Greatest thread to human civilization : capitalist greed - Stephen Hawkin

[The Rabbi]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

Seriously? The Industrial Revolution paralleled the rise of capitalism. It would not have succeeded except for capitalism.
As for Cuba, I suppose you could cherry pick examples to show that Cuba exceeds the US in something or other, based on official Cuban data, which is falsified. But the fact is Cuba is one of the poorest countries in the Western Hemisphere with a GDP about what it was under Battista.

Cuba's GDP is far lower now than it was under Batista.

I think they have roughly the same standard of living. Literally. ANyone want to go back to living like people did in 1950? I dont think so.

 

[The Rabbi]

Medicine predates capitalism Ed.

100% stupid it was not until the 20th Century that medicine could be helpful at all. Before that there was very very little

Ed Jenner invented the vaccines in 1776. Waaay before 20th century.

:"the vaccines." The Salk Vaccine was invented in 1776? The papillomavirus vaccine was invented in 1776? Or do you mean one specific vaccine, namely smallpox, that was invented then? Because you are committing a fallcy here.

 

[bripat9643]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

Seriously? The Industrial Revolution paralleled the rise of capitalism. It would not have succeeded except for capitalism.
As for Cuba, I suppose you could cherry pick examples to show that Cuba exceeds the US in something or other, based on official Cuban data, which is falsified. But the fact is Cuba is one of the poorest countries in the Western Hemisphere with a GDP about what it was under Battista.

Cuba's GDP is far lower now than it was under Batista.

I think they have roughly the same standard of living. Literally. ANyone want to go back to living like people did in 1950? I dont think so.

No, they don't have the same standard of living. Cuba was the wealthiest country in Latin American under Batista. Modern Cubans would love to go back to living like Cubans lived in 1950.

 

[The Rabbi]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

And we can legislate away our sins through fascism/socialism.

This is what they mean by our "collective salvation".

Repent sinners!! Turn from your sins and vote for Bernie or die in hell fire capitalistic global warming!!

Just out of curiosity, do left wingers baptize yet?

Fascism & Socialism are not the same.
Why is it that Fascists can't understand that?

You appear to be the only saying they are the same. Smart people understand the fundamental similarities as well as the differences.

 

[The Rabbi]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

And we can legislate away our sins through fascism/socialism.

This is what they mean by our "collective salvation".

Repent sinners!! Turn from your sins and vote for Bernie or die in hell fire capitalistic global warming!!

Just out of curiosity, do left wingers baptize yet?

Fascism & Socialism are not the same.
Why is it that Fascists can't understand that?

dear, they are identical for all intents and purposes in that both rely on powerful central govt; thus our Founders made them both illegal here.

Now do you understand?

Hey, explain to me why the Articles of Confederation were tossed under the bus by our Founders.

They didnt work. Any other stupid questions?

 

[The Rabbi]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

 

[The Rabbi]

"Hawkin" has a point.

Eventually, if labor is eliminated, capitalism as we know it will be too.

Yes , there is a big IF at the beginning of the quote. Apparently it has gone unnotieced to many...and there's a denial effect : that can't happen ( well maybe not in our lifetimes, but I am almost certain 99% of our current jobs will not be needed in a century).

You could have said that 100 years ago. And been mostly correct. Does that mean everyone is now out of work?

 

[CultureCitizen]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

What about Communists and Socialists leaders and Dictators who control all of Capitalism? Those Fucks are really greedy. There is no such thing as wealth distribution.

Agh, yes , some discussion allways. Socialism was supposed to be about collective ownership not about state ownership.
I don't like dictatorships and so far Nordic style socialism seems the best way to go .
There might be a better system though, Richard D'wolff has some interesting ideas.

 

[CultureCitizen]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

It did make the US the first economy in the world though.

 

[CultureCitizen]

Medicine predates capitalism Ed.

100% stupid it was not until the 20th Century that medicine could be helpful at all. Before that there was very very little

Ed Jenner invented the vaccines in 1776. Waaay before 20th century.

:"the vaccines." The Salk Vaccine was invented in 1776? The papillomavirus vaccine was invented in 1776? Or do you mean one specific vaccine, namely smallpox, that was invented then? Because you are committing a fallcy here.

The first vaccine. That established the base work for the rest of the vaccines, more were created during the XIX century and further development was made during the XX century.
Timeline of vaccines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Programmer]

“If machines produce everything we need, the outcome will depend on how things are distributed.” Hawking continued, “Everyone can enjoy a life of luxurious leisure if the machine-produced wealth is shared, or most people can end up miserably poor if the machine-owners successfully lobby against wealth redistribution. So far, the trend seems to be toward the second option, with technology driving ever-increasing inequality."

We have been warned.

Stephen Hawking Warns About The Greatest Threat To Humanity | Zero Hedge

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

I don't think a country could get away with grabbing their ankles with a no protection policy. But restricting exports is definitely preferred to restricting imports.

 

[The Rabbi]

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

It did make the US the first economy in the world though.

Wow a meaningless graph. Surely that proves the point!

 

[The Rabbi]

Medicine predates capitalism Ed.

100% stupid it was not until the 20th Century that medicine could be helpful at all. Before that there was very very little

Ed Jenner invented the vaccines in 1776. Waaay before 20th century.

:"the vaccines." The Salk Vaccine was invented in 1776? The papillomavirus vaccine was invented in 1776? Or do you mean one specific vaccine, namely smallpox, that was invented then? Because you are committing a fallcy here.

The first vaccine. That established the base work for the rest of the vaccines, more were created during the XIX century and further development was made during the XX century.
Timeline of vaccines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

OK so when you wrote Ed Jenner invented the vaccines in 1776 you were lying. And your point is therefore moot.

 

[The Rabbi]

Mankind's lot prior to capitalism was pretty grim. Average life expectancy for all but the wealthy was 35 to 40. No travel, tied down to an area of around 10 square miles for your entire life. A whole litany of pains due to a work week approaching 80 hours per. No real entertainment other than fighting, screwing and the occasional wedding.

Yep, the pre capitalist life was WONDERFUL!

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

I don't think a country could get away with grabbing their ankles with a no protection policy. But restricting exports is definitely preferred to restricting imports.

Your first three words are correct. The rest, not so much.
Protectionism is simply a cheat of the consumer to the benefit of the business owner. No nation ever protected itself into prosperity.

 

[IsaacNewton]

Rabi,

Indeed, overpopulation was not the only factor but the main and driving factor. In the case of easter island
Overpopulation lead to overuse of resources which lead to complete deforestation which in turn caused their collapse.

"Barbara A. West wrote, "Sometime before the arrival of Europeans on Easter Island, the Rapanui experienced a tremendous upheaval in their social system brought about by a change in their island's ecology... By the time of European arrival in 1722, the island's population had dropped to 2,000–3,000 from a high of approximately 15,000 just a century earlier."

Easter Island - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yes, mankind stuck on a very small island with no natural predators is an invitation for disaster. No question. The Earth on the other hand has a carrying capacity estimated at 40 BILLION people. We will never get anywhere near that number though. Population increase is already dropping world wide. Demographers calculate the world population will peak at 9 billion then level off back down to 6 billion.

The estimated carrying capacity for Earth for humans is 20-25 billion people, or less. Depends on technologies. Some estimates are between 4-16 billion.

We are already seeing a worldwide shortage of fresh water with 7 billion. It would be great if the human population started to decrease but that isn't in the near future so all the problems we see now are going to get worse.

Global Warming, however, is going to make the entire equation a mute point. Whether humans know it or not. A new Earth is coming, and it isn't very friendly to any life.

Shortages are due to in adequate distribution of resources. Corruption in the Third World is THE leading cause of hunger and the miserable deaths those poor people get to enjoy. In the 1960's the birth rate was 2.6. It is now at 1.6 and dropping so you are wrong.

Global warming as an agent of doom is a myth. Every shred of written history shows that when the planet has been warmer it has done better. We have numerous records (mostly taxman related) that show beyond doubt the benefit of a warmer world for man, animal, and plant.

Again, ignorance on parade. I'm sure if you lived in Tennessee in 1860 you'd be telling people why slavery is good for them.

I'm sorry the world's PH.D's disagree with you, but you think you are smarter than they. It is self delusion on a grand scale.

The world is already beginning to change due to Global Warming and it will be catastrophic for all life on Earth, especially larger mammals like humans. We are entering a period not seen on Earth for at least 20 million years and likely much longer.

If reality too scary, go hide.

Only the terminally gullible are falling for the global warming con. It appears libs just can't bare to imagine a future that has a happy ending. They seem to thrive on gloom and doom. Of course, they always need a bogeyman because no one would go their nefarious schemes otherwise.

Yes, you know more than 10,000 PH.D's.

Just cause right. You are another gullible ignorant that is to be ignored. You are terrified of reality, go hide behind your mama's apron strings.

 

[CultureCitizen]

"Hawkin" has a point.

Eventually, if labor is eliminated, capitalism as we know it will be too.

Yes , there is a big IF at the beginning of the quote. Apparently it has gone unnotieced to many...and there's a denial effect : that can't happen ( well maybe not in our lifetimes, but I am almost certain 99% of our current jobs will not be needed in a century).

You could have said that 100 years ago. And been mostly correct. Does that mean everyone is now out of work?

I wasn't alive 100 years ago. But I have seen the constant expansion of technology , the creative destruction of jobs.

Skill retooling is good enough for now, there are still many needs and areas to expand, and computers won't be getting smarter than the human in the next 25 years. After that , who knows, we've never faced a similar situation : having an entity which can surpass our habilities.

People no longer try to win a chess or jeopardy tournament against an AI , it is futile , but people continue to play against each other , just for the fun of it. Is that how work will be in the future?

 

[Programmer]

It was science and the industrial revolution which did that, not Capitalism.
And then the form of Capitalism that spawned the industrial revolution was merchantilism , not our current system.
If your argument was true, life expectancy would be very low in Cuba , and it's almost as high as in the US.
Now , that doesn't mean their government or economic system should be a model, I am just pointing out the flaws in your statements.

In fact modern capitalism will improve people's lot over mercantile capitalism. Asian economies lean toward mercantile capitalism at the expense of their low-wage-earning citizens.

Nope,
Merchantilist policies and protectionism play a very important role while an economy is in development. The US and GB were extremely protectionist before they were fully developed nations.

Also wrong. Protectionism is a losing proposition always and everywhere.

I don't think a country could get away with grabbing their ankles with a no protection policy. But restricting exports is definitely preferred to restricting imports.

Your first three words are correct. The rest, not so much.
Protectionism is simply a cheat of the consumer to the benefit of the business owner. No nation ever protected itself into prosperity.

US strategic reserve policy is fundamental to our prosperity. It's how we have useful money, low energy cost and why we're not selling our crude to Europe, even if they wanted it. How's the no protections history in your country/planet?

 

[S.J.]

Its so amusing to see posters on a message board calling Stephen Hawking an idiot. He is the Einstein of our age.

He is right of course. I would add all the rest is just talk as Global Warming is the one thing we will not stop and have never seen before. Physics and chemistry are about to decide which species survive the next mass extinction, which has already begun, and which will go gone. Humans will likely suffer massive losses and if not go extinct come perilously close.

The worst part is most humans don't have a clue about what is coming and soon to arrive. Much like the dinosaurs 65 million years ago.

Something wicked this way comes.

He is the Einstein of our age.
THAT is YOUR opinion...

Which isn't worth shit.

 

[bripat9643]

Yes, mankind stuck on a very small island with no natural predators is an invitation for disaster. No question. The Earth on the other hand has a carrying capacity estimated at 40 BILLION people. We will never get anywhere near that number though. Population increase is already dropping world wide. Demographers calculate the world population will peak at 9 billion then level off back down to 6 billion.

The estimated carrying capacity for Earth for humans is 20-25 billion people, or less. Depends on technologies. Some estimates are between 4-16 billion.

We are already seeing a worldwide shortage of fresh water with 7 billion. It would be great if the human population started to decrease but that isn't in the near future so all the problems we see now are going to get worse.

Global Warming, however, is going to make the entire equation a mute point. Whether humans know it or not. A new Earth is coming, and it isn't very friendly to any life.

Shortages are due to in adequate distribution of resources. Corruption in the Third World is THE leading cause of hunger and the miserable deaths those poor people get to enjoy. In the 1960's the birth rate was 2.6. It is now at 1.6 and dropping so you are wrong.

Global warming as an agent of doom is a myth. Every shred of written history shows that when the planet has been warmer it has done better. We have numerous records (mostly taxman related) that show beyond doubt the benefit of a warmer world for man, animal, and plant.

Again, ignorance on parade. I'm sure if you lived in Tennessee in 1860 you'd be telling people why slavery is good for them.

I'm sorry the world's PH.D's disagree with you, but you think you are smarter than they. It is self delusion on a grand scale.

The world is already beginning to change due to Global Warming and it will be catastrophic for all life on Earth, especially larger mammals like humans. We are entering a period not seen on Earth for at least 20 million years and likely much longer.

If reality too scary, go hide.

Only the terminally gullible are falling for the global warming con. It appears libs just can't bare to imagine a future that has a happy ending. They seem to thrive on gloom and doom. Of course, they always need a bogeyman because no one would go their nefarious schemes otherwise.

Yes, you know more than 10,000 PH.D's.

You mean 75 PHDs, don't you? 10,000 PHDs can all be wrong. OF course, there are plenty of PHDs who say AGW is a con. Anyone capable of committing logic can see the evidence doesn't support it.

Just cause right. You are another gullible ignorant that is to be ignored. You are terrified of reality, go hide behind your mama's apron strings.

Oh boo hoo! The bad ass liberal is being mean to me! I'm going to run home to mommy!

 

[The Great Goose]

He's right. Centuries ago this time period was envisioned to be a time of lesuire, and it could be so much nicer for us, but instead of creating beautiful gardens I had to spend my time paying the banks for the land.

we are being seriously wroughted and for No reason other than idiot greed box's need for status.

its really something I was always frustrated about. Why all the drudgery?
I know work is good but does it have to be soul destroying? No, it doesn't.

Well, you had choices by which you funded the purchase of the land on which your garden sits.
Your choices are simple...
1. save up the cash and buy the land outright
2. borrow the funds at a cost to you to make the purchase.
3. no complaining.

So what you are saying is, you like being jipped?