have been rigged since 2016.

Turns out he really had a point in 2020. So what?

 

[meaner gene]

The problem with that theory is Trump has been saying the presidential elections have been rigged since 2016.

Turns out he really had a point in 2020. So what?

First, why didn't Trumpl try to "fix" the election rigging he claimed in 2016?

Why didn't Trump find any of the election fraud he claimed in 2016?

And of course, why did Trump effectively disband the Federal Election Commission?

FEC commissioners' terms expired long ago, but Trump ...
www.nbcnews.com › politics › elections › fec-commissi...

Apr 30, 2018 — FEC commissioners' terms expired long ago, but Trump, Congress won't replace them. All four of the Federal Election Commission's ...

 

[Dragonlady]

You don't seem to know much about this matter. It's not Trump lawyers who are serving him badly.
It's the state and federal courts who are shielding Michigan, Georgia, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin from
the consequences of their fraud and corruption.

And that includes the Roberts Supreme Court. Look at the way he contorted and completely "misread"
(lied) about Supreme Court tradition in these state v state instances and spouted a lot of bullshit about
Texas (and twenty other states) supposedly not having "standing" in a case where every single citizen in
Texas (AND those other states, 73 MILLION voters plus) were disenfranchised.
Imagine a violent home robbery case whee the victim was told he had no standing in the matter.

By the court letting those four states bypass the Constitution and their own legislators, letting people like Michigan's Soros sponsored Sof S Jocelyn Benson set her own election laws for the Biden election.
And I hate to overuse a word like bullshit...but that's what it was. Absolutely illegal and unconstitutional.

You can file briefs and produce evidence until the cows come home...the court is going to find a way to not
even address these matters if that's what they want to do. And that's what they want to do.

Georgia has a special committee who has looked into the evidence of election corruption and it
recommended to the legislature to decertify Georgia's vote for Corrupt Joe Biden. But the rest of the legislator will have to approve that report. Hopefully they will find their backbones somehow.

Georia had no such committee. They looked into nothing. The Committee caved to direct pressure from Trump to recommend decertifying, but it did not happen. The Committee had no such power to decertify in any case.

The States in question followed their own laws, and their own Constitutions in conducting their elections, and Texas had no standing or ability to tell other states how to conduct the election.

86 different judged ruled to toss out Trump's laws suits. There wasn't a single judge out of any of them that dissented from these rulings. That alone should tell you how flimsy these cases were. If there was even one iota of truth to Trump's claims, you would think that one of those 86 judges would have sided with him. Not even the three judges he appointed to the SC specifically to hear his cases, would not side with him.

Furthermore, all of Trump's attorneys are now under scrutiny and are being reported to their respective bar association for disciplinary action for filing of scurrilous laws suits having no foundation in law or in fact, and making false and inflammatory, claims about election security in the USA.

What fools like you fail to realize is that there are ethical standards and codes of conduct for lawyers, and the filing of seditious and inflammatory law suits such as these violates the ethics and standards of the legal profession. Sydney Powell, Jenna Ellis and Rudy Guiliani had best look for other lines of work.

Rudy is soon going to be hiring a lawyer of his own. The SDNY is getting ready to file charges against Rudy for his role in the "Hunter Biden's laptop" scam, and for disseminating other Russian forgeries within the American Justice system in an effort to smear the Bidens. Rudy was repeatedly warned about the dangers of hanging out with Russian agents, and he continually ignored their warned and allowed them to use him to promote Russian propaganda and lies to Trump, who then promoted them to the American public.

Mr. Crebs said that they really didn't have a problem with Russian disinformation, lies or progaganda, coming out of Russia in 2020, because it was now coming directly from the White House through Donald Trump's Twitter feed, using information Trump received from Rudy Guiliani. Remember when Trump told Barr and the FBI that Rudy would help them investigate the Bidens, during the Ukraine scandal.

Notice how it's always Trump's closest advisors and most shamelessly loyal toadies who are ending needing pardons. No administration in history has been so dishonest, corrupt or criminal.

 

[Dragonlady]

The problem with that theory is Trump has been saying the presidential elections have been rigged since 2016.

Turns out he really had a point in 2020. So what?

Not according to everyone who worked in the election process, who scrutinized the running of the election, or the counting of votes. Not the international election monitoring agency Trump invited to certify the elections. Including poll watchers from both parties.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Rudy is named in a defamation suit‭ ‬brought‭ ‬by Dominion Voting Systems‭’ ‬attorneys.‭ ‬They specialize in defamation cases...

Why would a company which provides voting machines and associated software need lawyers which specialize in defamation cases?

To...bring a defamation case? They hired them for this case.

 

[meaner gene]

Rudy is named in a defamation suit‭ ‬brought‭ ‬by Dominion Voting Systems‭’ ‬attorneys.‭ ‬They specialize in defamation cases...

Why would a company which provides voting machines and associated software need lawyers which specialize in defamation cases?

To...bring a defamation case? They hired them for this case.

Dominion could lose $100 million in contracts due to Giuliani and others alleging their systems are defective.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Dominion doesn't want to sue...they just want a headline...if they sue they play right into Rudy's hands...they will have to turn over whatever and how ever many machines for investigation that Rudy wants...

I think it is a very safe bet that if their bluff is called, they will fold well before getting into the discovery phase. As it is now, everyone knows what they did, but it cannot easily be proven. To proceed with the lawsuit, they are going to have to open up all the details about how their voting machines and software worked, which will provide solid proof of their cheating and fraud, and blow any case for defamation completely out of the water.