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Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.So you are saying people look for the best surgeon and don’t shop price. I agree, that’s why markets don’t work in healthcare.Wow, you don't think do you. So all surgeons are the same? Maybe you get the really experienced one or maybe you get the joker just out of MedSchool who finished last in his class......Not if they are all charging the same $$.I haven't seen all the details.....but lets assume it is......the government isn't going to let a surgeon charge what he wants, so that's budget surgery, correct?Isn’t everything covered in Medicare for all?
Oh and since it's the government, and you cant get fired....why try and learn new techniques, you cant monetize it.....you get zero out of trying to improve yourself
One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
Yeah believable claim you are making.Heh.. I'm not going to share the personal details of my friends and relatives lives with a troll on the internet.Then do share details.Not when they are staring at death.If they're paying for it themselves, they consider both.
Actually, even then. I know people in that circumstance right now. And it's part of their calculus even though they're insured. If they weren't it'd be even more significant in their decision.
Dealing with private insurance companies who don't want to cover things because they don't want to pay for it is bad enough. Can you imagine having to deal with the government not wanting to cover things because the party currently in power wants to make a political point?
Or being unable to go to the doctor for 45 days every two years because the government is shut down for a political stunt?
Well then you're a greedy fuck.....pay for your own shit.......even though I don't believe a word in your post.....Why should it be free? resources are used to perform those......I know you hate paying for goods and services, but that's how the country works. If you want to afford shit, stop going to school for a useless degree and take ownership of your own life and make it happen.Yes, I definitely need to be protected from the "horrors" of having a health care plan that doesn't cover prostate exams or birth control. What would I, a 50-year-old woman, do without those "essential" coverages in my life? And how could anyone POSSIBLY assume I'm intelligent enough to decide for myself what I do and don't need, simply because I'm an adult who looks after herself on everything else in my life?
prostate exams were covered before obamacare and again I guess I should say depending on what insurance company and state.
Remember the great ObamaCare benefit of paying for colonoscopies? I paid over $3000 out of pocket for my "covered" colonoscopy. Prior to ObamaCare, it would have covered at 90% under my company provided health insurance. How did ObamaCare help that situation?
Being such a big asshole I would have expected you would have been given a discount [lol]. But, I digress. A colonoscopy is preventative medicine, and ought to be free, since not having early detection the cost will be much expensive if cancer is diagnosed years later.
I have Kaiser, and there was no cost for my colonoscopy., no cost for my annual physical and no cost for labs.
First of all Fuck You. I have safety retirement: A six figure monthly check since 2006, and lifetime health care for me and my wife.
Medicare is farmed out to insurance companies.
Not so much. You have "original Medicare which is Part A and Part B. In most plans the Gov is primary
They pay first, then the Private companies pay. The advantage plans replace OM in that they, not the Gov pay, those plans are called Part C
That's what I thought when I first looked into it. Turns out it's not true.
I'm not talking about the "advantage" plans, which are supplemental. The core of Medicare (Part A and Part B) is farmed out to private insurance companies. They make the decisions on whether or not to pay claims, and profit from those decisions.
33. Medicare is a Private–Public Partnership || Center for Medicare Advocacy
Most people think Medicare is a government program. That’s only partly true. While Congress created Medicare, and continues to develop Medicare coverage and appeal rules, decisions to pay claims are actually made by private companies. The government does not make those decisions. This was one of the compromises made in order to pass Medicare in 1965 – and the public-private partnership continues to date.
Indeed, the entities granting or denying coverage, and those deciding whether or not to pay claims, are mostly private insurance companies. For example, Anthem is the parent company of “National Government Services,” one of the major Medicare claims administrators. Another Medicare administrative contractor, “MAXIMUS,” is a for-profit company that helps state, federal and foreign governments administer programs.
No it isn't (as I sit here in my role) as health care consultant. The Gov makes the decision on whether to pay or not. ALL claims are filed with Medicare FIRST after they pay the private companies then pay their share. Your source is quite flawed
Um, no, whether or not Medicare is the first payer varies widely, depending on who the other payer is and a variety of other factors.
Just for starters.
Nope. When it comes to coordination with a supplement plan Medicare pays first. I again suggest you get your info from Medicare.gov
You don’t think republican women get abortions and use birth control? That’s funny.You don’t have an example of it happening with healthcare. Last I checked Dems and repubs have same healthcare needs.Which claim? My claim the political divide in the US is corrosive and destructive? That health care would be used as a carrot/stick by aspiring politicians? Do you really deny these things?You seem to have no backing for your claim...You don't seem to have thought through this much at all. "Dr. Trump will see you now ...."
Luckily, I can just copy and paste this. Guess you didn't see my previous post:
Let's start with the glaringly obvious: women's reproductive health care. Do you think Republicans would try to limit insurance coverage for abortion or birth control? You know they would. What about mental health? Most of them think it's fake news. Services for homosexuals? AIDS research? I could go on and on, but you either get it already, or are so deep in denial you'll never face reality.
Making health care a government responsibility will make it a political football, that will be whipped out every single elections to scare and coerce voters. Let's not.
All I did was ask you to expand on your imaginary example.Yeah believable claim you are making.Heh.. I'm not going to share the personal details of my friends and relatives lives with a troll on the internet.Then do share details.Not when they are staring at death.
Actually, even then. I know people in that circumstance right now. And it's part of their calculus even though they're insured. If they weren't it'd be even more significant in their decision.
I don't give one fuck if you believe it. You're clearly just here promoting an ideology. Most people, in the real world, have either faced these circumstances themselves, or know others who have. And, despite your denials, many people choose not to break the bank when faced with terminal illness.
Not so much. You have "original Medicare which is Part A and Part B. In most plans the Gov is primary
They pay first, then the Private companies pay. The advantage plans replace OM in that they, not the Gov pay, those plans are called Part C
That's what I thought when I first looked into it. Turns out it's not true.
I'm not talking about the "advantage" plans, which are supplemental. The core of Medicare (Part A and Part B) is farmed out to private insurance companies. They make the decisions on whether or not to pay claims, and profit from those decisions.
33. Medicare is a Private–Public Partnership || Center for Medicare Advocacy
Most people think Medicare is a government program. That’s only partly true. While Congress created Medicare, and continues to develop Medicare coverage and appeal rules, decisions to pay claims are actually made by private companies. The government does not make those decisions. This was one of the compromises made in order to pass Medicare in 1965 – and the public-private partnership continues to date.
Indeed, the entities granting or denying coverage, and those deciding whether or not to pay claims, are mostly private insurance companies. For example, Anthem is the parent company of “National Government Services,” one of the major Medicare claims administrators. Another Medicare administrative contractor, “MAXIMUS,” is a for-profit company that helps state, federal and foreign governments administer programs.
No it isn't (as I sit here in my role) as health care consultant. The Gov makes the decision on whether to pay or not. ALL claims are filed with Medicare FIRST after they pay the private companies then pay their share. Your source is quite flawed
Um, no, whether or not Medicare is the first payer varies widely, depending on who the other payer is and a variety of other factors.
Just for starters.
Nope. When it comes to coordination with a supplement plan Medicare pays first. I again suggest you get your info from Medicare.gov
Your post didn't say supplement plan. It just said private companies. Maybe the post you were replying to specified supplement plans, but just because you can see it doesn't mean I can.
I suggest you consider what your own personal, actual words were before you assume you have grounds to get snotty.
That's how all products work.Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.So you are saying people look for the best surgeon and don’t shop price. I agree, that’s why markets don’t work in healthcare.Wow, you don't think do you. So all surgeons are the same? Maybe you get the really experienced one or maybe you get the joker just out of MedSchool who finished last in his class......Not if they are all charging the same $$.I haven't seen all the details.....but lets assume it is......the government isn't going to let a surgeon charge what he wants, so that's budget surgery, correct?
Oh and since it's the government, and you cant get fired....why try and learn new techniques, you cant monetize it.....you get zero out of trying to improve yourself
One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
The average cost of LASIK surgery performed the United States in 2017 was $2,088 per eye, according to a report prepared for All About Vision by a leading vision care industry analytics company.
This is slightly higher than the average price for LASIK performed in the U.S. in 2016, which was $2,059 per eye.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/visionsurgery/cost.htm
Then it would be politically bad for repubs to mess with it. Try to keep up.You don’t think republican women get abortions and use birth control? That’s funny.You don’t have an example of it happening with healthcare. Last I checked Dems and repubs have same healthcare needs.Which claim? My claim the political divide in the US is corrosive and destructive? That health care would be used as a carrot/stick by aspiring politicians? Do you really deny these things?You seem to have no backing for your claim...
Luckily, I can just copy and paste this. Guess you didn't see my previous post:
Let's start with the glaringly obvious: women's reproductive health care. Do you think Republicans would try to limit insurance coverage for abortion or birth control? You know they would. What about mental health? Most of them think it's fake news. Services for homosexuals? AIDS research? I could go on and on, but you either get it already, or are so deep in denial you'll never face reality.
Making health care a government responsibility will make it a political football, that will be whipped out every single elections to scare and coerce voters. Let's not.
Where did I say that? Another strawman I guess. Can't you just focus on the actual arguments?
A colonoscopy is preventative medicine, and ought to be free, since not having early detection the cost will be much expensive if cancer is diagnosed years later.
Maybe you could go into business providing free colonoscopies!
Nah, I've already met too many assholes on this message board, president company not excepted.
A group of mostly Republicans subsidizes a group of mostly Democrats.So You think taking away access is not taking it away.
The ACA exchanges offered health insurance policies with subsidies for those households earning less than 4x poverty rate. The subsidies were based on people paying the maximum of 9.5% of that income on premiums.
You really need to learn what is in the ACA because you are making an ass out of yourself on this subject.
But it’s not. When it comes to life or death, people aren’t great consumers.That's how all products work.Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.So you are saying people look for the best surgeon and don’t shop price. I agree, that’s why markets don’t work in healthcare.Wow, you don't think do you. So all surgeons are the same? Maybe you get the really experienced one or maybe you get the joker just out of MedSchool who finished last in his class......Not if they are all charging the same $$.
Oh and since it's the government, and you cant get fired....why try and learn new techniques, you cant monetize it.....you get zero out of trying to improve yourself
One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
The average cost of LASIK surgery performed the United States in 2017 was $2,088 per eye, according to a report prepared for All About Vision by a leading vision care industry analytics company.
This is slightly higher than the average price for LASIK performed in the U.S. in 2016, which was $2,059 per eye.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/visionsurgery/cost.htm
It comes out, it's expensive so only rich people can get it
then the price drastically comes down....then after it stabilizes it goes up yearly just like anything else
So yes healthcare is a product just like any other in the US......which is why shopping will work to reduce costs.
See this is a bullshit post.....So, you are lying on the floor getting CPR & you are calling for quotes? Really?>Well easy, you shop for it, if the doctor says 400k, you say Ill keep looking and maybe find one for 320k.....Do you not know how to shop for a deal? Is this new? Right now, that doesn't happen.....
If you need CPR you are going to the emergency room......just like......drum roll...........we do now......your example is bullshit
Most people see doctors, like cardiologists and they can call them and get quotes......it's amazing how that works.
Most people choose dotors by reputation. I know of no one calling for quotes. You are lying as usual.
Show of hands, everyone who assumes that because "Assfuck Dave" doesn't personally know someone doing something, it never happens. Anyone?
Of course people don't often ask for prices for regular medical care. BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY THE BILL. Duuuuhhh. They DO, however, ask about prices for things they DO have to pay for themselves. Take a look at cosmetic surgery, for example. Unless it's reconstructive due to a trauma, it's not covered by most insurances. And you'd best believe people do NOT sign up for it without finding out how much it's gonna cost first.
Another area in healthcare where innovation continues, costs come down and quality goes up.
No they really are.But it’s not. When it comes to life or death, people aren’t great consumers.That's how all products work.Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.So you are saying people look for the best surgeon and don’t shop price. I agree, that’s why markets don’t work in healthcare.Wow, you don't think do you. So all surgeons are the same? Maybe you get the really experienced one or maybe you get the joker just out of MedSchool who finished last in his class......
Oh and since it's the government, and you cant get fired....why try and learn new techniques, you cant monetize it.....you get zero out of trying to improve yourself
One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
The average cost of LASIK surgery performed the United States in 2017 was $2,088 per eye, according to a report prepared for All About Vision by a leading vision care industry analytics company.
This is slightly higher than the average price for LASIK performed in the U.S. in 2016, which was $2,059 per eye.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/visionsurgery/cost.htm
It comes out, it's expensive so only rich people can get it
then the price drastically comes down....then after it stabilizes it goes up yearly just like anything else
So yes healthcare is a product just like any other in the US......which is why shopping will work to reduce costs.
This is true.....and people again, will shop around for deals......See this is a bullshit post.....So, you are lying on the floor getting CPR & you are calling for quotes? Really?>
If you need CPR you are going to the emergency room......just like......drum roll...........we do now......your example is bullshit
Most people see doctors, like cardiologists and they can call them and get quotes......it's amazing how that works.
Most people choose dotors by reputation. I know of no one calling for quotes. You are lying as usual.
Show of hands, everyone who assumes that because "Assfuck Dave" doesn't personally know someone doing something, it never happens. Anyone?
Of course people don't often ask for prices for regular medical care. BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY THE BILL. Duuuuhhh. They DO, however, ask about prices for things they DO have to pay for themselves. Take a look at cosmetic surgery, for example. Unless it's reconstructive due to a trauma, it's not covered by most insurances. And you'd best believe people do NOT sign up for it without finding out how much it's gonna cost first.
Another area in healthcare where innovation continues, costs come down and quality goes up.
Dental and vision care are also places where a lot of self-pay happens, either because people don't have plans at all, or because their plans don't cover a lot. Ever seen those commercials for eyeglass centers and their BOGO sales? That's why.
That's what I thought when I first looked into it. Turns out it's not true.
I'm not talking about the "advantage" plans, which are supplemental. The core of Medicare (Part A and Part B) is farmed out to private insurance companies. They make the decisions on whether or not to pay claims, and profit from those decisions.
33. Medicare is a Private–Public Partnership || Center for Medicare Advocacy
No it isn't (as I sit here in my role) as health care consultant. The Gov makes the decision on whether to pay or not. ALL claims are filed with Medicare FIRST after they pay the private companies then pay their share. Your source is quite flawed
Um, no, whether or not Medicare is the first payer varies widely, depending on who the other payer is and a variety of other factors.
Just for starters.
Nope. When it comes to coordination with a supplement plan Medicare pays first. I again suggest you get your info from Medicare.gov
Your post didn't say supplement plan. It just said private companies. Maybe the post you were replying to specified supplement plans, but just because you can see it doesn't mean I can.
I suggest you consider what your own personal, actual words were before you assume you have grounds to get snotty.
Perhaps you should actually pay attention to the entire conversation.
Sure. So somebody needs life saving surgery. You think they will pick the Chevy surgery over the Lexus surgery. That is funny.No they really are.But it’s not. When it comes to life or death, people aren’t great consumers.That's how all products work.Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.So you are saying people look for the best surgeon and don’t shop price. I agree, that’s why markets don’t work in healthcare.
One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
The average cost of LASIK surgery performed the United States in 2017 was $2,088 per eye, according to a report prepared for All About Vision by a leading vision care industry analytics company.
This is slightly higher than the average price for LASIK performed in the U.S. in 2016, which was $2,059 per eye.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/visionsurgery/cost.htm
It comes out, it's expensive so only rich people can get it
then the price drastically comes down....then after it stabilizes it goes up yearly just like anything else
So yes healthcare is a product just like any other in the US......which is why shopping will work to reduce costs.
Do you live in the US?
People will shop for their own funeral stuff.......keyword SHOP
they will shop for their own doctor.......the reason they don't now, is the system doesn't let them.
Well why do they pick Chevys over Lexus now?Sure. So somebody needs life saving surgery. You think they will pick the Chevy surgery over the Lexus surgery. That is funny.No they really are.But it’s not. When it comes to life or death, people aren’t great consumers.That's how all products work.Interesting example. Looks like price has gone up however.One part of healthcare has not been covered by insurance and we have seen quality consistently go up while prices have cone down, and that's Lasik eye surgery. Today, you can get it done on sale or you can pay a lot, it's up to you. And yes, you see ads touting low costs.
The average cost of LASIK surgery performed the United States in 2017 was $2,088 per eye, according to a report prepared for All About Vision by a leading vision care industry analytics company.
This is slightly higher than the average price for LASIK performed in the U.S. in 2016, which was $2,059 per eye.
https://www.allaboutvision.com/visionsurgery/cost.htm
It comes out, it's expensive so only rich people can get it
then the price drastically comes down....then after it stabilizes it goes up yearly just like anything else
So yes healthcare is a product just like any other in the US......which is why shopping will work to reduce costs.
Do you live in the US?
People will shop for their own funeral stuff.......keyword SHOP
they will shop for their own doctor.......the reason they don't now, is the system doesn't let them.
The clerical work needs done. Are you confising clerivpcal work with how the plan is enacted?Uh huh. Medicare is farmed out to insurance companies. You're not fooling anyone.I'm for Medicare for all & fuck the insurance guy.You do realize that a $50k hospital bill will bankrupt over half of all Americans, right? Keel over & get major heart surgery and you just whip out that credit card to pay that $400K bill. You are being ridiculous,
And what kind of father risks their kid's well being by not carrying health insutrance? Really?
A poor one. It wasn't by choice. I did what I had to do. And found out it's not nearly as scary as the insurance salesmen want you to believe.
You're making the case for catastrophic insurance - which I support. But this ridiculous fantasy that insurance is a club you join to have the bulk of your health care paid for by someone else killing us. Peddle your snake oil somewhere else, insurance salesman.
I'm pointing out that insurance companies make big bucks from Medicare now. "Medicare for All" will be an even bigger cash cow for them.
Big 5 insurers depend on Medicare, Medicaid for growth in enrollment, profits
The clerical work needs done. Are you confising clerivpcal work with how the plan is enacted?Uh huh. Medicare is farmed out to insurance companies. You're not fooling anyone.I'm for Medicare for all & fuck the insurance guy.You do realize that a $50k hospital bill will bankrupt over half of all Americans, right? Keel over & get major heart surgery and you just whip out that credit card to pay that $400K bill. You are being ridiculous,
And what kind of father risks their kid's well being by not carrying health insutrance? Really?
A poor one. It wasn't by choice. I did what I had to do. And found out it's not nearly as scary as the insurance salesmen want you to believe.
You're making the case for catastrophic insurance - which I support. But this ridiculous fantasy that insurance is a club you join to have the bulk of your health care paid for by someone else killing us. Peddle your snake oil somewhere else, insurance salesman.
I'm pointing out that insurance companies make big bucks from Medicare now. "Medicare for All" will be an even bigger cash cow for them.
Big 5 insurers depend on Medicare, Medicaid for growth in enrollment, profits
