GOP may "leverage" debt ceiling against de-funding Obamacare

[brfrad]

No, it is not illegal. You are not the authority on this.

This has already by done, Congress has checked off where it needed to, and you are bitching because government helps small business.

You are simply cry babying.

They are NOT helping small businesses by delaying it. Eventually, it will have to become law in which time small businesses will be in bad shape, but it gets delayed until after an election. They will either have to have a staff of all part-timers or keep their business small. Now, a big business comes in that can offer benefits and allow employees to become full-time. Full-time employees are in most cases going to be better, higher morale employees than part-time employees, who are most likely looking for full-time employment.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

 

[brfrad]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

So, you are probably the person who agrees with Washington D.C. that says if you have a big business you must pay them a $12 minimum wage. If you grew your business into a big business, why shouldn't you be allowed to play by the same rules as small businesses?

 

[Vandalshandle]

You have never been "free to determine how you want to finace your health care".

Sure we have. Until ACA was passed that is.

I live in a community of people over age 55. If 10% of these people were insurable by non-guaranteed issue indiviidual health insurers, I would be amazed, having spent my life in the health insurance business. Got glaucoma, history of alcohol or drug abuse, cancer, heart disease, COPD, been operated on for arthritis, have diabetis, high blood pressure, high chloseterol, treated for depression, MS, mental and nervous disorder, spinal problems, including chronic back pain, history of falling or dizzy spells, psoriasis, kidney or liver disease, gall bladder trouble, uirinary tract infections, erectile dysfunction, skin disorders, chronic migraines, or any of at least 50 other conditions that I could name, and you are SOL!

... and I'm not sure what all that has to do with anything. It certainly doesn't support your claim that we've never been free to decide how to finance our own health care.

I'll try to put this in a way that you can understand what I am saying. If you are too sick to get a job that has a health insurance fringe benefit, or if such a job does not exist in your home in Dogtrot, MO, then you are free to:
1. die
2. pay for care out of your own pocket, after you sell the family farm to finance it.

You are still free to do either of these things after ACA takes effect, but you are also given the option of buying guaranteed issue health insurance, which is an option you do not have today.

 

[Zoom-boing]

You have never been "free to determine how you want to finace your health care".

Sure we have. Until ACA was passed that is.

I live in a community of people over age 55. If 10% of these people were insurable by non-guaranteed issue indiviidual health insurers, I would be amazed, having spent my life in the health insurance business. Got glaucoma, history of alcohol or drug abuse, cancer, heart disease, COPD, been operated on for arthritis, have diabetis, high blood pressure, high chloseterol, treated for depression, MS, mental and nervous disorder, spinal problems, including chronic back pain, history of falling or dizzy spells, psoriasis, kidney or liver disease, gall bladder trouble, uirinary tract infections, erectile dysfunction, skin disorders, chronic migraines, or any of at least 50 other conditions that I could name, and you are SOL!

... and I'm not sure what all that has to do with anything. It certainly doesn't support your claim that we've never been free to decide how to finance our own health care.

I'll try to put this in a way that you can understand what I am saying. If you are too sick to get a job that has a health insurance fringe benefit, or if such a job does njot exist in your home in Dogtrot, MO, then you are free to:
1. die
2. pay for care out of your own pocket, after you sell the family farm to finance it.

You are still free to do either of these things after ACA takes effect, but you are also given the option of buying guaranteed issue health insurance, which is an option you do not have today.

Well, no. That's why there is a mandate requiring everyone to purchase health insurance.

What utter bullshit. My brother lost his job a few years back and is currently not working. He has health insurance that he has purchased on his own. Yes, it is affordable. Try again.

 

[Trajan]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

I see, so thats the yardstick now for submarining statutory law? right so when someone else asks is it going to be no? if so why if not why not?

hello, thats why we create laws, you cannot start picking and choosing, the time for that was BEFORE the bill was passed.

 

[dblack]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

I see, so thats the yardstick now for submarining statutory law? right so when someone else asks is it going to be no? if so why if not why not?

hello, thats why we create laws, you cannot start picking and choosing, the time for that was BEFORE the bill was passed.

Right. This is what those of us raising a fuss about "rule of law" are worried about. It really is a fundamental change in the way we govern our society.

 

[The T]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

I see, so thats the yardstick now for submarining statutory law? right so when someone else asks is it going to be no? if so why if not why not?

hello, thats why we create laws, you cannot start picking and choosing, the time for that was BEFORE the bill was passed.

Right. This is what those of us raising a fuss about "rule of law" are worried about. It really is a fundamental change in the way we govern our society.

It is indeed. Obama thinks he can address certain parts of LAW willy-nilly, and no one will call him on it.

That's what despots do...and it's outside the Constitution.

Now if Reid would grow a pair? WE would be rid of this asswipe in the Whitehouse that cares not for the rule of law much less the Constitution.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Zoom,
Have you ever heard of the word, "Underwriter"? Let me explain it to you. An underwriter is paid to turn people down who have an illness that is likely to cost the insurance comapny more in claims than he would pay in premiums. That is what I did for the health insurance industry. Every insurance comapny in America employees underwriters.

If your brother was abled to buy individual health insurance, then he was obvuiously not sick.

But, Zoom, don't take my word for it. Pick up the phone and call United Health Insurance Company, the largest health insurance company in America. They are in Minneapolis. Ask for the sales dept. Tell them that you want to buy individual health insurance. Then tell them thow pleased you are to find a company that will issue you a policy, in spite of the colon cancer that you had removed last year.

Then, come back to this thread, and tell us how long it took for the salesman to turn you down.

Based on my knowldege, I figure around 5 seconds.

If you guys really believe that sick people are eligible to buy health insurance, it is no wonder whatsoever as to why you are so completely uninformed about the entire subject of health insurance. I mean, we are talking about Health Insurance 101, here, not rocket science.

 

[BDBoop]

WASHINGTON, Aug 21 (Reuters) - U.S. Republican lawmakers, who staunchly oppose President Barack Obama's signature healthcare law, are considering using a fall showdown over the country's borrowing limit as leverage to try to delay the law's implementation.

The idea is gaining traction among Republican leaders in the House of Representatives, aides said on Wednesday. An aide to House Majority Leader Eric Cantor said the debt limit is a "good leverage point" to try to force some action on the healthcare law known as "Obamacare."

If House republicans follow through with this it will be further confirmation that most in the GOP are true partisan scum, and indeed place party above country.

And worse, their constituents are just FINE with that.

 

[ilia25]

AND, the debt ceiling should not be raised------we are already 17 trillion in debt with no end in sight. Do you think deficit spending can go on forever?

Yes, the deficit spending can go on forever -- because both national income and government revenue will keep growing forever. But you are too stupid to make the connection.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Zoom,
Have you ever heard of the word, "Underwriter"? Let me explain it to you. An underwriter is paid to turn people down who have an illness that is likely to cost the insurance comapny more in claims than he would pay in premiums. That is what I did for the health insurance industry. Every insurance comapny in America employees underwriters.

If your brother was abled to buy individual health insurance, then he was obvuiously not sick.

But, Zoom, don't take my word for it. Pick up the phone and call United Health Insurance Company, the largest health insurance company in America. They are in Minneapolis. Ask for the sales dept. Tell them that you want to buy individual health insurance. Then tell them thow pleased you are to find a company that will issue you a policy, in spite of the colon cancer that you had removed last year.

Then, come back to this thread, and tell us how long it took for the salesman to turn you down.

Based on my knowldege, I figure around 5 seconds.

If you guys really believe that sick people are eligible to buy health insurance, it is no wonder whatsoever as to why you are so completely uninformed about the entire subject of health insurance. I mean, we are talking about Health Insurance 101, here, not rocket science.

No, he isn't sick. Where did I say he was? What I said was he can buy affordable health insurance now (without the ACA). The left pushed the idea that people could not do this, could not afford this; it was part of the selling people the ACA. You know, the 'Affordable' part?

Oh, I see you were specifically speaking about sick people. I missed that earlier.

 

[ilia25]

ACA is not sustainable, should be killed...

On the other hand, part of me wish it doesn't get repealed nor defunded. Win the Senate and make all those who got exemptions to pay full price. Let them pay what the voted for on everyone else.

That's the thing. If it's really that bad, the gop should let it take effect because they'll win elections as a consequence. That's why I find their noisesome bs about defunding not being about shutting down govt to be highly suspicious, and think there may be some benefit to Obamacare.

As to unsustainablity, health care is unsustainable without reducing cost increases. Doing nothing is not an option.

I think that is what the GOP should do. However, when the POTUS, allows certain groups to be exempt, (even though it is illegal), it is going to be very difficult to show the true effect on everyone.

Small businesses are not a group of people. Exception for the small businesses means that some people would now be insured via the exchanges, instead of being insured by their employer.

But nobody is going to be exempt from being insured one way or another. That is the fundamental principle of Obamacare, and that is the only way it could work at all.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Small business asked for the delay, so, yes, small business is being helped.

You are not going to be the government czar who manages small business, are you?

I see, so thats the yardstick now for submarining statutory law? right so when someone else asks is it going to be no? if so why if not why not?

hello, thats why we create laws, you cannot start picking and choosing, the time for that was BEFORE the bill was passed.

Right. This is what those of us raising a fuss about "rule of law" are worried about. It really is a fundamental change in the way we govern our society.

p
Those of you who are worried about "rule of law" are obviously not you disinformation agents from the far reactionary right.

Small business asked for some legitimate help, the government gave it within the confines of legislation, and you guys can go suck on your bongs.

This is over, guys, forever: ACA is the law of the land. Like social security, FDA, Meat Inspection Act, Medicare, Medicaid, and so on and so forth. Love it.

 

[ilia25]

Zoom,
Have you ever heard of the word, "Underwriter"? Let me explain it to you. An underwriter is paid to turn people down who have an illness that is likely to cost the insurance comapny more in claims than he would pay in premiums. That is what I did for the health insurance industry. Every insurance comapny in America employees underwriters.

If your brother was abled to buy individual health insurance, then he was obvuiously not sick.

But, Zoom, don't take my word for it. Pick up the phone and call United Health Insurance Company, the largest health insurance company in America. They are in Minneapolis. Ask for the sales dept. Tell them that you want to buy individual health insurance. Then tell them thow pleased you are to find a company that will issue you a policy, in spite of the colon cancer that you had removed last year.

Then, come back to this thread, and tell us how long it took for the salesman to turn you down.

Based on my knowldege, I figure around 5 seconds.

If you guys really believe that sick people are eligible to buy health insurance, it is no wonder whatsoever as to why you are so completely uninformed about the entire subject of health insurance. I mean, we are talking about Health Insurance 101, here, not rocket science.

No, he isn't sick. Where did I say he was? What I said was he can buy affordable health insurance now (without the ACA). The left pushed the idea that people could not do this, could not afford this; it was part of the selling people the ACA. You know, the 'Affordable' part?

Oh, I see you were specifically speaking about sick people. I missed that earlier.

Well that is the problem ACA is trying to solve -- make health insurance affordable to sick people. And the only way it can be done is by requiring that everyone has an insurance.

And if you have to ask -- no, the government can't simply order the insurance companies to accept people with pre-existing conditions. Been there, done that -- it won't work.

 

[The T]

Zoom,
Have you ever heard of the word, "Underwriter"? Let me explain it to you. An underwriter is paid to turn people down who have an illness that is likely to cost the insurance comapny more in claims than he would pay in premiums. That is what I did for the health insurance industry. Every insurance comapny in America employees underwriters.

If your brother was abled to buy individual health insurance, then he was obvuiously not sick.

But, Zoom, don't take my word for it. Pick up the phone and call United Health Insurance Company, the largest health insurance company in America. They are in Minneapolis. Ask for the sales dept. Tell them that you want to buy individual health insurance. Then tell them thow pleased you are to find a company that will issue you a policy, in spite of the colon cancer that you had removed last year.

Then, come back to this thread, and tell us how long it took for the salesman to turn you down.

Based on my knowldege, I figure around 5 seconds.

If you guys really believe that sick people are eligible to buy health insurance, it is no wonder whatsoever as to why you are so completely uninformed about the entire subject of health insurance. I mean, we are talking about Health Insurance 101, here, not rocket science.

No, he isn't sick. Where did I say he was? What I said was he can buy affordable health insurance now (without the ACA). The left pushed the idea that people could not do this, could not afford this; it was part of the selling people the ACA. You know, the 'Affordable' part?

Oh, I see you were specifically speaking about sick people. I missed that earlier.

Well that is the problem ACA is trying to solve -- make health insurance affordable to sick people. And the only way it can be done is by requiring that everyone has an insurance.

And if you have to ask -- no, the government can't simply order the insurance companies to accept people with pre-existing conditions. Been there, done that -- it won't work.

But still and yet? The Gubmint does it...the Gubmint says yes they can...and will, and DO.

 

[The T]

I see, so thats the yardstick now for submarining statutory law? right so when someone else asks is it going to be no? if so why if not why not?

hello, thats why we create laws, you cannot start picking and choosing, the time for that was BEFORE the bill was passed.

Right. This is what those of us raising a fuss about "rule of law" are worried about. It really is a fundamental change in the way we govern our society.

p
Those of you who are worried about "rule of law" are obviously not you disinformation agents from the far reactionary right.

Small business asked for some legitimate help, the government gave it within the confines of legislation, and you guys can go suck on your bongs.

This is over, guys, forever: ACA is the law of the land. Like social security, FDA, Meat Inspection Act, Medicare, Medicaid, and so on and so forth. Love it.

Is this WHY Obama has suspended it for certain people? The CONGRESS for themselves?

JAKE? YOU live in a senile FANTASY world.

 

[JakeStarkey]

T, evidence the suspension of the law for Congress, for instance.

You can't, because it did not happen.

You are being played by the far right reactionaries and neo-corporatists.

We are all in the same ACA. http://www.factcheck.org/2013/05/congress-and-an-exemption-from-obamacare/

 

[Vandalshandle]

No, he isn't sick. Where did I say he was? What I said was he can buy affordable health insurance now (without the ACA). The left pushed the idea that people could not do this, could not afford this; it was part of the selling people the ACA. You know, the 'Affordable' part?

Oh, I see you were specifically speaking about sick people. I missed that earlier.

Well that is the problem ACA is trying to solve -- make health insurance affordable to sick people. And the only way it can be done is by requiring that everyone has an insurance.

And if you have to ask -- no, the government can't simply order the insurance companies to accept people with pre-existing conditions. Been there, done that -- it won't work.

But still and yet? The Gubmint does it...the Gubmint says yes they can...and will, and DO.

Yep, and I am living proof that that they can do what they claim they can do, being scheduled for minor surgery on Thurs., which will be paid for by Medicare, in spite of the fact that in 1965, when it passed Congress, we were all told that it was unconsititutional, unsustainable, unAmerican, immoral, and uncouth, among other things....(did I mention, "communistic"?)

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

(1) the Dems had the votes

(2) the Pubs don't have the votes now and never will

(3) this is over because

(4) the will of the people is to have ACA

(1) Wrong

(1) is only wrong if your definition of "vote" is different from the definition the rest of the entire world uses.

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